sub-ohm is it really relevant???

[NicoHolic]

...check out the Micro coils for Reo's.... RM2 threads... you'll find that what started out (by SuperXdrifter) as conventional resistance LR/SR 1.5 to 2.5 ohms, has shifted to a lower norm; slightly larger diameter coil (we're talking fractions of a mm)... still very small (Reomizer2 is a small b/f dripper)

i like them at .6 to .8 Ohms; 7 or 8 wraps; 27g, 28g nichrome... 1.8mm ID... very nice because you get faster response and everything else...
Those experts there (a lot better than me, including pdibs) will tell you its the best; imy opinion is that its the best I've gotten out of a Reo, but so far a Genesis or larger rda gives me better flavor...i have a hunch they mean because its easier to set up.

THE MICRO COIL MOVEMENT HAS LARGELY MOVED TO SUB-OHMS. Some still use micro coils at super-ohms, and get a decent improvement, but they're becoming the minority as more migrate. Some of us go a little lower (0.5Ω) and prefer a little thicker wire (26 AWG Nichrome and Kanthal) but 8 wraps is still about the most popular. Some of us still like 1/16" drill bits or 16 gauge filler needles to wrap on. Flavor gaps or micro gaps, as well as coil position, and air hole size can effect flavor. But it's all good. A big thanks to ukeman for this post. Referenced threads are here.

What arguably began in REOville

Micro Coil for the RBA on your REO

spread to RBA Systems

Micro Coils to increase Vapor, flavor & TH

 

[dr g]

wow; 20 watts..and HR, that's rare.

yeah, the small diameter may be for smaller atomizers ... i'm waffling on what diameters to use on a micro in a larger RDA tank ie. with lots of room, and high pos/neg posts...
or even a Genesis wick/coil set up...

i guess some of your explanations have been going over some heads (like mine)....
please explain in laymans terms if possible. Why should sub ohms and mechanicals not be here to stay? imo they are the cats meow

Because the main stumbling block right now with trying to do what subohm coils do is the power regulated devices can put out. By far most of the common ones top out at 15w, which is as mentioned right about in the high-subohm unregulated range. Once we see more devices in the 30+ watts range, we may start seeing regulated devices doing everything you can do right now with subohm.

I think regulated has the potential to scale far beyond subohm as well.

THE MICRO COIL MOVEMENT HAS LARGELY MOVED TO SUB-OHMS. Some still use micro coils at super-ohms, and get a decent improvement, but they're becoming the minority as more migrate. Some of us go a little lower (0.5Ω) and prefer a little thicker wire (26 AWG Nichrome and Kanthal) but 8 wraps is still about the most popular. Some of us still like 1/16" drill bits or 16 gauge filler needles to wrap on. Flavor gaps or micro gaps, as well as coil position, and air hole size can effect flavor. But it's all good. A big thanks to ukeman for this post. Referenced threads are here.

What arguably began in REOville

Micro Coil for the RBA on your REO

spread to RBA Systems

Micro Coils to increase Vapor, flavor & TH

I think high resistance stacked coil has a ways to grow.

 

[Ryedan]

That's what I thought too NicoHog, but I haven't hung out in those forums too much lately so wasn't sure. Good to know there is a bunch of info there for me when I start experimenting.

 

[jasl90]

I'm using stacked coils the way most people use "micro coils," but I like a more encompassing term since the coils I've been building are not micro diameter. I'm doing that to get more wire mass, luckily I can push enough voltage through to still get full wattage (see left). Returns results comparable to subohm coils with a 3+ ohm coil, at a given wattage. I also use silica so I need more wick mass.

Gotcha... New term... I like it.

I don't know, in theory we should be able to achieve everything that is achievable with subohm with regulated devices of the appropriate specifications. Once that happens, we may see subohm become rarer and rarer.

I think there will always be a place for purely mechanical devices. If for no other reason, a single person can fire up a lathe and turn out something beautiful without haveing to be an electrical engineer too. IMO, there's something very special about vaping a device that one person made from scratch, start to finish, in his workshop.

That said, my dream device... It would be a fixed 5 volt circuit with a 10 amp limit. Just like our current mechs, you'd control the output power with the resistance of the coil... You'd just be wrapping coils for a 5 volt fixed power supply instead of a 3.9 to 3.4 volt unfixed power supply.

 

[ukeman]

Because the main stumbling block right now with trying to do what subohm coils do is the power regulated devices can put out. By far most of the common ones top out at 15w, which is as mentioned right about in the high-subohm unregulated range. Once we see more devices in the 30+ watts range, we may start seeing regulated devices doing everything you can do right now with subohm.

I think regulated has the potential to scale far beyond subohm as well.



I think high resistance stacked coil has a ways to grow.

oh yeah, you know when i started out on a mech-rampage, finding some good ones, I was thinking, a DNA20 would be great because it can go to 20w.
Problem; not recommended for less than 1.0 Ohms...

You may be on to something dr g... you are using HR coils... omg don't have the time for that; because there's very little info out there.
Are you using RBA with HR coils ?

 

[dr g]

oh yeah, you know when i started out on a mech-rampage, finding some good ones, I was thinking, a DNA20 would be great because it can go to 20w.
Problem; not recommended for less than 1.0 Ohms...

You can actually go down to around ~0.6 ohms on it

You may be on to something dr g... you are using HR coils... omg don't have the time for that; because there's very little info out there.
Are you using RBA with HR coils ?

Yeah I'm doing it on Octopuses right now. Casually looking for other options.
I posted a pic of my first one here: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...working-wick-coil-setup-147.html#post10374044

Totally down and dirty build, wrapped it right on the silica and pinched the coils together after glowing them. That's not quite enough wick so my current one is 28g with 3x 3mm wick that i wrapped semi-nicely on a 5/32 drill bit. Keeps up real well.

 

[NicoHolic]

Some of us are into mechanicals, not just for the higher power, but for the robust and elegant simplicity. If TSHTF, many of us can build or rebuild them ourselves, as most of us do our RBAs. Our batteries work, and work hard with sub-ohms, but in the upper half of their charge when they're the strongest. Most pull them for charging at or above 15W. Regulated mod batteries are worked hardest, as hard as higher sub-ohms, when they're the weakest. Guess which last longer. I'm not bashing regulated mods here--just explaining why mechs will always be popular to some of us.

 

[kimbo55]

i'm using a protank at 1.5ohms and it performs great at 15 watts.

What is your wick set up?? Waiting to get a protank ll mini when I can find one!!

 

[dr g]

Some of us are into mechanicals, not just for the higher power, but for the robust and elegant simplicity. If TSHTF, many of us can build or rebuild them ourselves, as most of us do our RBAs. Our batteries work, and work hard with sub-ohms, but in the upper half of their charge when they're the strongest. Most pull them for charging at or above 15W. Regulated mod batteries are worked hardest, as hard as higher sub-ohms, when they're the weakest. Guess which last longer. I'm not bashing regulated mods here--just explaining why mechs will always be popular to some of us.

My regulated mods are actually significantly more reliable than the mech mods I see regularly. Mech mods are pocket battery shorters and their switchgear takes a commensurate beating. There's a reason all modern electronics have moved away from that. And I'm not saying this because I dislike mechs. It's hard to say what the trends and technology will bring us in the future.

 

[kimbo55]

A micro coil is not a new thing. Have you ever looked at a coil in a cartomizer ? It does not compare to sub ohm vaping. Yes the big clouds look cool, but the flavor, and nic hit are awesome ! I just don't understand why ppl have to knock something they haven't even tried ????

If anyone says that sub ohm vaping is harsh. Lower the nic, and you'll be amazed.

Great nose plume Jimi D.

 

[ukeman]

You can actually go down to around ~0.6 ohms on it



Yeah I'm doing it on Octopuses right now. Casually looking for other options.
I posted a pic of my first one here: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...working-wick-coil-setup-147.html#post10374044

Totally down and dirty build, wrapped it right on the silica and pinched the coils together after glowing them. That's not quite enough wick so my current one is 28g with 3x 3mm wick that i wrapped semi-nicely on a 5/32 drill bit. Keeps up real well.

i have a DNA20 box mod (Duggout)...Brandon at Evolve says not recommended below 1.0 Ohms...
I know this is controversial but can you say with confidence its ok?

i love the readout ... and it works great.

 

[dr g]

i have a DNA20 box mod (Duggout)...Brandon at Evolve says not recommended below 1.0 Ohms...
I know this is controversial but can you say with confidence its ok?

i love the readout ... and it works great.

100% confidence. go for it! you could try at .8 or .9 at first to get confident

 

[ukeman]

100% confidence. go for it! you could try at .8 or .9 at first to get confident

Just letting you know I "Went for it"...
.7 Ohms iGoL (27g kanthal 8-9 wraps micro. Cotton puff wick. 1.5mm wick ID) wow...

You know the really cool thing about a regulated device that can go up that high (DNA20 up to 20w) is that you can test what various wattage does to a sub ohm (or super ohm) coil...love Evolv with readout ++...

So depending on the juice as well, various wattage = dialing in your sub ohm.

i.e. at .7 Ohms at 10 to 11w (3.2v!)some juice tastes better ; plenty of vapor and t/h

up it to 15w or more and vavoom... with enough juice you do get something close to "cloud chaser"... and still no scorched juice.

what amazes me is seeing the readouts and approximating a mech device (3.6v +/- .2 - taking into account v/drop)... when i was a "regulated" dripper for a few years with Provari, I learned a lot; here is another opportunity to really "get inside" the vape with such devices (DNA20).

One question i have is how is the battery usage when you are getting super vapes even at 12w and .7 Ohms... i mean thats like 3.2 or 3.3v.... i would think negligible.... what about at 15w or 20w?
Bear in mind, 15w /.7 ohms is a mere 3.4v....!

3.7v @.7 ohms = 18w....

 

[dr g]

The battery life is related directly to the output wattage, with some variation for efficiency. Usually it is most efficient at the highest voltage output.

The resistance of the load attached is irrelevant to the draw the battery sees since the regulator controls the power output; on a mech you would be drawing max power possible through the load at all times.

 

[gokusnimbus]

there's a huge misconception that sub-ohms will burn your juice. how does it burn when the juice is vaporized and new juice replaces the vaporized juice? if there was no air flow, for sure it will sit and burn itself to toast. when you add air-flow into the mix and a fast wicking coil, you will never burn juice.

sub-ohms explode with more flavor and vapor and faster than standard/higher resistance coils hands down. i love firing off juice on a fresh sub-ohm coil. POP! SIZZZZZZZZLE!

my rebuildables are always .75 - .9 ohms. my style of vaping: lots of vapor + quick mouth hits. if i want even more vapor, slow down the inhale.

sub-ohms bliss!!

 

[suspectK]

if u have a vv device u dont need subohms. subohms r what people use on mechanical mods to turn the power up. they dont have any other way to adjust power like u do with a vv device. QUOTE]

This should be under a FAQ section. VV/VW FAQ...solve a lot of forum clutter.

 

[ukeman]

The battery life is related directly to the output wattage, with some variation for efficiency. Usually it is most efficient at the highest voltage output.

The resistance of the load attached is irrelevant to the draw the battery sees since the regulator controls the power output; on a mech you would be drawing max power possible through the load at all times.

heh i don't even understand that dr g, but after an hour with this set up; .7 Ohms micro coil on a DNA20 box mod, I'm finding i really like it at 9w !... according to the readout on the DNA20 that is like 3.4v (it reads 3.4 even at 10+w whereas before it showed lower for some reason)...
I think its the micro with 27g kanthal... good response and good flavor (cotton ball wick is good too)

wow... don't mean to confuse anyone, but i just set it to 7w; still reading 3.4v and still great vape! I can take longer draws and i bet the batt will last longer.

the DNA20 Duggout mod uses an 18650 and at 18w i will drain it in 20 min! lol. Good thing its a pass-thru functional....

 

[dr g]

In short it just means that you'll get similar life as any other resistance coil at the same wattage!

 

[ukeman]

there's a huge misconception that sub-ohms will burn your juice. how does it burn when the juice is vaporized and new juice replaces the vaporized juice? if there was no air flow, for sure it will sit and burn itself to toast. when you add air-flow into the mix and a fast wicking coil, you will never burn juice.

sub-ohms explode with more flavor and vapor and faster than standard/higher resistance coils hands down. i love firing off juice on a fresh sub-ohm coil. POP! SIZZZZZZZZLE!

my rebuildables are always .75 - .9 ohms. my style of vaping: lots of vapor + quick mouth hits. if i want even more vapor, slow down the inhale.

sub-ohms bliss!!

that about says it all... when you compare this to conventional atomizer vaping it IS like showboating; but wth, its amazing coming from that perspective. It's like "this is how it should be".
I love vapor production, but my first interest was better flavor... with sub ohm you get both.

I will say its a bit easier with a regulated VW that will take sub ohms though since you can dial in your sweet spot; on a sub ohm coil yet!

I gotta say I know and respect a lot of LR/SR RBA vapers though...

 

[ukeman]

if u have a vv device u dont need subohms. subohms r what people use on mechanical mods to turn the power up. they dont have any other way to adjust power like u do with a vv device. QUOTE]

This should be under a FAQ section. VV/VW FAQ...solve a lot of forum clutter.

? the point is also: you cannot use sub ohms on a VV device; its regulated to not fire under a certain resistance.