the upcoming regulation on e cigs, what are your opinions?

[tobacco-kills]

So we have only a few more weeks until the FDA announces they're regulations on e cigs.
What do you guys think there regulations will be and how do you think it will effect the industry.
Will we still be able to buy vapes and all the different flavors we want from tape shops and online sites?

I really feel as if they're gonna come out regulating flavored products, banning them completely.

 

[Train2]

That's an interesting thought - they could play it as "we want to keep this from appealing to kids".

But as it's the FDA, I figure what they want to see is a license required to sell anything with nicotine in it. And the rest of the government wants to tax the *#@& out of anything they can - probably starting with anything that's got nic in it...

If you can't sell nic without a license, that'll put a ding on MOST online flavored juice vendors. They may end up selling no-nic concentrated juice, and then we'll all have to somewhat DIY - adding nic that will cost twice as much due to tax and licensing costs.

That's MY guess where it's going.

By the time they implement it, I'll have a 5-year supply of nic in the freezer.
I don't think they'll do much damage to the availability of the concentrated flavorings - we'd have a problem if they did something that would increase the cost of MOST FOOD. LOL.

 

[stevegmu]

They may announce proposed regulations. Then the discussion and comment period begins. Then regulations will be announced. Could take months or years.

 

[swampman]

I will e-mail,make phone calls and otherwise be vocal yet respectful about ANY regulations...but...I will also DIY my own flavor juice if it comes to that, i want to learn how any way.

 

[Petrodus]

I'm totally done with trying to predict what the FDA will propose.
One thing is for sure ... Once they start regulating ... they will keep adding regulations.

You guys remember how smoking and esmoking bans all started ...
OH, so simple and no big deal ... inside government buildings ...
Now the movement is No Vaping anywhere smoking is not permitted
which will eventually be outside city limits in the country
as long as it's no closer than 1 mile from the nearest cow.

 

[Ranic85]

I'm totally done with trying to predict what the FDA will propose.
One thing is for sure ... Once they start regulating ... they will keep adding regulations.

You guys remember how smoking and esmoking bans all started ...
OH, so simple and no big deal ... inside government buildings ...
Now the movement is No Vaping anywhere smoking is not permitted
which will eventually be outside city limits in the country
as long as it's no closer than 1 mile from the nearest cow.

Theres a new one! We must save the cows! Moooooooo!

 

[Petrodus]

When the FDA starts to regulate ...
I suggest many, if not most, of our vendors will be caught flat-footed
and many issues ... bottle labels is just one and that would be if Mommie FDA
will even allow free floating bottled e-liquids.

 

[Bob Chill]

Let's not underestimate individual State's abilities. Their revenue is threatened too. IF the FDA say the nic supply channel is to be licensed, taxed, and regulated, then interstate delivery can be easily banned at the State level. Alcohol is a good example of coast to coast patchwork.

I know some will chime in and say you can order cigs online but it's a bad apples to apples. The VAST majority of cigs are purchased at a B&M. State tax stamps included. States lose very little tax revenue to online cig sales.

The majority of ejuice is sold online so the hole will be closed if a State wants it to be.

 

[paleocon12111971]

I'm thinking that the first set of regulations will be media advertisements. It will be incremental just as all tobacco regulation has been. At first, TV commercials like Blu would be banned on all channels prior to 10:00pm, then prior to 1:00am, and eventually altogether. After that, print advertisements for e-cigarettes will be prohibited in magazines with more than 50% and then eventually more than 15% of its subscribers under age 18. These regulations will almost certainly mirror those rolled out over the course of 40+ years for analog cigarettes. It will not be all at once. It will be spread out.

 

[Petrodus]

Of course ... The FDA will have no issues
with the Chantix poison ads airing 24/7

 

[twgbonehead]

I'm thinking that the first set of regulations will be media advertisements. It will be incremental just as all tobacco regulation has been. At first, TV commercials like Blu would be banned on all channels prior to 10:00pm, then prior to 1:00am, and eventually altogether. After that, print advertisements for e-cigarettes will be prohibited in magazines with more than 50% and then eventually more than 15% of its subscribers under age 18. These regulations will almost certainly mirror those rolled out over the course of 40+ years for analog cigarettes. It will not be all at once. It will be spread out.

I do hope you're joking. That was the scenario back in the '70s, in a totally different country, far, far away from here (in the time-space sense).

 

[Bob Chill]

Of course ... The FDA will have no issues
with the Chantix poison ads airing 24/7

Ah, but you see "medical professionals" prescribe those to people so they can be "cured". The Government AND doctors know what's best for us. Always. How can we possibly be trusted to make choices on our own? We don't know any better about anything. We must be protected from ourselves at all times.

 

[Spazmelda]

My predictions of their proposed regulations (they are pretty pessimistic):

All flavors except menthols and tobaccos banned.
All online sales banned, or sometimes when I'm feeling more optimistic age verification requirements.
Liquid nicotine banned, only prefilled cartomizers allowed.
Set limit on nicotine concentration, I'll guess 12 mg/ml.
All tv advertising banned.
Strict regulations on what can be included in advertising (so as not to tempt the chirrens).
Vaping restricted to only areas where smoking is allowed. Is this part of the FDAs domain?
I expect them to try something with hardware, but I'm not sure what they could do.

FDA can't set taxes, right? I expect those to come soon thereafter.

There, if I think the worst, maybe I'll be surprised.

ETA: totally forgot ban on sale to minors. Of course, that's a given.

 

[Pickleskunk]

The more noise the vaping community makes the better off we will be. Some of the bigger non-tobacco ecigarette manufacturers have access to good lawyers. The evidence against big tobacco took decades to compile. Vaping is at its infancy. I think the most they will be able to do at first is have nicotine products produced in FDA approved facilities, which will force many of the smaller vape stores to outsource their blends to an approved facility which will drive up costs. As far as banning fruity flavors based on the flawed premise that it is marketing geared towards children, I'm not sure. The government really likes to step on freedom, while throwing out common sense very quickly. This is where organization of the vape community to appeal to the public along with good lawyers to put pressure on politicians will be needed. They won't exceed their boundaries if they feel enough votes may be at stake. If they try and ban vaporizors in general they will be infringing on the .........(umm... u know... those people) community, which has a strong vocal base, and will only help our position with support. At the moment I am not terribly pessimistic. I have spoken with several mom and pop shops about the issue, and one larger store chain owner. They don't seem to be as worried as many here, and that is their money we are talking about.

 

[ClippinWings]

Best Case:
Ban on Sales to Minors.
Minor Tax, around $0.10/ml... (FOR NOW.... It will go up as more smokers become Vapers.)
Minor certification and regulatory hurdles for manufacturers
Some minor advertising restrictions.

Worst Case:
Ban on Sales to Minors.
Ban on Internet Sales.
Ban Flavors
Ban "Bluk eLiquid". Only prefilled Carts allowed. (claim fear of Nic Overdose)
Ban Nicotine over 9mg/ml (claim fear of Nic Overdose)
Ban on sales of "Mods" and VV devices (claim fear of Nic Overdose)
Heavy Tax, $2.00/ml or higher (in line with the cig-a-like assertion that a pre-filled cart is equal to 1 Pack of cigarettes.)
Massive hoops to jump through and expense for Manufacturers... (All but the Biggest won't be able to survive it)
Ban on TV advertising
Heavy regulation of all other forms of advertising.

I think it will land in the middle:
Ban on Sales to Minors.
Ban Nicotine over 12mg/ml (claim fear of Nic Overdose)
Moderate Tax, $0.25/ml or higher... (FOR NOW.... It will go up as more smokers become Vapers.)
Confusing hoops to jump through for Manufacturers... (will force some out of business)
Ban on TV advertising
Heavy regulation of all other forms of advertising.


Heavy Taxation will be justified as the cost of regulation, including the safety of the batteries and Quality of the Liquid.

I also give a Flavor ban a > 50% chance of happening.

 

[cookiebun]

My predictions of their proposed regulations (they are pretty pessimistic):

All flavors except menthols and tobaccos banned.
All online sales banned, or sometimes when I'm feeling more optimistic age verification requirements.
Liquid nicotine banned, only prefilled cartomizers allowed.
Set limit on nicotine concentration, I'll guess 12 mg/ml.
All tv advertising banned.
Strict regulations on what can be included in advertising (so as not to tempt the chirrens).
Vaping restricted to only areas where smoking is allowed. Is this part of the FDAs domain?
I expect them to try something with hardware, but I'm not sure what they could do.

FDA can't set taxes, right? I expect those to come soon thereafter.

There, if I think the worst, maybe I'll be surprised.

The FDA can't set taxes. I'm expecting the states to start taxing after the FDA regulations come out.
If everything you said above comes true I expect far fewer people to switch from analogs to vaping.
That's what all the power's that be want.

 

[Spazmelda]

The FDA can't set taxes. I'm expecting the states to start taxing after the FDA regulations come out.
If everything you said above comes true I expect far fewer people to switch from analogs to vaping.
That's what all the power's that be want.

Yes, that's what I meant. The FDA can't tax, but someone will start taxing ASAP. And yes, fewer people will switch. Some will go back to smoking. I'm fairly well set, but the possible roadblocks to come makes me sad/angry for people who haven't switched yet, or those that are just getting started.

For what it's worth, if they do put drastic regulations in action I don't think they will last forever. It will take a long time, but I expect that someday harm reduction, including ecigs, will be vindicated and those that stood in the way will have egg on their faces.

Maybe there will be some voices of reason within the FDA and other health agencies. We see some, and we are a vocal group. Maybe they will proceed with a light touch. Hopefully?

 

[twgbonehead]

The FDA can't set taxes. However, they CAN put products into certain classifications.

Once something is in that class, it opens the door for Federal, State and Local governments to tax that classification. Or restrict that classification. Or prohibit that classification. All the FDA needs to do is create the classification.

What is both laughable and at the same time scary is the lack of knowledge. The FDA talks about "Flavored E-cigarettes". Now, everyone here knows what a joke that whole phrase is. But that's the language that will be used in Congress when they discuss the matter. When the laws are actually written and passed, they will probably be worded quite differently. And when you try to get your Provari or Innokin and Customs impounds it, you can say "That's not a flavored e-cigarette" and that will get you ...... Where?

In the mean time, they will have succeeded in getting vaping as demonized as smoking. We lose. Your government at work.

 

[stevegmu]

BLU won't roll over and accept bans on flavors. They will spend $millions on lawyers, lobbyists and a lawsuits to prevent this. I don't see bans on flavors anytime soon.

 

[aikanae1]

I don't even want to think about it.