the times they are a changin' - my perspective

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cherrypopwizkid

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A lot changed from the time I quit vaping to now when I'm trying to come back. It feels like I went through a time machine to the future. Its one of those things where if your not actively doing it you lose touch with the changing trends. Here are some things I've already noticed, and some things I haven't, your two-cents and additions please.

Things that seem different:

Competition - There are way more vendors now than I ever remember there being, this is good because it has resulted in

Lower cost - One of the benefits I was told before vaping was its cheaper. Back then, IMO, not by much. Back when someone gave me a link to a 70 dollar kit and THAT was a good deal and it had ONE atty. Things are a lot more affordable now. NOW it might be significantly cheaper to vape than to smoke.

More cautious data - For the most part. Still I did see a site that irked me with its talk about how nicotine by itself is no worse than caffeine. This simply isn't provable. Heart disease still kills more smokers than lung cancer and its possible nicotine's ability to release cholesterol into the blood stream may be the issue. E-cigs are safer. There not "safe". More vendors are being truthful about what the e-cig is and isn't than they were back then. I started before the FDA had really taken stern notice. And I know, screw them, but there were some wild claims being made back then.

More customization (non-mod): Back when I started, you got a battery, an atomizer, and a cart or a mouth piece. You could be a cart got or a dripper, and most people were swinging dripper, but that was it. All this Low Resistance attys, 510's with longer batteries than 510's normally have, and these funny little doohicky's called cones are all foreign to me. There are a lot more ways to customize your experience. VG seems more easy to find to. PG seemed to be the standard and only those who really knew where to look got VG, if they wanted it of course. It also seems that vendors more now than then acknowledge that most people who vape for any amount of time drip. Models and supplies seem to be suited more for this than they were. There are a lot less vendors who don't sell juice.

Public Knowledge - This I was being made aware of as time passed. I don't have to explain to people what an electronic cigarette is anymore. Everyone seems to pretty much know. I've heard more radio and seen more television commercials for them. We had saturation issues back then and getting the e-cig in the public eye was a bigger priority than I think it is now. Not that we are done with that part but at least we are at the stage where Bush would normally have raised a Mission Accomplished banner.

Two things I haven't seen that I was hoping I would:

Storefront sales: I'm still not seeing e-cigs sold in smoking stores. I've heard some people say they find them at gas stations and there is one vendor in my mall but its either SE still or something basically the same. Still not seeing genuine storefront suppliers springing up like I'd hoped. This is the key to me. Until e-cigs are as easy to obtain as analogs and there doesn't NEED to be a shipping wait on juice and gear, the risk of just having to get an analog still exist.

Predictable Atomizers: I don't know if this will ever happen, but I was really hoping we would have atomizers you could honest to god say this will last X number of weeks and then you will need a new one. Its still random. Along with this I was hoping we'd have attomizers that lasted much longer. For the most part, the life span seems about the same as it did and is still scattered and unpredictable.
 

bassthumper

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A lot changed from the time I quit vaping to now when I'm trying to come back. It feels like I went through a time machine to the future. Its one of those things where if your not actively doing it you lose touch with the changing trends. Here are some things I've already noticed, and some things I haven't, your two-cents and additions please.

Things that seem different:

Competition - There are way more vendors now than I ever remember there being, this is good because it has resulted in

Lower cost - One of the benefits I was told before vaping was its cheaper. Back then, IMO, not by much. Back when someone gave me a link to a 70 dollar kit and THAT was a good deal and it had ONE atty. Things are a lot more affordable now. NOW it might be significantly cheaper to vape than to smoke.

More cautious data - For the most part. Still I did see a site that irked me with its talk about how nicotine by itself is no worse than caffeine. This simply isn't provable. Heart disease still kills more smokers than lung cancer and its possible nicotine's ability to release cholesterol into the blood stream may be the issue. E-cigs are safer. There not "safe". More vendors are being truthful about what the e-cig is and isn't than they were back then. I started before the FDA had really taken stern notice. And I know, screw them, but there were some wild claims being made back then.

More customization (non-mod): Back when I started, you got a battery, an atomizer, and a cart or a mouth piece. You could be a cart got or a dripper, and most people were swinging dripper, but that was it. All this Low Resistance attys, 510's with longer batteries than 510's normally have, and these funny little doohicky's called cones are all foreign to me. There are a lot more ways to customize your experience. VG seems more easy to find to. PG seemed to be the standard and only those who really knew where to look got VG, if they wanted it of course. It also seems that vendors more now than then acknowledge that most people who vape for any amount of time drip. Models and supplies seem to be suited more for this than they were. There are a lot less vendors who don't sell juice.

Public Knowledge - This I was being made aware of as time passed. I don't have to explain to people what an electronic cigarette is anymore. Everyone seems to pretty much know. I've heard more radio and seen more television commercials for them. We had saturation issues back then and getting the e-cig in the public eye was a bigger priority than I think it is now. Not that we are done with that part but at least we are at the stage where Bush would normally have raised a Mission Accomplished banner.

Two things I haven't seen that I was hoping I would:

Storefront sales: I'm still not seeing e-cigs sold in smoking stores. I've heard some people say they find them at gas stations and there is one vendor in my mall but its either SE still or something basically the same. Still not seeing genuine storefront suppliers springing up like I'd hoped. This is the key to me. Until e-cigs are as easy to obtain as analogs and there doesn't NEED to be a shipping wait on juice and gear, the risk of just having to get an analog still exist.

Predictable Atomizers: I don't know if this will ever happen, but I was really hoping we would have atomizers you could honest to god say this will last X number of weeks and then you will need a new one. Its still random. Along with this I was hoping we'd have attomizers that lasted much longer. For the most part, the life span seems about the same as it did and is still scattered and unpredictable.
So the point in this post was...?
You don't vape anymore, and you're simply popping your head in to spout off some things you are "happy to see" improving and "things we could work on?"
Nicotine releases cholesterol into your bloodstream? That's a new one...
do you have a link to any kind of supporting evidence?
I don't think its any worse than caffeine... and have heard that from MANY dependable sources.
You'd better start providing links to where you got your info before ppl start reading your post......:facepalm:
Predictable atomizers? You're asking a bit much. I'm waiting for someone in the states to create a "user-serviceable" atomizer (one you can swap out the nichrome and wick when they go bad) but atomizers are naturally "unpredictable" and it's almost impossible to say when they'll go bad with so many technicalities that could go wrong....
 
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DonDaBoomVape

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www.VapingGuides.com

DaveP

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Things have changed in the 7 months I've been vaping. LR atomizers are common, large capacity carts and large coil atomizers are here (cylinder and cone attys that hold 2.5ml and 1.5ml), ceramic cartomizers that really work well, and 1000mah batts. Juices are now available in mixes of pg/vg and the environment is growing. There are still people who look at me funny when I vape in public and I have to explain what I'm doing.

My doctor allowed me to demo my Ecig in his examining room. His eyes popped when I blew out a stream of vapor. I asked him if he could detect any tobacco odor and he said he couldn't, in fact, he said there wasn't much odor at all and what he smelled was nice and aromatic. He did some research on his own and from sites that I recommended. A week later, he had pamphlets in his waiting room for people who were interested in getting off cigarettes.
 

jtpjc

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Bassthumper has a bit of a grumpy mood it seems. Never mind, that can happen to all of us. Cherry, it seems we started with the e-cig about the same time. I was dissapointed with some of the first models, so I started smoking again, but earlier this year I came back. There's a lot of e-cigs that are actually reliable and, above all, consistent. About attys: I like them less and less. I'm even dissapointed with the Leo, sorry to say. As far as I'm concerned, love the cartomizers. For the ego/riva of course, those are robust devices.

Would like to hear more about the cholesterol part though. Never heard of that.
 

cherrypopwizkid

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It wouldn't be so bad if I wasn't getting slammed by a fellow bass player from my home state. That hurts. This is likely part of the "troll jumping" witch hunt stuff that's been infected the whole internet lately. Yeah what happened with me is I decided to quit altogether and to do it had to get rid of all my stuff. I was off all nicotine products for 6 months but now I find myself back on analogs and am hanging out here, getting caught up on everything, while I wait for my shipments. That was 'the point of this post'. Sure I can post some stuff about heart issues and nicotine. You can find wikipedia's little excerpt about it by wiki'ing Nicotine. I know of a video I can show you and then if you guys really want I suppose I could search my college database for some actual studies. It will take me a minute though. Let me run my errands and I'll be back on with the video. As I recall this is still in the testing stages, not all of its proven...But neither is the connection to smoking and lung cancer... The heart issue has been a major interest for me lately because I'm wondering how it connects to vaping. I'm wondering how much your risk is reduced anyhow by the fact that your more likely to exercise and eat right vaping than smoking. Anyway, I'll be back on after I run this stuff off real quick.
 

Bovinia

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By just doing a quick google search on nicotine and cholesterol you can read a bit. I'm not going to bother linking tons of articles but from my understanding the nicotine combined with certain chemicals in analogs can lower your HDL (good cholo) and raise LDL (bad cholo). Nicotine has not been shown to have the same effect in traditional NRT such as the nic patch.

Of course, whether or not it has any effect in combination with other ingredients in our e-juice is unknown :)

ETA: Welcome back to a better vaping world Cherry and Jt
 

cherrypopwizkid

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Here is wikipedia's excerpt. Disclaimer of course being its wikipedia. XD

Nicotine has very powerful effects on arteries throughout the body. Nicotine is a stimulant, it raises blood pressure, and is a vasoconstrictor, making it harder for the heart to pump through the constricted arteries. It causes the body to release its stores of fat and cholesterol into the blood.[55]

It has been speculated[who?] that nicotine increases the risk of blood clots by increasing plasminogen activator inhibitor-1, though this has not been proven. Plasma fibrinogen levels are elevated in smokers and are further elevated during acute COPD exacerbation. Also Factor XIII, which stabilizes fibrin clots, is increased in smokers. But neither of these two effects has been shown to be caused by nicotine [56] as of 2009[update].

Peripheral circulation in arteries going to the extremities is also highly susceptible to the vasoconstrictor effects of nicotine and the increased risk of clots and clogging.

This is the source they used for the cholestrol in the blood part:

Systemic nicotine stimulates human adipose tissue lipolysis through local cholinergic and catecholaminergic receptors

The bellow link will take you to whyquit.com, a site dedicated to quitting cold turkey, in their quiting day 1 video line up. The 9th link down, Heart and Circulatory disease, talks about this. Please note the site's creator Joel Spitzer is not necissarily an e-cig supporter. In my time on his website I did find one article so far about e-cigs. It was an interview with an e-cig user and the writer seemed to suggest quitting altogether was still superior in his opinion but that he felt regulations against a potentially safer form of nicotine delivery were the result of tobacco lobby. Again, 9th video down, labeled "Heart and Circulatory diseases" on this page:

Day one quit smoking videos

edit: WARNING - Video contains medical scenery that may be graphic.
 
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cherrypopwizkid

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By just doing a quick google search on nicotine and cholesterol you can read a bit. I'm not going to bother linking tons of articles but from my understanding the nicotine combined with certain chemicals in analogs can lower your HDL (good cholo) and raise LDL (bad cholo). Nicotine has not been shown to have the same effect in traditional NRT such as the nic patch.

Of course, whether or not it has any effect in combination with other ingredients in our e-juice is unknown :)

ETA: Welcome back to a better vaping world Cherry and Jt

exactly. This has been what I'm most curious about lately. I wasn't aware of these things when I first started. Beyond the chemical combination something else I've been wondering about is duration of study. With a nic patch your usually only using it temporarily to quit smoking. Vaping tends to be more long term and consistent. Its to new to say. I certainly hope the news is good, I hope its very obvious here I don't sugar coat things but I am a PV supporter and soon to be (once again) a user. But I also reiterate I feel like eating healthy and exercising regularly are easier to accomplish on PVs which would possibly reduce any risk that might exist.
 

Mufftrix

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Hi cherrypopwizkid and welcome back :)

I was away from the site for quiet a while busy moving house and all the associated turmoil ha-ha!

I have been vaping for around 2 years now on and off, and there have been a lot of changes, but still basically same attys.Albeit we do now have Low Resistance ones, which I do thing are a step forward as 6v was never right in my mind and testing, and of course we still have row upon row of mods :facepalm:

But like you say attys seem to be still the stumbling block in how long they are going to last, I think that is going to be the nature of them in the near future anyhow? just to treat them as a disposable item!

It is nice to see that there is some hope in the cart department which for me has always been a downfall in constantly having to top up and not wicking properly etc! So much in fact that I drip 99% of the time now. There at least now a few auto feed systems coming out. One noticeable one that seems very promising being the EGO Tank System?

Anyhows good luck 2nd time round! :)
 

TWISTED VICTOR

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I thought you had a good post, but I'd like to make a slight correction, nicotine has never been linked to heart disease in any study. It can complicate previously existing conditions, but hasn't been found to actually cause anything detrimental. True nicotine studies are rare since most studies referring to nicotine are, in reality, smoking related. Other than that, yeah, things are coming right along :).
 

alisab

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Hi Cherry and welcome back! I found your perspective very interesting. I actually just started vaping - just after Thanksgiving this year. I am coming along, not completely off analogs yet - but very close. I really didn't have any sense that things have been changing so rapidly, that is, until I read the year in review from the earlier poster and now you. It kind of reminds me of the early days with "personal computers" PC's now it PV's! I think we are at the beginning of something that will be huge (not as huge as computers but still radically big). It is not just that people are wanting to quit because of $ or not being able to smoke anywhere or health, though obviosly that is what brought many people here. I think vaping tastes better! I am now also trying different juices and really enjoy the different flavors. I was watching a review made by a heavy fellow who was really enjoying the taste of "Boston Cream Pie". He said, it's better to vape it than eat about a 1000 calorie slice. Who knows where this is all going but it is a very exciting new frontier. Thanks for posting.
 

cherrypopwizkid

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Thats true. Other than vaping there isn't really a method for using nicotine long term outside of smoking. Patches and gums are meant for temporary use. I think it was Carl Sagan though who said absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. The possible link between nicotine and cardiovascular effects there of is on going. I sincerely hope we can someday prove conclusively that there is not a significant increase in risk by vaping. The irony of the statement that more smokers die from heart disease is that more people die from heart disease smoker or non. Eating healthy and exercising are the keys to prevention regardless of if you smoke or not. My statement in the OP wasn't to suggest your definitely forcing yourself into cardiac arrest as much as it was to illustrate you can not definitely say nicotine is harmless on its own out side of addiction. The evidence isn't there partly because of, as you pointed out, the fact that most nicotine studies are indeed smoking studies. We want to be through and have full disclosure to maintain credibility.

Yes! And the money is about right now! Of course you could still make this an expensive hobby and many do because they enjoy the technical and coniseur aspect of it, but more now than before you can vape on a budget which is wonderful! Can't wait till my gear gets here. Just thinking about vaping is making these analogs taste like garbage. I just read the year in revieiw, awesome post and we even had some overlap which was great because it assured me I wasn't just seeing things. XD

Edit: Correction. Obviously there are methods commonly used long term outside of smoking such as dip and chew, I should have said tobacco I suppose.
 

hushedpuppy

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It kind of reminds me of the early days with "personal computers" PC's now it PV's! I think we are at the beginning of something that will be huge (not as huge as computers but still radically big).

This is a good comparison. I wonder if we're at the "Windows 95 is Mac 84" stage? I've only been vaping a few months and already the rapid pace of change is making my head spin. I'm glad I never got into stockpiling because I would have hated to be stuck with 100 regular attys when the LR's came out. I guess I could have stored them beside my dusty box of 100 floppy discs. :laugh:

Cherry, welcome back to ECF! Wishing you Merry Christmas... and a Happy New Year with your new PV! :)
 
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