Popcorn anyone? Explain this call to action to me once again.

[VapinWolf]

I am flabbergasted... I have to wonder where else this type of logic could be applied.
If a skating rink did not allow outside skates, could they force the same restrictions on a rink that did (and saw more business because of it)

What about a restaurant that decides not to serve alcohol and loses business to those who do...

Possibilities are endless!!

It's in our best interests, trust me

 

[Mogar]

I live in a city where smoking is not allowed in bars, but vaping is. I worked with a bar owner to not only allow vaping but encourage it. The bar now has a "side shop" where they will loan out ego's and tanks and sell you the juice for use inside the establishment. It has not only taken off, but constantly has people coming in asking for help. They do have a request on the door, as well as over the loudspeaker at times not to blow large clouds. He has had exhaust fans installed to pull the vapor out as quickly as possible and even when the bar is packed, there is a slight haze but no cloud to walk through.
(They also have a cloud chasing tournament once a week but that is a different story)
Now... Where is the harm in doing this? He wants this in his establishment, and pulls in customers that want to be around this situation. If people do not want to be around it, there is a different section that does not allow it so those with "sensitive noses" can go and not be bothered.

 

[Bored2Tears]

IF vapor from an ecigarette was invisible and odorless, we'd have a much stronger case for doing our thing anyplace we like. The reality is that some eliquid has a distinct smell and we just aren't in a strong position to win on this point.

 

[OlderNDirt]

The day "we the people" not only allowed, but encouraged our government to dictate to private business owners that they could not discriminate against some citizens, yet MUST DISCRIMINATE against others, we lost our freedoms. Would it really be that difficult to enact a law stating that all business establishments must post their smoking rules at the entrance. Every business owner can then determine their own clientele and all potential customers can then make their own choice whether to enter or not. Just a couple of those lost freedoms.

Had that been the case with smoking, we would most likely just be revisiting the same with vaping. Sadly we gave up that freedom and evidently now even those same business people (I use that term loosely) are jumping right onto that government control bandwagon. How times have changed!

 

[crxess]

My only grips is that ALL OF THIS is for the future TAXATION the Federal state and Local governments want.

They stand to loose Millions a year just in the immediate future. In 10-15 years Tobacco could be a thing of the past and they have to make up Revenues.
My suggestion is Save the people some money. Live off the millions they already have and forgo those extreme Salaries they keep raising.

 

[skoony]

IF vapor from an ecigarette was invisible and odorless, we'd have a much stronger case for doing our thing anyplace we like. The reality is that some eliquid has a distinct smell and we just aren't in a strong position to win on this point.

you would be surprised at how unobtrusive vaping is when a little discretion and
common sense is used.
regards
mike

 

[dogluvr]

Wowzer! I'm fairly new to vaping and trying to visit the forums and learn as much as I can when I can. But my question is, why is vaping considered unsafe? Is it? I thought it was just water vapor. What am I missing? Why does the government have their tightie whitees in such a wad??

 

[bluecat]

Wowzer! I'm fairly new to vaping and trying to visit the forums and learn as much as I can when I can. But my question is, why is vaping considered unsafe? Is it? I thought it was just water vapor. What am I missing? Why does the government have their tightie whitees in such a wad??

There just hasn't been enough long term studies done. Who can say what 30 years of vaping may do to a body? Just impossible at the current time period.

I'll take my chances though.

 

[Mogar]

There have been a number of studies done. Most studies (just like normal) are taken and verbalized how their side wants to hear it. One I am following is a "labrat" type where they have the mice in a cage and pumping in a specific mixture from 90/10 to 10/90 on a 24 hour period. The one question I had when I was told of this was what was the level of the mixture? how much vapor are you pouring into the cage, is it a total solution (100%) or are you giving the poor rat some air or just barely putting 1ppm in the cage. This question was not answered. I am interested in the results.

 

[DC2]

This is why...

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...o-smoking-law-update-2015-a.html#post15012135
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...96-public-ecig-prohibition-el-ceritto-ca.html

 

[DC2]

Wowzer! I'm fairly new to vaping and trying to visit the forums and learn as much as I can when I can. But my question is, why is vaping considered unsafe? Is it? I thought it was just water vapor. What am I missing? Why does the government have their tightie whitees in such a wad??

Each question you just asked could be taught as a class in college.
There are answers, but they are complicated and can't be answered in a single post.

1) I believe second-hand vapor is COMPLETELY safe for the most part
2) It is not just water vapor, but it isn't much worse than water vapor or fog machines
3) What you are missing is all of the powerful entities that want to destroy vaping
4) The government has it's panties in a bunch for a lot of reasons, only one of which is loss of tax revenue

 

[AndriaD]

i can see it from the bar owners point of view as well though if you dont want smoking in there . +losing money to other businesses that allow it isnt an even playing field. i actually agree with their point. If my livelihood depended on it I would vote the same way they did. i think -some- stuff should have government involvement at least, as long as they dont strangle us.

That's like letting a black widow spider crawl on you if it promises not to bite. Ludicrous!

Andria

 

[boog]

our local dive bar used to allow vaping, but the smoke alarm kept getting set off.
$200 fine after the first 3 times... owner said screw it, go outside.

 

[Duchovnik]

I have to generally agree with the OP ... I am Californian born and bred, and as everyone knows smoking has been banned here in nearly every public place. And I don't mind that, in many places I appreciate it because I remember the smoking sections in restaurants and such...but the vapers blowing clouds in places like my college's library or other places where it so easily draws attention are really only hurting our cause in keeping e-cigs legal to use in public areas. It's soooo obvious, it's distracting, and annoys a lot of people. Health has nothing to do with it anymore, really. It's become just another thing for people to b*tch about, and we generally LOVE to complain about other people because it makes us feel important. If enough people get annoyed, it will be banned, you can damn near guarantee it. Then it's ruined for everybody. I don't like to drop everything I'm doing to have a nic break so I like to vape in some places at times, but a sneak vape; really just minimize the vapor output from your nose/mouth so only the snottiest of a-holes will be butthurt if they catch you bringing the e-cig to your mouth.

There is another reason for doing this too, and it's simple human psychology; if people were less annoyed by it, they'd be less likely to have knee-jerk reactions to pro-vape arguments. They'd be more open to reason.

 

[r_sizzle]

There have been a number of studies done. Most studies (just like normal) are taken and verbalized how their side wants to hear it. One I am following is a "labrat" type where they have the mice in a cage and pumping in a specific mixture from 90/10 to 10/90 on a 24 hour period. The one question I had when I was told of this was what was the level of the mixture? how much vapor are you pouring into the cage, is it a total solution (100%) or are you giving the poor rat some air or just barely putting 1ppm in the cage. This question was not answered. I am interested in the results.

Sounds a lot like the study they did on the monkeys with grass. Turned out they only found brain damage on the monkey that received smoke constantly throughout the study. The results are whatever the "person" who paid for the study want them to be. If not, funding for the study abruptly ends.

 

[CMD-Ky]

the playing field is absolutely level. One group elects to ban a product, the public rejects the election. Freedom wins the day, the public voted with their feet. And, if you can't beat the competition, outlaw the competition.

i can see it from the bar owners point of view as well though if you dont want smoking in there . +losing money to other businesses that allow it isnt an even playing field. i actually agree with their point. If my livelihood depended on it I would vote the same way they did. i think -some- stuff should have government involvement at least, as long as they dont strangle us.

 

[CMD-Ky]

Yes! If the bar owners gave people what they wanted, business would improve. The non-vaping bar owners want to do as they choose and then they want the government to force others to follow suit. I find it disgusting. See my signature.

i see their point of view also. they should deal with it..
not the government.
regards
mike

 

[Bored2Tears]

you would be surprised at how unobtrusive vaping is when a little discretion and
common sense is used.
regards
mike

Agreed.......unfortunately I have very little confidence in most people when it comes to using discretion or common sense. People don't seem to legislate or regulate themselves very well in my opinion. I'm all for fighting the battle, but I guess I am pessimistic about winning on this one.

 

[Strings]

We may not win on this one. But that could leave us in a better position

If a large number of vapers contact their reps and say "don't do this. It will end badly for you", said rep can shrug it off (right now)

If, after voting for a restrictive measure, vapers show up in droves to vote/volunteer for said rep's opposition, then we have a credible threat when the next restrictiive measure comes down the pipe

 

[OlderNDirt]

We may not win on this one. But that could leave us in a better position

If a large number of vapers contact their reps and say "don't do this. It will end badly for you", said rep can shrug it off (right now)

If, after voting for a restrictive measure, vapers show up in droves to vote/volunteer for said rep's opposition, then we have a credible threat when the next restrictiive measure comes down the pipe

One would like to think things work that way, but...........

"Vapers show up in droves"? More likely they might show up in a trickle and that may be optimistic. I think I have read enough on these boards about some vapers already accepting only vaping where smoking is allowed and those places are continually becoming fewer and farther between.