Sigelei Zmax V3 and V5 Telescopic: User's Group

[E squire]

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. If nothing else, this demonstrates just how willing to help our Zmax community can be, even with a problem that seems to defy our best efforts. To that end, I'll post my coil variation testing results in the next couple of days.

I'm a bit bummed out that my problem seems unique. I'm still interested to hear from anyone experiencing anything similar with their device.

 

[dsconnell]

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. If nothing else, this demonstrates just how willing to help our Zmax community can be, even with a problem that seems to defy our best efforts. To that end, I'll post my coil variation testing results in the next couple of days.

I'm a bit bummed out that my problem seems unique. I'm still interested to hear from anyone experiencing anything similar with their device.

a couple thoughts I had are: 1) if the unit is set to mean mode vs rms mode you'll want that set to rms. 2) do a full factory reset by pulling the battery and pressing the fire button several times, then insert the battery while holding the fire button for several seconds. This will reset the unit to factory specs so you'll have to go through the settings and reset them to your settings. That's all I got.

 

[E squire]

a couple thoughts I had are: 1) if the unit is set to mean mode vs rms mode you'll want that set to rms. 2) do a full factory reset by pulling the battery and pressing the fire button several times, then insert the battery while holding the fire button for several seconds. This will reset the unit to factory specs so you'll have to go through the settings and reset them to your settings. That's all I got.

Did all the above, without success. Though now I might play with it on mean just to rule it out, if nothing else.

Update: I'm experiencing the same power limitations on mean (set to 15w, displays 7.3w on a 2.3 ohm coil).

 

[E squire]

To sum up potential troubleshooting on this power limitation (for those who might have a similar issue):

1. Double check your settings/readings (e.g. RMS v. Mean, battery level, atty resistance, power setting).

2. Clean and noalox the tube threads and the base of the battery spring.

3. Try a different/new battery. Stacked 18350s resolved my performance issue in a sense, but not achieving higher power output in a single battery configuration is still a problem. Also, make sure you have a quality charger.

4. Take out the battery and fire to discharge static. Perform a reset by holding the fire button down as you load the battery (display will show firmware version and battery voltage as it boots up. ALL settings will default and must be reset (particularly menu #s 8, 7, and 2/3). Until you remove the battery again, when the fire button is pressed you will see just the atty resistance for a second and then the normal display).

5. Try different power settings on different attys, keeping track of your battery voltage, resistance, set wattage/voltage, actual wattage/voltage, and current to determine if there is any discernable pattern related to voltage or current (This is where I'm at).

6. Check the internals for good connections (not there yet, and not planning to go there unless the problem gets worse. Not recommended for those who aren't mechanically and electrically adept).

 

[E squire]

Humm... I have had some very very curious experiences with kanger heads when I tight them down (huge variations in resistance... From 1.2 up to 2.8) BUT your v5 should give you the correct reading unless the resistance changes drastically during firering... I don't know what else it could be besides something on the board. Can you test another atty just to eliminate the possibility of the kanger head playing havoc?

Regards
Tony

Sent from my GT-I9195 through Tapatalk

Now that I'm in "special" debug mode after a reset, I am noticing slight resistance variance (usually only by .1 or .2). I'm using rebuilt protank coils. I'll also note that on my two protanks, I have 2 different airflow attachments (one with a ring that screws up and down to cover 4 airflow holes, another with a ring with a large airflow hole that gradually closes as it is twisted) with floating 510 center pins.

My battery level right now is 3.9v. Power is set to 15w. As the protank sits more "snug" on the 510 connection, I get a 2.3/2.4 ohm reading and output of 7.3 or 7.0w. If I loosen the protank a bit, the resistance goes up to 2.7 ohms and I get 6.5w output. Loosen it more, I get higher ohms and lower power output.

Only once, the resistance somehow dropped to 1.5 (probably over tightened) and the output showed about 11w.

I'm all the more committed to playing with different coil builds on my AGI now, partly since I expect I won't get the same resistance fluctuation (since there is no floating pin and no potential compressing of silicone grommets), but also because the fluke resistance drop and accompanying wattage jump seems to indicate that this is a voltage output problem rather than a current problem and I may be able to achieve higher wattage on a lower resistance coil. Stay tuned...

 

[PaulBHC]

I put the Sig on the counter while messing with stuff in the sink, swung my arm around and knocked it into the top rack of the dishwasher. It hit a cup and survived except for the chrome plastic IO button. It has a ding on the edge and part of that sticks up. I'll probably have to file it down someday. I only hope that the chrome doesn't peel and start slicing my thumb.

 

[yzer]

Now that I'm in "special" debug mode after a reset, I am noticing slight resistance variance (usually only by .1 or .2). I'm using rebuilt protank coils. I'll also note that on my two protanks, I have 2 different airflow attachments (one with a ring that screws up and down to cover 4 airflow holes, another with a ring with a large airflow hole that gradually closes as it is twisted) with floating 510 center pins.

My battery level right now is 3.9v. Power is set to 15w. As the protank sits more "snug" on the 510 connection, I get a 2.3/2.4 ohm reading and output of 7.3 or 7.0w. If I loosen the protank a bit, the resistance goes up to 2.7 ohms and I get 6.5w output. Loosen it more, I get higher ohms and lower power output.

Only once, the resistance somehow dropped to 1.5 (probably over tightened) and the output showed about 11w.

I'm all the more committed to playing with different coil builds on my AGI now, partly since I expect I won't get the same resistance fluctuation (since there is no floating pin and no potential compressing of silicone grommets), but also because the fluke resistance drop and accompanying wattage jump seems to indicate that this is a voltage output problem rather than a current problem and I may be able to achieve higher wattage on a lower resistance coil. Stay tuned...

Looks to me like you have poor electrical connections in your atomizer. How do you get readings of 7.3W? My V5 displays watts in .5 increments.

 

[yzer]

I put the Sig on the counter while messing with stuff in the sink, swung my arm around and knocked it into the top rack of the dishwasher. It hit a cup and survived except for the chrome plastic IO button. It has a ding on the edge and part of that sticks up. I'll probably have to file it down someday. I only hope that the chrome doesn't peel and start slicing my thumb.

The chrome is unlikely to be thick enough to cause injury. The plastic burr might be bothersome. Just file it off. Glad your Sigelei survived the dishwasher misadventure.

 

[E squire]

Looks to me like you have poor electrical connections in your atomizer. How do you get readings of 7.3W? My V5 displays watts in .5 increments.

I plan to test on my AGI - which lacks a floating positive pin and has no coil "head" with squishable grommets like the protank, and is thus presumably more accurate for testing - as soon as I can to perhaps rule a bad atty connection out or identify it as the issue. However, I recall (not specifically) this same issue coming up on that atty. Also, I wrap my coils similarly on that atty and usually hit around my 2.5 ohm target that I seem to achieve when I properly screw in my protank. I suppose I would get different resistance readings if I slightly unscrewed that one, too. But tests on the AGI are my next step.

And I can only select wattage in .5 increments, but it displays in tenths. If you're not having the issue I'm having (displaying power output lower than than set power), there's no reason you would see any other increment.

 

[yzer]

OK, I've just never seen a fired power display on the V5 or V3 in anything other than .5 increments even when I notice vapor production falling off with battery power at 3.2 to 3.3V. Then again, as you say my Sigeleis seem to work fine for me.

 

[yzer]

I just happen to have a battery at 3.3V right now and I watched the fired wattage display carefully as that last .10 of battery slipped away. I'll be darned. I saw displays of Low Vol, 6.5W, 5.4W, Low Vol, 5.7W, 6.1W, Low Vol and finally 5.1W before for the battery slipped forever into Low Vol territory. Never noticed that before.

 

[yzer]

I saw the different fire wattage readings because the discharged battery was not able to reach the power I selected for it (6.5W). The voltage on any battery will rebound a little if allowed to rest, allowing it to fire a few more times. Eventually the battery will stop rebounding, no longer fires at all and the display stays on Low Vol. I never took time to watch for this effect on the displayed power before.

 

[E squire]

I saw the different fire wattage readings because the discharged battery was not able to reach the power I selected for it (6.5W). The voltage on any battery will rebound a little if allowed to rest, allowing it to fire a few more times. Eventually the battery will stop rebounding, no longer fires at all and the display stays on Low Vol. I never took time to watch for this effect on the displayed power before.

This is how my problem operates. At a certain battery level, the v5 can't put out enough voltage to hit my set power/voltage. At any single battery level, though, it can't put out the higher power/voltages, and it will run hours that way before displaying low vol or shutting off.

It might be an current output issue, but my flukey protank coil resistance drop and power jump leads me to believe it is a voltage output problem. If the device thought the coil was around 1.5 ohms and was able to hit around 11w, then current limit doesn't seem to be the issue. I'm anxious to test this on my AGI RBA, but I'm in western New York, and it's in Ohio.

 

[ctruth]

Zmax V5
So nice..I bought it twice.

Just love the tactical feel of the firing button and the fact that the software doesn't go nuts if I accidentally double tap the switch.
AND, unlike some other VV's the software doesn't go nuts and need a 5 click if I happen to take a slightly longer vape draw.

EDIT: Oh yeah and the double 18350 feature - lasts a lonnng time. Great.

 

[yzer]

Glad you like the V5s ctruth. And welcome to the group!

 

[E squire]

As promised, here are the results of testing different resistance coils on an RBA.

Throughout the tests, I am using a fairly new (less than 10 charge cycles), fully-charged purple Efest 18650 2500mAh 35A high drain battery. The RBA is the Youde AGI with a simple single coil 2 post setup utilizing the RDA deck (rather than the genesis tank). My v5 has been reset and put into “debug” mode so I can check the resistance more readily with each fire. RMS mode is enabled.

All coils are 30 gauge kanthal and have been wrapped around a wire nail. While I do not know the precise diameter of the nail, it is almost identical to the inner diameter of a stock protank coil.

For each reading, I am firing at least three times (often more) to make sure readings are consistent. On the first set of tests on each coil, I set the device to “Power” and set power to 15w. I set the display to display power (aka “Display Voltage” in Menu 5) and record results. Then, I set the display to show current and record results. On the second set of tests on each coil, I set the device to “Voltage” and set voltage to 6v. I set the display to show voltage and record results. Then, I set the display to show current, but did not record results as it always matched the current displayed in “Power.”

Test start battery reading: 4.1v

Coil 1 – 4/3 wrap
Ohms: 1.6
Max W: 9
Current: 2.3
Max V: 3.9

Coil 2 – 5/4 wrap
Ohms: 1.8
Max W: 8.4
Current: 2.1
Max V: 4.0

Coil 3 – 6/5 wrap
Ohms: 2.1
Max W: 8.4
Current: 2.0
Max V: 4.3

Coil 4 – 7/6 wrap
Ohms: 2.4
Max W: 8.0
Current: 1.8
Max V: 4.5

Coil 5 – 8/7 wrap
Ohms: 2.8
Max W: 7.5
Current: 1.6
Max V: 4.7

Coil 6 – 9/8 wrap
Ohms: 3.0
Max W: 7.3
Current: 1.5
Max V: 4.9

By this time the battery had dropped to 4.0v after 110 fires, so I decided to retest a couple of the first coils:

Coil 1 – 4/3 wrap
Ohms: 1.6
Max W: 8.5 (-0.5)
Current: 2.3
Max V: 3.8 (-0.1)

Coil 3 – 6/5 wrap
Ohms: 2.1
Max W: 8.0 (-0.4)
Current: 1.9 (-0.1)
Max V: 4.2 (-0.1)

I did not run all of these tests in a stacked 18350 configuration. What I did do was fire a 2.7 Ohm coil at max power setting and got a max output of 12.4w; ran a 1.8 Ohm coil the same way and hit 15w; and ran a 1.4 Ohm coil the same way and got 15w until the coil blew (didn’t take long).

So, for those masters of Ohm’s law out there… What’s the analysis? What does this tell us, if anything, about my problem?

This seems to show a loss of output as the battery drains, even at near-full (4.0v) charge. It also doesn’t seem to be a particular voltage or amp limit, since those values varied throughout the tests.

 

[fairmana]

E squire, my guess would be that there's a component in your boost converter circuit that is out of spec or faulty (a surface-mount capacitor that can't charge up to it's full voltage capacity?). A faulty boost circuit is the most likely scenario since you don't have this output problem when you use the buck converter (2 x 18350's). For some reason, your boost converter circuit isn't able to take advantage of the full battery potential which translates to a reduced output power at the atomizer. The voltage being provided from the boost circuit will impact the amount of current available to put across your atomizer, since Voltage x Current = Power (or) Voltage^2 / R = Power.

When I compared your recorded max voltage outputs to those that I happen to have recorded using the same value atomizers, I'd say that your V5 is only putting out roughly 75% of the power that it should be. If you don't feel any excess heat coming from the upper part of the tube where the circuit card is, then you can assume that the missing 25% of the power is not being bled off as heat, but is instead never being drawn from the battery to begin with.

I'd recommend using your V5 in a stacked battery configuration if you can't send it back for a replacement. There is always a chance that the faulty component(s) could eventually completely fail and cause a major failure in your device keeping you from using it even in stacked mode. If single battery mode is important to you for reduced size and you want accuracy and reliability, you might want to bite the bullet and buy another V5 if you plan to stick with the ZMax. I'm hoping you still have some form of recourse and can send it back.

Best of luck, and again, sorry for the crappy situation with your V5.

 

[yzer]

I have taken a back seat in this discussion because I don't wind coils. For instance, I don't know how to calculate the effect wire gauge has on coils. I've seen the calculators for this (like Steam Engine) but haven't used them. I just don't bother with that stuff vaping in the carto tank world.

I do have confidence in what fairmana writes. It seems that your V5 is not producing enough output in single battery operation. Even I can hit 10W with a 2.0Ω single coil carto on a single battery.

This shouldn't deter you from buying another Sigelei V5. I don't think any of us have seen a problem similar to yours on this thread before so it seems like an isolated and seldom encountered defect. It was just your bad luck of the draw in getting that unit. Hope things work out better soon.

 

[michaelpet]

anyone ordered the v5 from fasttech recently, regarding shipping delays

 

[JeremyR]

Any reputable supplier should replace it!

It is showing a defect in the boost circuit. You should be able to hit 15w with the 2.4 ohm coil no problem.

Especially with the large amount of testing you can supply them. I would request a replacement and send them a copy of the results or a direct link to your post.

Which will be this -

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...t14216274.html?highlight=Masters#post14216274


I have had suppliers ship me the device first and then returned the defective unit for refund after reviving the new one. However I did pay upfront for the new device under the promise they would refund when the return was received. It's actually pretty cheap to send back it in a bubble mailer .