Replacement for nichrome coil...

[ZorbaTheGreek]

This is an awesome thread. Really great of you Quit4myKids to take the initiative on this. I mean really awesome of you. Thank you from the vaping community for trying to improve these devices and keep the innovation ball rolling. I'm on a budget right now, but I would have loved to try one of these out. Guess I'll have to settle for second hand reports Good luck to all the tinkerers out there with your new materials. I really think even with a slow warmup time, this has allot of potential. I would totally take a bulletproof vaporizer that takes a second to get going over one that needs parts replaced on a regular basis.

 

[jxmiller]

If we end up trying higher voltages, I can only do 3.7V and then 8.4V... I only have 18650's. I tried with a fully charged 4.2V 18650. I am curious what kind of voltage abuse this thing could take in short bursts. If it comes down to it though I would rather someone else try... 5V or 6V before I go trying 8.4V.

Just putting that out there.

Edit:

I see Quit4MyKids posted that these range 2-3 ohms and most being close to 2ohms. Perhaps I just got the one that was near 3 Ohm? Lower Ohm means more heat. Waiting for others to respond then..

 

[radwor]

Xmiller,

I've got a 4 cell 14500 in series boosted to 5v portable USB PS that I use for a portable wired pass-thru. I could easly use for testing @ 5v, but I'm not sure if this will handle it, what do ya think? I only have one. lol
ps. mine was marked 2.7 and tested @ 2.7 Ohm exactly.

If we end up trying higher voltages, I can only do 3.7V and then 8.4V... I only have 18650's. I tried with a fully charged 4.2V 18650. I am curious what kind of voltage abuse this thing could take in short bursts. If it comes down to it though I would rather someone else try... 5V or 6V before I go trying 8.4V.

Just putting that out there.

Edit:

I see Quit4MyKids posted that these range 2-3 ohms and most being close to 2ohms. Perhaps I just got the one that was near 3 Ohm? Lower Ohm means more heat. Waiting for others to respond then..

 

[jxmiller]

Xmiller,

I've got a 4 cell 14500 in series boosted to 5v portable USB PS that I use for a portable wired pass-thru. I could easly use for testing @ 5v, but I'm not sure if this will handle it, what do ya think? I only have one. lol
ps. mine was marked 2.7 and tested @ 2.7 Ohm exactly.

<capswithoutcaps>was wondering if that was the ohm measurement!</capswithoutcaps>

Mine is 2.7 as well. Quit4myKids, were any marked lower? I imagine if one was 2.0 it would perform better in the realm of heat up time... probably sacrifice a bit of heating area though along with it... hmm.

 

[Quit4myKids]

I decided to keep the extra heater, and sacrifice it in the name of testing. I applied 3.7V for 30 seconds, and it stayed hot (my IR thermometer doesn't go high enough to actually measure the temp, anything over 125F just reads "Hi" on the LED display). I continued to 60 seconds, then 120 seconds with the same result.

I then plugged it into a 5V passthrough (drawing straight from USB, no battery) that supplies 5.11V consistently with no load, and got the same results, even to 5 minutes. Finally, I tried to fry it using a 6V lantern battery, and ran it for 15 minutes without it going cold. I then tried it again at 3.7V, and got a similar heat up and cool down time.That was all I had time to do, but I think the results were encouraging. I have also found the heating time to be a little longer than I would like, but won't be able to do any formal testing, videos, etc... until I get back after the new year.

I believe all the heaters were marked the same, although I have to admit I was in a hurry to get them out, and didn't closely inspect each one. I thought the marking said "2.1", not "2.7". As I said, I'm not going to have any real time to test this until after the holidays, but I look forward to reading the results of everyone's tests while I'm traveling.

Thanks for everyone's hard work and assistance in getting these here. Now the fun (and "real" work) begins!

Quit4myKids

 

[jxmiller]

I tried to fry it using a 6V lantern battery, and ran it for 15 minutes without it going cold. I then tried it again at 3.7V, and got a similar heat up and cool down time.

So when increasing voltage you get the same heat up time? If so that would be discouraging. I am tempted now to try the 8.4V, but I am going to first aquire a laser thermometer. I need to be able to measure over time and determine if the voltage increase increases heat up time.

 

[Bagazo]

Voltage increase lowers heat up time

 

[Quit4myKids]

I just ran it with 2 x 3.6V Trustfire 16340 batts (CR123 form), and it worked at 7.1V (measured with no load). I don't have a stopwatch with me, and wasn't checking time from button to vapor on a wet heater, I just wanted to see if the higher voltages would fry the heater. I can't comment on how voltage affects time to a specific temp until I can set up a controlled environment and perform some real tests in a controlled environment.

Add: I just read the quoted section again, and I understand your confusion. I was referring to "similar heat up and cool down time" as follows:
The second time I powered the heater at 3.7V (after running it for long periods at higher voltages), it seemed to perform about the same as it did when I first applied 3.7V prior to the higher voltages. I apologize for my lack of clarity and the resulting confusion.

Quit4myKids

 

[jxmiller]

I just ran it with 2 x 3.6V Trustfire 16340 batts (CR123 form), and it worked at 7.1V (measured with no load). I don't have a stopwatch with me, and wasn't checking time from button to vapor on a wet heater, I just wanted to see if the higher voltages would fry the heater. I can't comment on how voltage affects time to a specific temp until I can set up a controlled environment and perform some real tests in a controlled environment.

Add: I just read the quoted section again, and I understand your confusion. I was referring to "similar heat up and cool down time" as follows:
The second time I powered the heater at 3.7V (after running it for long periods at higher voltages), it seemed to perform about the same as it did when I first applied 3.7V prior to the higher voltages. I apologize for my lack of clarity and the resulting confusion.


Quit4myKids

Very promising. Heat up times should be increased with increased voltages.. I would think.

Messed around with it again... I am not sure but as the vapor came off I can say (as I have already partially) it smells sort of sweet and my flavorings seem to have been brought out better. But there is something else.. maybe. What are the chances a chemical is being released on the newer ones when we are heating them up? You think the materials are safe?

 

[Bagazo]

Increased voltage means faster heat up.

Your batteries are your power source and voltage is just an indicator/value of how much of that power can flow at any given time. So the higher the voltage the more power your pushing and if the resistance is the same then you get faster heating.

In laymans terms: more gas car goes faster, turn up the flame food cooks faster, open the tap all the way and your glass will fill faster.

In Numbers: using 2.7 ohms as the resistance

@3.7 Volts @7.4 Volts

I = V/R

I = 3.7/2.7 I = 7.4/2.7
I = 1.37 I = 2.74

W = VI
W = 3.7 * 1.37 W = 7.4 * 2.74
W = 5.07 W = 20.27

so it would seem your pouring 4 times the power into the heating element so the heat up time should be cut by 4 but this doesn't mean much when dealing with fractions of a second.

 

[Bagazo]

Reposted to unjumble my calculations.

Increased voltage means faster heat up.

Your batteries are your power source and voltage is just an indicator/value of how much of that power can flow at any given time. So the higher the voltage the more power your pushing and if the resistance is the same then you get faster heating.

In laymans terms: more gas car goes faster, turn up the flame food cooks faster, open the tap all the way and your glass will fill faster.

In Numbers: using 2.7 ohms as the resistance

@3.7 Volts
I = V/R
I = 3.7/2.7
I = 1.37

W = VI
W = 3.7 * 1.37
W = 5.07

@7.4 Volts
I = V/R
I = 7.4/2.7
I = 2.74

W = VI
W = 7.4 * 2.74
W = 20.27

so it would seem your pouring 4 times the power into the heating element so the heat up time should be cut by 4 but this doesn't mean much when dealing with fractions of a second.

 

[Quit4myKids]

What are the chances a chemical is being released on the newer ones when we are heating them up? You think the materials are safe?

I am not going to say that I am certain that anything, (including the usage of e-cigarettes) is completely safe, especially in the litigation-heavy society where we all reside. That said, I was assured by the manufacturer rep there is nothing that could leach into the fluid or vapor from the heaters, either cold or well past the specified temperatures, from either the ceramics, the lead pads, or the leads themselves. I haven't tried it yet, but intend to as soon as possible.

I did check the ceramic pot from the BE112 atomizer I took apart, and the heater slips in nicely, with the leads exactly matching the exit holes from the previous coil. I plan on reassembling the atomizer with the new heater after I run some tests on it outside the tube, and will try vaping with it after figuring out how best to regulate the voltage. I did try sucking up a little of the vapor from the open heater through a straw, and it was very strong. From my preliminary, non-controlled results so far, I'm going to predict that we will need a much higher voltage using pulse-wave modulation (something I'm just learning about) to address the heating time, and possibly a thermistor (also learning about these) to regulate the temperature. We may be able to build a thermistor into a future heater, but I'm not certain. I'm not certain how to address the cooling time other than an automatic shutoff.

I'm done testing until after the holidays. Everyone enjoy your new toys and have a great holiday. I'll be monitoring the thread, but probably won't be very active until after the new year.

Quit4myKids

 

[jxmiller]

I am not going to say that I am certain that anything, (including the usage of e-cigarettes) is completely safe, especially in the litigation-heavy society where we all reside. That said, I was assured by the manufacturer rep there is nothing that could leach into the fluid or vapor from the heaters, either cold or well past the specified temperatures, from either the ceramics, the lead pads, or the leads themselves. I haven't tried it yet, but intend to as soon as possible.

I did check the ceramic pot from the BE112 atomizer I took apart, and the heater slips in nicely, with the leads exactly matching the exit holes from the previous coil. I plan on reassembling the atomizer with the new heater after I run some tests on it outside the tube, and will try vaping with it after figuring out how best to regulate the voltage. I did try sucking up a little of the vapor from the open heater through a straw, and it was very strong. From my preliminary, non-controlled results so far, I'm going to predict that we will need a much higher voltage using pulse-wave modulation (something I'm just learning about) to address the heating time, and possibly a thermistor (also learning about these) to regulate the temperature. We may be able to build a thermistor into a future heater, but I'm not certain. I'm not certain how to address the cooling time other than an automatic shutoff.

I'm done testing until after the holidays. Everyone enjoy your new toys and have a great holiday. I'll be monitoring the thread, but probably won't be very active until after the new year.

Quit4myKids

On the technical side I don't have much of a clue as to what you are talking about. Thermistor... modulation... not sure.

My brain tells me though that pumping an initial high volt (fast heat up) then dropping the voltage down (very fast) just enough to retain temp would be a plan. i would not know how to do this. My ideas and research go into what would the simplest solution be though. This means I am going to try with only a switch and batteries first. if that does not work then I will put effort into more technical things.

 

[Quit4myKids]

I know that I have been scrambling with holiday preparation, traveling to relatives, last minute shopping, etc..., but I'm surprised nobody has posted anything about their experiences with the heaters. I don't have anyplace here to work with it, or I would have brought mine with me. Although I'm having a nice vacation, I'm anxious to get back home and start testing. I think everyone should have received them by now. Does anyone have any news, or is everyone else also busy with the holidays?

Q4mK

 

[jxmiller]

I know that I have been scrambling with holiday preparation, traveling to relatives, last minute shopping, etc..., but I'm surprised nobody has posted anything about their experiences with the heaters. I don't have anyplace here to work with it, or I would have brought mine with me. Although I'm having a nice vacation, I'm anxious to get back home and start testing. I think everyone should have received them by now. Does anyone have any news, or is everyone else also busy with the holidays?

Q4mK

I think its just me and you doing anything so far. I am quite busy as well. Been brainstorming on how to plug this in better. My config was not optimal.

 

[KonaNeil]

....My brain tells me though that pumping an initial high volt (fast heat up) then dropping the voltage down (very fast) just enough to retain temp would be a plan. i would not know how to do this....

A capacitor? Maybe look up how a taser works? You wouldn't need to pulse nearly as much current.

 

[Vapinginjapan]

With these elements, resistance should increase exponentially as the temperature climbs up to it's design temp.

Thus, you could feed it as much voltage as it could take, and it would still reach the same heat ceiling and stay there.

Voltage regulation, if the internal limit is designed correctly, should be irrelevant. Thus, it would seem that the more voltage the better. As much voltage as the battery can provide.

An 11.7v 400mAH LiPO pack would be perfect for this, if it weren't for the fact that they're a fire hazard and prone to explosion.

 

[rbonie]

I know that I have been scrambling with holiday preparation, traveling to relatives, last minute shopping, etc..., but I'm surprised nobody has posted anything about their experiences with the heaters. I don't have anyplace here to work with it, or I would have brought mine with me. Although I'm having a nice vacation, I'm anxious to get back home and start testing. I think everyone should have received them by now. Does anyone have any news, or is everyone else also busy with the holidays?

Q4mK

Let me know how this goes. If you need $ help not tech help...Anything to solve the atty issue

 

[DonleyDoRight]

I'm dieing to read some feedback and test results here.
Somebody please fire these up and let us know.
Could be the best thing since sliced bread.

 

[Scubabatdan]

Sorry was away for the holidays snowboarding in TN, am back and will start getting at it. I did recieve it, but was put on the back burner for Christmas.
Dan