What IS their problem????

[Anjaffm]

@zoiDman:

I do not know your gender. But let me tell you this much:
I am a lady. A woman. A person of female sex. And in my life I have been approached - repeatedly - by cowardly males with intent to insult and verbally attack. Because I am "only a woman". Well, they were in for a big surprise. A very big surprise. I do not think highly of cowards approaching a lady with intent to insult and intimidate. And those cowards all left with their tails between their legs.

And I can very well understand what the OP is telling. Because such things have happened to me. Without the least provocation.

Like I said, I do not know your gender.
But as a woman, I have had similar experiences.

.........
edit:
Diogenes:

and here comes another guy blaming the victim.
Maybe she was wearing her skirt too short as well?

 

[Fulgurant]

ok... Lol

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Trust me, I LOLed too when you trotted out that question as if it were the end-all be-all. If real college policy makers really are that arrogant, then the situation's too depressing for anything other than laughter.

 

[Mrs C]

I think this is a Very Hard Sell to make to people.

Telling someone that a Vaper needs to vape constantly opens up many issues when it comes to e-Cigarette policies.

You didn't State constantly

of me by policy makers Numerous times when deciding whether or not to allow e-Cigarette use on a college campus.

And that is: "Why do e-Cigarette users have to use their e-cigarettes more frequently than smokers seem to have to smoke?"

I don't vape constantly, I do vape more than I smoked. While there are not a lot of studies yet specifically on E liquid vapor, there are enough credible ones on the contents individually to show they are less harmful than

smoking
side stream smoke (I don't include 2nd hand not going there)
sitting by a bonfire
simply breathing as you walk down a sidewalk with traffic
wait at a bus stop
share breathing space with people in cough or sneeze range during cold and flu season

 

[Sickkboy]

The heck is wrong with these people?! They had their wrong med? Women on period still behave much much nicer than this.

 

[bcalvanese]

Ya know, there are several members of this community that take a lot of there own time in doing reviews, events, research, and you name it. They do it for us. So we can have the information we need, and devices we use. They are 110% deticated to this community, and I can garantee that not one of them would support some of the comments that I have read here.

This is how we support them?

This is the thanks they get for all they do for us?

This is very upsetting to me, because this is the kind of thing that can ruin everything that these people have busted their butts for.

And we even have some veteran members that are supporting this type of behavior.

Way to go team...

 

[zoiDman]

@zoiDman:

I do not know your gender. But let me tell you this much:
I am a lady. A woman. A person of female sex. And in my life I have been approached - repeatedly - by cowardly males with intent to insult and verbally attack. Because I am "only a woman". Well, they were in for a big surprise. A very big surprise. I do not think highly of cowards approaching a lady with intent to insult and intimidate. And those cowards all left with their tails between their legs.

And I can very well understand what the OP is telling. Because such things have happened to me. Without the least provocation.

Like I said, I do not know your gender.
But as a woman, I have had similar experiences.

.........
edit:
Diogenes:

and here comes another guy blaming the victim.
Maybe she was wearing her skirt too short as well?

I'm sorry to hear that.

Just say'n that before we Burn this Old Guy at the Stake, it would be nice to know all that went on.

But this is the Internet. So that can't happen. That is why I don't get to Wound Up about things like this.

 

[JJOOHHNN]

I have a problem with the ones that playact, others are just misinformed.

I am sure I am misinformed about a lot of other subjects and I am willing to bet most of us out here have bad information on some part of the universe of knowledge.

 

[stevegmu]

Last I checked, resorting to physical violence when verbally confronted is an easy way to get arrested, tried, convicted and sent to jail/prison; not that the big talkers here would actually do what they claim in the real world.

Would make the news, though- Electronic cigarette use leads to violence...

 

[Diogenes]

Diogenes:

and here comes another guy blaming the victim.
Maybe she was wearing her skirt too short as well?

After I finished writing my response, I went back and reread all that you wrote prior to what my response was going to be, just because I wanted to cover everything. After I hit "post reply" I realized that this would be the type of response I would get from you.

From this response, I can see that you either did not read what I had written, or did not comprehend it. I agreed that the guy should not have approached the OP and did what he did. But my point was that we did not know what was going on other than what was presented to us. I did not express nor imply that the "victim" had it coming, that it was her fault. You are simply reading something that is not there.

You dislike men, it is very apparent. We are the root of all that's evil, and that ALL MEN victimize women. Here's the problem though, (I realize that this is completely off topic), but more than 40% of all victims of domestic abuse are male. So, get off your soapbox. You need to realize that anyone, ANYONE, can be a victim, not just women. /rant

More than 40% of domestic violence victims are male, report reveals | Society | The Observer

 

[Anjaffm]

I'm sorry to hear that.

Just say'n that before we Burn this Old Guy at the Stake, it would be nice to know all that went on.

But this is the Internet. So that can't happen. That is why I don't get to Wound Up about things like this.

Thank you
And I am not getting wound up at all It is just that many women have had similar experiences with cowardly males who attempt to insult and intimidate a woman. Those cowards who feel oh-so-strong when faced with a woman. And who would not dare say a single word to a man.

.. stuff.. happens.
And tough women are not born. They are made

............
@bcalvanese:

This is very upsetting to me, because this is the kind of thing that can ruin everything that these people have busted their butts for.

remind me to shed a tear when I have time

In the meantime, why don't you take a look at this:
Rampant Antismoking Signifies Grave Danger

That makes fascinating reading as to the real reasons behind smoking bans. And now vaping bans.

......
/edit:
@Diogenes:
And I was expecting this kind of response from you.
There is a big difference between "all males" and "cowardly males who insult a woman, because they would not dare to insult a man".

You dislike men

Do I now? Or do I dislike cowards who try to pick on those whom they perceive (!) as being weaker than themselves?

Fact is: that guy walked up to a lady with intent to intimidate her. Fact is: that guy walked up to a lady and used an expletive.

Some people might enjoy such a "wonderful show of strength". Others do not.
Suit yourself.

 

[34 Hour Reset]

@zoiDman:

I do not know your gender. But let me tell you this much:
I am a lady. A woman. A person of female sex. And in my life I have been approached - repeatedly - by cowardly males with intent to insult and verbally attack. Because I am "only a woman". Well, they were in for a big surprise. A very big surprise. I do not think highly of cowards approaching a lady with intent to insult and intimidate. And those cowards all left with their tails between their legs.

And I can very well understand what the OP is telling. Because such things have happened to me. Without the least provocation.

Like I said, I do not know your gender.
But as a woman, I have had similar experiences.

.........
edit:
Diogenes:

and here comes another guy blaming the victim.
Maybe she was wearing her skirt too short as well?

So if a woman decides to be jerky to a man, would you sarcastically say that perhaps the man's skirt too short as well? Meaning, would you still employ your rapey buzzwords had the genders been reversed?

Jerks are just jerks.

 

[Fulgurant]

You didn't State constantly

That's because it's a trap question, based on a tautological premise. It's designed to distract you with an irrelevant discussion about e-cig usage habits, when what you should be asking is why the conversation's reasonable in the first place.

"LOL, of course vapers don't need to vape in places where smokers aren't allowed to smoke; after all, smokers can survive not smoking in those places! And if vapers do say that they need to vape more often than smokers need to smoke, then we can draw all sorts of unflattering inferences about the insidiously addictive properties of vapor instead of defending our indefensible policy decisions."

 

[Hill]

I'm saying if someone gets confrontational, simply defuse the situation by putting your device away. Maybe even say "I'm sorry".

You may have to eat a little crow, but you will do a lot for the community.

So what your basically sayingis you would say "Oh I'm so sorry Mr. anti nicotine nazi. Of course your right and your beligerant and ill tempered attack on my perfectly legal activity proves it.
I will now put my vaping device away and walk away meekly because I'm such a bad person and you have every right to take away the freedoms our forefathers gave there lives for us to have. you can count this as a bona-fide win"

You might roll over and give up but I won't. F&^K that guy, I subscribe to Teddy Roosevelts philosophy "Speak softly but carry a big stick"
that guy would've got the stick
On the other hand if someone approached me in a civilized manner and asked me to please not blow my vape their way. I would have obliged them and perhaps even apologized.

 

[zoiDman]

Trust me, I LOLed too when you trotted out that question as if it were the end-all be-all. If real college policy makers really are that arrogant, then the situation's too depressing for anything other than laughter.

I didn't see the Individuals I dealt with to be Arrogant at all. But they didn't understand why person who uses and e-Cigarette couldn't go and hour or so without taking a hit.

There was also the issue of what Exactly was inside an e-Liquid.

Where it would be Fun to Demonize them as ANTZ. Hell bent on ridding the world of Tobacco, it just wasn't like that.

 

[tA71ana]

Ya know, there are several members of this community that take a lot of there own time in doing reviews, events, research, and you name it. They do it for us. So we can have the information we need, and devices use. They are 110% deticated to this community, and I can garantee that not one of them would support some of the comments that I have read here.

This is how we support them?

This is the thanks they get for all they do for us?

This is very upsetting to me, because this is the kind of thing that can ruin everything that these people have busted their butts for.

And we even have some veteran members that are supporting this type of behavior.

Way to go team...

Giving people respect is one thing.
But there are those for whom giving constant deference to is a license to run roughshod over you.
There comes a point where one must say "this far and no farther".
I have learned in 53 years of life that people are going to think what they choose, in many cases willfully and wantonly ignoring facts.
I can't control what others think - I can only manage my reaction to it and that is if I choose to react at all.
Another thing (and I have said this many times in this forum)
Humankind is terribly dysfunctional..one of our issues as a species is a need to control others.
If you smoke, folks harangue you about smoking...so you quit and then they harangue you about vaping.
If you stop that, they will harangue you about something else.
Because of the above tendency to control, sometimes members of our species need to be told to mind their own freaking business, ie., boundaries need to be set because of what I mentioned in Line 2.

 

[progg]

Their problem is growing in frequency and the individual is their target. They operate from the comfort zone of familiar groups/collectives.

Our institutions - gov't, education, media,culture - are chock full of the anointed, the offended, the unthinking emotional blackmailers.

Do not all these groups support the problem behavior? Do you support them? Do you support the initiation of the use of force upon an individual to achieve a goal, a gov't policy, a social 'good'?

BTW, under the circumstance the OP reports, I would not escalate the situation (or apologize). Escalation can lead to handcuffs. This situation isn't worth that. Ultimately, the dude acted in a way that has become acceptable and which is reinforced daily. It's learned, rewarded behavior. They get a squishy, righteous trophy from the group for supporting the group. It could be a smile, a pat on the back, a title, a profile in the paper. That's all that's required.

Unless and until you say no to the lot of it, even for a social 'good(s)' you find desirable, you'll contribute to its growth. This wasn't meant to you specifically,OP.

 

[Anjaffm]

So what your basically sayingis you would say "Oh I'm so sorry Mr. anti nicotine nazi. Of course your right and your beligerant and ill tempered attack on my perfectly legal activity proves it.
I will now put my vaping device away and walk away meekly because I'm such a bad person and you have every right to take away the freedoms our forefathers gave there lives for us to have. you can count this as a bona-fide win"

You might roll over and give up but I won't. F&^K that guy, I subscribe to Teddy Roosevelts philosophy "Speak softly but carry a big stick"
that guy would've got the stick
On the other hand if someone approached me in a civilized manner and asked me to please not blow my vape their way. I would have obliged them and perhaps even apologized.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you

 

[Fulgurant]

I didn't see the Individuals I dealt with to be Arrogant at all. But they didn't understand why person who uses and e-Cigarette couldn't go and hour or so without taking a hit.

Then they're incompetent. There is no alternative; if you're trying to design a fair and reasonable policy, and your best inquiry assumes that the policy is already reasonable, then you're either arrogant or you're irrational, and thus unqualified for the task.

There was also the issue of what Exactly was inside an e-Liquid.

That would be a fair question for them to ask, but it's not the one you selected as your "last word" trump card, so I was left to assume that the other was the best question they asked you. I can only go on what you write.

Where it would be Fun to Demonize them as ANTZ. Hell bent on ridding the world of Tobacco, it just wasn't like that.

Whether the people in question were dyed-in-the-wool ANTZ themselves, or whether they were just ignorant tools of the ANTZ ultimately doesn't matter. The point is that people in authority should be extremely cautious and thoughtful when they consider restricting the behavior of individuals. From what I've seen personally, and from what you wrote on this subject particularly, it seems to me that petty fuctionaries up and down the ladder are far too quick to exert what power they have.

 

[dragonbone]

Ya know, there are several members of this community that take a lot of there own time in doing reviews, events, research, and you name it. They do it for us. So we can have the information we need, and devices we use. They are 110% deticated to this community, and I can garantee that not one of them would support some of the comments that I have read here.
This is how we support them?
This is the thanks they get for all they do for us?
This is very upsetting to me, because this is the kind of thing that can ruin everything that these people have busted their butts for.
And we even have some veteran members that are supporting this type of behavior.
Way to go team...

What on earth are you on about?

1. Who is 'them' and 'they',
2. and what have 'we' done to 'them'?
3. Which veterans
4. have supported 'what' behaviour
5. and why is 'that' bad?
6. Who is the team?

 

[Anjaffm]

Giving people respect is one thing.
But there are those for whom giving constant deference to is a license to run roughshod over you.
There comes a point where one must say "this far and no farther".
I have learned in 53 years of life that people are going to think what they choose, in many cases willfully and wantonly ignoring facts.
I can't control what others think - I can only manage my reaction to it and that is if I choose to react at all.
Another thing (and I have said this many times in this forum)


Humankind is terribly dysfunctional..one of our issues as a species is a need to control others.
If you smoke, folks harangue you about smoking...so you quit and then they harangue you about vaping.
If you stop that, they will harangue you about something else.
Because of the above tendency to control, sometimes members of our species need to be told to mind their own freaking business, ie., boundaries need to be set because of what I mentioned in Line 2.

Thank you very much indeed