Vaping?? A trigger for recovering addicts??

[HyOnLyph]

Hello all,
My wife and I have a home for women in recovery. We have introduced the smokers...(5 out of 7) to vaping. No pressure.. just an offer of availability if they want.

Recently we were told by one of the ladies that she was afraid of vaping. It triggered memories of smoking ..... Yesterday a friend of mine who has been vaping for a few weeks said the burnt taste from a dry carto or dripping triggered memories smoking Crack. It shocked him (he's been clean for 15 years) and it really concerned me.

I'm in this to help the ladies and others... not to trigger their addiction and cause a relapse.

My thing was never .... or Crack so I had no point of reference to be aware of this.

I understand if people don't want to talk about this... but if you have any insight or advise, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks for listening and thanks for any thoughts you may have.

 

[xg4bx]

maybe a pv that looks closest to a cig? i only ever smoked "green stuff" so that's a tough one.

 

[FreakyStylie]

I've wondered that myself. These are definitely not cigarettes. They have a different taste, sound, look, and smell. I'm sure there are plenty of triggers that could be set off by being around somebody who is using a pv.

I would have to say that counseling is probably the only way to combat it. Whether directly with a professional, or somebody in your position talking with a counselor to seek professional direction on how to handle this type of situation. They may be able to offer simple tools to re-associate the electronic cigarette with something else. A simple cue might be something in the nature of referring to it like drinking a milkshake from a straw. A milkshake has a different flavor than a cigarette, makes a funny sound, and mimics the habituation of smoking also. IDK, just my two cents.

 

[Broseybrose]

I can definitely see how it is possible for vaping to trigger... especially for an addict thats new in recovery. Bottles of ejuice are "vials of dope", the ecig is the pipe. Plus there's the ritual of preparation to deliver a drug to your system, filling your ecig.

I have no advice to offer you and im sorry. As a former addict i can only see and state how ecigs could trigger relapse.

What stylie said about re-association is truth. Whether it comes in the form of counseling or clean time. Im able to vape because ive learned to re-associate the ritual of preparation with vaping, as opposed to getting high.

 

[jj2]

This is a hard one since addicts try very hard to avoid triggers.
As smokers we had to teach ourselves to recondition are minds to make the switch from smoking to vaping and at first that was a hard one for some.
As hard as it might have been, it will be hundred times more difficult for some of your ladies and your friend.
In the end I agree with FreadyStyle, a counselor or some kind of professional help might be the only road that will help.

 

[Liv2Ski]

What flavors were in the juice??? I am not certain what part of vaping caused the trigger for them since there is no flame and the PV does not really look like a crack pipe. The sound may be close if you are using a LR atty and get that hiss and pop. But it is not exact. That is what leads me to the flavor/smell. Menthol can have a chemical taste/smell to it and that could cause a trigger. Try a strong coffee or Chocolate flavor for them.

 

[JeffTM]

Great question. I'm a recovering addict and have experience smoking ..... For me personally, it hasn't been a trigger. However, I gave a puff to a friend of mine and his eyes shot open with a "deer in headlights" look and simply said, "woah." He told me that the taste reminded him exactly of smoking ..... He has a long time in recovery, so it didn't trigger him to use, but I imagine it may for others. My friend has since smoked different flavors and says that he hasn't gotten the .... taste from them.

Regardless of taste, the act of vaping can be reminiscent of using certain drugs. When I direct drip, I take the mouthpiece out and hold it in my mouth while I drip onto the atomizer. I've been told many times that it looks like I'm preparing some kind of hard drug.

I have a slight fear of showing my e-cig to newcomers, since it is essentially another way to get "high" although the drug isn't quite as harmful as, say, crack. It's really your call. I have a feeling it will help people far more than it will hurt them. I also think that if someone goes out and smokes .... as a result of taking a puff from an e-cig, they probably didn't have a very strong foundation of recovery and would have gone out soon anyway... the world is full of triggers.

Hope this helps.

 

[JonnyVapΣ]

I suppose it's similar to getting off cigarettes. There are smokers everywhere. Many of our PVs mimic cigarettes. I see (and smell) people smoking and every so often get that craving to light up a smoke. But I don't. I don't let that former addiction control me. Not any more. I've done a lot of crap in the past but cigarettes were by far the hardest for me to get off of...and stay off of. So far so good and for the first time after many failed attempts at quitting I truely feel I am done with smoking. It may sound harsh but the reality is; "get over it". Don't let that past addiction control you. My doctor told me a couple years ago that my liver was failing and to stop drinking...or die. Never drank a drop after that. Temptations are literally everywhere (seriously, I can't pay for gas without walking by stacks of beer and cigarettes) but you just have to get over it. It's easier said than done and it's not something that everyone is capable of. Reality isn't always pleasant.

 

[pseudus]

As another recovering addict here, I'd like to offer my $.02 as well. I have a little over 3 years clean, and have been vaping for about 2 weeks. I agree with what has been said here, especially the ritualistic nature of it. Vaping is a godsend to me, but even with 3 years, I was a little nervous about starting. The cleaning and loading of carts and having the syringes around definitely reminds me of where I come from, but it is easy to differentiate. I also feel like triggers are a load of crap. In active addiction, everything was a trigger for me. If it rained, if it was sunny, if I was having a bad day, if I was having a good day, whatever...we all know how it goes. So I think when you're done, you're done...and newcomers are a vicarious lot. Many are looking for reasons to go back out or draw parallels, etc. I'm not sure what the answer is, and I am sure it should be considered on a case by case basis but honestly, who knows.

I asked AngusATAT if I could start a group here for this very type of discussion/support for us vapers in recovery, but was told that it would break the "absolutely no drug talk" rule. I think this is important and very well could lead those on shakey ground in the wrong direction. This is a huge can of worms...

Also, its good to see I am not "alone" here.

Good luck...

 

[pseudus]

I suppose it's similar to getting off cigarettes. There are smokers everywhere. Many of our PVs mimic cigarettes. I see (and smell) people smoking and every so often get that craving to light up a smoke. But I don't. I don't let that former addiction control me. Not any more. I've done a lot of crap in the past but cigarettes were by far the hardest for me to get off of...and stay off of. So far so good and for the first time after many failed attempts at quitting I truely feel I am done with smoking. It may sound harsh but the reality is; "get over it". Don't let that past addiction control you. My doctor told me a couple years ago that my liver was failing and to stop drinking...or die. Never drank a drop after that. Temptations are literally everywhere (seriously, I can't pay for gas without walking by stacks of beer and cigarettes) but you just have to get over it. It's easier said than done and it's not something that everyone is capable of. Reality isn't always pleasant.

Not to post back to back, but JonnyVapΣ, you sir are not an addict. Addicts cannot just "get over it". I don't expect you to understand, nor am I offended, just realize that if an addict could just "get over it" they would.

 

[FreakyStylie]

Not to post back to back, but JonnyVapΣ, you sir are not an addict. Addicts cannot just "get over it". I don't expect you to understand, nor am I offended, just realize that if an addict could just "get over it" they would.

LOL, just look at the nicotine addicts here. We haven't gotten over it, we've simply assimilated. And I'm not trying to put any downplay on any other addictions. Just a funny side note.

What you had said about the groups makes me think this thread could get closed, so I would suggest looking for a place that would host a forum. I think it's a great idea!

 

[JonnyVapΣ]

Not to post back to back, but JonnyVapΣ, you sir are not an addict. Addicts cannot just "get over it". I don't expect you to understand, nor am I offended, just realize that if an addict could just "get over it" they would.

Ya...you're right. We're all robots built on the same assembly line. Everyone is the same.

I may have thought I was addicted to nicotine until last week when I had a lower G.I. rupture and almost bled to death. When recovering I couldn't vape any nicotine (I vape roughly 5-7ml of 18mg a day) without getting ill. Had the wife mix up a bottle of zero nic and been on zero for a week now. So ya....I got over it.

 

[pseudus]

What you had said about the groups makes me think this thread could get closed, so I would suggest looking for a place that would host a forum. I think it's a great idea!

A recovery forum for vapers? Or a vaping forum for people in recovery? I have the resources, just don't know if there is a big enough interest.

 

[Automaton]

I think pseudus' point was merely that not everyone is that way.

Most addicts also have addictive personalities. Some don't. Even someone who doesn't have addiction risk factors can become addicted - and they may be the people who are able to "get over it," like you did. But most addicts can't, and many die trying.

And I think the point was that to say people just need to "get over it" is painting a complicated problem with a broad brush, and a little dismissive of how hard it is for many people.

If you can, then great, and lucky you. But I think you're the exception rather than the rule. It has nothing to do with willpower.

Goodness knows I possessed the willpower to quit cigarettes. But the problem was I couldn't function at all while I was withdrawing. If I had been able to sit in a cave with someone bringing me food for 3 weeks and just sweat it out, maybe I could have. Maybe not. But I've nearly lost my job and all my friends attempting to quit. Vaping is the only way I can do it without my entire life imploding.

I do have a particularly addictive personality, but I think that there are more people who are closer to my end of the spectrum than yours.

pseudus - I wish we could have something like that - a place for vapers in recovery. There are quite a few vapers who have had other substance problems, and reading this post was eye-opening to me. I know a couple people who are recovering and started vaping, but their method of drug intake wasn't smoking so I hadn't heard of this problem before.

I agree with others that therapy and re-association techniques may be a way forward for them.

 

[HappyHooligan]

I can understand the trigger of vaping, I have been vaping for a little over 2 months and have only had 2 flavors that to me tasted exactly like ...., to the point that it was scary. I have been clean for almost 8 years, thankfully joining the army took me completely away from the life I had when I was using, and helped to give me a reason to stay clean. I haven't even thought about smoking .... for along time, but out of the blue tasting it was a very strange, almost scary feeling.

Hooligan

 

[Another Puffer]

Simply put, I would err on the side of caution and simply not offer vaping. Sometimes good intentions can be your worst enemy, if the situation is that fragile, why risk it.

 

[mi528hz]

I am an electrician. I was vaping in our job trailer. This guy from another job came by to pick up some parts for his job. Later that day I got a call from his foreman, He went back and told them it smelled like I was smoking .... in there. Not sure what .... smells like but, it made me think.

 

[FreeFlow]

All I can comment on is that vaping has helped me significantly reduce my ......... intake. I've never smoked those other drugs but for me, my vaping addiction/obsession has taken over my ......... addiction. I realize these are completely different drugs, just thought i'd share.

And for me, it's really just trading one addiction for another.

 

[FreakyStylie]

A recovery forum for vapers? Or a vaping forum for people in recovery? I have the resources, just don't know if there is a big enough interest.

Sorry, sometimes I get rushed. Definitely a forum for people in recovery, but in the same spirit as how you wanted to make a group here.

I have enough friends and family members who have gone through different systems, and a lot of them have had better success when the focus was on something other than the recovery process. Having a focus on vaping, sounds like a great idea because you can have a solid anchor, but still talk about the topics related to the recovery process.

As an example, a couple people I know were in an art class. As it turned out, there were a lot of other people in the class who were in recovery. They were able to focus on the art, but their conversations happened naturally and they all really seemed to benefit from each other. I don't know if it makes any sense out loud.

As for the interest, I'm sure that you would have at least a couple just from reading this thread. IDK, I know a couple people around me who are interested in vaping that might enjoy knowing there were others in similar situations. Some of these people don't want to be a part of any "group" having to do with what they've gone through because they are trying to forget about it, but they could still benefit from being around people who understand. These people would especially benefit, and potentially have more interest because it is a "virtual" group, and they don't even have to get dressed to be a part of it.

 

[HyOnLyph]

Wow, what great responses. I wasn't aware that this kind of question might violate the "no drug talk" rule. So before this gets pulled... I just want to thank you all for your honest and valuable insights. Every one of you had something interesting to add. Thank you very much. I hope this thread continues.

I can see that "triggers" may be something to be aware of... but not something to be feared. Like many of you said... (paraphrased) "triggers are everywhere." Learn the differnce and move ahead. Life is a trigger. That really is true. It doesn't oversimplify addiction but it is part of it.

pseudus... perhaps angus would reconsider if a thread had a warning. I can't believe that rule was meant for those in recovery having honest and open discussions.

Through our work... we have realized that there are many facets to addiction. The physical, genetics, emotional... etc.. I know of people just as addicted to their TV as one of our ladies used to be to alcohol. (I mean really addicted to TV.) It is their escape. It is what causes their brain to disengage... desensitizes them from their fears for a short moment. So many of the ladies come to us recovering but still so afraid of life. They actually are afraid of the fear that they might feel about the anxiety over something they might have to face.

By the time they come here, they have been through detox and some type of treatment and are attempting to put their life back together. I don't think I would even suggest vaping to someone who was still very fragile in their recovery. I've never tried ....... but from what I've seen, it really kills or rewires pathways in the brain in such a way that reality is altered for quite a long time... It takes months (or longer) for those pathways to be rewired to where one can trust their own perceptions again.

I am grateful to all of you who have posted and will continue to post. I'll be here.

PS.. if a mod thinks I've overstepped the rules... I appologize. It really is an innocent question. If you feel it's necessary to censor this thread, Please be selective.

I stepped away for a few minutes and missed FreakyStylie's last comment. I liked what you said about "and a lot of them have had better success when the focus was on something other than the recovery process. " We've found that there comes a time when focusing on where you want to go, even if it's just the next step, is far better than avoiding where you've been. Moving toward healthy vs moving away from unhealthy. When we are moving away from "unhealthy", our focus is behind us. It is still the base of our attention. Moving toward healthy allows us to have hope and a vision for the future. How many of us have tried to avoid the semi-truck next to us on the freeway by staring at the truck as we pass it. Almost unconsciously we drift toward the truck. To pass it safely, we need to focus down the road past the obstacle. (sorry... I started preaching... I get that way sometimes... )

Thanks again to everyone. Happy Thanksgiving