RBAs vs new RDAs

[xxJollyRogerxx]

I starting thinking about this as I was looking around at the new tanks that are out.

Ppl have been asking what new RDA to go with and I see Magma being thrown out as I guess that is the new kid on the block for RDAs but when I looked at the specs it states that it has a new "expanded well to hold up to 40 drops". Awesome for the drippers it seems no more constant dripping. But isn't that 40 drops roughly equal to 1ml of juice or a little more? That made say "Hrmm" then I look at the build and you can definitely see a deeper well on them where the juice would sit when filled. See what I just said when "filled" so you are now filling a dripper which really to me looks more like a ultra-mini tank with a 1ml capacity. That is not much more than a small RBA that holds 2.0 ml or even 2.5ml. Yes you drip to fill it but you are still "filling" it. The older drippers seemed just that a few drops and vape that then add more drops.

Now take a Kayfun or most other RBAs for that matter you know you get a tank and you get juice channels so you can hold more and not have to keep filling it. The beauty of a tank style right?

It really appears the lines are differentiation are starting to blur between the 2. Not saying all RDAs will follow suit but with amount of times i see this one name mentioned it seems popular with drippers .. for the moment at least

I really can't see the flavor being so much better or the vapor production being so much greater when it is not really that much different when the designs are very close to each other. Take 1 ml away from an 2 ml RBA or add another 1 ml (heck even .5 ml) to the RDA and it is essentially almost the same.

So now my question is how is this new RDA so much different from a tank bottom feed RBA?

 

[Rule62]

The main difference is in airflow. The airflow on Kayfuns is somewhat anemic, compared to that of the Magma. The Magma is designed primarily as a dual coil device, with airflow directed below each coil. Although I've never built my Magma in single coil mode, which you can, I suppose there's not much difference between it and a Kayfun.

 

[GeorgeWachsmuth]

Well.....I do occasionally build my Magma in single coil. There is an airier draw and the "Magma flavor" still present. I prefer it over my Kayfun when at home. On the go? I use a Kayfun of some type.

 

[ConradM]

The Magma is essentially the perfect atty. It holds enough juice to not be inconvenient yet it has the flavor of a chimney. Not to mention it's far easier to maintain than any chimney RBA.

I can fill mine and take it out for a day of shopping or running errands and not have to worry about re-dripping.

 

[anumber1]

So you haven't tried a magma? A person doesn't have to keep a magma filled. It works ok with a couple of drops at a time (dont know why you would though as even when filled, mine is good for half a dozen good pulls before dry).

The larger, domed chamber and the bottom air holes make it like a super kayfun. The magma has great flavor. Yes, it is much more intense than a kayfun style tank system.

That said, my magma also is not sealed. Tip it while full in your pocket and you have a juicy pocket. The kayfun is my at work and out and about go to.

 

[Flt Simulation]

I keep hearing about all these Kayfuns having 'enemic' airflow.

I have a SvoëMesto Kayfun Lite-Plus (v2) and I have to set the airflow screw in the bottom of it somewhere between minimum and maximum.

If I was to unscrew it all the way out, the airflow would just be too "airy" and the vapor production would decrease somewhat.


Who wants to be sucking air from a big open hole! ... you need a little resistance to resemble those cigarettes you are trying to stay off of (at least I do).
__________________________________

Personally, I think the best use of an RDA is when you are trying out various different juices ... An RBA just is no good for that.

But for vaping the same juice all day long, I certainly don't want the hassle of continually needing to put drops of juice in it for hours on end!

 

[Kemosabe]

I keep hearing about all these Kayfuns having 'enemic' airflow.

I have a SvoëMesto Kayfun Lite-Plus (v2) and I have to set the airflow screw in the bottom of it somewhere between minimum and maximum.

If I was to unscrew it all the way out, the airflow would just be too "airy" and the vapor production would decrease somewhat.


Who wants to be sucking air from a big open hole! ... you need a little resistance to resemble those cigarettes you are trying to stay off of (at least I do).
__________________________________

Personally, I think the best use of an RDA is when you are tying out various different juices ... An RBA just is no good for that.

But for vaping the same juice all day long, I certainly don't want the hassle of continually needing to put drops of juice in it for hours on end!

personally, i had always found cigarettes to have far to stiff of a draw. when i smoked, i would usually twist out a portion of the tobacco to loosen up the cig and create more air flowing through it. also, i always lung-hit my cigarettes so a stiff draw was not optimal at all.
now that i can select my air flow with vaping/rdas, i am in hog heaven.

 

[ConradM]

I keep hearing about all these Kayfuns having 'enemic' airflow.

I have a SvoëMesto Kayfun Lite-Plus (v2) and I have to set the airflow screw in the bottom of it somewhere between minimum and maximum.

If I was to unscrew it all the way out, the airflow would just be too "airy" and the vapor production would decrease somewhat.


Who wants to be sucking air from a big open hole! ... you need a little resistance to resemble those cigarettes you are trying to stay off of (at least I do).

I used to think the same thing. But when you get used to big hits and lots of vapor (from having open airflow) you can't go back to a tight draw.
__________________________________

Personally, I think the best use of an RDA is when you are tying out various different juices ... An RBA just is no good for that.

But for vaping the same juice all day long, I certainly don't want the hassle of continually needing to put drops of juice in it for hours on end!

That's kind of the point of this thread. The Magma can last up to an hour on one fill. You break that down and it's good for your work commute, running errands ect.

 

[snow blind]

I really can't see the flavor being so much better or the vapor production being so much greater when it is not really that much different when the designs are very close to each other.

Not even close. RDA's have much more of an area to build. They have MUCH more airflow. The chamber volumes are normally larger on RDA's. Vapor and flavor are generally very different.

The appeal of RDAs lie in their use. They produce more vapor. Lots of times (depending on if were talking Kayfun here) they produce even better flavor that RTAs. They're easier to change flavors. They're easier to rebuild/wick. They are more reliable as there is no feeding mech... besides your bottle.

I personally use nothing but drippers at home and then switch to my Kayfun when out. Each has their place.

 

[xxJollyRogerxx]

No, I don't have a Magma and I am not against to trying it. Heck I am giddy with this hobby.
But I do have a Kayfun 3.1 and I gotta agree with Flt Simulation; if i open up the airflow all the way it is just WAY too airy. I think mine is setup around a little more than 1/2 way at the moment. I can't imagine anyone running this wide open. So it is interesting to hear the flow being called restrictive in any way since it is adjustable.

So aside from air flow design which seems to be the point here. There are not many other differences. It just seems more like an RBA than an RDA though. Please correct me if I am wrong but older RDAs you would just drip a few drops onto the wick vape then re-drip.
Definitely RBAs are horrible to use for sampling; just a big PITA to do that. I actually think now I am going to get a Magma to help in that department.

So the air chimney design is the point now but aren't the airflows on any atty driven by design from the MFG? Each his own kinda thing.

Curious as to what ohms you are running the magmas at then? sub-ohm? Are you using the same ohm on both the Kayfuns and the Magma?

 

[snow blind]

You don't take inhales straight into your lungs, do you? I'm guessing you're a mouth to lung inhaler from your airflow comments with the Kayfuns. For those using lung inhales (seemingly what most of us "graduate" to) Kayfuns are almost impossible to get a good lung fill with via the standard lung inhale. I can only mouth to lung my kayfuns. A LOT of the reason behind RDA's is designed around a big lung inhale. You get much, much more vapor that is far more condensed and as a result, most of the time, more flavorful.

 

[snow blind]

As far as ohms. Don't sub ohm a Kayfun lol... bad things happen! Well, a minor sub ohm build is completely fine... .9-.7... but when you start really going down it can't keep up and you WILL burn wicks and wish you were dead because it tastes so bad!

Magma's can run really well anywhere from a 1.4 ohm single coil all the way down to the dangerous (i dont do this) sub-sub ohm area. The Magma performs well in all areas.

 

[ConradM]

No, I don't have a Magma and I am not against to trying it. Heck I am giddy with this hobby.
But I do have a Kayfun 3.1 and I gotta agree with Flt Simulation; if i open up the airflow all the way it is just WAY too airy. I think mine is setup around a little more than 1/2 way at the moment. I can't imagine anyone running this wide open. So it is interesting to hear the flow being called restrictive in any way since it is adjustable.

So aside from air flow design which seems to be the point here. There are not many other differences. It just seems more like an RBA than an RDA though. Please correct me if I am wrong but older RDAs you would just drip a few drops onto the wick vape then re-drip.
Definitely RBAs are horrible to use for sampling; just a big PITA to do that. I actually think now I am going to get a Magma to help in that department.

So the air chimney design is the point now but aren't the airflows on any atty driven by design from the MFG? Each his own kinda thing.

Curious as to what ohms you are running the magmas at then? sub-ohm? Are you using the same ohm on both the Kayfuns and the Magma?

That's the other benefit to a dripper vs a chimney. I generally run my drippers at .3 - .4. But in my experience a chimney can't keep up at that wattage.

 

[Flt Simulation]

Speaking of "Lung Hits" ... I am 66 years old and smoked full-flavor 'reds' for 45 years (started during my time in Viet Nam).

The 2nd half of those 45 years of smoking, I smoked 2 packs per day.

Even with a heavy cigarette habit like that, I can never remember the time I did "Lung Hits" while smoking cigarettes (maybe something else, but NOT cigarettes).


So, why in hell would I want to lung hit my e-cig atomizer that I chain-vape all day long?

I do Mouth to Lung just like I always did with cigarettes.

 

[ConradM]

Speaking of "Lung Hits" ... I am 66 years old and smoked full-flavor 'reds' for 45 years (started during my time in Viet Nam).

The 2nd half of those 45 years of smoking, I smoked 2 packs per day.

Even with a heavy cigarette habit like that, I can never remember the time I did "Lung Hits" while smoking cigarettes (maybe something else, but NOT cigarettes).


So, why in hell would I want to lung hit my e-cig atomizer that I chain-vape all day long?

I do Mouth to Lung just like I always did with cigarettes.

It's just the evolution of it is all. I started it out mouth to lung with clearos like I'm sure most did.

 

[Flt Simulation]

Conrad ... Were you a heavy / long-time cigarette smoker before you started vaping?

And Conrad ... Do you get more enjoyment from vaping when doing lung hits all the time? ... Or just a little stronger nicotine "buzz"?


Just trying to understand why someone would continually lung hit these e-cigs.

 

[snow blind]

I smoked for 10 years... wasn't super heavy and always mouth to lung inhaled my early vaporizers (read eGos and clearos/cartos) the first two years. After moving into RBAs... well you can't really mouth to lung most. Most RBAs are made to lung inhale. The airflow is so open that you simply breathe in. There is no sucking or pulling required. (Depending on RBA etc) You don't have to rip some crazy full lung inhale... but breathe normally. There is no horrible lung ache or strain... how much vapor you take is all up to you. You can go crazy and empty that chamber like your life depends on it and blow clouds... or you can simply do short, natural lung pulls for 1-2 seconds and get the same amount of vapor you do with mouth to lungs.

I can set my Tobh on half an air hole and do mouth to lungs but opening it up is such an "easier" experience. My KFL+ is a mouth to lung only that i still enjoy when out of the home... then i can't wait to get back and screw on a RDA lol.

You should try an airy/open atty and do a lung inhale or two... you might end up liking it?

 

[ConradM]

Conrad ... Were you a heavy / long-time cigarette smoker before you started vaping?

And Conrad ... Do you get more enjoyment from vaping when doing lung hits all the time? ... Or just a little stronger nicotine "buzz"?


Just trying to understand why someone would continually lung hit these e-cigs.

Yes I was a PAD 19 year smoker. Lung hitting was never my intention. But as I built my coils lower and lower and needed more and more airflow I eventually had to lung to hit. So I guess you could say lung hitting is just a result of chasing that bigger hit.

Now I can't back to a "tight" draw device. I recently tried a Fogger v4 and while I could lung hit it, it took to much effort and I just don't care to mouth to lung anymore.

 

[xxJollyRogerxx]

I actually do lung hits all the time. I tried doing the mouth hit like a analog but it turns into a lung hit . I guess i was forced to do mouth hits on analogs due to the filter stopping any kind of lung hit. But as soon as I pickup an APV it was lung hits from the beginning even though I have been smoking for over 30 years. Granted the stiff draw of clearos were making me do mouth hits but then I drilled them all out! I still carry a drilled out T3S with me during the day to carry around at work. And it is a very stiff draw.

So I guess that is where the real difference lies. Chimney vs Dripper air flow (don't even know how to name that one! LOL)
I have never done cartos or anything like that so I have no comparison which is why my curiosity was piqued by what the "real" difference is after looking at the new Magma. It is, obviously not, ohms, wicking or liquid storage so really air flow is the only thing left (which was mentioned in the beginning of this thread). Which to be honest, still kinda puzzles me as the Kayfun wide open is too much air but on the flip side I do have a Kanger Aerotank Mega and that wide open is ok but could be a bit larger.

 

[GeorgeWachsmuth]

Fact is....I am not trying to imitate my smoking. I did imitate it a while back but I have found lung hits to be more enjoyable when I vape now. I am vaping not smoking so this is fine. Its a different action and experience. I enjoy RDAs...but I do still use the Kayfuns I have.