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cigarbabe

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I dont think Jerry is allowed to post over here to defend his product. He can post about WTA but not specifically about what his company is doing or his product ;) BTW Yeah they are having theirs tested.

My bad Ruppy I had forgotten about that law.

I am removing this statement at the request of the vendor until all testing is completed.
So what will the naysayers do now?

Trese you can purchase WTA from two sources one I can vouch for personally.
Vapelicious | Whole Tobacco Alkaloid Liquid for Electronic Cigarettes
http://www.aromaejuice.com/
I've tried to buy from a third but they didn't have any product at that particular time so now I'm waiting on a friend to provide a sample of Aroma's juice .....
I think you will love it just give it a try!

Just saw Aaron's post.
What are you trying to imply by saying "be careful" Aaron?
That there is something inherently wrong with WTA ?
Geezus dude it's comments that aren't clarified like yours that are causing so much frickin' confusion!
C.B.
 
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AaronY

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Just saw Aaron's post.
What are you trying to imply by saying "be careful" Aaron?
That there is something inherently wrong with WTA ?
Geezus dude it's comments that aren't clarified like yours that are causing so much frickin' confusion!
C.B.

Sorry for being not more clear. I ment be careful of the fear mongering, misinformation, and a supplier. Sorry for not being more clear. Did not mean to be part of the problem. Long day and really out of it. Hope this comment clears it up a bit. Sorry.
 

cigarbabe

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Thank you Aaron!
I just wanted you to be clear about what you meant
and I know you didn't make the comment in a malicious manner. ;)
Sorry if I was hard on you but it is such an important product and I don't want any more misinformation to be put out. I just want everything about this product to go well!
C.B.
 
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Enid

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Response to the question about Ahlusion using WTA.
Do you use Whole Tobacco Alkaloids in your e-liquids?

At the current time we do not use whole tobacco alkaloids (WTA) in our e-liquids available for resale. We have been testing the application in e-liquids for personal consumption as of November 2010, but will not release this to the public until we have sufficient data to support WTA as a safe and viable addition.

Once WTA is made available, it will be listed as an option with our e-liquids in our E-Liquids section.

((disclosure: I haven't tried WTA, probably won't, haven't dealt with any of the companies mentioned))
 

AaronY

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Actually as Aaron pointed out unless you are diying it some of you favorite juices may have WTA already and you don't know it.
Actually HF think tobacco extracts all have WTA and fruit flavors do not. That is what I was saying. I don't think any vendors are adding WTA with out saying to juices yet.
 

AlmightyGod

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I found this post in another thread & it is excellent:

WTA / tobacco alkaloids :

95% nicotine
2-3% nornicotine
2-3% anatabine
0.3% anabasine

plus a few more at < 0.1%

E-liquid and WTA are 95% the same. Both are tobacco products. The only difference is that nic-only e-liquid removes the other alkaloids for no good reason; just the assumption that nicotine being the most significant by percentage must be the key. It is not the whole story - that's why nic. patches barely work. E-cigs do better because mimic the psycho-behavioural aspects of smking. But for many, they will puff incessantly on the nic only liquids and never be satiated; eventually drawn back to analogs.

Nicotine is the most 'dangerous' thing in it. With WTA, less is more; and that really does reduce any risks with nicotine or PG/VG or flavors.

I have studied this for some years. I have no involvement in any commercial ventures with WTA.

The scare mongering about WTA is exactly the same type of scare mongering about nic-only e-liquid. That anti-science nonsense could imperil the health of millions for who nicotine alone does not work (about half of smokers).
 

AaronY

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This is very interesting and probably helpful for those that can't seem to get off cigs. How are WTA's and tobacco extract juices from suppliers like Want 2 Vape and others different from each other? Or are they the same thing.
I am not sure how much W2V tobacco extracts have. The creator of 3 of W2V excellent tobacco extracts said in a comment "Any natural tobacco extract worth a damn **should be** chock full of WTA " Figure Vapenstein knows way more then me on this. I had every W2V flavor. Think W2V and Vaprite are the best tobacco juices out there. I noticed a calming WTA effect when vaping them. I think WTA needs to be added into non tobbaco flavored juices because the WTA is taken out in the extracting process to get nic but is not put back in by the extract. Luckily Vapelicious and soon others are creating the option for WTA now in non tobacco extracts. Did that answer your question?
 

cigarbabe

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Response to the question about Ahlusion using WTA.
Do you use Whole Tobacco Alkaloids in your e-liquids?

At the current time we do not use whole tobacco alkaloids (WTA) in our e-liquids available for resale. We have been testing the application in e-liquids for personal consumption as of November 2010, but will not release this to the public until we have sufficient data to support WTA as a safe and viable addition.

Once WTA is made available, it will be listed as an option with our e-liquids in our E-Liquids section.

((disclosure: I haven't tried WTA, probably won't, haven't dealt with any of the companies mentioned))

I'm sorry for mentioning that Ahlusion was offering WTA for "public consumption".
I was premature in my opinion and removed it after speaking with Wlad.
Enid is correct so let me thank her directly
Thank you Enid for the clarification!
Mea culpa!
C.B.
 

AaronY

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W2V macerations/extractions may contain many other impurities besides the WTA being isolated by Aroma & others.

If you are going to error on the side of caution, tobacco macerations/extracts are probably less safe than WTA.

Have a link to more info one that. Seems to go with what I think but would like more info.
 
Seems I need to repeat that WTA is NOT adding anything. It is about retianing all the alkaloids in tobacco not just the nicotine (though that is by far the greatest by percentage).

For some people it is the combination of the alkaloids that was the draw to smoking - and is required in an alternative to stop smoking - to avoid all the cancer causing stuff in smoke. In a previous post I listed the main alkaloids (>0.1%) so if anyone wants to persist in saying that any of those might be carcinogens - which one(s)? Let's hear it, or stop blowing smoke.

Just as with extracting just nicotine, the purification process cannot quite be 100% pure - but with both nicotine and WTA is damned close. WTA is the extract just before it is narrowed down to just nicotine (without any good reason). It contains no TSNAs, no radioactive polonium, no carbon monoxide, no heavy metals, and no additives (in all cases just the imperceptibly tiny amounts that could also remain in nicotine e-liquid), and certainly no combustion products. 'Normal' e-liquid and WTA are 99.9% identical. If you don't understand what WTA is, don't try it; and don't deny a life-saver from others (potentially millions of others, for whom nicotine alone will not work). And don't say 'it works for me' - we're all different.

In truth, many people fall on the borderline - they can get by with just nicotine but only by vaping incessantly; and if that doesn't subside over time, they also could conside WTA as a better alternative.

Again, smoking does not equal nicotine (although that's a big part, how big, and how much the other alkaloids play a part in a given individual, varies). It's an oversimplification. That's why patches barely work, and vaping (nic only) also does not work for many people; maybe half? So given that vaping has the nicotine, has the vapor, has the behavioural aspects that closely mimick the original, why not?

WTA, just like 'normal' e-liquid is aimed at smokers, who already consume all the WTAs; vaping tobacco alkaloid extracts is a way to avoid all the nasty stuff in smoke.

I have zero commercial connections with regard to WTA.

Over the last few years I have 'researched', thought about, discussed and posted on how to make vaping as safe as we can. So I looked at acrolein from VG (fairly minor concern), dry residues (a concern), possible dangers of flavorings (a concern - much is still unknown) and other additives such as sweetners and citric acid (concerns), the 'burning' of fillers in the hardware (a concern, but minimised by dripping or cartomisers, moreso with tanks), etc. WTA is in my mind part of that endeavor. It can help more people switch to a safer alternative to smoke, and also help in reducing the need to vape excessively.

To complicate the issue slightly ... why not all e-liquid be WTA? My only reason to take the line of 'only if nicotine-only liquid doesn't work for you and you're sure of that' is that nicotine alone is less addictive, so if one can get along with just nic, there's a relatively easy path from there to reduce or stop nicotine altogether (even vaping) - if you wish.

But the big issue is having available e-liquids that can work for more people. That's the big step - not getting off alkaloids, but getting off pretty much all the nasty stuff in smoke.
 
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CharlieGirl

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It sounds to me as if WTA may be a workable option for me, since no matter how much or how long I vape, I still feel I am missing something and am still drawn to cigarettes. Even vaping frequently at 36mg doesn't "satisfy". It is by far enough nicotine because it will start to make me sick, but there is still that edge. Granted, I am down from 2+ packs to about a half pack, but it is definitely an effort and it really annoys me that I can't be like "everyone else" (not literally) and be satisfied with just vaping. Now I have the paraphernalia of TWO addictions to arrange to carry around with me, it just isn't cool. It's certainly not from lack of wanting! I really enjoy so many aspects of vaping but it still feels like a teaser rather than an alternative. So which would be worse for me... to continue reaching for the analogs, or to give WTA a try? Seriously, this stuff is already in cigarettes too, it is a native component of tobacco (PLUS the gazillion other noxious chemicals in cigs,) so why would I hesitate to use it (WTA) in a vape that HAS to be less polluting than ALL the crap in the cigarettes??? If I was completely satisfied with vaping alone, I would probably not have any interest in WTA whatsoever, so if vaping is all good for you, do NOT concern yourself with it. Simple! Its a no brainer, really. But please do NOT try to infer it is a dangerous additive, it is not, it is already part of the tobacco. Granted, we don't know how dangerous it is, but I've already been smoking it for 40 years, so maybe I still need it for a while longer. You don't, great for you, you're lucky. Maybe it won't even turn out to be the answer for me, I really don't know, but don't you think it should be my option to try?
 

cigarbabe

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Reaching for the analogues is far worse and more damaging for you CharlieGirl as I'm sure you know.
It was that missing "something" which made me try the WTA
and it is just superior imo to regular nicquids.
I'm a two fisted vaper unless I'm using WTA so I love getting a break from constant vaping.
I hope kinbaloo's post has made it clear since none of our posts apparently did that WTA is not an additive of any kind.
Frankly I don't care about having it tested for my consumption but if it's being done well Huzzah!
I would still purchase it tested or not because it does indeed help me to lower my vaping quotient.
For the record I don't believe vaping is harmful to your system at least for most of us
of course that would depend on your individual health issues and I have many of those!
Even with my myriad problems that I have, I feel better, vape less and function better when I'm using WTA's.
WTA ROCKZ!
C.B.
 
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