should we be stocking up just in case

[gadiwhat]

Where's the governator in California when you need him. That man refused to sign a bill against ecigs

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

 

[junkman]

I think a sensible regulation would be to stop the sale of extremely high nicotine base liquids used for diy. Personally i don't use them,.

You don't use them so that is why you think it would be sensible.

I happen to think that is a terrible idea.

 

[stacee jaxx]

You don't use them so that is why you think it would be sensible.

I happen to think that is a terrible idea.

I don't use them so that is why i think it is a good idea ?.

That is not why i think it is a good idea. I think it is a good idea for it to be a regulation because companies shouldn't be allowed to sell such a high level of nicotine liquids to the general public. It would be a responsible move to regulate it. Government departments feel they have a responsibility to protect the public. What's wrong with allowing the sale of nicotine liquids which had the maximum nicotine content of something that wouldn't harm someone. How many warning have you read that tell you not to exceed a certain level of nicotine when mixing liquids. You could still diy with 4.5%. I mean forget about anything else regulation wise for a second. Don't you even care about the safety of the general public ?.

And please don't tell me what i think !.

 

[Vapoor eyes er]

I think a sensible regulation would be to stop the sale of extremely high nicotine base liquids used for diy. Personally i don't use them, but, i do use a perfectly good premade e liquid at 4.5mg. None of you guys would use such a high mg e liquid, or maybe some of you do, but the company i get it from seem to think it's neccessary. The company i am referring to is expanding all the time. They're an english company but have outlets in quite a few countries now including the usa. One of the few companies that label their e liquids with health warnings,expiration dates etc. i copied and pasted this from their site:

"Intellicig has been at the forefront of electronic cigarette research for over 3 years. In conducting blood trials to determine product safety, Intellicig remains a flagship for research. Intellicig employs an in-house Phlebotomist to assist in trials of this nature.

Intellicig has worked with a leading laboratory in the UK to determine the levels of nicotine delivered from the Intellicig to the user. These trials are essential as a method of ensuring the consumer is not put at risk from excessive nicotine levels.

Product shelf life is the key to ensuring consumer safety. Intellicig have conducted stability studies following the International Conference of Harmonisation (ICH) Guidelines for stability testing.

CN Creative have set acceptance criteria for product shelf life based on the British Pharmacopoeia acceptance for nicotine products for inhalation, which is legally binding for medicinal products. By setting strict acceptance criteria, CN Creative have further increased the safety of Intellicig. This practice has not been adopted by other electronic-cigarette suppliers or
manufacturers.

Unlike other manufacturers of electronic cigarette e-liquid preparations, Intellicig have focused on manufacturing technique rather than the addition of preservatives to increase product shelf life. Intellicig believe that consumer safety should come first and the addition of preservative ingredients is not necessarily the first step in increasing product shelf life.

Vapour Analysis

There has been reported concern on the safety of vapour created by electronic cigarettes and the uncertainty of what happens to “e-liquid” when it is vaporised.

The company has conducted vapour analysis of ECOpure produced from the Intellicig in line with test methods carried out by the FDA.

CN Creative are committed to the safety of its products and have exceeded the testing conducted by the FDA to assess all potential breakdown products of electronic cigarettes. CN Creative have
commissioned an MHRA audited lab to test for these chemicals using Gas-Chromatography-Mass-Spectroscopy and Liquid Chromatography-Ultra-Violet Detection. This testing further demonstrates CN Creatives commitment to product quality and safety.

Gas Chromatography Mass-Spectroscopy (GCMS) has also been conducted in an independent third party MHRA audited lab on the vapour produced from ECOpure.

Results from this independent analysis showed no signs of any harmful chemicals or the reaction of nicotine with any of the recipients of ECOpure.

The results illustrated that the vapour contained the same ingredients as the neat ECOpure."

I've bought e liquid from this company for the past two years. It's only been a few months that they have sold a 4.5mg e liquid, before that their highest was 3.0 or a unflavoured 3.6 which they stopped producing. Their e cigs are for beginners so are cig-a-likes and their choice of flavours is limited too. I use their menthol all the time. Regardless of what i find elsewhere i always go back to these guys because their menthol is outstanding.

I know you folks think i deliberately show no support for CASSAA and think i couldn't care less about a ban but seriously, with companies like this going to the all the trouble of analysing vapour and everything else, when i buy their e liquid i feel like i am supporting something somehow. I cannot find another company that do what they do. Even since i first visited their site i read about what they do as far as testing and then providing their results for people to read. So if you think i'm unsympathetic to people maybe your right . But i have a lot of faith in this company and what they do. They are my CASSAA ! I do hope i have redeemed myself a little.

Well you'd better understand if/ when vaping becomes regulated you can kiss 45 mg juice to the curb. I'm hearing sealed cartos and a max of 14 mg. What would you do then?

 

[stacee jaxx]

Well that was the whole point of my post. If this company thinks that 4.5% is a sensible nicotine level with all the tests they've been doing, then based on that i'd say a regulation wouldn't go lower than 4.5%. You see it's not me saying it. It's them. They seem quite confident.

 

[Racehorse]

by committing to use participating vendors first, I am indeed advocating supporting CASAA, albeit somewhat indirectly.

Look, I brought this up because in real life, that is how I make purchasing decisions.

I use a realtor who gives back to my community by providing a small college scholarship to our high school
I use a veterinarian who volunteers time at the local homeless animal shelter and at the free rabies clinics
I use electricians and plumbers who wired and plumbed our local volunteer fire department building in my community for free
I use a dog groomer who volunteer grooms homelss dogs and cats going out on transport for adoption to new homes in other states
I patronize business owners who believe in giving back to both our community and to their customers, because without the latter they can't succeed.

If you are not just "in it for the money", then you pay it forward within your area of expertise and in your community. That is how I was raised up. Either some form of civic duty / volunteerism was expected of us....and since we were too poor to make donations, we provided it "in kind" with manual labor (were sent over to an elderly person's home to help them with grass-cutting, lifting or chores, or reading to the blind, etc.).

Anyone making $$ in this cottage industry needs to support vaping organizations that support the future of vaping, and vapers/customers, because your livelihood is dependent on those customers and the continuation of our freedom to vape. Without those things, you don't have a paycheck anymore.

Would I bypass vendors using this criteria? Yes, I'm afraid I would.

 

[Reaper0329]

Well, I confess I'm not well versed in the issue, as I only very recently started vaping with any degree of regularity, but there is, I think, reason to be concern. The tobacco industry has a vested interest in stubbing out the ecig industry (we're cutting into their profits, remember?), and anti-smoking organizations are, in my limited experience, zealously committed to stamping out anything that involves any gaseous...anything...coming out of one's mouth that isn't CO2. I am rather optimistic that a ban wouldn't pass, but...discounting the possibility is a losing strategy.

Also, first post. Pleasure to be here.

 

[Vapoor eyes er]

Well that was the whole point of my post. If this company thinks that 4.5% is a sensible nicotine level with all the tests they've been doing, then based on that i'd say a regulation wouldn't go lower than 4.5%. You see it's not me saying it. It's them. They seem quite confident.

There is no mention regarding the safety of 45 mg nicotine. Note also most, if not all, vendors have a max of 36 mg and the majority of vendors and vapers believe 36 mg is generally a high enuff mg to begin with.

 

[mikepetro]

Well that was the whole point of my post. If this company thinks that 4.5% is a sensible nicotine level with all the tests they've been doing, then based on that i'd say a regulation wouldn't go lower than 4.5%. You see it's not me saying it. It's them. They seem quite confident.

I fear the FDA could care less what a single vendor, especially a Foreign one, has to say. They will have their own studies to back up whatever position they take.

 

[Vapoor eyes er]

We are going to war against a number of formidable opponents with influential lobbying groups, deep, deep pockets and deep political connections. Big Tobacco, Big Pharma, the "non profit" anti smoking orgs....they all have a vested financial interest and together their net worth is equal to billions of $$ at a minimum. Intellcig is akin to the corner grocery going up against Walmart.

Edit: On the Intellcig website I see NO notice of the upcoming FDA discussions and I believe customers have a right to know about these issues.

 

[stacee jaxx]

I fear the FDA could care less what a single vendor, especially a Foreign one, has to say. They will have their own studies to back up whatever position they take.

To keep the british government happy i expect. Although at least they actually do something, or a whole load of stuff, when most other companies/enterprises do absolutely **** all !. And that's why the FDA are looking at regulations in the first place i suspect. I mean if vendors did take responsibility then there wouldn't be the need for CASSAA. Funny that the public are the ones that are trying to defend their rights and all the vendors do is cash in on the panic buying. LOL !

 

[potholerepairman]

Have been thru a lot of supply scares for sure myself and bought a lot of stuff.If you can buy what you like do it, other wise wait.Reason for this thought is I ended up with a ton of useless stuff that just rotted away, most of it was not even from a supply scare but me hording in my mind.Bought too many mods that just got old and worthless, if you can buy most anything off the net with out a worry( legal scripts from canada, chinese bug spray, scotch guard that works, etc), do you really think that almost a million vapers will not be able to find a suitable vape online when/if any law gets passed and enacted , thats seems slim to me.

 

[mikepetro]

Have been thru a lot of supply scares for sure myself and bought a lot of stuff.If you can buy what you like do it, other wise wait.Reason for this thought is I ended up with a ton of useless stuff that just rotted away, most of it was not even from a supply scare but me hording in my mind.Bought too many mods that just got old and worthless, if you can buy most anything off the net with out a worry( legal scripts from canada, chinese bug spray, scotch guard that works, etc), do you really think that almost a million vapers will not be able to find a suitable vape online when/if any law gets passed and enacted , thats seems slim to me.

I agree. I did stock up on some nic. I figure it might take a bit for the supply chain to get reestablished if the FDA does something drastic. Nic will keep for a long time in the freezer, and if nothing happens then I just chalk it up as insurance policy. A very CHEAP insurance policy compare to going back to the cigars.....

 

[stacee jaxx]

So lets say that a judge listens to both sides of the arguement. And regardless of any "dodgy" evidence that is exposed by the defence the judge decides to ban e liquid. Then obviously he/she got paid off. How long is that expected to last in the usa ?. If that happened in england that judge would be strung up. That kind of corruption doesn't exist in my country. The law would be all over him. Checking his bank accounts and any over seas accounts, everything, everything !. The result of the case alone is evidence against him. He wouldn't last five minutes. It's a brave man that makes that decision.

 

[Baditude]

I honestly don't know what the time period was when the FDA imposed their ban a few years ago before it was overturned in court. Maybe some old timers can jump in on this one.

And I don't believe that these types of hearings involve a judge. From my understanding, the FDA will submit their proposal either before or after testamonies are given by interested parties, and then make their final decision.

 

[grandmato5]

And I don't believe that these types of hearings involve a judge. From my understanding, the FDA will submit their proposal either before or after testamonies are given by interested parties, and then make their final decision.

Here is a nutshell version of what will happen:

The FDA sends their proposed deeming order and proposed regulations to the Office of Budget Management, they look it over, if anything needs to be changed sends it back to the FDA to revise, sends it back to OBM again, repeat as needed When its finally considered the correct version it is published in the Federal Register. The FDA will then announce a time frame that they will accept comments on their proposed deeming order and proposed regulations. There is no set time for these comments to be accepted by them, could be weeks or it could be months. When whatever timeframe the FDA picks for accepting comments on their proposals is up then the FDA is suppose to consider the comments and decide on a final deeming order and regulations. That could take a month it could take a year or longer OR it could be never. The FDA has no obligation to let the public know how long they will take or even IF they chose to do nothing.

 

[grandmato5]

What upcoming FDA hearing do I keep reading about on here ? I'm not aware of any upcoming FDA hearing on their proposed deeming order or regulations ? Did I miss something ?

The upcoming Food and Drug law Institute Conference is the only thing I am aware of where possible deeming order and regulations will be discussed.

 

[Baditude]

Here is a nutshell version of what will happen...That could take a month it could take a year or longer OR it could be never. The FDA has no obligation to let the public know how long they will take or even IF they chose to do nothing.

This sounds like we should be in business for several months to say the least; plenty of time to plan a course of action.

I was afraid the whole process could occur within a month's time, but what was I basing this on, knowing how fast the government acts?

 

[Aheadatime]

That kind of corruption doesn't exist in my country.

That kind of corruption is global. Central banking is inherently corrupt. In order not to derail the thread further, you can PM me if you have questions about central banking and corruption, as it has little to do with the OP.

 

[Over_Stimulation]

In order not to derail the thread further, you can PM me if you have questions about central banking and corruption, as it has little to do with the OP.

genius!!!!!!!!!!!!