Vapor Flask V3 DNA40 Clone thread
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Aside from the RMA number that is word for word the response I received about mine. Your reaction is about the same also.
Bloke,
Just remember that a good Rosin Flux (I like liquid by GC) is your best friend. Even when you are just reheating a connection flux will turn a poor gray colored connection into a shinny bright great connection.
This is everything I own, solder-wise. The iron is a 48W device, it has a screwdriver-type head on at the moment but also comes with a standard pointy one. The little rolls of solder came free with it, they're 1.0mm and 1.5mm. The larger roll I bought the other day is 1.0mm. All three have Rosin flux inside, but I also have the separate Flux that you see.
Here is the hole that's for the ground screw on mine, probably the same location on all of them.
Yeah she said it was the supplier who wanted it back, so sounds like they responded differently to Kangxin (or are doing so now.)
That said, it's 3F who hold the relationship and she/they had the opportunity to take the risk themselves. It isn't even the having to return it part that really pisses me off, it's having to return it first, before they'll send another. Meaning I'd have to wait 5 weeks - a total of 6.5 weeks from original order - before I hopefully get a working product.
And having to pay the return shipping up front hardly makes that easier to swallow.
So I take the cheapest shipping available. I'm out another $15 or whatever. Then what happens if the package gets lost? Or battered around further in transit such that when they get it it looks like I smacked it about? Then I'm out not only a flask, but an extra $15 on top!
I am surprised at 3F. Maybe they are getting so many orders that they don't care if they piss off one customer. But it seems to me that their business relies a lot on people being willing to take a chance. If their first order then turns out to be exactly what everyone worries about when they order from China, they won't come back and nor will anyone they talk to.
A few loss-making orders would seem to be a price worth paying from their point of view, to ensure that they're well known for taking on most of that risk on part of the customer (as indeed we thought they were, based on the KX experience.) But as I say, maybe they're making money hand over fist. Who knows.
And was that the end of it, or did you get them to move at all? (I assume you expressed your dissatisfaction to them?)
On the subject of returns - rowsley in my M80 TC thread was just saying that his istick 50W is broken (constantly firing without button pressed.) He ordered from ECiggity in Hawaii, and has had the device over a month already.
After he sent them a video they quickly emailed him a prepaid shipping label, and told him that they would dispatch a replacement as soon as the tracking showed it was in transit.
That's how you handle returns.
Sure I was hoping my disappointment and inconvenience would have a (big) silver lining in that I'd get two. But I was never expecting that. Had they asked for it back having already sent me a replacement, I wouldn't have been too annoyed overall - still sucks having to wait twice the shipping time, but I was already pleasantly surprised with 8 days delivery, 20 days was always possible.
But the way they're handling it has turned it from disappointing to dreadful. Who the hell wants to wait nearly two months for a working product, or thinks that's reasonable to ask a customer to expect? Sure most of that is shipping delay, but their business is based on selling to people from far away countries. They should be factoring that in, and ensuring when there are returns, it's as painless as possible.
Right OK, I'm done
Now to see about this flask..
After he sent them a video they quickly emailed him a prepaid shipping label, and told him that they would dispatch a replacement as soon as the tracking showed it was in transit.
That's how you handle returns.
Sure I was hoping my disappointment and inconvenience would have a (big) silver lining in that I'd get two. But I was never expecting that. Had they asked for it back having already sent me a replacement, I wouldn't have been too annoyed overall - still sucks having to wait twice the shipping time, but I was already pleasantly surprised with 8 days delivery, 20 days was always possible.
But the way they're handling it has turned it from disappointing to dreadful. Who the hell wants to wait nearly two months for a working product, or thinks that's reasonable to ask a customer to expect? Sure most of that is shipping delay, but their business is based on selling to people from far away countries. They should be factoring that in, and ensuring when there are returns, it's as painless as possible.
Right OK, I'm done
Now to see about this flask..
(Not quite done)
Another possible reason for Waidea demanding the return is that maybe it's obvious to them - as it seemed to be for you guys - that it's a 5 minute fix on the ground screw. They want to fix this one and send me back the same one, not have to give out another and then be unable to re-sell the one I return because it'd be used (that is assuming they don't already do that sometimes!)
Another possible reason for Waidea demanding the return is that maybe it's obvious to them - as it seemed to be for you guys - that it's a 5 minute fix on the ground screw. They want to fix this one and send me back the same one, not have to give out another and then be unable to re-sell the one I return because it'd be used (that is assuming they don't already do that sometimes!)
They gave you that response on your Kangxin that died? I don't remember you saying that!
This is exactly what I think! Let's face it, vaping is not a billions upon billions user(s) industry yet, so I think these retailers keep up with the handful of forums online... A quick Google search of 3f and flask shows threads of people saying, if not bragging, how they "scored" 2 Flasks for the price of 1.
I think what started out as a gesture of good faith for the customers who really had issues (like bloke) turned into a BOGO for others... as Croak has stated.
I'm sorry dude. And I feel your pain. At this point, returning it and waiting for another 2-4 weeks, your better off asking for a refund including return shipping, and order from someone else. Or of course you could open that one and hopefully repair it.
Now, maybe they'll overnight/2-day or otherwise "express" ship you a tested replacement as compensation? I guess you could ask them.
I can't fault 3f for not shipping another in advance, they are simply selling boxes, not manufacturing the device. I'm sure their profit margin isn't 50% or 100%? I think you guys understand that.
I'm not saying it's fair, because it's not. And it sucks, but it happens.
I just got a flask myself, to put a dna30 in it... I had 3x brand new DNA30 chips, all new purchased at the same time from an authorized seller. I used 2 of them (perfectly) , I had 1 left I was saving for myself. I installed it, brand new, never soldered on, and the screen flickered. The other 2 of the batch of 3 were/are perfect in everyway... Mine was defective right out of the box. Now, I have to pay evolve $10 (20% of original purchase price) for the repair/replacement plus shipping back to them... Is that fair for a $50 item? That's more than 30% (including the shipping $5.60) but it is what it is. That being said, I'm thankful evolve is going to make it right, the alternative is leaving me for dead with a defective chip. So - I ended up using a dna20 I had, so yeah I have a dna20 flask! LOL (works great though and I'm at <15w 99% of the time anyways)
So sorry bloke! You've got a difficult decision ahead. Good luck brother!
I didn't buy mine from the "supplier", it is for 3F to make it good with their customer and worry about themselves and their supplier later.
Yeah. What I said to them in the email was that if they wanted me to return it, I would, but in that case I wanted a full refund and would not order from them again.
However I think in reality that if they don't back down, I will simply go ahead and open it. It might be a simple fix as everyone here has hoped (ground screw(s) ).
Either I'll succeed, and then I'll have a working flask in not too long. Or I'll fail, in which case I'm unlikely to bother returning it (maybe if I feel I can get it back together without any indication it was ever dismantled.) In that case I'll be out $80 because I'll go straight away to Focal and order another, and chalk the whole thing down to bad luck.
One downside - for the general good - is that that means I'll either just never contact 3F again, or I'll say to them "forget it, it's working now", or, unlikely, I will be returning a product that they detect as customer opened. Any of which might add to any suspicion they have that people are trying to pull a fast one on them for free flasks. So, sorry about that
But seems like the age of immediate returns is over anyway, so can't see it doing much further harm.I'd think that any such option from China - using FedEx or similar - is probably going to cost somewhere near the cost of a free flask (at least the wholesale price that it costs to 3F.)
Yeah, but they hold the relationship with the customer, not the manufacturer. And they are not a normal retailer. It's not like ordering from Amazon or whoever. They're a long way away, so shipping takes weeks. The products are cheaply made, quickly made clones with a higher risk of failure. And because of the former, the latter is much worse because return turnaround time is measured in months.
They don't need a 50 or 100% return margin to provide free units to 1% of customers. And if their failure/return rate is much higher than 1%, they need to cancel that product because it's dishonest and irresponsible to sell a product with a high chance of not working (doubly so given the difficulty in returns.)
And again I wasn't even asking for a free unit. I was asking for an immediate dispatch of the replacement, after which I will return mine. So that I get the working product I pay for in the shortest time possible; recognising that I should have had it already, and everything happening now is inconvenience and hassle.
It's not even about fairness to me, as such. I think it's stupid from their own point of view I literally would have purchased hundreds of dollars of further products from them, probably in a matter of months. They won't now be getting any of that. They don't know that for sure, of course (though I have now told them in my annoyed response!) But they have to know that vapers tend to want lots of new products, of which there is an ever-increasing range to choose from. They should also realise that someone willing to spend $80 buying from China with multi-week delivery is somewhat likely to do it again. IF he gets a good experience.
Again, they're not a normal retailer. They represent something of a risk and an unknown to their overseas customers. I would think they would want to do all they can to take on as much of that risk themselves as they can. And that's exactly what I thought they were doing before, based on the other experiences people quoted.
Of course it could be a special situation, as you and croak said. Maybe word has got out that it's a BOGOF bonanza, and they are fielding lots of suspicious or downright fraudulent returns. Maybe it was my bad luck to get a problem at a time when they are having to clamp down on that. But if so, it's their bad luck too, and I still think they could handle this much better. Again, it's not even the having-to-return-it part; I just want my fixed unit ASAP.
And I'd say that requiring me to pay upfront for cheap, uninsured shipping is really the icing on the cake - it's that more than anything else that tells me that contrary to previous reports, they don't give a damn about customer satisfaction or reputation. Or, again that they're in the midsts of a big returns problem and they're handling it badly because they're unprepared for it. (Maybe before now, they never asked for anything returned, and now suddenly they have to and don't have it figured out properly.)
Well that's not right either. The unit doesn't work, it should be replaced free of charge including free return shipping. In fact, here in the UK, that's actually the law (except possibly about free return shipping.)
So Evolv suck too!
Thanks man!
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3FVape may not have RMA labels yet because this is obviously a new policy. Get your price on shipping it back & I'm pretty Sure it will cost more than $15.00 with a tracking number. With the amount of shipping they do they should easily be able to inquire with their shipping company about RMA shipping Label options that are more cost effective for them. I would ask them because I would be surprised if you could ship it back for less than $25 - $30.
Really sorry to hear it Bloke! Worst news possible. It is surprising that 3FVape will not ship you a new unit when you submit a tracking number to them that you have shipped the damaged unit back. You could video packing it up and mailing that package & email links with the tracking number. I'd be surprised if they denied cross shipping a unit with that kind of proof of shipping. Run it past them.
If they don't agree to that you could tell them you think its just a loose ground & ask if the manufacturer could talk you through the repair in a Skype Video Call session.
Doubt they will do it, but never hurts to ask!
Really sorry dude! Now I feel like I jinxed you!
Really sorry to hear it Bloke! Worst news possible. It is surprising that 3FVape will not ship you a new unit when you submit a tracking number to them that you have shipped the damaged unit back. You could video packing it up and mailing that package & email links with the tracking number. I'd be surprised if they denied cross shipping a unit with that kind of proof of shipping. Run it past them.
If they don't agree to that you could tell them you think its just a loose ground & ask if the manufacturer could talk you through the repair in a Skype Video Call session.
Doubt they will do it, but never hurts to ask!
Really sorry dude! Now I feel like I jinxed you!
I agree with that, they should be willing to work with a disgruntled customer (rightfully so I might add) a little better than ship it back for under $15 and we will figure it out from there. That's why if it were up to me, I'd want a refund and order from someone else.
All I'm saying is I think their generous customer service may have fallen victim to abuse. So they had to change things up, that I understand. But the middle ground in my opinion is this... The cost of the unit is let's guess $40 (just for the sake of this example) so before they would advance replace a $40 cost unit if a defective unit made it to a customer.
So now, the customer has to return the defective product which is not unheard of or unreasonable. But for compensation ship the replacement unit express of some kind.. $25-$30 so the customer gets the working unit asap. That to me would be acceptable, just saying.
As for the defect, that's their argument with the wholesaler/supplier, as 3F is their customer...just like Bloke is 3F's customer.
All I'm saying is I think their generous customer service may have fallen victim to abuse. So they had to change things up, that I understand. But the middle ground in my opinion is this... The cost of the unit is let's guess $40 (just for the sake of this example) so before they would advance replace a $40 cost unit if a defective unit made it to a customer.
So now, the customer has to return the defective product which is not unheard of or unreasonable. But for compensation ship the replacement unit express of some kind.. $25-$30 so the customer gets the working unit asap. That to me would be acceptable, just saying.
As for the defect, that's their argument with the wholesaler/supplier, as 3F is their customer...just like Bloke is 3F's customer.
Damn you're dead right, Tpat - the cheapest shipping I can get is $18.30.
I'm going to email that to them right now.
Oh, and that's without tracking - just "delivery confirmation." With tracking, it's $100!
Admittedly that's Royal Mail (our equivalent of USPS), there might be other independents that are cheaper. I'll check that quickly..
EDIT: About $26 from an independent courier firm, I assume including tracking.
I'm going to email that to them right now.
Oh, and that's without tracking - just "delivery confirmation." With tracking, it's $100!
Admittedly that's Royal Mail (our equivalent of USPS), there might be other independents that are cheaper. I'll check that quickly..
EDIT: About $26 from an independent courier firm, I assume including tracking.
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@tpat, yeah international shipping is expensive.
I will say this, I'm a small business owner, that's why I can somewhat understand the situation at 3F...though I am in No WAY defending them. They have a commercial shipping account, which gives them a discount based on the volume they ship. Considering they are an online seller 100% volume is pretty high. They should get very reasonable rates, shipping companies fight for large volume shippers accounts. I would be willing to guarantee they could overnight or express ship a replacement for LESS than or close to the cost of a advanced replacement.
Again, they are shafting you Bloke as a customer... No doubt. They CAN handle this better, but apparently have chosen not to. And in the end, their name sake will be their rating 3F's!
One of my favorite sayings is bad service can make good food taste bad.... And great service can make mediocre food enjoyable. (yeah I'm a fat guy) LOL
I will say this, I'm a small business owner, that's why I can somewhat understand the situation at 3F...though I am in No WAY defending them. They have a commercial shipping account, which gives them a discount based on the volume they ship. Considering they are an online seller 100% volume is pretty high. They should get very reasonable rates, shipping companies fight for large volume shippers accounts. I would be willing to guarantee they could overnight or express ship a replacement for LESS than or close to the cost of a advanced replacement.
Again, they are shafting you Bloke as a customer... No doubt. They CAN handle this better, but apparently have chosen not to. And in the end, their name sake will be their rating 3F's!
One of my favorite sayings is bad service can make good food taste bad.... And great service can make mediocre food enjoyable. (yeah I'm a fat guy) LOL
3FVape wants to work with you if you STAY CALM & show them you are trying to work with them as well to make this as smooth as possible all the way around! Kate is a lot harder to deal with than Gina and you can always send an email to Monica (their boss) about cross shipping the replacement after submitting your tracking number to them as proof of shipping.
Just relax when you communicate with the & they will work with you if you are reasonable! Tell them it would cost you $100 to ship with a tracking number and that their shipping company will probably offer a return label service much cheaper that you can get.
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How do you know so much about 3F customer service? How many products have you returned?
(Also, love these names! Kate, Gina, Monica, and probably Barry, Alan and James. I'm going to email them back as Wang Yong.)
(Also, love these names! Kate, Gina, Monica, and probably Barry, Alan and James. I'm going to email them back as Wang Yong.)
OMG. If you send it with tracking, you'd be 2/3 the way to a genuine flask! Wow... What a nightmare.
FWIW : I had an issue with FastTech and they actually have a USA address for returns, for situations like this... I don't know about in the UK?
FWIW : I had an issue with FastTech and they actually have a USA address for returns, for situations like this... I don't know about in the UK?
3FVape's Return policy on their website:
Incorrect/Damaged Goods
We try very hard to ensure that you receive your order in pristine condition. If you do not receive the products ordered, please CONTACT US. In the unlikely event that the product arrives damaged or faulty, please contact us immediately. Provided that you have contacted us first, 3FVape covers for all shipping charges for returning damaged and incorrectly shipped items.
Incorrect/Damaged Goods
We try very hard to ensure that you receive your order in pristine condition. If you do not receive the products ordered, please CONTACT US. In the unlikely event that the product arrives damaged or faulty, please contact us immediately. Provided that you have contacted us first, 3FVape covers for all shipping charges for returning damaged and incorrectly shipped items.
He is 3F forum snooper... LOL (just kidding)How do you know so much about 3F customer service? How many products have you returned?
(Also, love these names! Kate, Gina, Monica, and probably Barry, Alan and James. I'm going to email them back as Wang Yong.)
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