Why would hospitols ban ecigs?!?!?

[M4RKeM4RK]

Very interesting topic. Guess I will add my 2 cents as someone who works in a hospital and lives in an extremely hospital abundant region (SE Michigan). There are several organization in the area who WILL NOT hire "smokers," and consequetly "vapers." There is no distinction between the two as NICOTINE TESTING is done prior to employment. In my city alone, there are more hospitals than you could count on your fingers and toes, and most of them do not allow smoking ANYWHERE on the property. My hospital is the only one in the area that allows smoking, and employees and visitors from the 4 hospitals within a block or so of us all come to our outdoor smoking shelters on their breaks. My volt will be arriving tomorrow, and I fully intend on vaping in my office. If I close the door and vape some fruity flavors it will just smell like I opened an air freshener Oh How sneaky I am. We constantly have inpatients who want to leave the ward to go smoke, and personally, I think giving them 808s with cartos would be an ideal solution. It would keep patients safer, under better supervision, and away from aggravating their comorbidities. Anyways, thanks for the interesting read, OP and subsequent posters.

 

[fwellers]

People need to understand who/what the enemy of vaping is. These are not reasonable entities that truly care about smokers' health. After fighting for vaping for over 3 years, I can confidently tell you that we have been fighting Big Pharma, NOT Big Tobacco and groups such as the ALA, ACS, CFTFK, etc. are backed by Big PHARMA. Their sole goal is to denormalize smoking to peddle their smoking cessation drugs and eliminate ALL use of non-Big Pharma nicotine products. No matter how safe it is proven, vaping will NOT be accepted by them because it LOOKS LIKE SMOKING and delivers nicotine in a non-medicinal way. Even 0 mg e-cigarettes are unacceptable because it "normalizes smoking." The only way you will get the ANTZ to accept vaping is if it has no visible vapor, is unscented, looks like a tampon and is approved by the FDA as a SHORT TERM treatment for nicotine addiction. I think BP calls it a Nicotrol Inhaler.

We aren't facing objections based on a lack of education or bad PR from the moniker "e-cigarette." These are the objections:

1) It looks like smoking, even without nicotine in it, so smokers will light up when they see e-cigs being used.
2) It looks like smoking, even without nicotine in it, so it "normalizes" and/or "glamorizes" smoking and we want to denormalize smoking.
3) It is a cool gadget, so kids will try it, become addicted and then "graduate" to smoking real cigarettes.
4) It doesn't end nicotine addiction for most users, so it's just exchanging one addiction for another.
5) Nicotine still has health risks, so those that contain nicotine are still not 100% safe.
6) They are just another insidious way to addict people to nicotine.

So you can see that arguments that we should call it something else or that the ANTZ just need more proof that e-cigarettes are low risk compared to smoking are an exercise in futility. Their objections have nothing to do with reality. And that's just the moral objections they have - don't forget about all of the money lost in grants, funding, taxes and profits if people suddenly have something that doesn't require them to quit and won't cause them to need Big Pharma's "smoking related disease" treatments!

My Father used to always say that BP doesn't want a cure for cancer, because cancer is big business. I think someone alluded to that same thing in this thread.
If this is true, then it confuses me why BP would want to denormalize smoking. Smoking causes cancer and thus keeps filling the coffers. I would think that is a much better source of $$ for the greedy pharms then smoking cessation drugs.

Someone explain it to me.

 

[Condorman]

Not all hospitals ban vaping on their premises. As a matter of fact, I've read a few threads where they are even handed to patients who smoke for use inside the hospital.

My Dad is in a cottage hospital, no problems with me giving him a smoke on my gear, ditto when he was in the general hospital, though I was asked to be discreet in case people got the idea it was OK to light genuine tabs

 

[tomhh]

My Father used to always say that BP doesn't want a cure for cancer, because cancer is big business. I think someone alluded to that same thing in this thread.
If this is true, then it confuses me why BP would want to denormalize smoking. Smoking causes cancer and thus keeps filling the coffers. I would think that is a much better source of $$ for the greedy pharms then smoking cessation drugs.

Someone explain it to me.

i think they dont really want to make people quit smoking. they just want to make them TRY so they go and buy their useless NRT drugs, go back to smoking and then rinse and repeat. later they might need cancer drugs too if BP gets lucky...

 

[TCasualties]

As harmless as they may be, it looks bad... and people who are in hospitals most likely do not want to see huge plumes of "smoke" coming out of peoples mouths lol.

 

[J.R. Bob Dobbs]

short answer- its a frickin hospital man!

long answer-
its a hospital, their number one concern is for the safety, and security and well being of ALL PATIENTS. someone with emphysema walking through your cloud of vapor could have a extreme reaction, who knows. The other side of the coin is that vaping looks like smoking. They don't want uneducated people thinking they allow smoking in and around the hospitals.

 

[wacdenney]

I do understand the points about BP and money. I also understand that's it looks bad. Frankly I am always somewhat uncomfortable Vaping in public.

I think what ticked me off was the bs reason I was given. I was in the parking lot and this lady just happened to be walking by. I guess her attitude when I tried to explain rubbed me wrong also.

I just feel like the plight of vapers is similar to all of us trying to make sense out of congress. It seems like what's good for the people and makes good sense is irrelevant to the conversation.

 

[RosaJ]

I vape in public because I'm not committing any crime. I'm old enough to have lived through the days of personal freedom and as far as I know, it is still a free country. If I'm vaping in a parking lot and a little old lady/man gives me grief I just remind them of when they were young and smoked other illegal substances back in their day and go on about my business.

If we're all intimidated, then vaping is not going to get the recognition it deserves as the best tobacco harm reduction method there is to date.

PS: I have yet to be "reprimanded" by any one out in public. And no, I don't vape in any business that says not to when I ask them.

 

[mightymen]

It not about hosiptals or anyother place/building/group or anything that it sounds like. It's all about a group of people who are trying to stand on box and make speachs they will say anything as long as there being heard. Will only tell the part that will grab peoples attention so they can be heard. I guess this makes them feel powerful.

No proof that e cig are bad. So what being done, telling people it not regulated (so what this means nothing) or Propylene glycol it bad for you maybe but not saying 1000'2 products being sold to the public with Propylene glycol to rub all over ther bodies and food products have this in it and much more.

There are NO NEGATIVE reports on ecigs. Now larger companys and drug companys want to control this to make MORE money. So what there doing pushing for rules/regulations knowing this will push out small companys and there will move in.

 

[NICnurse]

The hospital system I work for banned vaping as of January 1st, 2012. There was a memo emailed to all employees stating the reasons for banning vaping as follows:

Vaping has not been proven to be safe through rigorous FDA testing. Vaping looks like smoke and to some visitors in the hospital they could mistakenly believe it is ok to light a real cigarette after seeing someone exhale vapor. Due to lack of FDA testing, there is no way to know what the byproduct of exhaled vapor is and it could cause a negative or adverse reaction in some people. And finally......the 5 separate campuses of our healthcare system promote a nicotine/tobacco free lifestyle. While BP NRT's are paid for by the company for users trying to quit, they only pay for the traditional 12 weeks of use in order to help employees quit. My hospital system also refuses to hire nicotine users now as well. I know of one other hospital in KC that has done the same thing. One of the biggest hospitals in town does still hire nicotine users but they pay a higher insurance premium from the date of hire.

Now.......I believe the majority of their reasons being anti vaping are hogwash and weak excuses. However, after seeing the limited mental capacity for understanding of some folks in this world, I can fathom how some "genius" could see someone vaping and then turn around and light up a cigarette in the middle of the hospital. Patients try to smoke in the stairwells all the time. Sad fact. It is kind of funny though when our rent a cop security guard catches them in the act. It is a "grab the popcorn and watch the show" kind of moment.

 

[markdm4805]

RJ Reynolds is not fighting us, they are joining us...
Reynolds Test Markets Vuse E-Cigarette

I think i would be leary of an e cigarette made by big tobacco. Remember the only other e cig made by a tobacco company is blu and we all know what great quality they are. Keep in mind e cigs are a unique nicotine industry in that it is almost all mom and pop made by vapers for vapers. I would wager that some small vape shops barely profit they are out there mainly to help out the fellow vaper. With BT it could go two routes. The FDA could impose testing standards that are so expensive only they could afford it or they could dominate the market and make products that are so crappy it drives everyone away. Im not saying either scenario is very likely. Im just saying they could be the enemy that sneaks up from behind. Finally who would you trust more with you E Liquid one of the many small retailers on ECF or RJ Reynolds.

 

[mightymen]

NICnurse hospital gave a memo saying "Vaping has not been proven to be safe through rigorous FDA testing"
Since when is it braken the law if, Vaping has not been proven to be safe through rigorous FDA testing. Now we are be told what we can't do even if the FDA has not found faults with it. They are using any means to stop any thing that looks, sounds, mightbe Cigs. I always thought in the USA something had to proven to have a law to regulate or ban something. Where are our rights? I could easy understand that the vapor from e cigs could confuse people who had no understanding about vapor. Hell they might even yell fire who knows. But that wasn't said in the memo. What was said, something was not proven to be safe by FDA that is being used by you and you can't do this here because we say so! FDA dose not make laws, FDA regulates. If nothing else can be seen they want to put e cigs same as anlog cigs.

 

[zapped]

NICnurse hospital gave a memo saying "Vaping has not been proven to be safe through rigorous FDA testing"
Since when is it braken the law if, Vaping has not been proven to be safe through rigorous FDA testing. Now we are be told what we can't do even if the FDA has not found faults with it. They are using any means to stop any thing that looks, sounds, mightbe Cigs. I always thought in the USA something had to proven to have a law to regulate or ban something. Where are our rights? I could easy understand that the vapor from e cigs could confuse people who had no understanding about vapor. Hell they might even yell fire who knows. But that wasn't said in the memo. What was said, something was not proven to be safe by FDA that is being used by you and you can't do this here because we say so! FDA dose not make laws, FDA regulates. If nothing else can be seen they want to put e cigs same as anlog cigs.

Thats cause FDA isnt trying to prove vaping safe, its trying to prove it unsafe and those are two VERY different things

 

[Tonytiger1]

Some hospitals use pg in the air system to kill germs.


Tony

 

[zapped]

If the Fda was trying to prove vaping safe they could have done so at any time in the past year. Theres certainly enough evidence and support from these and other forums to at least get vaping on the fast track.

The only thing besides incompetence that explains their delay is because they are looking for something that will give them justification to ban them.

They came out swinging 3 years ago when they were illegally seizing and destroying shipments from China to U.S vendors, I dont see them changing their tune any time soon.

 

[mightymen]

They don't want to ban them. It called regulate. When regulations are put in place the prices will go up and big company's are waiting in the wings to start selling as stop smoking devices, etc. It's all about the money. Gov't officals get trips, favors, money in other forms to past regulations which do not need laws to be past by Fed/State/Local Gov'ts. All they have do is justify any regulation (no laws being passed) easy and fast. if you look there are regulations out there to do it this way and another not to do it this way. When you get involved with regulations each gov't agency can have there own. And guess how many new agencys have been setup in the few years and what powers have been given to them.

 

[blondeambition3]

I vaped the whole week I was hospitalized with no issues at all.

I wouldn't worry about 'vaping' posing any potential health hazard in hospitals.

Hospitals, ideally, are 'supposed' to be clean, healthy, sterile environments.... unfortunately they're not. I've had 3 close relatives die and 1 person (me!) almost die from hospital induced 'superbugs'.

Do whatever you can (or must!) to stay out of Hospitals. Just my

 

[mikejm]

I hate hospitals and don't like doctors. There is a controlling factor that I don't like and a lack of openness.

 

[tj99959]

I doubt that a hospital is going to serve you a beer with your lunch either. It's their facility, and they set their rules.

 

[Clovery]

Even though my state has a law that e-cigs are banned everywhere real cigs are, the hospital I have worked in generally "looks the other way" when it comes to e-cig use. I remember there was a patient who had a partial lobectomy for lung cancer, and she was vaping away on a cig-a-like when the nurse went in her room to give her pain meds. She fell asleep shortly after and the nurse came back and took the ecig out of her hand and put it in a denture box for her on the nightstand.

You do have to consider that nicotine is a drug and causes vasoconstriction, so maybe a general rule of thumb like "if the doctor orders a nicotine patch, then ecigs are okay". Most smokers get a standing order for a nic patch, but there are some patients who might not. For example if someone is in the hospital for very high blood pressure, or heart arrhythmias, you don't want them to have unrestricted access to something which is going to counter the effects of medications you're giving them to lower their heart rate and blood pressure.