Apollo Reliant 60W - TC with TCR adjustment, including Stainless Steel support

[TheBloke]

Yeah it's lovely to work with, glad you're liking it

I started temp testing it. The results were.. inconclusive. For a dry coil vape I found the most accurate setting was 10 or 11. 12/13 was way over temp. But for the actual vape I want it higher, as you say.

So I need to do wet coil tests and will do so soon.

 

[TheBloke]

Although that said I am at this precise moment vaping on a 24G SS 304 coil with TCR 11, set to 240°C - 10°C higher than I usually have it. That's vaping fine. 230°C isn't bad, but does drop off a little towards the end.

I need to do more testing to narrow it down.

 

[AlaskaVaper]

I ordered some SS from 3F last night. They do not specify the grade so I just am hoping it is ok. In the meantime I will continue to enjoy an RDA with my estimated as 16 Ga crab-pot SS wire. I can barely coil that stuff on my coil-master tool as it is so heavy ga. I sure hope my Apollo arrives today or tomorrow- it was ordered the day before labor day so I don't know why it is taking so long to arrive.

As usual, I am following theBlokes font of wonderful information as he explores all matters TC related. I have learned so much that I had no clue about 6 months ago. Keep on keeping on Bloke.

 

[TheBloke]

Thank you Sir, it is a pleasure I assure you!

Yeah 16G sounds like quite a challenge It's a bit late now you already ordered, but FastTech recently added wire specifically stated to be 304. Here's a list of four spools they carry: Found 4 stainless steel 304 at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

So maybe for your next order - or you might get lucky and what you ordered might already be 304.

When you get the wire, we can check the resistance and this will tell us which grade it is.

Or if you have a link to the wire you ordered, I might be able to tell now if it lists resistance figures?

316 and 317 are OK too - just as nice to coil with. It's just their TCR is a fair bit lower, below 0.001. This likely means they can't be properly vaped on an EVic VT (200°F would be too hot for them, taking them to over 600°F), but the SXKs and Apollo Reliant should still be OK.

 

[TheBloke]

When you get the wire, we can check the resistance and this will tell us which grade it is.

Or if you have a link to the wire you ordered, I might be able to tell now if it lists resistance figures?

Is it like this (or same spool in different gauge)? Silver Stainless Steel 26 AWG Resistance Heating Wire for RBA

They have several gauges of that same wire. I'll check the 26G, which lists as 5.42Ω/m.

We can fairly easily check what wire that is, with reasonably good confidence:

1. Go to Steam Engine Wire Wizard.
2. In the size box, enter 26G
3. Check the resistance per meter for different SS
   1. SS 304:
      1. 
   2. SS 316:
      1. 
   3. SS 316L is 5.82Ω/m, and SS 317L is 6.29Ω/m

Yours is listed as 5.42Ω/m - far closer to SS 304 than any of the others.

It's not identical, which almost certainly means that their wire is not exactly 26G / 0.405mm. Or that they just measured it slightly inaccurately!

Anyway, good news: I would say it's 95% chance your new wire is SS 304. When you get it we can measure some resistance values to be absolutely sure.

 

[TheBloke]

I just checked the other gauges as well and they all match SS 304 quite closely (though none 100% exactly)

Note that they list the wire as 30, 28, 26, 24 gauge, but according to the description it's actually: 0.25mm, 0.30mm, 0.40mm, 0.50mm. This is quite common and for most gauges it's quite close in size, the exception here being 28G where real 28 is 0.321mm, but they give 0.30mm which is 10% thinner.

None of this affects the resistance comparison, it still seems almost certain it's SS 304.

Just be aware that if you use Steam Engine to do calculations on resistance, then to be most accurate don't enter the AWG number (eg 28) instead enter the actual thickness (eg 0.3mm)

 

[AlaskaVaper]

I received my Apollo today and I was a bit taken aback at its extremely small size. For some odd reason from the photos I had seen I just assumed the mod would be somewhat larger. Be that as it may it does seem yo be performing well. I like the bright screen that is refreshing after the Koopor mini. The menu system is very basic. It might initially be a bit troubling for anyone that does not have some understanding of the 10-100 TCR function as the device does not incorporate the more traditional TC displays showing the Ni and Ti modes etc. Fortunately for me I have for several months been seeking the elusive so called "nickel purity" function in a mod. I got my first mod with that NP capability when I got the Zero SXK mod awhile back. Now with the Apollo NP is again in hand and seems to be working very well. I have been vaping with my Crown tank and SS coil as the very first use of the Apollo and so far I am very pleased with the result. When the mod arrived the NP was set at 70 and not yet having read the manual for the correct button presses I proceeded mohave a few draws on the Crown with the temp at 420. Wow, hot and crackling vapor. I dropped in stages ending down at the lowest possible temp setting and it was a pretty good vape. Then I opened the manual to find how to locate the NP scale. Dropped it from 70 to 12 where I messed avout and now 15 is where I am residing currently. Seems to be working well here for the SS coil. Temp is set to 420F. Dropping down to 380 the mod drops into temp protect during an extended draw but at 420 it seem to be very steady. One thing that I notice is that when TP kicks on, the vapor is brutally curtailed and, it is quite noticeable as it pulses on and off. I have never noticed this to such a degree on my other TC mods. Not really objectionable, just different from what I was used to perceiving on other mods. that seem to produce a smoother TC modulation as TP moves in and out. All said, I believe I will like this little device, though I do wish dual 18650's were de-minimus for these new mods.

 

[cigatron]

One thing that I notice is that when TP kicks on, the vapor is brutally curtailed and, it is quite noticeable as it pulses on and off. I have never noticed this to such a degree on my other TC mods. Not really objectionable, just different from what I was used to perceiving on other mods. that seem to produce a smoother TC modulation as TP moves in and out.

Nooo, say it isn't so! Perhaps the momentary heat reduction (pulse) is caused by not high enough joules setting; too slow to heat back up to temp after hitting tp? I hope it's something that can be rectified with settings as I would prefer to run the Reliant as a tc mod, not just a tp mod. I have my heart set on buying a Reliant when funds allow.

@USMCotaku ? @TheBloke ? You two seeing this issue?

 

[USMCotaku]

Nope, mine vapes quite smooth. What's being described sound more like the sxk mods....first guess, tcr off or wattage too high.

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping

 

[cigatron]

Nope, mine vapes quite smooth. What's being described sound more like the sxk mods....first guess, tcr off or wattage too high.

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping

Could you elaborate on this a little? I have read that the sxm mods have had temp over run issues but don't remember if they pulsed after hitting tp. I also understand, I think?, how tcr settings affect temp accuracy (displayed) but can't remember if it also affects temp precision (control).

 

[f1vefour]

TCR definitely affects accuracy, it's how the device knows what the temperature actually is.

 

[cigatron]

TCR definitely affects accuracy, it's how the device knows what the temperature actually is.

I probably shouldn't have used precision and accuracy in the same sentence. I know tcr values are important to allow an accurate "display" of coil temp. I just don't get yet how , or even if, tcr settings affect the mod's ability to "control" coil temp eg. pulsey vs. not pulsey.

If I haven't made myself clear, I understand, I'm not that good at communicating my thoughts.

 

[USMCotaku]

Well, on the sxk for example, a tcr too far off causes the mod to hit what it thinks is the right temp to quickly, then you get the choppy temp regulation, for in that instance the wattage is far too high for the settings. So the tcr setting is making the mod work overtime to regulate.

What wire are you using?
What tcr setting are you at?
What wattage?

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping

 

[f1vefour]

@USMCotaku

I received my Apollo today and I was a bit taken aback at its extremely small size. For some odd reason from the photos I had seen I just assumed the mod would be somewhat larger. Be that as it may it does seem yo be performing well. I like the bright screen that is refreshing after the Koopor mini. The menu system is very basic. It might initially be a bit troubling for anyone that does not have some understanding of the 10-100 TCR function as the device does not incorporate the more traditional TC displays showing the Ni and Ti modes etc. Fortunately for me I have for several months been seeking the elusive so called "nickel purity" function in a mod. I got my first mod with that NP capability when I got the Zero SXK mod awhile back. Now with the Apollo NP is again in hand and seems to be working very well. I have been vaping with my Crown tank and SS coil as the very first use of the Apollo and so far I am very pleased with the result. When the mod arrived the NP was set at 70 and not yet having read the manual for the correct button presses I proceeded mohave a few draws on the Crown with the temp at 420. Wow, hot and crackling vapor. I dropped in stages ending down at the lowest possible temp setting and it was a pretty good vape. Then I opened the manual to find how to locate the NP scale. Dropped it from 70 to 12 where I messed avout and now 15 is where I am residing currently. Seems to be working well here for the SS coil. Temp is set to 420F. Dropping down to 380 the mod drops into temp protect during an extended draw but at 420 it seem to be very steady. One thing that I notice is that when TP kicks on, the vapor is brutally curtailed and, it is quite noticeable as it pulses on and off. I have never noticed this to such a degree on my other TC mods. Not really objectionable, just different from what I was used to perceiving on other mods. that seem to produce a smoother TC modulation as TP moves in and out. All said, I believe I will like this little device, though I do wish dual 18650's were de-minimus for these new mods.

 

[USMCotaku]

Ahhh. I.believe 15 is a bit high for SS, this could be why you are experiencing this. Try 11 and raise your temp a tad

Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping

 

[AlaskaVaper]

A brief up date on what I have been experiencing with my Apollo. First I do not like the +/- buttons as they are flush with the surface of the body and I have to use fingernails to ensure contact. The buttons are closely enough spaced so it is difficult to press with two fingers and being flush are nearly impossible to activate, with any certainty, with a flat single thumb or finger pressure. Also, I am afraid that I have the "dreaded" fluctuating resistance issue that several others have mentioned. Frequently when hitting the firing button no vape transpires. I have observed that while I continue pressing the firing button that the resistance on the screen is fluctuating wildly running uo as high as 2.7-2.8 ohms then dropping lower then uo and down very erratically. When the device does fire the res stays very stable. Something is very much amiss here. At first I thought it might be an incorrect TCR setting and since I am using the Crown with SS I have tried settings between 10 and 30 but the fluctuating resistance happens intermittently no matter what the TCR is set at. I have tried different Watt level settings in temp mode and that does not seem to make any difference with the intermittency issue, The device does seem regulate properly in Watt and Mech mode it seems. However, for me so far the TC function is janky, either in the chip, or as has been suggested in the mod body itself. I hate to post this but this has been my experience after a brief period of just 2 days as I write this comment. So far, I have gone through one battery and am at about 50% on a second.

Another thing that might provide a clue to what is happening is after posting this I have returned now in edit mode to mention when I went to fire the mod i had the new coil up/ old coil down screen appear. I selected old and the mod fired ok. I have had this screen message appear more frequently on this mod than on any device I have ever used. I believe this is perhaps a part of the res fluctuation issue. And by the way the Crown tank has been solid on other devices but without a TC function for SS. I frankly do not attribute this issue to the Tank.

 

[f1vefour]

I always get the new coil message after the device has been sitting for a while, it's a bit overly sensitive about ohm fluctuations. My kayfun fluctuates by about 0.03+- and it causes the new coil dialog. This isn't a fault, it just doesn't have the ability to lock the resistance.

I know the atomizer fluctuates a bit because it does the same thing on my Cool Fire IV.

I'm still waiting for my stainless steel to come in so I can't speak on the TC yet.

 

[cigatron]

I always get the new coil message after the device has been sitting for a while, it's a bit overly sensitive about ohm fluctuations. My kayfun fluctuates by about 0.03+- and it causes the new coil dialog. This isn't a fault, it just doesn't have the ability to lock the resistance.

The reliant doesn't have a res lock feature?

 

[f1vefour]

The reliant doesn't have a res lock feature?

Not that I have seen, but I'm in Kanthal mode.

 

[cigatron]

Still? Whatcha waitin' fer @f1vefour ?