Probably stupid questions

[skydragon]

Hello all,

I have questions. That usually means "watch out" lol

I have PG, VG and Nic.

I know I need flavorings and protective gear. I do realize nic needs to handled carefully.

But I seem to be stuck at this point. I don't know what I need as far as equipment to go further. Right from the start. I have watched videos although they just make up one bottle at a time. I have read. I have had people tell me what they use but I can't seem to get over the hump to actually start. Kind of like I am not putting it all together in the order it should be.

Say I wanted to use 60 or 30 mil bottles premixed at a certain strength and stick them in the freezer. What do I need? What type of bottles? I lost the link but I did see some that had the "european" <not sure> type. Ones that you just stick the needle into without worrying about splash so much. But do you just transfer the nic to that from the 500 mil bottle of nic? Add your PG/VG, put in freezer and take out later when ready to add flavoring? Or don't mix with the PG/VG before putting in freezer? I know some boil and reuse the bottles? The ones I have use a screw on top.

Why do I need a graduated cylinder and beakers and flasks if I am just doing on bottle at a time? Do those allow you to make bigger premixed batches to then put into your smaller bottles? Add flavoring later. That's another thing. Everything I read says to fill as close to the top as possible but if you leave flavoring out until later, that will not fill the bottle all the way.

I have heard both ways as far a syringes. Use and throw away and reuse. If reusing, how do you clean them well enough?

I know there are recipes that you input what you want, but again, it is better (easier) to pre-make different strengths, grab a bottle out of the freezer and add flavoring. That sounds easier to me so you don't have to constantly mix the PG/VG. =)

From start to finish how do you all do it? With what gear? I do know some. It just seems streaming it all together in a smooth fashion is stumping me. I kind of feel like I did when I first started researching e-cigs in general. Like my head wants to pop off.

I know................rambling. Sorry about that. I was smart enough to NOT get 100mg nic before I know more of what I am doing. I have 60. Which I do realize is also dangerous if not handled correctly. I will be careful.

Thank you.

 

[yzer]

Say I wanted to use 60 or 30 mil bottles premixed at a certain strength and stick them in the freezer. What do I need? What type of bottles?
-I'm still reusing the plastic 30 dripper bottles that came with my pre-mixed juice. I freezer store my nicotine base in Boston round amber glass lab bottles with Poly-Seal caps. Lots of vendors sell these small dripper bottles. I got the Boston round bottles from a lab supply online.

But do you just transfer the nic to that from the 500 mil bottle of nic? Add your PG/VG, put in freezer and take out later when ready to add flavoring? Or don't mix with the PG/VG before putting in freezer? I know some boil and reuse the bottles? The ones I have use a screw on top.
-You don't understand the concept of nicotine base yet. This is a liquid that is VG, PG or a combination of both that contains nicotine. A nicotine base can be frozen for long term storage. You can buy your base at various nicotine concentrations and dilute it to a nicotine concentration for your own base. You will further dilute your base while making finished juice. Finished juice can contain water or flavoring or a lot of other things. Finished juice is usually not frozen.

Why do I need a graduated cylinder and beakers and flasks if I am just doing on bottle at a time? Do those allow you to make bigger premixed batches to then put into your smaller bottles? Add flavoring later. That's another thing. Everything I read says to fill as close to the top as possible but if you leave flavoring out until later, that will not fill the bottle all the way.
-To measure liquids for accurate mixing. Graduated cylinders are much more accurate than beakers or flasks for measuring. You can use unmarked bottles for mixing measured liquids.

I have heard both ways as far a syringes. Use and throw away and reuse. If reusing, how do you clean them well enough?
-Antibacterial dishwashing liquid works wonders.

I know there are recipes that you input what you want, but again, it is better (easier) to pre-make different strengths, grab a bottle out of the freezer and add flavoring. That sounds easier to me so you don't have to constantly mix the PG/VG. =)
-Yep. You can store your frozen base in a bottle that holds just enough for your batch of finished juice. Or use a larger base storage bottle and put it back into freezer. This second option may introduce more water and oxygen to your base over time. I make up 25mg base. I want the ability to dial in the final nicotine level while making the finished juice so I add more VG or PG for dilution when mixing finished juice. I plan on reducing my finished nicotine concentration over time.

From start to finish how do you all do it? With what gear? I do know some. It just seems streaming it all together in a smooth fashion is stumping me. I kind of feel like I did when I first started researching e-cigs in general. Like my head wants to pop off.

I know................rambling. Sorry about that. I was smart enough to NOT get 100mg nic before I know more of what I am doing. I have 60. Which I do realize is also dangerous if not handled correctly. I will be careful.
-I'd use cheap disposable plastic gloves and eye protection with 60mg until you are good at handling liquids. The search feature is your friend. Show me 10 DIY mixers and I will show you 10 different sets of lab gear.

Look luck, with more reading you will be ready to start soon.

 

[skydragon]

Say I wanted to use 60 or 30 mil bottles premixed at a certain strength and stick them in the freezer. What do I need? What type of bottles?
-I'm still reusing the plastic 30 dripper bottles that came with my pre-mixed juice. I freezer store my nicotine base in Boston round amber glass lab bottles with Poly-Seal caps. Lots of vendors sell these small dripper bottles. I got the Boston round bottles from a lab supply online.

But do you just transfer the nic to that from the 500 mil bottle of nic? Add your PG/VG, put in freezer and take out later when ready to add flavoring? Or don't mix with the PG/VG before putting in freezer? I know some boil and reuse the bottles? The ones I have use a screw on top.
-You don't understand the concept of nicotine base yet. This is a liquid that is VG, PG or a combination of both that contains nicotine. A nicotine base can be frozen for long term storage. You can buy your base at various nicotine concentrations and dilute it to a nicotine concentration for your own base. You will further dilute your base while making finished juice. Finished juice can contain water or flavoring or a lot of other things. Finished juice is usually not frozen.

Why do I need a graduated cylinder and beakers and flasks if I am just doing on bottle at a time? Do those allow you to make bigger premixed batches to then put into your smaller bottles? Add flavoring later. That's another thing. Everything I read says to fill as close to the top as possible but if you leave flavoring out until later, that will not fill the bottle all the way.
-To measure liquids for accurate mixing. Graduated cylinders are much more accurate than beakers or flasks for measuring. You can use unmarked bottles for mixing measured liquids.

I have heard both ways as far a syringes. Use and throw away and reuse. If reusing, how do you clean them well enough?
-Antibacterial dishwashing liquid works wonders.

I know there are recipes that you input what you want, but again, it is better (easier) to pre-make different strengths, grab a bottle out of the freezer and add flavoring. That sounds easier to me so you don't have to constantly mix the PG/VG. =)
-Yep. You can store your frozen base in a bottle that holds just enough for your batch of finished juice. Or use a larger base storage bottle and put it back into freezer. This second option may introduce more water and oxygen to your base over time. I make up 25mg base. I want the ability to dial in the final nicotine level while making the finished juice so I add more VG or PG for dilution when mixing finished juice. I plan on reducing my finished nicotine concentration over time.

From start to finish how do you all do it? With what gear? I do know some. It just seems streaming it all together in a smooth fashion is stumping me. I kind of feel like I did when I first started researching e-cigs in general. Like my head wants to pop off.

I know................rambling. Sorry about that. I was smart enough to NOT get 100mg nic before I know more of what I am doing. I have 60. Which I do realize is also dangerous if not handled correctly. I will be careful.
-I'd use cheap disposable plastic gloves and eye protection with 60mg until you are good at handling liquids. The search feature is your friend. Show me 10 DIY mixers and I will show you 10 different sets of lab gear.

Look luck, with more reading you will be ready to start soon.

Thank you yzer.

I bolded a few statements I think I need clarified.

1) When you say you freezer store your base in Boston round bottles, do you mean you have added your mix of PG/VG already?

2) I think you are right. LOL

3) I think the term "base" is what has me a little confused as it seems to be used interchangeably. Obvious base would be what I buy from the vendor. Nic in PG/VG base. But I know some also mix in more PG/VG right away so all they have to do is add flavoring, water etc. So when you say base, which do you mean?

4) If I have it correctly, it sounds like you take your nic and mix it right away with your PG/VG to get to 25 mgs, put that in the freezer and then take it out when you want to make up a batch. So you then put your thawed liquid into smaller bottles then add flavoring etc?

So a person is making an entirely different type of "base" when mixing nic "base" with the extra PG/VG which you break up into smaller increments for future use?

 

[yzer]

Answers to numbered questions in Post#3

1. Yes. It is easiest for me to buy nicotine base in the carrier I use most: 100% Glycerin USP (VG). I buy in 100mg strength. I don't use PG so as soon as I get that big bottle of 100mg I immediately dilute it with VG to 25mg, mix it and pour it into the Boston round bottles for freezing. I have turned the 100mg VG base into 25mg VG base. I have also done the same process with 50mg base. I heat VG in a hot water bath to make mixing, measuring and pouring easier.

3. Nicotine in VG, PG or a mix of the two with no other ingredients is base nicotine, whether the vendor dilutes it or you dilute it or you both dilute it.

4. Not quite. I take out my base and thaw it. Then a specific measured amount of base (say 100 ml) goes into a mixing vessel, like a clean 250 bottle. I add enough VG to get 20mg base.

At this point my method differs from anyone who uses flavored juice. I use unflavored juice. I just add 5% distilled water and I'm good to go for 18mg unflavored. After shaking the mixing bottle the juice is poured off to the 30 ml dripper bottles.

Instead of adding only distilled water to reach the desired nicotine level you must add flavoring for flavored juice. You can add measured flavoring to the whole 250ml mixing bottle if you want a big batch or simply pour it into smaller bottles and use that for making smaller flavored batches.

 

[skydragon]

Answers to numbered questions in Post#3

1. Yes. It is easiest for me to buy nicotine base in the carrier I use most: 100% Glycerin USP (VG). I buy in 100mg strength. I don't use PG so as soon as I get that big bottle of 100mg I immediately dilute it with VG to 25mg, mix it and pour it into the Boston round bottles for freezing. I have turned the 100mg VG base into 25mg VG base. I have also done the same process with 50mg base. I heat VG in a hot water bath to make mixing, measuring and pouring easier.

3. Nicotine in VG, PG or a mix of the two with no other ingredients is base nicotine, whether the vendor dilutes it or you dilute it or you both dilute it.

4. Not quite. I take out my base and thaw it. Then a specific measured amount of base (say 100 ml) goes into a mixing vessel, like a clean 250 bottle. I add enough VG to get 20mg base.

At this point my method differs from anyone who uses flavored juice. I use unflavored juice. I just add 5% distilled water and I'm good to go for 18mg unflavored. After shaking the mixing bottle the juice is poured off to the 30 ml dripper bottles.

Instead of adding only distilled water to reach the desired nicotine level you must add flavoring for flavored juice. You can add measured flavoring to the whole 250ml mixing bottle if you want a big batch or simply pour it into smaller bottles and use that for making smaller flavored batches.

I thought I had it but then I got confused with #4

4. Not quite. I take out my base and thaw it. Then a specific measured amount of base (say 100 ml) goes into a mixing vessel, like a clean 250 bottle. I add enough VG to get 20mg base.


You first mixed it down to 25 mgs with VG and froze it? Then you take it from the freezer, thaw it and with only VG mix it down some more to 20 mgs? Is there a reason not to mix it down to 20 mgs to begin with?

Also, what size bottles do you freeze the liquid in? You use the entire contents of one frozen bottle?

Thank you.

 

[yzer]

No reason why I couldn't dilute the base to 20mg instead of 25mg the first time except that I was making 20mg juice when I mixed the 25mg base for freezing.

Best size for the freezer bottles is the size that will hold enough base for one of your finished batches, however large or small that may be. One batch is enough e-liquid to last me two months. I store the finished 30ml plastic dripper bottles in the fridge.

If you don't finish off the contents of exactly one freezer bottle of base for a single batch it can always be refrozen or stored in the fridge for several weeks, no problem. Use that bottle first the next time you want nicotine base. Figure out how much base you want to use per batch to select freezer bottle sizes.

 

[skydragon]

No reason why I couldn't dilute the base to 20mg instead of 25mg the first time except that I was making 20mg juice when I mixed the 25mg base for freezing.

Best size for the freezer bottles is the size that will hold enough base for one of your finished batches, however large or small that may be. One batch is enough e-liquid to last me two months. I store the finished 30ml plastic dripper bottles in the fridge.

If you don't finish off the contents of exactly one freezer bottle of base for a single batch it can always be refrozen or stored in the fridge for several weeks, no problem. Use that bottle first the next time you want nicotine base. Figure out how much base you want to use per batch to select freezer bottle sizes.

Okay...........I think I have things a little more clear now.

Thank you for your help yzer. It is appreciated.

 

[NGAHaze]

The base nicotine even unfrozen or unrefrigerated will likely last at least year before starting to degrade significantly. You can extend it's life considerably by freezing and refrigerating however, leaving out a small batch to have at the ready for mixing isn't going to be a problem provided you use it in a reasonable period of time. You do however, want to minimize it's exposure to air, heat and light in order to keep it as fresh as possible. I'd advise that you start with small batches at first, perhaps 4 or 5 ml, until you find something you like and then make up a larger batch. I've had some batches that I just couldn't make vapable and had to toss them. Luckily they were just small amounts.

 

[skydragon]

The base nicotine even unfrozen or unrefrigerated will likely last at least year before starting to degrade significantly. You can extend it's life considerably by freezing and refrigerating however, leaving out a small batch to have at the ready for mixing isn't going to be a problem provided you use it in a reasonable period of time. You do however, want to minimize it's exposure to air, heat and light in order to keep it as fresh as possible. I'd advise that you start with small batches at first, perhaps 4 or 5 ml, until you find something you like and then make up a larger batch. I've had some batches that I just couldn't make vapable and had to toss them. Luckily they were just small amounts.

Thank you NGA =)

 

[NGAHaze]

Thank you NGA =)

You are most welcome!

Btw, if you don't already have one, I find this tool quite useful; it's a juice calculator which is helpful in determining how much of X to add to Y so you end up with Z:

eJuice Me Up - Best eJuice Calculator

 

[Starlyte2]

I find 250ml bottles quite practical for bases, and as for equipment, I use bottles to hold the mixes, with dropper tops, and safety screw tops, a pair of those thin plastic gloves that Drs use, and syringes, with needles: 1ml (for the flavours), 2ml (for small samples, or weak flavours), a 5 and 10 mls for the bases. That's it. Oh, I forgot, a funnel, little, and in placcy, which came with Gr. Guevara, and I use for transfers less precise, or when the bottles are all at the same level.
As Nic rests liquid, thick, OK, but liquid, I put it in the freezer on arrival, then thin it to 54mg/ml as needed.
I do intend making a seeping box, heated, towards Autumn, but as for other equipment, I have tiny pipettes, which came free, and are useful, but not essential, but beakers and all that are more for show IMHO, though do correct me if I'm wrong.
Mixing's fun, so put in your bases, add the flavour, but always star low, as it's easier to add more than take it out . Then give it a little shake and...
1/ Leave the top off for 24hrs OR leave the top on all the time OR leave the top off all the time. Each swears by one method or another, but they all work.
2/ Heat in a bath of hot water (this speeds up seeping, but DO get all the air out of the bottle first or you get round bottles ), although some pass it for a quicky in the microwave, but check up on the times, as I don't have a clue. Again, each to his/her own... .
3/ Taste it the next day, so you get an idea of it's taste, weakness, etc OR don't toutch for a week/month or whatever. Flavours do get stronger with time, at least tobacco ones, and juice darkens, usually...

Personally I think it makes sense to taste and correct, day after day, until it's more or less good.
At first I used, or rather re-used, 5ml bottles, to get tastes as I liked them. I wrote all down, marque of the flavour included, in %, which is easier to go bigger with. Some were super, some drain-worthy, but there's so much info on forums that I just keep on picking up one trick, dropping another. It really is great fun, as you are limited by the flavours available, which must be quite a respectable number, and your imagination. Reading gives you the % approximatively, just needs adjusting to YOUR taste. With 5ml, it isn't a big loss, and some even make up new juices at 3ml, which is enough to see if you'll like it.
So go for it, and apart taking care you get the Nic level right, all you have to do is have fun, and use your imagination. It is nice when you actually ENJOY your first DIY juice. YOU made it, to YOUR taste. HAPPY VAPING

 

[skydragon]

More good info. Thank you.

 

[anotherme]

So I can use some distilled water to thin my juice, correct?

 

[Mowgli]

I live in Carcassonne

We visited Carcassonne when I was a kid. What a place to live. Mon Dieu!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7b/Cité_de_Carcassonne.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fc/Carcasssonne_vieux_pont.jpg