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I don't understand your rationale that safety and innovation can not co-exist together.
I'm against over-regulation when it comes to vaping. As they now read, the Deeming Regulations by the FDA would halt vaping progress if allowed to be set into law, but we're not entirely there yet. I'm hopeful that the Deeming will become more vape friendly in the future.
When it comes to advanced mass-marketed battery-operated systems like power tools, cell phones, laptops and hybrid electric cars, the system designers of those products have taken appropriate steps to make them "safe" for uninformed end-user use.
With e-cigs, we are not there yet. Vape gear is not regulated; it doesn't have minimal standards of build quality or quality control. Unless a novice vaper finds a forum like this one that promotes safe vaping practices, then that person can be considered to be an uninformed end user and at risk for injury.
Therefore, if we observe a pattern of unacceptable or suspect manufacturing in vape gear, I believe we must point that out to the vaping community. If we don't do it, who will?
The eLeaf iStick 50W had an unusual number of auto-firing issues, some of them resulting in fires. eLeaf's response was to say those units must be counterfeits. When victims were able to point out that their units were indeed authentic, eLeaf still wouldn't recall them or offer refunds. Eventually, that model was quickly replaced and eLeaf undoubtedly saved a lot of money by their inactivity. My point being, don't expect a Chinese manufacturer to own up to shoddy gear and to do the "right thing."
istick 50 watt exploded | E-Cigarette Forum
istick 50 watt exploded | E-Cigarette Forum
Most consumer battery operated devices are no where near the limit of the battery's operating limits. High-end flashlights, remote control cars/airplanes, and ecigs come to mind as applications that really push a battery's limits. With the RC toys the device is physically far removed from the person so a mishap is inconsequential. With ecigs a mishap is literally in the persons face or hand.
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It doesn't work like that.
The device pulling power from the charger is supposed to "ask for" what it needs, be it 0.5a, 1.0a, 2.0a, etc. If the power source is unable to provide what's requested, it's supposed to give only what it can. Say the device "asks" for 2.0a but the source only delivers 0.5a.
A well designed device says "Ok, I'll take it" and just takes longer to do what it was going to do.
If either the power source or the power consumer are poorly designed or simply malfunction, a dangerous amount of current flows and bad things happen,
The only thing that could have caused the event shown in that video is the battery in the device received far too much charging current. The device receiving the current is supposed to have something like a circuit breaker in it. It's supposed to recognize that there's too much electrical current flowing and it's supposed to open the circuit and stop the flow.
I am not disputing your experience in 2014! Your experience should clearly recognize the vast and fast paced changes in the industry! To have and hold on to a bias based mostly on those "prehistoric" experiences seems a bit unreasonable to me. But unless you only hold vaping to those standards, surely there are a plethora of other products and brands you hold to those same standards and not only avoid, but warn others of. Ergo, my first response.
I totally agree! There are a lot of posts complaining or inquiring about Smok products! And I not only read them, but try to use a bit of reason to hopefully get a grasp on any cause for each complaint. Seems to me many complaints are from new vapers, many of whom never post back with any resolution to their original "problem." Many of whom are just learning to use any vape gear. There are a good number of coil complaints, many of which are the result of poor priming/break in. So out of "all those Smok complaints", how many are known to be due to defects or poor QC and how many turn out to actually be user error or abuse? But all will be added to the list for "all Smok bad" proof. I just don't get or agree that "anything but Smok" posts are any benefit to anybody or insures their safety!
Look. I respect your vaping knowledge! I really do! I've even tagged you to help posters with battery questions or problems. But I cannot agree with your admitted bias against Smok.....or any other manufacturer of vape gear. If Smok were magically removed from the vaping world, do you really believe that world would be much, if at all, safer?
"If one's intent is to eliminating e-cigarette "explosions", that's advocacy against vaping." That's about thething I've ever read.
Well, just seems to me that any intent to eliminate vape gear explosions would be the elimination, or at least extreme reduction of, high powered batteries. Or requirements and regulations for fail safe equipment that would surely increase the cost, perhaps significantly. Or a combination of both. Non of which I see as beneficial to the vaping industry.
All this over 195 "reported explosions" over 8 years, 126 of which (65%) occurring while "in pockets, being charged, or in storage"......absolutely nothing to do with gear regardless of brand. And of the 60 reported "explosions" while "in use", no indication of how many were mechs or what batteries were being used. let alone brand of gear.
But for all vapers' safety, "anything but Smok!"
I am glad you wrote this, I was around as a lurker when the protected/unprotected controversy was in full sway. I think that I went to the dreaded "unprotected" (sounds dangerous) battery based upon some things you wrote way back. I got my AW's and used them exclusively for a long time. I know that your knowledge has helped many more people than you know.
I'll agree to disagree with both of your statements. A little bit about my personal vaping history:
I began vaping nearly 6 years ago. Back then, all that was available were cigalikes and the first mechanical mods. Battery choices for mods were extremely limited. I believe the Trustfire ICR batteries were recommended by my mod's manufacturer. In hindsight, years later, those were some of the worse batteries ever, but like I said the choices back then were very limited.
Well, only a couple months in, I had the unfortunate experience of having a battery explode in my mod. I was naturally rather upset by this. I was pretty naive about batteries, and began a rather intense research into the subject to educate myself.
I learned a lot about battery chemistry and battery safety. AW was just beginning to introduce the first IMR batteries, but the vaping guru's at the time were telling vapers to not use them because they were not "protected". Well, from my research I learned that IMR batteries were a "safer chemistry" which didn't need protection circuitry like ICR batteries had built into them. They were much less likely to flame or explode.
Rolygate (ECF manager and administrator) and myself wrote blogs promoting the use of IMR batteries instead of protected ICR batteries. I like to believe that both of us had something to do with making vaping a little safer by educating the community about battery choices. Today, using ICR batteries is considered to be obsolete.
Warning: Batteries for APV'sI sort of became an advocate of battery and vaping safety over the years. I worked in a vape shop in 2014, and got to experience a lot of which gear had the most returns because of poor quality control issues. SMOK was one of the worse brands...no, it WAS the worse brand; we could expect up to 1/3 of SMOK mods to be returned for any number of issues. The francise general manager eventually refused to deal with SMOK and stopped stocking them.
Battery Basics for Mods: IMR or protected ICR? (title has since been revised)
I casually view the topics on ECF, and I can't help but observe a higher frequency of SMOK issues related to quality control. Usually at least a couple a week. I'm amazed that no one else has picked up on this.
Yes, I am biased against SMOK products. That bias is based upon MY experience and my being an advocate for vaping safety.
"If one's intent is to eliminating e-cigarette "explosions", that's advocacy against vaping."
Really? That's about the most
An anology to your ideas would be that seat belts, air bags, anti-skid brakes, etc have not been benefitual in reducing injuries or even deaths in the automobile industry. Yes, these features used to be "optional" and eventually became "standard" features via government mandates to protect consumers, and undoubtedly increased the purchase price of cars. I for one am glad those mandates were made because we now have safer cars for everyone.
I said when it comes to advanced mass-marketed battery-operated systems like power tools, cell phones, laptops and hybrid electric cars, the system designers of those products have taken appropriate steps to make them "safer" for uninformed end-user use. Vape gear manufacturers have not done this.
As you said about vape gear, prehistoric technology has been replaced with modern technology. I don't believe we are there yet concerning safer vape gear, its only been made more powerful. We have a long way to go, regardless of the price.
If mechanical mod manufacturers would simply make vent holes in the proper place, it theoretically would eliminate exploding metal tubes when a battery vents. Eliminating direct battery mods would theoretically eliminate explosions when an uninformed novice puts on the wrong kind of tank. Adding an inexpensive insulator sleeve into the battery compartment would theoretically eliminate a battery from shorting out if the plastic wrapper is worn. Getting away from Lipo battery chemistry and going to safer chemistry hybrid-IMR battery chemistry would theoretically decrease potential battery explosions. These changes would not significantly increase the cost of vape gear, but would make them safer than what is currently available.
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THANK YOU!!!!!! There is enough "blame" to go around.
I get your analogy. But this is probably not the time or place to get into my opinions on invasive government intrusion into our daily lives. We already have a pretty good indication where government may/will/wants to go with vaping regulation and little, if any, has to do with safety.
I dont know about everyone else but Im going to charge my batteries when they need charged. if thats before bed or when ever. I put my charger in a Glass casserole dish and its placed so nothing flammable is near. Just keeping it real. You can prepare for the worst then if it happens your only out some batteries and a charger. In a perfect world you can be present for your charging but my scheduled dose not always give me that much time.
Forgive me, but I did have to chuckle reading that. Brought back to mind, when microwave ovens first came out it warned about not putting a egg, in shell and microwaving it for a "boiled" egg. Me being young, adventurous, and a bit of a rebel (I prefer adventurous) decided to put the egg in an old, very heavy glass casserole dish, with lid to confine the splatter. There I was, nose pressed against the glass, observing this eminent "explosion" when KA-BOOM! That sucker went off like a 12 gauge! Let's just say, cleaning up all that egg with embedded glass shards and fragments was a challenge.
But I'm feeling much better now!
LoL I did the same thing minus the dish. I do not put the lid on when I charge its simply there to stop anything combustible from catching fire if a battery were to vent. you can make charging a tin by drilling some holes in a tin and lining it with fire blanket material then you can put the lid on but fire blanket is lose woven fiberglass and Id rather not have itchy all over me every time i charge my batteries.Forgive me, but I did have to chuckle reading that. Brought back to mind, when microwave ovens first came out it warned about not putting a egg, in shell and microwaving it for a "boiled" egg. Me being young, adventurous, and a bit of a rebel (I prefer adventurous) decided to put the egg in an old, very heavy glass casserole dish, with lid to confine the splatter. There I was, nose pressed against the glass, observing this eminent "explosion" when KA-BOOM! That sucker went off like a 12 gauge! Let's just say, cleaning up all that egg with embedded glass shards and fragments was a challenge.
But I'm feeling much better now!
@OlderNDirt When there was a gas outage here, I was microwaving eggs in plastic Tupperware. I heated the water (stove/oven didn't work), dropped in the egg and put it all back in the microwave for a minute or something. There was no mess at all.
I take my poached egg, toss it on a plate and dig in with the fork. The yolk exploded, everywhere. On the ceiling, walls, windows, and floors... I since learned to poke a hole in the yolk before microwaving.
I take my poached egg, toss it on a plate and dig in with the fork. The yolk exploded, everywhere. On the ceiling, walls, windows, and floors... I since learned to poke a hole in the yolk before microwaving.
Government regs prohibiting possession and/or transporting "explosive devices" when coming home from the grocery store?
That's not how USB charging works though. The charger is inside the mod, the wall wart is simply a power supply. The charging circuitry inside the mod limits how much current is drawn, so using a higher rated wall adapter isn't dangerous (in fact, it's safer, because the wall adapter won't heat up as much).
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IMHO, this is another "ford vs chevy". Yes your gonna see issue with the Smok, because it seems to be the most popular at the moment.
The thing is, was it the fault of the product, or the fault of the user??? Sure they may say this or that happen, but they wont tell you what they could of done to help create the issue.
In the days of youtube, and people wanting to make money, get views, bla bla bla, I take allot of videos of this nature with a grain of salt.
My smok has been rock solid, friends of mine use the same thing, no issues. Now I am sure if we abused, dropped, did whatever to the mod, the mod may have the issues.
Now with the batteries, I am not sure how that falls back on the mod itself. Yes, I am sure there have been some Smok issues, I am sure there have been issues with mods from other companies, but what is truly the mod problem vs, mis use or abuse by the user themselves is the real question.
The thing is, was it the fault of the product, or the fault of the user??? Sure they may say this or that happen, but they wont tell you what they could of done to help create the issue.
In the days of youtube, and people wanting to make money, get views, bla bla bla, I take allot of videos of this nature with a grain of salt.
My smok has been rock solid, friends of mine use the same thing, no issues. Now I am sure if we abused, dropped, did whatever to the mod, the mod may have the issues.
Now with the batteries, I am not sure how that falls back on the mod itself. Yes, I am sure there have been some Smok issues, I am sure there have been issues with mods from other companies, but what is truly the mod problem vs, mis use or abuse by the user themselves is the real question.
C'mon people. They call themselves 'Smok' - the clue's in the name. 
On a serious note; MY personal experience is that Smok products are prone to failure at a higher rate than other of the bigger brands. Not necessarily catastrophic failure but poor QC. I put this down to the volume and variety of product that they put out. I'm with Baditude on this one.
On a serious note; MY personal experience is that Smok products are prone to failure at a higher rate than other of the bigger brands. Not necessarily catastrophic failure but poor QC. I put this down to the volume and variety of product that they put out. I'm with Baditude on this one.
The damages listed in the reddit thing were a little out there. Not the amounts, it just started out with the damages, and how he/she is going to get "them" to pay for it. It didn't strike me as someone who was sincere. That doesn't mean they aren't, it was just my immediate impression of it.
Just somehow it reminded me of people who brake check other cars, get into a crash, and then blame the car behind them and live off the insurance money.
Just somehow it reminded me of people who brake check other cars, get into a crash, and then blame the car behind them and live off the insurance money.
I own a number of mods from a wide variety of Chinese manufacturers and the only ones that have failed are from Smok.
I avoid Smok and built in LIPO devices. Easy decisions.
I avoid Smok and built in LIPO devices. Easy decisions.
You guys able to zoom in or something? I can't see that it's even an ecig more or less what brand.
The video makes it crystal clear to me.....................................USER ERROR!
Hear me out.....
Small gathering to watch a Honey Boo Boo marathon. Vaper has a sore and stiff neck after 8 hours watching a TV placed ridiculously high on the wall. Takes his vape with him on a bathroom break. Tries to take a hit in spite of only having one hand available at the moment. Tipping his head slightly downward, a sharp pain emanating from his neck shoots down into his arm, temporarily paralyzing his hand causing him to drop his vape. Yep! Right into the crapper! Not wanting to miss a single minute of Honey Boo Boo, he grabs the vape, quickly wipes it off, and returns to the show (not sure he even took time to wash his hands!).
While watching, he shakes water out of his vape, blows into the 510, and lets it dry.......for a bit. Finally tries a hit, but nothing. Figuring dropping it into the "dog's watering bowl" drained the battery, he hooks it up for a re-charge. The exhaustion from hours and hours of TV viewing (couldn't bring myself to type "Honey Boo Boo yet again! Oh, snap!) soon puts everybody to sleep.......well, except for the guy that ran out with the fire extinguisher.......he stopped watching 7 1/2 hours ago. And that my friends is when his battery finally vented!
The moral of the story and lesson to be learned? Never, ever watch Honey Boo Boo! (Dang! Did it again!) And if you do, heaven forbid, turn off that camera so there is no evidence of your actions!
Now admit it! Anybody go back and watch the video and look for where the TV was mounted?
Hear me out.....
Small gathering to watch a Honey Boo Boo marathon. Vaper has a sore and stiff neck after 8 hours watching a TV placed ridiculously high on the wall. Takes his vape with him on a bathroom break. Tries to take a hit in spite of only having one hand available at the moment. Tipping his head slightly downward, a sharp pain emanating from his neck shoots down into his arm, temporarily paralyzing his hand causing him to drop his vape. Yep! Right into the crapper! Not wanting to miss a single minute of Honey Boo Boo, he grabs the vape, quickly wipes it off, and returns to the show (not sure he even took time to wash his hands!).
While watching, he shakes water out of his vape, blows into the 510, and lets it dry.......for a bit. Finally tries a hit, but nothing. Figuring dropping it into the "dog's watering bowl" drained the battery, he hooks it up for a re-charge. The exhaustion from hours and hours of TV viewing (couldn't bring myself to type "Honey Boo Boo yet again! Oh, snap!) soon puts everybody to sleep.......well, except for the guy that ran out with the fire extinguisher.......he stopped watching 7 1/2 hours ago. And that my friends is when his battery finally vented!
The moral of the story and lesson to be learned? Never, ever watch Honey Boo Boo! (Dang! Did it again!) And if you do, heaven forbid, turn off that
camera so there is no evidence of your actions!Now admit it! Anybody go back and watch the video and look for where the TV was mounted?
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