The shops seem to steer newbies into cloud gear and low nic because that consumes more juice. I started a brother 2 years ago. He's still at 10 watts and 3.5 ml per day.
Where is vaping going?
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While I see part of it as evolution the rest is simply competitive marketing taking over.
I still have and use a iTaste CLK! (650ma eGo with a Aspire K1 mounted) However I still have the same issues I did when I first got it. Namely:
Then came the internal vs user replaceable batteries. Once the tanks and mods were over 20-22mm diameter in size a user could use standard 18xxx batteries in it.
While Fasttech now offers prewound NR-R-NR welded coils which make rebuilding protank atomizers childs play a user would otherwise need to upgrade to Nautilus or larger style tanks to gain access to RBA's to get out of the factory atomizer rut. All of which might not fit properly on a "pen" style battery.
IMHO: beyond the above I think it is all competitive marketing. If given the choice between a 40W and 75W device with the same size/formfactor and price, which would we think the consumer would buy more times than not?
If your thinking the 40W device think again.
I still have and use a iTaste CLK! (650ma eGo with a Aspire K1 mounted) However I still have the same issues I did when I first got it. Namely:
- less than 2ml of capacity, have to refill to often
- only 650ma battery, enough to drain the tank but best put it on the charger once the tank is dry
- itty bitty factory coils which cost $3 a pop at the local B&M or $12 for a package of 5. (ouch!)
Then came the internal vs user replaceable batteries. Once the tanks and mods were over 20-22mm diameter in size a user could use standard 18xxx batteries in it.
While Fasttech now offers prewound NR-R-NR welded coils which make rebuilding protank atomizers childs play a user would otherwise need to upgrade to Nautilus or larger style tanks to gain access to RBA's to get out of the factory atomizer rut. All of which might not fit properly on a "pen" style battery.
IMHO: beyond the above I think it is all competitive marketing. If given the choice between a 40W and 75W device with the same size/formfactor and price, which would we think the consumer would buy more times than not?
If your thinking the 40W device think again.
I've seen a lot of new pod mods come out this year. Watching some reviews, they don't look too bad.
As far as B&Ms....they should have enough choices now, to offer something for anyone.
As far as B&Ms....they should have enough choices now, to offer something for anyone.
I guess I see the OP's point: He seems to be lamenting the fact that there is much less choice available to MTL vapers in a market geared more towards high-wattage, direct-lung vapers.
It seems true, but it is also true that the consumer drives the market. It's a business first.
It seems true, but it is also true that the consumer drives the market. It's a business first.
Then blame the shop she bought from, not the industry. A good shop is going to stock the mtl type devices, along with the larger dl attys and mods. The industry as a whole is going to innovate and continue to move forward. They are also going to continue to produce the smaller mtl tanks, batteries and combos. A decent shop is not going to sell a new vaper a massive box mod and a 30mm atty to sit on top of it. They are going to do all they can within the law to steer that person to one of the many many starter devices on the market.
While many people still do mtl vape, the hobby portion will continue to push for larger, be it attys, mods, power or what have you. It's the nature of it. It's the same thing for every market be it vaping, computers, cars etc.
It also falls on you, as a vaper, top help steer someone new to the device/setup that works for them. Go with them to shops. Point them in the right direction online. Show them devices that may work for what they want/need.
Ultimately stop blaming the industry and the hobby portion for doing what they do.
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Yup, now everyone wants the 300 and 400W mods.
Is there less development on the mtl side? Yes and no. Mods themselves can be used however you prefer. Want to vape at 10W on a 3 battery mod? Sure, and you'll go over a week without recharging. No one says you have to turn it up to 150W. IMO, what really determines the mtl experience is the tank. A tank with a tight draw and either factory coils that are comfy with low power low air, or an RTA that's single coil friendly with restricted air allows for a good mtl experience. While there have been a number of single coil RTAs that allow you to restrict the airflow that have entered the market in the last year, there haven't been as many factory coil tanks like that. There was the Nautilus X but what else for non-builders or beginning vapers?
So for me, it's not a problem on the mod side (and my 200W example was extreme, lots of 75W mods that are small easy to use and can run at 10W all day) but on the tank side. The more people buying single coil RTAs and tanks that have low airflow and mtl friendly factory coils, the more development money will go that route.
okay i get you're not happy with what you see... but the example you cited? the issue was with your friend and not the shop. if she's going to smoke rather than vape because she chose to buy a device that was large and chose to not take it because of fashion? that's her. as many have stated, the beauty of vaping, is that there is a ton of ways of doing it. i wouldn't have quit if i only had MtL choice. my hubby and i both started with the topbox mini 75w starter kits with .5ohm coils(neither of us could vape the 1.2 ohms). he's MtL and i'm DtL... one kit, two different styles, and it worked for both of us. he's still MtL and stealth vapes far higher wattage than i do. have you really tried those devices you claim are so bad? did you even know, with the RBAs a lot of them come with, you can vape from 0.1 to 3.0 ohms and aren't limited to big clouds?
the market has come out with roughly half a dozen new pod style easy to vape simple MtL devices this year, they're actually very popular. instead of telling people to get off your grass from your porch... how about holding a picnic on your lawn?
Thank you you at lest a few of you see my point.
All I would like to do is buy an 17- 18mm mtl rta with out spending hundreds of £'s. But are there any out there at the moment, if there are I can't find them.
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Personally, I moved beyond the 14mm batteries because of the short running time, not the clouds.
I have never been MTL, even on pen style ego clearo's as difficult as it was or as long as i had to pull i always was direct lung. To me they made the product better/easier. Oddly enough i was always a MTL Smoker and hated DL smoking.
Yup, small diameter RTAs are rare at any power level. Probably more out there that take heads, which are mostly rebuildable too. Lately I've been looking for wider and shorter low power RTAs for better pocketability and there are few of those too.
I think there is GG gear that is small in diameter. If you don't mind clones they've probably been done. I have a Vision Eternity that is tiny enough to fit on a eGo battery. Performance isn't fantastic, but is surprisingly good for a tank that size.
If you don't mind dripping there are some really great tiny RDAs out there too.
Good luck with it
I never understood the fascination. 300w? 400w? Even 200w? I've never pushed a mod beyond 150w, and that's with triple 18650's. Call it nerves, call it hypercritical thinking, call it fear...I don't even want to push dual battery mods past 100w, let alone push a single battery mech close to the CDR of its battery. I'll leave the clouds in the stratosphere where they belong. Guess it's that mentality that Eskie mentioned: bigger is better. Meh.
Growing pains. Every industry and technology has them. They are, for all intense purposes, impossible to prevent and if one is being realistic, necessary for any growth or learning curve to proceed. Unfortunately we find our selves in a society that has the audacity to think it can prevent all such pain. It has the innate human self righteousness to think any and all harm can be prevented if just the right amount of controls and regulations are implemented. Sadly this path usually has the opposite affect and stunts the growth curve of the new technology and harms 100% of the user base rather then forcing the general populace to learn by observation and self reflection.
It's that "upgraditis" that lots of us, particularly those of us in the gaming PC world which has its similarities in the vaping world, suffer from. Self righteousness coupled with self-appointed feelings of entitlement...along with a dash of desire, drive us to constantly be on the prowl for new shiny. That growth curve is directly affected by our wants.
High power is about bragging rights and/or clouds. Fire breathing is primordial. Kids don't see electronic cigarettes. They see cloud toys. It's not about nicotine. Clouds and the watts to make them are part of the market and will stay part of the market unless some noticable health issue comes up which hasnt happened yet. One of the things I like about vaping is I don't have to step outside. If I had to produce big clouds to be happy I would have to step outside. Thankfully 30 watts and 5-6 ml per day is enough for me so I can do it just about anywhere. I was flying the day before yesterday and spent a couple hours waiting for the flight and vaped discretely while I waited. I'm sure a few people noticed, including airport security, but nobody cared enough to make an issue of it. I would not have gotten away with 80% vg at 60 watts.
It can be done. Just very discreetly and best with something that doesn't look vape like. Better off in a restroom to reduce the likelihood of drawing attention even more. Although I was just in a restaurant a few days ago that had a sign No Smoking including e cigarettes. New one in a restaurant for me.
it can be, indeed. i've run into a few vapers in restrooms at EWR and LGA...but never out in the open anywhere near a gate. then again, we do live in the northeast.
I've seen that in NYC restaurants as well.
Oh, that was you I ran into at LGA? Hey, after the damn traffic to get into the airport, you've got to somehow relax before finding out your flight is delayed two hours because the plane is still in Charleston.
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