SmokTech Telescope is air tight!

[synthros]

I have no expertise and no dog in the fight, but.....

Smoktech clearly acted, quickly and it would seem appropriately in direct response. That impressed me favorably.

Got vapes who I have not used before, I've heard OF them but don't know much about them - pulled the product and has offered a "corrected" product? That impressed me very favorably also, so much so that I'm going to check them out. It seems like most internet based e-cig operations are accurately classified as "small" businesses. Maybe they were just reacting to the bad press, but it sure seems like they put "doing the right thing for their customers" first, that impresses me too!

It certainly would appear that both smoktech and gv reacted to concerns about the safety of the product. I suppose it's possible that they took these actions while believing that there were no safety concerns at all and just wanted to shut down these concerns. However I don't believe that for a second.

That's just what it Looks like to me , I'll leave the technical details to those who are more experienced/expert. I'm just really glad to see pretty quick corrective action taken in regards to safety concerns, this kind of response bodes well for all of us and the industry as a whole. I realize some people want them to do more, and I think that may always be the case. Still feel better that some big names in this industry at least seem to be trying to provide "safer" products. Just my .02

 

[mostapha]

So, I thank sense Fields for his commentary and the vent holes are a necessary and welcome addition. But I agree with the people saying a hot spring wouldn't do anything.

Here's the thing: The mod telescopes. Shove a 2 cent for safety fuse in there. Or there's one out now (forget what it's called) that resets after a time. Or I think the Kick has some built in protection as well.

The only big problem I saw with it was that the likely failure points look like they're all pointing at your face. And if it does fail and you don't drop it from it being hot, it seems like it'd shoot the venting gas at your face…hence the need for vent holes at the bottom.

I'm still not going to buy one because I'd rather have a real empire, even if I have to pay 6 times as much for one……and failing that, it's not enough saved compared to a SB, BB, or Legacy or even a P+ to consider it with how ugly it is and the fact that it's just a piss-poor imitation of a mod that might no longer be made. But a little common sense goes a long way.

I mean……seriously……if you can fit a 2 cent for safety fuse in an unregulated mod, why not?

Props to GV for pulling it and treating their customers well, even if they're really of the opinion that it's not a big deal. I'll be buying more stuff from you.

 

[Mr.Self_Destruct]

This is what can happen when batteries go bad.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/gg/64570-gg-safety-tested-proved.html

You can be sure somebody somewhere would be stacking batteries in this Smok telescopic.

 

[Puffythegun]

I have no expertise and no dog in the fight, but.....

Smoktech clearly acted, quickly and it would seem appropriately in direct response. That impressed me favorably.

Got vapes who I have not used before, I've heard OF them but don't know much about them - pulled the product and has offered a "corrected" product? That impressed me very favorably also, so much so that I'm going to check them out. It seems like most internet based e-cig operations are accurately classified as "small" businesses. Maybe they were just reacting to the bad press, but it sure seems like they put "doing the right thing for their customers" first, that impresses me too!

It certainly would appear that both smoktech and gv reacted to concerns about the safety of the product. I suppose it's possible that they took these actions while believing that there were no safety concerns at all and just wanted to shut down these concerns. However I don't believe that for a second.

That's just what it Looks like to me , I'll leave the technical details to those who are more experienced/expert. I'm just really glad to see pretty quick corrective action taken in regards to safety concerns, this kind of response bodes well for all of us and the industry as a whole. I realize some people want them to do more, and I think that may always be the case. Still feel better that some big names in this industry at least seem to be trying to provide "safer" products. Just my .02

After a case of denial. This crap comes from communist China it's workmanship sucks and no one checked them when they arrived. Error was made but I can tell you every damn thing he buys from this day on will be checked. Somewhere maybe in a dream it hit him "it was found before anyone got hurt, it would have ruined me". He got an education, we all did. I hope his sticks in his gut for a long time. Safety must always be mission 1. The makers need to be ..... slapped for thinking we would miss this. They failed us and Gotvapes. They didn't look. They assumed. They shipped them. One look at the threads, we call those bad here. Total crap. It looked like a wiggle snake. Again we call that a fail here. It pivots but it's not supposed to,ever. No holes (120psi checked) tight. As best as I can see they lock up with less then 1 thread engaged. If even 2 were aligned it would remain aligned and rigid. 2.
I think the maker owes us a public apology. A fat one. Bad dog, no bone. Ya sneaky 's!
I got no dog here I just checked one out. I'm an engineer and my neighbor was worried.
It's crap like this that will get the govt sniffing our butts and lording over us.
You get what you pay for, a cheap knock off that's a piece of crap.
Buy American. If your nose gets blown off at least you can sue.

 

[Sense Field]

Hi guys!

I just got off of skype with someone talking about this.

So here is what I have learned...the holes will prevent the pressure during the thermal runway. When a battery swells, it is possible for the battery to block the holes, though it's also possible it won't. This depends on the placement of the holes.

The term "Hotspring" is wrong...it was made up when someone created a nonconducting spring.

What we actually thought we were talking about was a collapsable spring. Again, this will not stop the thermal runway, which is the events leading up to an explosion. *It can prevent the events that lead to the thermal runway (venting), which is higher then normal temperature of the battery.* (*This was added by another person I spoke with). So if a collapsable spring does collapse, then you did not have venting because venting is the thermal runway which leads to an explosion and the thermal runway can not be stopped.

Most important of all, I am wrong, the P+ does not have a "hotspring" or a collapsable spring. When I experienced the spring deforming, something else must have been going on.

I apologize for providing some information that was incorrect, though, I have been assured that the rest of the video is spot on and that the mod as it was, is extremely dangerous according to the person I was talking with.

So all said and done, we are safer with vent holes and if they can figure out a way to set up the bottom switch so that when tightened down it's not stuck on "always on" mode, we would be even better off.

 

[asha23]

Thanks for the video! I'll be avoiding this mod.

The question I ask is, why do Smoketech use the consumer as beta-testers for their products?

Dollars.

OK. With substandard cartomisers, and their new rebuildable tank, which by all accounts is terrible out of the box, I can accept this to a degree. But when it comes to tube mods. It's just completely unacceptable. Especially when safety is of paramount importance.

The naysayers early on in the thread are ridiculous. Also anyone who splits hairs about whether a balloon is operating at enough pressure, etc... Smoketech have admitted that the device is not completely safe. So next time you come on a forum to naysay, get your facts straight. PLEASE... Someone could believe your drivel and blow their teeth out.

Think a little bit before you post in future eh? The O.P. isn't fear mongering. It's explaining IN SIMPLE TERMS the shortcomings and potential issues with a new mod. A new mod which is potentially a pipe bomb no less. So instead of carping, perhaps show some appreciation for someone who is trying to help the community... Why not try and help the community yourselves, rather than splitting hairs just for the sake of it. It's annoying.

Er. If something is airtight. It's airtight. All more pressure will do is EXPLODE the mod... That's not venting.. Well it is, but not the sort of venting we are looking for here.

 

[whiskey]

Good job on the Vid, Sense...it was ground breaking...Kudo's for giving the consumers a heads up.

 

[AttyPops]

Kudos for the vid, Sense Field. I'd like to see the test while actually testing the thread "leakage"...not just 2 halves... although it's probably irrelevant now that they are making changes. Still would have been insufficient, I'm guessing.
Kudos to GV for the recall and fast response and $25 credit. I don't expect a reseller to be perfect...just to try to be, and correct when not.
Kudos to smoktech for making changes, thumbs-down for not having better standards ahead of time. Hope they put new standards in place for all future models and review existing ones.
Kudos to ECF for beating on the venting standards as much as practical.

Box mods still rule.
Fuses are good too.

 

[tj99959]

This is what can happen if a Li Ion battery goes thermal.
Lithium Ion Battery Explosion - YouTube
Now thinking that we can somehow control that force through the use of holes or slots is just plain ludicrous. The only real solution is preventing it from happening in the first place. Once the bomb has gone off ... it's to late!
LiMn chemistry is a step in the right direction, but IMO even they need a protection chip, and we should be demanding them from the battery manufacturers. The 2 cent fuse is a great addition. Protection ckts in APV's lessen the odds of a problem immensely. But after chatting with a thermal dynamics engineer at Alliant Techsystems ( ATK) all excessive venting holes or slots will do is weaken the outer shell of the "rocket" causing metal fragmentation to become more likely, and those metal fragments flying around could have the ability to kill.

So lets start thinking about how to prevent batteries from exploding instead of spending so much energy worrying about after they explode. There's no point to closing the gate after the cows have gotten out.

 

[AttyPops]

This is what can happen if a Li Ion battery goes thermal.
Lithium Ion Battery Explosion - YouTube
Now thinking that we can somehow control that force through the use of holes or slots is just plain ludicrous. The only real solution is preventing it from happening in the first place. Once the bomb has gone off ... it's to late!
LiMn chemistry is a step in the right direction, but IMO even they need a protection chip, and we should be demanding them from the battery manufacturers. The 2 cent fuse is a great addition. Protection ckts in APV's lessen the odds of a problem immensely. But after chatting with a thermal dynamics engineer at Alliant Techsystems ( ATK) all excessive venting holes or slots will do is weaken the outer shell of the "rocket" causing metal fragmentation to become more likely, and those metal fragments flying around would have the ability to kill.

OK TJ. But for regular Li-Ion batteries, we DO recommend protection chips/protected batts. For IMRs... it's a different reaction rate. I don't see where claiming vent holes make it worse is helping. Just my

Maybe it turns out that vent holes weakening stuff is bad... but I think at this point it's better than the air-tight solution. Yes, I caught the "excessive" part. But how do we know where that line is drawn?

Kudos for fuses and protection.

 

[Rocketman]

That must have been some really strong double sided tape

and the way the cell swoll all up, wow.

 

[cozzicon]

I've got a real problem with what sensefield did here.... That review was incomplete and misleading. I've always expected better of him since he's an experienced reviewer.

Here's the problem... being airtight allows the PV to be used as a flotation device in the event of flood, plane crash, or toilet overflow. Pretty innovative if you asked me.

It's really ignorant to trash a product like this because you're too stupid to understand it's enhanced features.

Shame on you SenseField!!

 

[b3ast1e]

I'm trying to be as generous and open minded as possible here but it's getting harder and harder to forgive this sort of thing.

I've found it increasingly tiresome having to put up with V1 long wick/V2 short wick /V3 long wick and not compatible with V2 BS - stupid little manufacturing wrinkles like end connectors that just aren't machined properly and cause damage to your PV, shorting CE3s that cause instant battery failure (but don't get a recall from vendors, just a price reduction and a warning at checkout....hello?!), copies of Lavatubes that don't switch off properly, counterfeit batteries being supplied in starter kits...this list just gets longer and longer.

I have always kept in mind that we're riding the crest of a wave here, we're essentially test pilots breaking records. So a lot of that comes with the territory. But these counterfeit copies of much better designed and manufactured devices, it's obviously not a cool thing, and every time we sucker ourselves into buying cheap knock offs we're causing boom time for the counterfeiters.And deep down we know we're throwing good money after bad - they probably won't last, you'll get little or no after sales support or access to spares (and everything will be smothered in epoxy anyway), and you can set your watch by version 2 coming out in a month or two, with some vital design oversight corrected...or made worse.

I'm not going to be buying a Smoktech PV any time in the future, especially when it takes community pressure to get them to remember to include vent holes - that would be funny if it wasn't so damned dangerous. I'd rather wait it out, put aside some extra cash and buy something I can see is manufactured to high tolerance using robust materials and with safety as a top priority.

And I sincerely hope that all vendors are taking very serious note of this specific issue because this is a good time to wise up - don't put the burden of proof on your customers when it comes to safety concerns just so you can get a quick turnaround and earn some fast cash - do the frigging work yourselves guys, save us from getting our faces blown off. I don't think that's too much to ask.

 

[Rocketman]

I still question the use of a 'party balloon' instead of the more reliable 'industrial grade' balloon.

Would you trust a 'party balloon' as a contraceptive?

 

[Rocketman]

Track record:
faces blown off by Chinese PVs versus faces blown off by U.S. made PVs?

 

[b3ast1e]

I still question the use of a 'party balloon' instead of the more reliable 'industrial grade' balloon.

Would you trust a 'party balloon' as a contraceptive?

Yeah maybe, if it's featherlite, for those who like a more sensitive party.

 

[tj99959]

OK TJ. But for regular Li-Ion batteries, we DO recommend protection chips/protected batts. For IMRs... it's a different reaction rate. I don't see where claiming vent holes make it worse is helping. Just my

Maybe it turns out that vent holes weakening stuff is bad... but I think at this point it's better than the air-tight solution. Yes, I caught the "excessive" part. But how do we know where that line is drawn?

Kudos for fuses and protection.

I understand full well what you are saying, but my point is that our thinking needs to become more proactive instead of reactive. For instance in my field of work we didn't think in terms of after an engine failure. Our efforts were in preventing engine failures.

 

[cozzicon]

Track record:
faces blown off by Chinese PVs versus faces blown off by U.S. made PVs?

I think the USA is winning with the PS mod that exploded from using radio shack CR123s. That is if memory serves.

There's been plenty of battery failures though. Including battery failures in protected mods like the Provari.

But if face-blasting is your criteria... USA has it.

 

[RobertH]

So a balloon put's out as much pressure as a venting battery? If this is true should it have blown up when he attached the battery? A better test would be to install an air valve on the body of the tube and then matched the pressure of a venting batter, and if it fails anywhere other then the area of the air valve addition then you got a failure. otherwise you are proving it will not vent the pressure of a balloon.
I see your point but your test only proves it will not vent the pressure of a balloon but does not prove it will not vent the higher pressure of a venting battery.
Thank you,Rob.

 

[Iffy]

Would you trust a 'party balloon' as a contraceptive?

Not any more...