Why don't people want e-liquid labels changed?

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GeorgeS

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    You seem to be mixing up proper, sensible regulations (which are needed, of course) with regulations made on purpose to protect *corporations* (even at the people's expense, if need be) and control *people* - when it should be the other way around.

    Oh not at all. However define "proper, sensible regulations".

    Are any of these high powered vaping devices safety tested? No.
    Has every (any?) flavor being used been tested for long term effects on the users? No.
    Is every bottle of e-juice have chemical breakdowns of what goes into it? No.
    Are there child proof safety caps on the bottles? No.

    While I doubt that BT has done any of the above there is not mounds of studies and information proving the safety of vaping and the long term inhalation effects of the juice being marketed ether.

    Yes, it would appear that BT and others may help push to regulate vaping as we know it out of existence. However, please re-read what I wrote earlier, the bottom line being that if industries self regulated effectively there would be no reason to have government agencies and their regulations to play "big brother" and "protect us" or protect big business.
     

    caramel

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    Are any of these high powered vaping devices safety tested? No.
    Has every (any?) flavor being used been tested for long term effects on the users? No.
    Is every bottle of e-juice have chemical breakdowns of what goes into it? No.
    Are there child proof safety caps on the bottles? No.

    Is FDA using the same standards on all "tobacco products"? Particularly, on cigarettes too?
     

    caramel

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    Many Tobacco products (and Alcohol) are "grandfathered" as everyone knows they are to dangerous to ever pass any regulations. ;)

    While there's little one could do about the 'safety' of the inhaled stuff, the list of chemicals could surely be retrofitted to cigarettes if it's so important? Also child-resistant tamper-proof packaging? Or aren't they important other than for hampering vapers?
     

    DeAnna2112

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    I will say this and then I'm through with the subject.

    The movie industry and later the video gaming industry were both at one time facing strict government regulation. The way they both avoided the government regulation was to form an industry agency that oversaw and regulated itself. Their own agencies imposed their own restrictions, ratings, and guidelines. EVERYONE these days know what the movie ratings are, and most everyone knows about the video game ratings. Non-adult only theaters avoid rated X movies, virtually every video game store avoids selling porn games. Many theaters and stores will ID or refuse to sell to obviously underage kids. Advertising posters, trailers, and commercials are regulated and censored to avoid showing what they deem to be "mature" content to underage audiences, even if the movie or game itself is packed full of said mature content.

    The vaping industry really needs to adopt the same if they want to avoid heavy government regulation. They need to form an overall industry regulating agency that sets guidelines and limitations on how ecigs are marketed and sold, and that includes labeling. The industry needs to step up and demonstrate that it can act responsibly for the benefit of the industry, vaping community, and wider community as a whole or the government WILL enforce it's own standards and regulations. These people that think that ecig companies and ecig users should be able to do whatever they want with impunity are just begging the government to take over. You may as well call your government representatives up and tell them that you're incapable of controlling yourselves, because that's precisely what you're saying when you say that stuff like labeling ecig liquids just like candy is a good idea.


    Personally I'm just waiting for the day when some child dies because some vaping idiot who thinks they should be able to vape anywhere they want and behave however they want blows a big cloud of almond whatever into the face of some kid with a severe nut allergy. Watch how the government reacts to that one. And trust me, a case like that is just a matter of time with the attitudes some people here have about self control. We like to claim that second hand vapor is harmless, but the truth is that some of these flavors can kill someone with the right allergy, and some vapers are absolutely militant when it comes to being told that they should control where and how they vape in public.

    "Personally I'm just waiting for the day when some child dies because some vaping idiot who thinks they should be able to vape anywhere they want and behave however they want blows a big cloud of almond whatever into the face of some kid with a severe nut allergy. Watch how the government reacts to that one. And trust me, a case like that is just a matter of time with the attitudes some people here have about self control. We like to claim that second hand vapor is harmless, but the truth is that some of these flavors can kill someone with the right allergy, and some vapers are absolutely militant when it comes to being told that they should control where and how they vape in public."


    A severe allergic reaction to second hand vapor has already been reported on this forum. I am not going to go look it up but i guess it was about a month ago someone on here posted that they and a group of friends routinely get together from time to time to vape and hang out. One of the guys in the group started not feeling well and his throat swelled up and had to be rushed to the hospital. Apparently someone was vaping a peanut flavor and this guy had an allergy to peanuts.
    This is why i avoid vaping in public places because it happens and probably more then what we realize.
     

    Rossum

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    Chamberlain was a fool
    As is anyone who thinks they will achieve peace via appeasement of those who wish to rule them.

    Don't get me wrong; I do not believe the FDA will leave us to vape in peace no matter what we do, but I will not concede them an a square centimeter of territory (even on a label) willingly.
     

    skoony

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    Oh not at all. However define "proper, sensible regulations".

    Are any of these high powered vaping devices safety tested? No.
    Has every (any?) flavor being used been tested for long term effects on the users? No.
    Is every bottle of e-juice have chemical breakdowns of what goes into it? No.
    Are there child proof safety caps on the bottles? No.

    While I doubt that BT has done any of the above there is not mounds of studies and information proving the safety of vaping and the long term inhalation effects of the juice being marketed ether.

    Yes, it would appear that BT and others may help push to regulate vaping as we know it out of existence. However, please re-read what I wrote earlier, the bottom line being that if industries self regulated effectively there would be no reason to have government agencies and their regulations to play "big brother" and "protect us" or protect big business.
    i agree it would be better with self regulation than heavy handed
    Imperial entanglements.
    the way i see it its not who regulates its,why regulate at all?
    first the hardware.coil,wick,tank and a power source.(battery)
    aside from accidental venting,most caused by user abuse,a leaky
    tank here and there whats to regulate?
    wicks are of no real concern as the majority of these so-called
    dry hits are due to those making their own coils and wicks.
    most of these problems occur in the sub ohm range when
    dripping. i use iclear16's and have never had a dry hit.
    no regulation can prevent things at the DYI level nor
    should they attempt too. manufacturers of coil and
    wick assembly's have been very responsive in
    ironing out most of their issues.

    then there is the juice. whats to regulate there?
    nothing.your no frills basic e-juice has one ingredient.
    PG or VG and or both.that's it. i don't see a whole lot
    of room for regulation there.FDA food grade PG and VG
    are already made to exacting FDA regulation as to the purity
    of the product and as such they are what they are.
    now you can ad flavorings and or nicotine made again
    to FDA purity and safety standards.
    if a vendor is not using the above ingredients the vendor
    is not making e-juice. there are already laws at the
    local level to handle purity,safety and the manufacturing
    of e-juice. why is intrusive Federal regulation necessary?

    now the health concerns.
    name me one verified health concern other than allergy's
    that has been connected to e-cigs.
    i know of none.
    unless you abuse the hardware all if any toxic agents found
    are at such low levels as to be meaningless.
    all the positive scientific knowledge we have now indicates
    when averaged out that vaping is 98.7 % safer than smoking.
    what does that mean in the real world? it means it might be
    as dangerous as drinking municipal tap water.( no insult implied to you bottled water people.)
    as to long term studies,yes there will be long term studies.
    however the short term studies seem to indicate that when
    the long term studies are finished there will be little if any
    there,there.
    now lets look at the known harm this deadly,dangerous and,extremely addictive
    liquid nicotine has wrought upon society.
    there are only three reported deaths concerning liquid nicotine
    in the last 25 years in the USA.
    one murder by injection.
    one suicide by injection.
    one possible poisoning of a toddler in out state
    New York from a bottle of nicotine with a missing cap
    left in the toddlers reach.
    there you have it. the torrid tale of what liquid
    nicotine has done to tear the very fabric of society
    asunder.
    still has horrible as liquid nicotine's safety record is
    i will stack it up against the safety record of a very
    similar product.
    caffeinated energy drinks.
    :eek: OMG! how have we survived for so long with out
    Federal regulations? its a miracle we are all alive
    and posting here today. by all rights we should already
    have one foot in the grave. so yes folks,lets keep
    urging the government to regulate e-cigs because
    you never know there may be wicking material,
    nickel from the coils,and,impure ingredients and or additives
    in the juice.the batteries may explode. we may
    abuse our hardware.some one may tamper with our hardware
    and or juice.please govment' protect us.
    :2c:
    regards
    mike
     

    skoony

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    Your argument about the juice is wrong. There are multiple ingredients. What do you think makes the flavoring? All of it is approved for INGESTION, not inhalation. 2 entirely different sources of entry.
    my argument is essentially correct.
    any inhalation standards are already in place.
    with over 100 years of commercial food processing
    and flavor extraction any lung related health
    issues would have been noted and inhalation
    standards put into place. other than a minor concern
    from diketones in the flavoring no such concerns have
    been voiced nor noted even by our opponents.
    nicotine in the concentrations we use it produces
    no long term effects to otherwise healthy lung
    tissue.
    there really is no serious health effects that can
    be attributed to -e-cigs when used correctly by
    an otherwise healthy person.none.
    regards
    mike
     

    stevegmu

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    There are exposure limits for stage hands and concert workers who work around fog machines, as well as guidelines for protective equipment for food flavoring manufacturers. Nothing anyone vapes has been tested for repeated inhalation throughout the day. Even the tired example of asthma inhalers. Those who use them don't chain use them...

    From what I have seen of vape meets and vape shops, most vapers, aren't the healthiest of people...

    In the end, there will be regulations for age, advertising, labels and packaging...
     
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    skoony

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    There are exposure limits for stage hands and concert workers who work around fog machines, as well as guidelines for protective equipment for food flavoring manufacturers. Nothing anyone vapes has been tested for repeated inhalation throughout the day. Even the tired example of asthma inhalers. Those who use them don't chain use them...

    From what I have seen of vape meets and vape shops, most vapers, aren't the healthiest of people...

    In the end, there will be regulations for age, advertising, labels and packaging...
    if e-cigs put out enough vapor to exceed the safety limits imposed
    on stage hands or required the use of an air filtering mask do
    you not think this would have been pointed out already?
    its the exposure level that dictates the safety requirement.
    e-cigs are no where near it.
     

    stevegmu

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    if e-cigs put out enough vapor to exceed the safety limits imposed
    on stage hands or required the use of an air filtering mask do
    you not think this would have been pointed out already?
    its the exposure level that dictates the safety requirement.
    e-cigs are no where near it.


    Direct inhalation vs. casual inhalation. No studies yet...
     

    zoiDman

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    As is anyone who thinks they will achieve peace via appeasement of those who wish to rule them.

    Don't get me wrong; I do not believe the FDA will leave us to vape in peace no matter what we do, but I will not concede them an a square centimeter of territory (even on a label) willingly.

    I can Respect your point of view Rossum.

    So what is the Plan to Fight Everything that the FDA Proposes?

    Should I write my Reps and tell them to Fight Against 18+ age Limits, allow Any Marketing Images an OEM/Retailers wants, and to Fight for No CRP?

    I wonder how Many Senators would do this?
    I also wonder how many Money Givers to Senators would Back this type of Position if a Senator did in fact do this?
     
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