It may be a little late in the game but the truth is working it's way into the mainstream media
FDA went way too far on e-cigarettes: Opposing view
FDA went way too far on e-cigarettes: Opposing view
The debates not over - FDA went way too far on e-cigarettes
- Thread starter Marc411
- Start date
- th_trl_thread_readers 0
- Status
Most vapers have been lazy about the politics. May be that will change now. The British vapers can vote themselves out of the EU in a close vote. American vapers might send Trump to the White House. If he gets there I want him to replace as many people as possible and don't worry who they are. Interfering with vaping is genocide. I've had enough of all of them.
Yeah... Or if Trump obtained the Oval Office, he might see BT reaping All the Profits of a Regulated e-Cigarette Market as a Good Thing?
Hard to say what Any Political Candidate might Do? Given that there is a Long Line of Broken Campaign Promises and 180's on Policies by BOTH Parties.
Couple that with What has Any Candidate even said about e-Cigarettes?
Perhaps.
But at my age, I have seen Many Candidates who say One Thing, and then once in Office either Do Nothing or Doing Something Different.
And Any President Can't really do Much Anyway. It would be up to Congress to make the Changes.
The deeming regs can, should, and very likely will, be challenged in court as arbitrary and capricious, with no basis in science.
Copying and pasting what I said on another thread about the article:
...................................
Good article. It's a guest editorial in USA Today. ANTZ will point to the disclosure at the bottom of the page, and say COI bias.
Here's USA Today's editorial staff's opinion:
FDA takes e-cigs out of 'wild West': Our view
(Link broken. Copy and paste.)
I disagree. A sympathetic president could easily order his new Secretary of HHS to not enforce these regulations as as currently written, and then to revise them to be far more reasonable. Having laws and regulations on the books doesn't mean much if they're not enforced. There are countless examples of this.
Note: I am not saying that any of the current candidates who actually have a prayer of getting elected would do this, but I do think we have a better chance with one than the others.
Last edited:
That Doesn't seem Very Viable.
So a New President instructs his(Her?) New HHS Secretary to tell the FDA ignore the 2007 Grandfather Date? Or to just Rubber Stamp PMTA for ENDS Applications?
Some might See that as an Abuse of a the Power which is Questionable that the Office of the President even has.
No. I think our Only hope here is in Congress. Not saying that the President can not put Pressure on Congress to Do Something. But I believe that Congress is the Only Entity that can change any of this Now.
But the way things are Going, Many are starting to talk about a Shift in the Majority of BOTH the House and the Senate.
Yes, they went way too far IMO. I think it was in all of the backs of our minds, well aware on the government radar, we knew this was eventually coming...but yes they went way too far. 2007....for Christs sake that is indeed everything with the exception of cartomizers and cigarette style batteries lacking in power. It's complicated and choosing a political candidate in regards to this issue is also complicated. First off, give credit where credit is due. In his quest to weaken corporate America, diminish America's influence on the world stage (as in the dreams of his father), and crush both big and small business, Obama held off as long as he could I guess with the regulation. Despite being a smoker, Obama is well aware big tobacco is one of the massive, wealthy corporate, money making machines that should suffer. Non-vaping regulation did just that, a knife in the back of one of America's corporate giants. Now that his reign is winding down and a long eight years is finally over, they are going to throw a bone to big tobacco and give them the regulations.
Problem is they all lie and what matters is the thickness of the envelope. We have no idea what goes on in the back room. You may think Bernie is the man, another guy opposed to big money, big business and corporate America. He will surely let big tobacco suffer....maybe? You just don't know, again it is the size of the envelope that matters. We all know they lie as soon as they open their mouths, say one thing and do another. I see Hillary as the biggest friend to big tobacco. The speaking fees only tell you what you need to know about the love of the almighty dollar. I envision her single-highhandedly destroying the entire vaping industry from a huge big tobacco payoff. Trump on the other hand, self funding his own campaign, may see the benefits of how vaping is actually helping people get off of cigarettes and have no sympathy for an industry unarguably making people ill.
Another angle is the powerful healthcare industry. They obviously need sick people to survive along with big pharma in the business of selling sick people drugs. Both benefit from sick people and probably secretly applaud any type of win for big tobacco. Another consideration is what happens if the nation goes 'single payer'? Do you think the federal government wants to foot the bill for all the sicknesses associated from smoking? Hell no! Hillarycare would essentially be the same thing as Obamacare with continued higher premiums and unaffordable deductibles. Trump has said mentioned in the debates he sees how single payer has worked in countries like the UK and Canada (with no mention of the fact of those folks come here for operations and procedures we would consider routine because they don't want to die on the waiting list). From that perspective, the guy like Trump who seems to favor the singer payer option may be the best choice for the vaper because we know the government isn't going to want to end up paying for the sickness and disease caused by smoking related illness.
Like I said...it's complicated. Best advice I guess I can give, start stocking up if you haven't already. You should always be able to find PG VG, wire and cotton and batteries, so focus on liquid and hardware. Make sure you have plenty of the traditional style atomizers like Plumes, Mutations, Tug Boats, Tobh, etc. That is hardware is time tested, works great, and should last a very long time. If you can rebuild you coil heads in your tanks that would be a big plus as well. Start saving those spent heads and be prepared if you're not already to rebuild. An easy rebuild is the Isub head. The .5Ω is better in those regards because of the wick replacement, keeping the same wire for multiple uses before a rewire. The .2Ω wire will collapse as soon as you try to pull the wick. ISub also makes a dedicated head just for rebuilding. They are decent tanks that get the job done; they may not be the greatest cloud producers for competition folks, but they work well enough to get you through the day!
Problem is they all lie and what matters is the thickness of the envelope. We have no idea what goes on in the back room. You may think Bernie is the man, another guy opposed to big money, big business and corporate America. He will surely let big tobacco suffer....maybe? You just don't know, again it is the size of the envelope that matters. We all know they lie as soon as they open their mouths, say one thing and do another. I see Hillary as the biggest friend to big tobacco. The speaking fees only tell you what you need to know about the love of the almighty dollar. I envision her single-highhandedly destroying the entire vaping industry from a huge big tobacco payoff. Trump on the other hand, self funding his own campaign, may see the benefits of how vaping is actually helping people get off of cigarettes and have no sympathy for an industry unarguably making people ill.
Another angle is the powerful healthcare industry. They obviously need sick people to survive along with big pharma in the business of selling sick people drugs. Both benefit from sick people and probably secretly applaud any type of win for big tobacco. Another consideration is what happens if the nation goes 'single payer'? Do you think the federal government wants to foot the bill for all the sicknesses associated from smoking? Hell no! Hillarycare would essentially be the same thing as Obamacare with continued higher premiums and unaffordable deductibles. Trump has said mentioned in the debates he sees how single payer has worked in countries like the UK and Canada (with no mention of the fact of those folks come here for operations and procedures we would consider routine because they don't want to die on the waiting list). From that perspective, the guy like Trump who seems to favor the singer payer option may be the best choice for the vaper because we know the government isn't going to want to end up paying for the sickness and disease caused by smoking related illness.
Like I said...it's complicated. Best advice I guess I can give, start stocking up if you haven't already. You should always be able to find PG VG, wire and cotton and batteries, so focus on liquid and hardware. Make sure you have plenty of the traditional style atomizers like Plumes, Mutations, Tug Boats, Tobh, etc. That is hardware is time tested, works great, and should last a very long time. If you can rebuild you coil heads in your tanks that would be a big plus as well. Start saving those spent heads and be prepared if you're not already to rebuild. An easy rebuild is the Isub head. The .5Ω is better in those regards because of the wick replacement, keeping the same wire for multiple uses before a rewire. The .2Ω wire will collapse as soon as you try to pull the wick. ISub also makes a dedicated head just for rebuilding. They are decent tanks that get the job done; they may not be the greatest cloud producers for competition folks, but they work well enough to get you through the day!
No, I mean simply don't enforce any of it. E.g: There's a certain leafy green substance, which is illegal to use, buy, sell, or cultivate under federal law. Yet the FedGov does nothing to enforce those laws, particularly in states that have indicated they don't want it enforced, where there are shops openly selling that substance for recreational use. A similar approach could be used toward small manufacturers of newly deemed "tobacco products", particularly vape shops and mod makers.
Great title but article didn't really explain too much. I agree with the Fda going to far and holding ecig to more scrutiny than cigarettes but wished it gave a few main points and possible solutions. Are we hosed? I've seen a signature sign up to oppose this but what happens when get 100,000 signatures(can't see why we won't get there). I'm just trying to figure out what all this means to the industry and what we can do to save it.
I'm not sure if that would work Either. At least not right Now.
With that Other Stuff, it had been around for a Long Time. And the public kinda adopted a "What you do in Your House is Your Business" attitude to it. It made it Easy for the Feds to Look the Other Way. And for States to do Ballot Initiatives for it. And in some cases, like California, it took Many Tries.
Doesn't seem like we are Anywhere Near that with e-Cigarettes. And might not be for a Generation or so.
There also wasn't a BT for the Other Stuff for the Market to be Turn Over to.
It would work. The President has authority of it. And authority over the FDA.
I just Don't see it as Viable. But Hey, I could be Wrong.
BTW - The Feds are Still going to move Forward and Tax e-Cigarettes/e-Liquids? Right?
The FDA is going to need to clarify some things in the next 90 days. I read an article that says after 90 days from now there can be no new hardware or liquid products offered for sale. Suppose a shop creates a new 0 nic e liquid 91 days from now. Does the restriction apply to that? Does the restriction apply to new hardware that is introduced 91 days from now that can be used to vape 0 nic liquid?
I might support banning ecigs if tobacco was also banned. Then I wouldn't need vaping to avoid smoking. The Billion Lives documentary could be called A Billion Criminals
That article merely refutes their main article which irresponsibly applauds the deeming as overdue regulation.
The mistake is to believe that tobacco is regulated in the normal sense of having to prove safety. To do so would be to ban it.
The mistake is to believe that tobacco is regulated in the normal sense of having to prove safety. To do so would be to ban it.
The FDA and the President - if he tries to rubber stamp it - are going to have their azzes kicked by State Representatives who while corrupt and unbelievably ignorant, are going to note their a) employment numbers b) sales and regular state taxes on b&ms, PLUS c) the sin taxes that they HAVE placed, or have every intention OF placing on vaping, just hauled out from underneath them. They don't want to ban it, they want to tax it
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
