That didn't last long

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Robino1

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I'm assuming as you're a member, you're not referring to the CASAA links :glare:

Soo.. tobacco/absolute is not a carcinogen and it's cool that we heat tobacco up to a high temp and vape it?

I am a member of both CASAA and ECF. Sorry, I really don't mean to offend you. :nun: It just hit my funny bone wrong.

I personally don't believe that Naturally Extracted Tobacco have carcinogens in them. I don't know much about absolutes nor do I know about WTA's. I use NET liquids. I would be more wary of the WTA's only because more of the chemical compounds of the tobacco are extracted. With NET's, they are just getting the flavor from the tobacco.

My take on the whole thing, just my opinion only, the burning of the tobacco and paper causes the chemistry of the cigarette to change. The result from Burning and the Smoke from the combustion of all those additives in addition to tobacco, are what causes the carcinogens to come about.

Tar is a very nasty byproduct of burning a cigarette. I feel the I'm using a HEALTHIER alternative. 100% free from danger? I don't believe it is. Nothing can say that it is 100% good for you. But I don't believe I'm putting myself in danger. I am using something that is by far(!) less riskier than smoking traditional cigarettes.
 

Dougiestyle

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Didn't The Sun publish a story about a woman who was abducted by aliens and gave birth to a half-alien baby or some such malarky? Seems like a legitimate source of media to base educated decisions upon. As a matter of fact, I think the required reading for this semester's course on Naiveté 101 is The Sun!

I extract tobacco flavoring from a house cavendish. I have felt no ill effects. In fact, it's quite satisfying!
 

AgentAnia

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I'm assuming as you're a member, you're not referring to the CASAA links :glare:

Soo.. tobacco/absolute is not a carcinogen and it's cool that we heat tobacco up to a high temp and vape it?

You have been given some good information on this thread, and suggestions for some good reading on the subject. I get the distinct impression that your mind is already made up on this, and quite honestly, my personal advice to you would be that for your own peace of mind, you stop vaping immediately, as clearly the dangers you perceive outweigh the benefits you might obtain.
 

Vocalek

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So are you saying tobacco absolute, nicotine and/or extract does not contain any carcinogens?


I'm trying to make an informed decision. If I believed everything that came from a single source/group I'd be very foolish.

I hate to quote them, but they are considered the experts in this area:

Carcinogens do not cause cancer in every case, all the time. Substances labeled as carcinogens may have different levels of cancer-causing potential. Some may cause cancer only after prolonged, high levels of exposure. And for any particular person, the risk of developing cancer depends on many factors, including how they are exposed to a carcinogen, the length and intensity of the exposure, and the person's genetic makeup.
SOURCE: American Cancer Society Known and Probable Human Carcinogens

Also, it is important to keep in mind that the smaller the quantity, the less likely people are to develop cancer. I give you for example, the fact that an FDA-approved nicotine patch contains exactly the same "carcinogens" as a gram of e-liguid -- 8 nanograms. There are no cases of cancer that have ever been linked to wearing a patch. A 4-mg piece of nicotine gum contains 2 nanograms, but people chew up to 10 pieces a day. Many former smokers continue chewing the gum for the rest of their life, to prevent relapse. Again, no case of cancer has ever been linked to gum.

You can believe what you want to, but as for me, I believe that my risk of cancer would be MUCH higher if I had continued to ingest over 100,000 nanograms per day from smoking rather than switching to vapor.
 

Vocalek

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ECF Veteran
Please don't worry about this...

249-252 Nitrates, nitrites and nitrosamines - Food Intolerance Network

Shows that nitrosamines are not a tobacco product.. They are a plant product, basically

Nitrosamines are chemical compounds. They can be found in foods and various other products. Tobacco-specific Nitrosamines (TSNAs), as the name implies, are only found naturally in tobacco. There are several different types of TSNAs, and some are considered more carcinogenic than others. Tobacco-specific nitrosamines - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That being said, the quantities of TSNAs that have been found in e-cigarette vapor are so miniscule that they aren't worth worrying about. You'd be exposed to higher quantities of nitrosamines (though not of the TSNA type) in a restaurant that charcoal broils some of the food.
 

Robino1

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I tried to look up tobacco absolute but couldn't find anything quickly. I know it is a flavor that is sold and used to create tobacco flavored liquids. It is different from NET liquids in that Absolute is a more concentrated flavor? It gets confusing because both do come from the tobacco leaf. How they differ? Not exactly sure. I do know I do not like the flavor of absolutes.

There is a good source in The Natural Tobacco thread in the General E-liquid section. It is HUGE though.

They are special terms and do mean certain things. There is Naturally Extracted Tobacco (NET), tobacco absolute and the ever controversial WTA. WTA stands for whole tobacco alkaloids. There are those that need that extra that the WTA's provide to stay off cigarettes.
 

Uma

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The OP has me worried. The patch and the gum literally do have countable traces in every single dosage. The ecig have NEGLIGIBLE traces.
I tried to quit smoking, for most of my life, by using the Pfizer patch, Nicorette gum, etc... Repeatedly throughout the years. If the OP's concerns are valid, then this means I not only received carcinogens from my previous smoke habit, but the carcinogens were multiplied every time I used CDC promoted products such as the patch, gum, lollipops, inhalers,
They KNEW this? They knew about the real Traces but convinced me I was safe using their products??? Yet they turn around and try to convince me that Negligible traces are worse for me and I should refrain from negligible traces and return to their definite traces found in big Pharma products that are approved by the FDA?
I am so angry right now, I probably shouldn't be typing. But I feel it's important to warn anybody else who might be tempted to believe that the patch is safe like they tell us it is. Be very careful! You are applying a known trace carcinogens onto your bodies, and even inside your bodies, as the nicotine orbs, gums, lollipops dissolve.

Thank you for bringing me to my senses, OP!!!!
 

Nermal

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I share your feelings on typing while angry, Uma, but you haven't said a thing that shouldn't be said, nor anything you wouldn't want to defend later on.

Thanks Robin. I think you've pretty much covered the possibilities of what the term might mean. I do worry about replying is such a case, as sometimes one can later realize the op was talking about something entirely different. Words have meanings, but not always universal meanings.
 

Penn

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The OP has me worried. The patch and the gum literally do have countable traces in every single dosage. The ecig have NEGLIGIBLE traces.
I tried to quit smoking, for most of my life, by using the Pfizer patch, Nicorette gum, etc... Repeatedly throughout the years. If the OP's concerns are valid, then this means I not only received carcinogens from my previous smoke habit, but the carcinogens were multiplied every time I used CDC promoted products such as the patch, gum, lollipops, inhalers,
They KNEW this? They knew about the real Traces but convinced me I was safe using their products??? Yet they turn around and try to convince me that Negligible traces are worse for me and I should refrain from negligible traces and return to their definite traces found in big Pharma products that are approved by the FDA?
I am so angry right now, I probably shouldn't be typing. But I feel it's important to warn anybody else who might be tempted to believe that the patch is safe like they tell us it is. Be very careful! You are applying a known trace carcinogens onto your bodies, and even inside your bodies, as the nicotine orbs, gums, lollipops dissolve.

Thank you for bringing me to my senses, OP!!!!

FDA also approved those cessation devices for longer use than directed not long ago. Yeah, the FDA cares.

I successfully used the patch (depending on definition of success) to be nicotine free for 6 months once before. After going back to smoking the patch didn't cut it when trying again more than a few days. I did use the patch in situations where I knew I couldn't smoke for an entire day but after 2 or 3 days I had the symptoms that both overdose and withdrawal have in common.
 

Orb Skewer

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JD4x4

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By all means the op should do his/her own research using sources he/she deems credible. I did.
Flavoring contents are their own subject, but nicotine itself is not carcenogenic if its a reasonably pure extract and not heated to temps WAY higher than we vape at (as was the case in the French study). I'll trust the available body of scientific studies out there until real world vape-specific long term study results have been done. Meanwhile, I KNOW tobacco cigarettes will most likely kill me, and I've made MY choice. Everyone has their own threshold of truth.

addendum- Just pay VERY close attention to real numbers, studies that represent actual vaping conditions.
As for formaldehyde, look up how many sources of it there are in life, and how & what temperatures generate it. Same with the nitrosamines.
 
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Stubby

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Today a UK newspaper published an article about E-cigs and how they've found carcinogens such as formaldehyde in the tested juice (sure you've all heard). I always assumed people smoked for the nicotine but died from the smoke.. that got me thinking about tobacco and nicotine and realised people have died from chewing tobacco. With every other vendor now claiming "natural tobacco" and many juices containing tobacco absolute I'm starting to worry about the carcinogens in E-cigs.

Of course vaping is the healthier option but should I now avoid any tobacco flavours?

Lew

P.S.
After reading all of the main threads on the subjects I'm still clueless as to the difference between Whole Tobacco Alkaloid, Absolute, and Extract so if anyone can sum it up for me that'd be great.

Your basic premise is false. The studies haven't been able to find any connection to cancer from western smokeless tobacco since 1990. There has been a lot of conditioning (brainwashing) in the past 30 years about the dangers of tobacco. The fear we are seeing and that you express are a result of that and not the actual science.

Just so you know there are at least 20 carcinogens in roasted coffee. Sounds scary.... but of course the studies have never been able to link roasted coffee with cancer.

Swedish snus has been studied for over 40 years. Snus is certainly a tobacco product but again, no connection to cancer can be found.
 

FINNIX

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Tobacco absolute is used in many tobacco flavoured e-Juice. From my understanding it's a very concentrated extract.

You'd be exposed to higher quantities of nitrosamines (though not of the TSNA type) in a restaurant that charcoal broils some of the food.

We aren't eating "charcoal grills" food 40 times a day, 7 days a week though.
 
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Kent C

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Tobacco absolute is used in many tobacco flavoured e-Juice. From my understanding it's a very concentrated extract.



We aren't eating "charcoal broil" food 40 times a day, 7 days a week though.

But that's her point. You don't have to eat them 40 times a day and 7 days a week because of the higher quantities in just one meal vs. the miniscule amount in vaping. Vaping may not be for you, but you might also question your choice of vegetables...

MMS: Error

... even though there may be some benefits of nicotine:

Eating nicotine-containing produce like peppers, tomatoes may lower Parkinson's risk - CBS News

FORCES International - Archive
 
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