FDA Sen Johnson (R-Wis) demands answers from FDA RE deeming

Status
Not open for further replies.

VNeil

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jun 30, 2014
2,726
6,868
Ocean City, MD
This, IMO, is where the Conversation should Always be turned Back To.

e-Cigarettes are Harm Reduction over Smoking. Credible Science is showing that. So if Cigarettes are going to be Allowed to be Sold in this Country, why wouldn't e-Cigarettes be seen, at worse, as a Lesser Evil?
vaping is a huge public benefit. But the govt is spending a billion dollars on junk science to "prove" otherwise.

The govt is a 65% partner in the "evil" tobacco business. Admiting the truth is bad for business.
 

Rickajho

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Apr 23, 2011
11,841
21,763
Boston MA
1. There is no reason why every juice vendor should have to establish that vaping each of his/her eLiquids is generally safe. If you bake cookies and market them to a local food store, do you have to do clinical studies to prove cookies are generally safe and "are a public benefit"? But that is a moot point because...

2. Most importantly, the TCA was not meant to be fair. It was meant to eliminate any future "tobacco products" that were not grandfathered. So the issue is not the fairness of the PMTA process, the issue is that the law was expressly written to prevent something like the vaping industry from ever getting off the ground. That is the fault of Congress, which basically decreed that no more new products made from nicotine would be sold as general consumer products, even if they are 1000% safer than cigs. Congress needs to fix this.

You have to bear in mind that the FDA is more asking manufacturers to prove things are not unsafe - which is an impossible double negative to test for.
 

zoiDman

My -0^10 = Nothing at All*
Supporting Member
ECF Veteran
Apr 16, 2010
41,619
1
84,746
So-Cal
Vaping is a huge public benefit. But the govt is spending a billion dollars on junk science to "prove" otherwise.

The govt is a 65% partner in the "evil" tobacco business. Admiting the truth is bad for business.

Of course the Government is spending Money to say Vaping isn't Safe. That's what you do Before you push a Heavy Tax onto something that only effects a Small Percentage of the Population. Also helps to Justify the FDA's Deeming.

Then Once the Market is Heavily Taxed, and the People who you want (that give you Money) have Dominated the Market, you can pull back and start say's...

"Ya Know? These FDA OKed e-Cigarettes aren't as Bad is before Regulations. So smokers should buy a VUSE."
 

Hulamoon

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 6, 2012
8,636
43,384
65
Waikiki Hawaii
Is there such a thing as a cookie that is a public benefit? What does "public benefit" even mean? How is tobacco a public benefit? But I guess tobacco slithered by having to meet that requirement. I could begin an endless list of consumer items that are in no way a public benefit and another of items that are actually a public harm. Why don't they have to prove themselves?
Sure they can! If I don't get my cookies and vape, I'll have to go Viking berserk and kill people…. QED cookies,(sugar, bacon) and vaping have GOT to be public harm reduction. :banana:
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rickajho

VNeil

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jun 30, 2014
2,726
6,868
Ocean City, MD
Of course the Government is spending Money to say Vaping isn't Safe. That's what you do Before you push a Heavy Tax onto something that only effects a Small Percentage of the Population. Also helps to Justify the FDA's Deeming.

Then Once the Market is Heavily Taxed, and the People who you want (that give you Money) have Dominated the Market, you can pull back and start say's...

"Ya Know? These FDA OKed e-Cigarettes aren't as Bad is before Regulations. So smokers should buy a VUSE."
About right....
 

MacTechVpr

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Aug 24, 2013
5,725
14,411
Hollywood (Beach), FL
You have to bear in mind that the FDA is more asking manufacturers to prove things are not unsafe - which is an impossible double negative to test for.

For all their edictation, we're being led by glib amateurs Rick. Stands to reason.

Good luck. :)
 

DaveP

PV Master & Musician
ECF Veteran
May 22, 2010
16,733
42,646
Central GA
Sugar and Fat are the two worst enemies of health in America. It's certainly not vaping.

Imagine the outrage if 90% of products containing more than X% sugar and fat were removed from the market after a certain date. People would buy another freezer to stock up on Twinkies and Snickers before the initial invocation of the rule.
 

DaveP

PV Master & Musician
ECF Veteran
May 22, 2010
16,733
42,646
Central GA
The FDA deeming regulations seem to be more of restriction placed on e-cigarettes in the form of compliance costs rather than a sin tax to the states like the MSA. It's more of a forced reduction in products and sellers caused by the high cost of compliance. It will, of course, take pressures of competition away from tobacco companies and slow the switch from tobacco cigarettes to vaping products. Few sellers and the demise of Mom and Pop vape shops will reduce availability to those who would switch to a safer source of nicotine.

Government isn't that adept at funneling money into projects where funding was intended to be spent. Even by their own admission far too much of the MSA money was spent on day to day budget items legally because the MSA didn't require them to spend it on smoking reduction efforts.

The Master Settlement Agreement and Its Impact on Tobacco Use 10 Years Later: Lessons for Physicians About Health Policy Making

Conclusion
It is clear that the MSA has not resulted in a clear and straightforward intensification of state tobacco control efforts, because of the impact of interest group activity and changing economic situations at the state level. MSA resources have been significantly diverted from tobacco control and treatment into other state policy activities.59
 

DaveP

PV Master & Musician
ECF Veteran
May 22, 2010
16,733
42,646
Central GA
Is there such a thing as a cookie that is a public benefit? What does "public benefit" even mean? How is tobacco a public benefit? But I guess tobacco slithered by having to meet that requirement. I could begin an endless list of consumer items that are in no way a public benefit and another of items that are actually a public harm. Why don't they have to prove themselves?

True, if they want to fix a health problem, outlaw anything that contains high fructose corn syrup. That's a cheap, but profitable corn product since ethanol was added to gasoline.
 

Vandal

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Oct 21, 2009
799
3,357
NE Ohio
True, if they want to fix a health problem, outlaw anything that contains high fructose corn syrup. That's a cheap, but profitable corn product since ethanol was added to gasoline.
Don't even get me started on HFCS. I have been ranting about it for years. They have ruined my favorite cookies and candy bars with that toxic mess. I keep having to find alternatives to things I love because industry keeps finding cheap ways to ruin them. And too many seem none the wiser for too long. There does seem to be a bit of a movement away from HFCS, but I am impatient to taste a Fig Newton again. ;P

I think eventually enough of the public catches on, just enough to change things a little. It's a long process though.
 

Sanctuary Denied

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Sep 6, 2013
321
327
Vancouver, Wa
There does seem to be a bit of a movement away from HFCS, but I am impatient to taste a Fig Newton again. ;P

I think eventually enough of the public catches on, just enough to change things a little. It's a long process though.

I've been working for Nabisco, the maker of the Fig Newton, for just shy of 27 years now. We've been under the umbrella of many corporate names (including tobacco, ironic huh?). Since we been under Mondelez there has been a progression of healthier (their words, not mine) snacks. It does seem, to me, that we don't sell as many as we used to, but we've also have saturated the market with a plethora of flavors. You may want to write them about the health advantages of not not using HFCS. Just a thought.
Back on topic, isn't the FDA supposed to respond to Sen Johnson's second letter today?
 
  • Like
Reactions: rwoodin
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread