Study I found on e-cigs

[Maurice Pudlo]

I consume around 30mg of nicotine based on the fact that I use 5ml of e-liquid per day that has 6mg/ml of nicotine.

My former smoking habit had me sucking down some 30 Marlboro Golds per day at what I think was 0.8mg delivered per cigarette smoked. That works out to be 24mg of nicotine per day.

Electronic Cigarette Nicotine Content | Electronic Cigarette Web

I'm pretty close to what I was in my previous days as a smoker, assuming the nicotine in my e-liquid is absorbed fully or at worst only 80%.

Metabolism and Disposition Kinetics of Nicotine

^^This study suggests Ph has a bit to do with the rate at which nicotine is absorbed when carried in smoke and a ton more great information. Take a look.

My personal {MODERATED} meter is pegged at zero for where remaining nicotine goes.

{MODERATED}

Maurice

 

[DKP#]

Comparison of the effects of e-cigarette vapor... [Inhal Toxicol. 2012] - PubMed - NCBI

Vapor diluted into a 40m^3 or a room ~8x13x13 feet poses "No Significant Risk" and cigarette smoke did.
No surprises there, but it hardly compares to vaping in a car with children.

Nothing wrong with Fear and Doubt, especially when facing an unknown. It's over confidence that can get you into trouble.
I'm not trying to stir the pot, but I am concerned that people may assume that this means it's completely safe or that others aren't exposed to nicotine. It doesn't say that and it's not uncommon for the government to revise what "Significant Risk" levels are.

 

[AndriaD]

Do you have a link to where you saw the 6mg per Cigarette. Because I believe that it is more like 0.6mg per cigarette.

Hmm... could be. I don't know the link right off the top of my head, but I'll see if I can find it again. I was looking it up to get some idea of what strength e-juice I should get.

Andria

 

[AndriaD]

Do you have a link to where you saw the 6mg per Cigarette. Because I believe that it is more like 0.6mg per cigarette.

Nicotine, Tar, and CO Content of Regular Cigarette Brands in 2007

Ok, that was the same pg I saw... I was confusing the tar and nicotine! So this explains a GREAT deal to me about why the 18mg and 12mg made me so godawful sick, if the cigarettes I was smoking, periodically rather than constantly, were only .5mg per cigarette!

And thank god I'm no longer getting 6mg of tar with every one!

Andria

 

[zoiDman]

...

And thank god I'm no longer getting 6mg of tar with every one!

Amen to that.

Not to mention the Array of Chemicals that are Added too Cigarettes and that are Produced when they are Burn.

 

[AndriaD]

Amen to that.

Not to mention the Array of Chemicals that are Added too Cigarettes and that are Produced when they are Burn.

Indeed; I had a very hard time during my 3rd week smoke-free, and asking around the forum, I gleaned info that suggested that 3 wks is the period necessary for MAOIs to be evicted. Considering that MAOIs are often prescribed for depression, and that I have struggled with depression my whole life, explained that hard 3rd week very well. Fortunately it doesn't last long, or it didn't for me; by the time the 4th week rolled around, I was feeling a great deal better. Of course some of my vapemail likely contributed to that!

But I don't want to try and imagine what the 3-month mark will be like, what other misc. stuff will be evicted at that time that will cause my mood to go south. Guess it's good that I'm already selecting the vape items I want for my "3 month vapeversary" -- I once made it to 3 months via cold-turkey, and started back -- so to me, 3 months is a BIG DAMN DEAL -- and husband knows this, and feels as I do, that I deserve some nice presents for making it that long and staying strong in my resolve to not smoke. I see an IBTanked in my near future... It will sure look nice with that Sigelei I'm ordering this weekend!

Andria

 

[KODIAK (TM)]

BTW - If all the Nicotine doesn't get Absorbed by an e-Cigarette User's body, where does it go?

You exhale it. So yes, those around you can get 2nd hand nicotine intake but I don't have any stats as to how much that is. My wife sometimes complains she gets a headache around me though.

I could perhaps be guilty of that ...so what is the right way please?

What I meant was... well, take me for example; On average I can get 15 "drags" from a normal king-sized cigarette. Comparing that to 15 hits of vapor delivers nowhere near the nicotine "state" I felt when I smoked. Even now, at 24mg I need to vape a lot to get that same nic fix. At least 45 puffs I'd say.

 

[MorpheusPA]

I'm never sure how to calculate this. My old cigs were listed at 0.1 mg (an ultra-ultra light). I got, theoretically, around 4.5 mg of nicotine per day.

But it took me 10 ml per day of 22 mg/ml to switch over successfully, or a total exposure of 220 mg per day.

Yet those two things worked out about the same as far as my body was telling me how I felt. Logic dictates that the automatic puff machines that measure nicotine are way the heck off.

Even today, my intake is 10 ml of 5 mg/ml, or 50 mg of nicotine per day. But at this point, I have so little addiction to it that I can walk away if I have to (I'm not happy about it three hours in, but it's tolerable).

 

[Pictor]

Thanks ...thought you meant there was some other way other than inhaling it into the lungs. Still, the 15 vs. 15 comparison is very easy to comprehend.

 

[rothenbj]

I have no idea what you're talking about. My cigarettes were ultra-lights; on the VA Slims website, it shows their nicotine content as 6mg.

The rest of that is somewhat irrelevant, as we can only measure by the scales we're given.

Andria

I don't think it's very easy to make comparisons. From what I've read and I don't consider myself an expert, cigarettes contain any where from 5mg to 12mg or so of nicotine but only like 10% gets absorbed by the body. I think that's why you say 6mg, but the absorbed nicotine may only be .6mg. I found quotes about ultra lights being at .5mg, I'm assuming that's the absorbed rate.

Now what hasn't been confirmed is the absorbed rate of vaped nicotine. Dr Etters has an ongoing study which I've been answering questionnaires for months. I received an email last week, after the latest survey, asking for a saliva sample. He may be able to shine some light based on his questionnaires and cotinine results as to absorption rates.

I know at 5mg and appx. 50 cigarettes a day, I was inhaling say 200mg of nicotine a day assuming 50mgs went up in sidestream. If ecigs and snus absorption rates are the same as cigarettes and I'm using 4-5 portions of 12mg snus a day, I'd need to be vaping somewhere in the neighborhood of 140-150mg of nicquid to be at the same level at the end of the day. Considering I'm vaping around 20mg nicquid, that would have me vaping 7-8mg a day. However I vape maybe a ml every couple days and that's more for advertising than need.

So what I'm basically suggesting is that we're comparing apples to apricots and there's more to whatever the reasons people smoke than just nicotine. We also know that the level of nicotine tolerable by each person will be self regulated byy how it makes them feel.

 

[Kent C]

I'm never sure how to calculate this. My old cigs were listed at 0.1 mg (an ultra-ultra light). I got, theoretically, around 4.5 mg of nicotine per day.

But it took me 10 ml per day of 22 mg/ml to switch over successfully, or a total exposure of 220 mg per day.

Yet those two things worked out about the same as far as my body was telling me how I felt. Logic dictates that the automatic puff machines that measure nicotine are way the heck off.

Even today, my intake is 10 ml of 5 mg/ml, or 50 mg of nicotine per day. But at this point, I have so little addiction to it that I can walk away if I have to (I'm not happy about it three hours in, but it's tolerable).

As Roly points out in some sticky that nobody reads, you can't compare smoke to eliquid or tobacco to vapor. The comparison that the study Lynn Dawkins makes in the video - it's the level of nicotine that reaches the blood that is comparable and I forget the exact cigarette content but the 18mg eliquid from 2nd generation ecigs was close to the equivalent of a cigarette whereas the same 18mg eliquid in a cartridge in a cigalike was way short. I'm with you on the 'what the body feels' part of it. Although that has changed as I've decreased my nic level since starting 5 years ago. I vape around 11mg and will hiccup (my early warning) at anything around 20+mg so my tolerance has changed as well.

 

[rothenbj]

Nicotine content in tobacco used in hubble-bubbl... [Saudi Med J. 2004] - PubMed - NCBI

 

[Bob Chill]

It's a tricky apples to apples comparison because it's not just the nicotine. It was touched on earlier in this thread. The big addiction to cigs is the whole chemical package. Especially the mood altering maoi aspect. If it was just nicotine then nrt's ould be wildly successful but we all know they suck. It's why they suck that makes it an interesting discussion.

Every vaper has the "hollow period" during the first month or 2. At least I think they do. I sure did. And I over nic'd on a regular basis chasing the "exact" effect cigs gave me. It's impossible to get that. And that's prob one of the main reasons many struggle early on or get frustrated and go back to cigs.

Once you shake the hollows it gets really easy and crazy enjoyable. I dropped my nic from 18 to 12 so I could vape more and get headaches less. Now I'm getting ready to go to 10 (I mix my own so I can go down in small increments). I've been at it nearly a year and I've found that the need for the act of vaping is more important than the nicotine. I could prob go zero nic if they could master the throat hit. I don't need a big hit but I have to feel it
bite. 6mg is too smooth to be satisfying to me. I'm sure it will be figured out eventually.

I don't think comparing nic to cigs and vaper is even worth the calculation. It doesn't mean much to the individual. You are either satisfied or not. Plus the delivery is so different. Cigs are designed to speed ball it to the brain. Ecigs casually deliver through the mouth, nose, and throat. It's mostly useless to deep inhale vapor. Your lungs can't absorb the big liquid molecules.

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

I can catch that nicotine buzz on 6mg/ml e-liquid with a certain build on my Genesis atomizers, I've replaced throat hit with a warm vape and killer flavor. It wasn't a difficult transition, in fact I went 18, 12, and now to the 6mg/ml in the span of 100 or so days.

I can see someone on clearos, or cartos sticking with the higher nicotine contents, you just aren't going to consume as much fluid per unit of time.

There is the data set I want to see, nicotine absorption over quantity of juice consumed, with groups of vapers who vape with a similar method.

Maurice

 

[rothenbj]

It's a tricky apples to apples comparison because it's not just the nicotine. It was touched on earlier in this thread. The big addiction to cigs is the whole chemical package. Especially the mood altering maoi aspect. If it was just nicotine then nrt's ould be wildly successful but we all know they suck. It's why they suck that makes it an interesting discussion.

Every vaper has the "hollow period" during the first month or 2. At least I think they do. I sure did. And I over nic'd on a regular basis chasing the "exact" effect cigs gave me. It's impossible to get that. And that's prob one of the main reasons many struggle early on or get frustrated and go back to cigs.

Once you shake the hollows it gets really easy and crazy enjoyable. I dropped my nic from 18 to 12 so I could vape more and get headaches less. Now I'm getting ready to go to 10 (I mix my own so I can go down in small increments). I've been at it nearly a year and I've found that the need for the act of vaping is more important than the nicotine. I could prob go zero nic if they could master the throat hit. I don't need a big hit but I have to feel it
bite. 6mg is too smooth to be satisfying to me. I'm sure it will be figured out eventually.

I don't think comparing nic to cigs and vaper is even worth the calculation. It doesn't mean much to the individual. You are either satisfied or not. Plus the delivery is so different. Cigs are designed to speed ball it to the brain. Ecigs casually deliver through the mouth, nose, and throat. It's mostly useless to deep inhale vapor. Your lungs can't absorb the big liquid molecules.

Yeah, I watch some of the younger guys doing deep lung hits and exhaling volume of vapor. I take 2 or 3 mouth puffs where most of the vapor escapes, then get the throat hit and exhale a wimp puff. It works for me.

 

[AndriaD]

I'm never sure how to calculate this. My old cigs were listed at 0.1 mg (an ultra-ultra light). I got, theoretically, around 4.5 mg of nicotine per day.

But it took me 10 ml per day of 22 mg/ml to switch over successfully, or a total exposure of 220 mg per day.

Yet those two things worked out about the same as far as my body was telling me how I felt. Logic dictates that the automatic puff machines that measure nicotine are way the heck off.

Even today, my intake is 10 ml of 5 mg/ml, or 50 mg of nicotine per day. But at this point, I have so little addiction to it that I can walk away if I have to (I'm not happy about it three hours in, but it's tolerable).

I smoked ultralights, the .5mg as we established, at my usual P.A.D., about 10mg per day. I vape probably about 5-10ml per day, it kinda depends on how many hours I'm awake (as did my smoking)... at 8mg, anywhere from 40-80 mg per day. But my body is clearly telling me (constipation) that I'm actually *getting* far less nicotine than I was with cigarettes. Yet I feel no cravings to speak of; since I don't work, I can vape pretty much at will, unless my hands are wet (common state for a housewife's hands!), and I feel completely satisfied, though it does take longer to reach that state in the morning, than it did with a cigarette -- it was very hard to ditch that morning smoke, it was the very last to go. So in the mornings I commonly use a blend that's about 9.5-10mg, then taper off to 8 or 9 after about 45-60 minutes.

So strange, that I'm *using* that much nicotine, yet apparently getting so little of it; it seems really odd to me that 12mg made me so ill. It's got to be the difference between smoking periodically, or vaping constantly.

Andria

 

[Bob Chill]

Yeah, I watch some of the younger guys doing deep lung hits and exhaling volume of vapor. I take 2 or 3 mouth puffs where most of the vapor escapes, then get the throat hit and exhale a wimp puff. It works for me.

I never got into chasing clouds. It's pretty cool seeing people do it at vape shops but isn't for me. I love a shallow inhale of a good pull and slow roll out the nose and mouth. Dripper or tank, it doesn't matter. I don't do sub ohm stuff either. Haven't the need for it. I tried it a few times and dropped it. I wrap 2.2 and push 10 watts into it and am totally satisfied.

But the wide range of creativity and preferences is part of the allure to the hobbyhabit. Putting a bic to the end of a Marlboro seems so lame and boring now. Lol

 

[Maurice Pudlo]

I'm a sub ohm vaper, well into my 40s. The sub ohm vaping is or rather was what made me drop my nicotine level almost instantly.

For me at least it isn't about big clouds but flavor, the two go hand in hand to some extent.

I've gone as low as 0.38 ohms, but now aim for 0.50 ohms most of the time.

My next drop in nicotine is not that far off, I'll go through the juice I have left over the next three weeks and cut myself down to 3mg/ml, I want to get to zero prior to some crazy taxation.

I've noticed that when I vape a juice at 12mg/ml the instant buzz is a bit less joyous than it once was, I think that's a good thing, I am tired of the ups and downs of nicotine now-a-days, its much nicer to have a nice stable feeling throughout the day.

Maurice

 

[Kent C]

Good posts... and remember that's "Candy apples to Candy apples comparisons"

 

[Jake6731]

The OP linked to Dr Farsalinos' study on nicotine absorption from electronic cigarette use that does a pretty good job of comparing the blood plasma levels achieved by the user of first and second generation e-cigarettes versus tobacco cigarettes:

"The results of the study showed that nicotine absorption from e-cigarettes was significantly lower compared to tobacco cigarettes. In reality, 5 minutes of use led to 1/3rd to 1/4th plasma nicotine levels compared to smoking 1 tobacco cigarette. "