Vaping for Science!

[Hans Wermhat]

If you are bringing in regular vapers, let them use their own set ups. You will get a cross section of different devices and can include more variables in your study. Some devices use a lot more juice than others. If you let them bring in their own rigs, you can get a wider range of real world data instead of just limiting your study to what you provide them.

 

[gandymarsh]

It would seem more effective to have test subjects who are smokers who are not vapers, than those who regularly vape, to determine what is appealing. A simple survey among already vapers would answer your question...

I agree with this.

I don't understand what you are trying to glean from this study. Experienced vapers all have their own preferences and are not going to be impressed by an Ego with a cheap clearomizer.

Why not get a bunch of smokers, preferably smokers who say they don't want to quit, let them try a decent device like an iStick 30 or 40 or similar device and ask them for an opinion.

 

[stevegmu]

I agree with this.

I don't understand what you are trying to glean from this study. Experienced vapers all have their own preferences and are not going to be impressed by an Ego with a cheap clearomizer.

Why not get a bunch of smokers, preferably smokers who say they don't want to quit, let them try a decent device like an iStick 30 or 40 or similar device and ask them for an opinion.

Or give 20 smokers $50 worth of gear, a lesson in using it, a week, and have them report what they like or don't like about it and if they reduced cigarette consumption...

 

[YoursTruli]

I am a graduate student interested in e-cigs. I have a research study design that essentially is trying to look at what makes vaping so appealing to former/current smokers. I plan on having people come in for a lab session where they use an e-cig and I measure some variables before and after vaping.

I'm looking to see how experienced vapers with smoking history respond to the nicotine in e-cigs in an objective way. There's a lot of research in this field right now that is survey-based, which is asking people what they think or how they are feeling. I can't give too much away, but I have created a design that will measure how people are responding to vaping in a more objective way. My hope is with this information, it will help understand the mechanisms that have allowed so many people to quit smoking or cut back on cigarettes through vaping. It's challenging to directly study this, as you all probably know, because of FDA regulations and yada yada.

I am sorry but something seems very "off" about all this.

Since vaping is an experience unique to each individual user based on their personal preferences, choice of gear, choice of eliquid flavors/unflavored, choice of nicotine levels/no nicotine what makes it appealing and work is unique to each individual user, what works for one vaper may not/will not work for another vaper.

We understand there is currently a lot of research going on in this field, not all of it is good science, impartial, beneficial or fair to vapers so asking a vaping forum for help without giving us any clue/background on what results you are trying to achieve is asking a lot given some of the harmful junk science we have seen during the FDA hearings... and I do not know about yada yada but there are no current FDA regulations on vaping/gear/eliquids and most of us vapers would like to see it stay that way.

 

[amandapalmtree]

mm - at $10/ person, with 100 people, that gives you $1000 budget? 10 kanger subox mini kits, extra coil heads, silicone drip tip covers, juice, 20 batteries, charger would come in under that number, I believe

heck, if they are coming in individually, you could do it with a couple of subox kits, multiple extra tanks, batteries, charger, juice and easily come in under that number

I will look into these! Thank you!

 

[amandapalmtree]

Using the standard nicotine ejuices, you have 0, 3, 6, 12, 18 and 24mg.

I see no reason to have more than those, and you can probably knock off the 0mg since you are trying to study nicotine effect right?

Get from mt baker vapor or vape wild or somewhere cheap.

So all you need are 5 delivery devices, and maybe an extra in case one doesn't work properly......with each of those 5 nicotine concentrations.........and 100+ throw-away mouthpieces should be used to cover those for the 100x people.

If you can wait on shipment, some place like Fasttech in china will be cheapest way to order the hardware.

Heck, if you told one of the big vendors what you were doing they might even kick in the ejuice for ya.

This is really helpful, thank you!

 

[amandapalmtree]

I didn't get the entire idea, but avoid cig-a-likes and get a generic eGo/evod set-up.

The "eGo" e-cig is the basic refillable, or 2nd generation device.

Personally speaking, I think getting high(er) power 3rd generation kit (if that's what all this hardware is called) is not the way forward.

100 x eGo and clearomiser set-up - that'd be my choice.

(Prefilled cartomisers are to be avoided i.m.o.)

Thank you! I was thinking about eGos, those seem to be pretty well known

 

[amandapalmtree]

Maybe you could try that study right here, right now, in this thread. Everyone here is vaping as we speak !.

I would love to! Unfortunately in my study you would have to come into my lab physically, which might be a bit of a hike. However, if I do an internet survey in the future, I know exactly where to come!

 

[amandapalmtree]

What confuses me about independent studies of the effects of vaping on vapers is why those guys don't just come to a place like ECF and ask everyone here. ECF has got 228,518 members and there are no limits to how many studies could be going on in this forum. But for some unknown reason these folks who do these studies want to do it behind closed doors where no one can see. We would like to see these studies being done in real time on tens of thousands of vapers. If there were ever a perfect place to perform a study on the effects of the electric alternative then ECF is it.

I'm sure almost every ECF member would agree, and that's tens of thousands of committed vapers

If there is anything you want to know about my experiences of vaping i'd be happy to take part in your study right now.

I'd also like to add that if you need information to help you kick this study off then why don't you ask those 100 people for it ?. Seems silly to come to ECF and ask vapers for helpful information then not ask them, while you are here, about their experiences of vaping.

.

If you aren't interested in anything we may have to say on our own experiences of vaping then i can only assume that you are trying to take the piss !.

I'm sorry if it came off the wrong way, I was really just looking for a product recommendation. I thought that coming to something like this, I would be able to hear from real people what they thought. Again, people would have to physically come into my lab to do this study, so I can't do it online. My lab in the past has done internet surveys with vapers, and we've advertised on Reddit, so we do make an attempt to reach out to you all. I really appreciate the information everyone here has given me!

 

[amandapalmtree]

In a perfect world, everyone using the same devise would work for everyone, as far as quitting smoking.

But that's not the case. The reason so many people are able to give up smoking (using e-cigarettes), is their ability to find a setup that works for them.

• Be it low powered or high powered (this greatly affects the amount of vapor put out & mg nicotine someone uses).
  
• Be it tight airflow or airy airflow
• Be it mouth-2-lung or direct to lung inhailing (and choosing the hardware that allows them to do one or the other or both)
  
• Be it regular nicotine or NET (naturally extracted tobacco) or some other type of nicotine (can't remember what that is).
• Be it PG/VG or just PG or just VG.

The reason so many have quit smoking (by vaping) IMHO, centers around choice & options.

There are 1000's of stories, all of them different. I've been vaping almost 9 years. Learned the "tricks of the trade" through youtube. Didn't have time for forums and what I was using was working great for me.

Joined ECF 1.5 years ago as I had a lot of time (my situation changed) and was interested in what others had to say. Spend most of my time here in "new members" answering questions and providing links on anything vape related: hardware, battery safety, DIY, juice.

You are 100% correct! Everyone does use something a little different, and that will certainly be one limitation of my study. However, I have to start somewhere small and build up, so that's where I'm at right now

 

[amandapalmtree]

a simple ego/vision style battery with a vision CE5 clearomizer and
or iclear16 at 1.8 to 2.1 ohms should be sufficient.
for in lab testing these would be affordable and usable
for anyone who vapes at least for the limited amount
of time they will be used in the lab.
an e-juice some where between 8 to 12 mg per ml
should be good enough to measure nicotine in the system
with out having to resort to any extravagant testing
techniques.
the more advanced box mods and such have a place in vaping
but your average vaper is not using them. at least 80% and probably
a lot more vapers do not use the more advanced systems despite
what you might glean from reading these forums.
regards
mike

thank you!!!

 

[amandapalmtree]

It would seem more effective to have test subjects who are smokers who are not vapers, than those who regularly vape, to determine what is appealing. A simple survey among already vapers would answer your question...

You are absolutely right! However, those things have all been done before, I'm trying something a little different

 

[amandapalmtree]

If you are bringing in regular vapers, let them use their own set ups. You will get a cross section of different devices and can include more variables in your study. Some devices use a lot more juice than others. If you let them bring in their own rigs, you can get a wider range of real world data instead of just limiting your study to what you provide them.

You're right, this is one limitation in my study. Unfortunately, in the world of academia (which I am in) it is better to have control in this situation. Maybe in the future research we can look at people using their own set-up, but for my purposes right now, I need to keep it standard

 

[amandapalmtree]

I agree with this.

I don't understand what you are trying to glean from this study. Experienced vapers all have their own preferences and are not going to be impressed by an Ego with a cheap clearomizer.

Why not get a bunch of smokers, preferably smokers who say they don't want to quit, let them try a decent device like an iStick 30 or 40 or similar device and ask them for an opinion.

You're right, and other groups have done similar studies like this. I'm not looking for an opinion, per se, but more of how people respond in more objective ways.

 

[amandapalmtree]

Or give 20 smokers $50 worth of gear, a lesson in using it, a week, and have them report what they like or don't like about it and if they reduced cigarette consumption...

This sounds like a great study, and in fact, a lot of people would love to do this! However, the FDA does not allow us to administer e-cigs with the intent of therapeutic purposes (like smoking cessation). Some groups in Europe and Australia/New Zeland have done exactly this, though, but the studies were not very rigorous

 

[amandapalmtree]

I am sorry but something seems very "off" about all this.

Since vaping is an experience unique to each individual user based on their personal preferences, choice of gear, choice of eliquid flavors/unflavored, choice of nicotine levels/no nicotine what makes it appealing and work is unique to each individual user, what works for one vaper may not/will not work for another vaper.

We understand there is currently a lot of research going on in this field, not all of it is good science, impartial, beneficial or fair to vapers so asking a vaping forum for help without giving us any clue/background on what results you are trying to achieve is asking a lot given some of the harmful junk science we have seen during the FDA hearings... and I do not know about yada yada but there are no current FDA regulations on vaping/gear/eliquids and most of us vapers would like to see it stay that way.

You are correct! However the FDA has regulations on what type of research that can be done with e-cigarettes, so there are limitations there. Again, I apologize if it came off the wrong way, but I was really just trying to get a sense about a product recommendation from a group of people who obviously know what they are talking about. I know that there are a lot of individual differences to take into consideration, and this is exactly why I came here to see what could generally be recommended to me

 

[edyle]

If there are vape stores in your area you should definitely pay them a visit.

If your subjects are existing vapers I think it would definitely help for you to familiarise yourself with what vape gear they use. Somebody vaping on the popular istick+nautilus setup is probably going to frown if you give them an ego battery with a ce4 to vape.

you're probably going to want a bunch of driptips
$6.25 Acrylic + POM Detachable Hybrid 510 Drip Tip (10-Pack) 10-pack - 21.2mm / green at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

 

[evan le'garde]

I'm sorry if it came off the wrong way, I was really just looking for a product recommendation. I thought that coming to something like this, I would be able to hear from real people what they thought. Again, people would have to physically come into my lab to do this study, so I can't do it online. My lab in the past has done internet surveys with vapers, and we've advertised on Reddit, so we do make an attempt to reach out to you all. I really appreciate the information everyone here has given me!

If you agree that the kinds of devices that vapers use are a personal preference, then again i'd have to ask you why you don't ask your test subjects for this information ?. Seeing as none of us here are a part of your study it really is pointless asking any of us anything.
Unless you think your test subjects aren't "real people".

 

[amandapalmtree]

If you agree that the kinds of devices that vapers use are a personal preference, then again i'd have to ask you why you don't ask your test subjects for this information ?. Seeing as none of us here are a part of your study it really is pointless asking any of us anything.
Unless you think your test subjects aren't "real people".

I need to have the e-cig ready before they come in. I'm trying to get a general idea of something that everyone would be okay using. Everyone is going to use something different in their regular lives, but if there is something out there that is good enough for my quick study session, that's what I need

 

[edyle]

I need to have the e-cig ready before they come in. I'm trying to get a general idea of something that everyone would be okay using. Everyone is going to use something different in their regular lives, but if there is something out there that is good enough for my quick study session, that's what I need

You need some pre-information before your subjects come in, if they are already vaping.
Some will be using little cigalikes.
Some will be using ego size setups with evod tanks.
Some will be using mech mods.
My guess is most will be using 30 watt mods with either an aspire tank or a kanger tank or similar.
Some will use rda's aka drippers.

A vape shop would be a good place for you to talk to somebody; they might loan you supplies for your study instead of you having to buy all the stuff; the liquids you use you will have to pay for, but for hardware, if you can just borrow or rent it........