California (re) joins Witch Hunt

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RiskyBusiness

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Dec 15, 2009
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This bill would deem any article that can provide inhaled doses of nicotine by delivering a vaporized solution a drug under these provisions.
SB 882 Senate Bill - INTRODUCED

This bill would authorize action to halt the sale, distribution, or offering for sale of electronic cigarettes that have not been approved or cleared by the federal Food and Drug Administration. [...]
This bill would deem any article that can provide inhaled doses of nicotine by delivering a vaporized solution a drug under these provisions. [...]

The sickness is spreading quickly....
 

Belletrist

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Dec 21, 2009
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Here's the relevant wording:

This bill would authorize action to halt the sale, distribution,
or offering for sale of electronic cigarettes that have not been
approved or cleared by the federal Food and Drug Administration. By
changing the definition of an existing crime, this bill would impose
a state-mandated local program.

i don't reckon the governator will sign this one either?
 

Defiantgroundhog

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Jan 3, 2010
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Alright... I haven't read through the many many threads on this topic so please excuse me. I've been thinking a lot about this and from the information I've gathered there doesn't seem to be a huge difference between the affects of nicotine and caffeine on the body. You can buy MASSIVE amounts of caffeine in pill form... liquid form. I supposed not vapor but still. I'm not sure where I'm going with this because I guess the FDA does have some kind of regulations on the distribution of caffeine. They just seem very loose whatever they are.
I guess my point is that the focus seems to be that nicotine is a drug but caffeine is also a drug and no one seems to bat an eye at that.
 

Haytoni

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Jan 20, 2010
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I'm not a lawyer but what I understood from it is.
They are regulating that only approved FDA ingredients are used in electronic cigs.
They are applying advertising and sales to minor laws of tobacco to electronic cigarettes.
And it seems they may be trying to get a California state tax for them.
Now you got it, all in how much money they can get.
 

RiskyBusiness

Senior Member
Dec 15, 2009
73
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Florida
I'm no lawyer either, but what I see here is:

An act to amend Sections 22950.5

followed by a revisiting of:

Existing law, the Stop Tobacco Access to Kids Enforcement Act
(STAKE Act)

and finally, a new proposal to

authorize action to halt the sale, distribution,
or offering for sale of electronic cigarettes that have not been
approved or cleared by the federal Food and Drug Administration

and

This bill would deem any article that can provide inhaled doses of
nicotine by delivering a vaporized solution a drug under these
provisions.

Sounds like a new "drug" classification for the entire product (article), and an outright ban. However, again, I am no lawyer.
 

jamvector

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Feb 3, 2010
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Alright... I haven't read through the many many threads on this topic so please excuse me. I've been thinking a lot about this and from the information I've gathered there doesn't seem to be a huge difference between the affects of nicotine and caffeine on the body. You can buy MASSIVE amounts of caffeine in pill form... liquid form. I supposed not vapor but still. I'm not sure where I'm going with this because I guess the FDA does have some kind of regulations on the distribution of caffeine. They just seem very loose whatever they are.
I guess my point is that the focus seems to be that nicotine is a drug but caffeine is also a drug and no one seems to bat an eye at that.

Sorry about the length of what I am posting herein, but Dietary Supplement regulation is a very similar issue to ours. We could learn something from how the grassroots movements in the mid-90's were able to get their products protected from Big Brother. There is far more at wiki (Dietary supplement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) on this, but a strikingly relevant excerpt is as follows (Especially note Clinton's quote in the middle). Maybe we should try to communicate their successes as precedent in our letters to congress, govs, etc?

United States Regulation
Pursuant to the DSHEA, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) regulates dietary supplements as foods, and not as drugs. While pharmaceutical companies are required to obtain FDA approval proving the safety or effectiveness of their products prior to their entry into the market, dietary supplements, like food, do not need to be pre-approved by FDA before they can enter the market.[13]
The DSHEA gave the FDA the express responsibility to regulate the manufacturing processes of dietary supplements, and the FDA issued its first proposed rule in 2003.[14] In June 2007 it issued its final rule,[15] which requires all dietary supplement manufacturers to ensure by June 2010 that production of dietary supplements complies with current good manufacturing practices, and be manufactured with "controls that result in a consistent product free of contamination, with accurate labeling."[16] In addition, the industry is now required to report to the FDA "all serious dietary supplement related adverse events." The new rules have been criticized, however, with skeptics arguing lack of FDA resources, loopholes, and an exception on quality assurance for raw material suppliers (with the burden placed on manufacturers) will lead to continued quality problems.[17] There's also concern that supplement manufacturers and retailers will hide behind the new regulations.[17] Prior to the rule supplements have had major quality problems, and the number of FDA investigators has declined.[18]
The DSHEA, passed in 1994, was the subject of lobbying efforts by the manufacturers of dietary supplements.[19][20] At the time of its passage DSHEA received strong support from consumer grassroots organizations and members of Congress. In recognition of this, President Bill Clinton, on signing DSHEA into law, stated that "After several years of intense efforts, manufacturers, experts in nutrition, and legislators, acting in a conscientious alliance with consumers at the grassroots level, have moved successfully to bring common sense to the treatment of dietary supplements under regulation and law." He also noted that the passage of DSHEA "speaks to the diligence with which an unofficial army of nutritionally conscious people worked democratically to change the laws in an area deeply important to them" and that "In an era of greater consciousness among people about the impact of what they eat on how they live, indeed, how long they live, it is appropriate that we have finally reformed the way government treats consumers and these supplements in a way that encourages good health."[21]
Popular support may have been based on a misunderstanding of the situation after the deregulation of the supplement industry. A large survey by the AARP, for example, found that 77% of respondents (including both users and non-users of supplements) believed that the federal government should review the safety of dietary supplements and approve them before they can be marketed to consumers.[22] In an October 2002 nationwide Harris poll, 59% of respondents believed that supplements had to be approved by a government agency before they could be marketed; 68% believed that supplements had to list potential side effects on their labels; and 55% believed that supplement labels could not make claims of safety without scientific evidence. All of these beliefs were incorrect as a result of provisions of the DSHEA.[23]
 

JenJen

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Aug 27, 2009
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I am not going to panic, but I am stocking up! I refuse to go back to smoking and that is what would happen if I couldn't have my vapor king to keep me happy! Along with my 6 batteries that I rotate, I have 6 xl batts that have never been used, 3 pass throughs never been used, probably a years supply of cartos unused, two coffee cans full of gently used cartos with condoms and .... plugs attached just waiting to be refilled! I am also stocking up on my favorite flavors in 36mg strength so that I can just cut in half with VG and stretch it out if need be.

Yeah, I am paranoid lol! But you won't catch me running low on anything! Not going back to the dark side EVER! and no more of my money will be lining the pockets of the Tobacco Companies.

I never felt better! Thanks VRL! :)
 

Brandnew vper

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Feb 1, 2010
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Im stocking up. Not quite like Jen Jen but enough to last 2 or 3 months plus Im not a heavy vaporer. But Im also stocking up on knowledge. Like the education of making my own batteries and atomizers and juice. Like a vaping mcgyver. This way they cant take anything from me. And if anything crazy happens like I cant buy anything I will produce my own. that way I wont smoke analogs again. And save money!
 

ALC

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ECF Veteran
Jan 17, 2010
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Ohio
Im stocking up. Not quite like Jen Jen but enough to last 2 or 3 months plus Im not a heavy vaporer. But Im also stocking up on knowledge. Like the education of making my own batteries and atomizers and juice. Like a vaping mcgyver. This way they cant take anything from me. And if anything crazy happens like I cant buy anything I will produce my own. that way I wont smoke analogs again. And save money!

Totally agree and I am doing the same. Knowledge is power and they can never take that away. If I have to train myself to be a chemist, metal expert, blah blah blah, then I will.

I am thinking that the goal is to tax it to death and insure that the liquids are made in the US so they can control it.

I also believe that when it comes to California they are the frontier of extreme go green mania. I think that because they see the vapor and think of smoke, this is the driving force. Unfortunately, you cannot educate or explain anything to people that are closed minded and want to believe what they want.
 

yanks21

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Feb 17, 2010
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It's funny you mention supplements jam because I was thinking the same thing but I recall hearing recently that John McCain and Byron Dorgan released a bill to put supplements under FDA control.

I didn't read into it much but just Googled it now and came up with this:

McCain?s Dietary Supplement Bill: An Attempt to Implement Codex Alimentarius - BlackListed News

This whole e-cigarette thing reminds me (to a slightly lesser extent) to the whole thing with Stevia. For people not familiar with Stevia it is an herb that acts as a sweetener it has been used in South America for ages and is used in places like Japan to sweeten soft drinks, etc.

Stevia is MUCH MUCH MUCH healthier than all of the sweeteners out there such as Equal, Splenda, etc. but it couldn't be marketed here in the US as a sweetener only as a dietary supplement (I believe this has may have changed recently)

Of course the fight against Stevia wasn't as blatant as this because there aren't billions of tax dollars tied to it.


I tend to agree with Belletrist that the Governator will just veto this bill as well - I hope it isn't just wishful thinking.
 
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