Carts filler materials and tests.

[jfdpl686]

Not getting much into hydraulics and physics, but understanding the principles, we can lean a lot about the carts in our e-cigs.
The liquid “holding together” (at a molecular level) is cohesion. When you have any filler and you try to fill your cart, you’ll see the liquid “pooling” in an almost drop shape. At the same time, it is showing “adhesion” (when liquid is attracted t other materials) in this case the filler and the edges of the cart.
In a new cart, if you fill it with water and turn it upside down quickly, you’ll notice the water remains there. This simply proves that we need to have our carts in the best shape and no burned edges; otherwise it will be more prone to leak.

Now, the atomizer needs to be “wet” all the time. We cannot flood it or let it dry. So the cart and filler is the “dosing device” and should work correctly in order to give us the best experience.
Most people around here get the best experience of flavor/vapor/TH when dripping. But it is not always possible or desirable. When driving or simply in a place where we cannot drip; we are to the mercy of the carts.
Many threads talk about fillers, I’ve read most of them and each person have their preference but it is not normally cross-referenced to any device or, most important; liquid.
I’ve tried many fillers and mods; and to be honest, ALL of them work very good… sometimes. Why? Because it depends on our necessities and liquid used at each time.
Some fillers or mods allow more liquid but they are prone to leaks, others require more “topings” and others simply will waste a little more liquid.
First, it is better to make some tests to settle for one or different fillers depending the liquid you use.
You can cut and shape them and get different results but one thing is constant. All fillers shall be clean and the cart mounted correctly to get the best of them. For alignment check Kristin’s post here http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/tips-tricks/81768-updated-everything-you-ever-wanted-know-about-your-510-a.html
So, here are my findings so you can decide which filler is best for a given liquid and given use.
Factory filler.
Good for “thin” liquids. It requires a lot of topping and it retains a lot of liquid in its fibers; so you will waste some once you need to clean it; it is very absorbent, almost like cotton. Generally good “on the go” with little to no leakage; good if you draw long and/or hard, not allowing much liquid to the mouth chamber or your mouth. After a couple uses with medium dense liquids, topping is hard and require some help with a paper clip or tweezers.
It is very difficult to dry after cleaning it (compared to other fillers) and cannot be reused several times unless you’re very careful to reshape it.

Aquaclear (Foam filter insert).
It is fibrous with large cavities. Great for dense (think) liquids; not so good for thin ones. Filling and topping is very easy without any tools but it could leak if the liquid is thin or you move your PV much. It is a very cheap alternative and very easy to clean just wash it with water, a quick dry with a paper towel and can be reused several times. When using VG this is very good. With thin liquids it could fill the rear chamber or get some liquid in your mouth when long or hard draws.

Fluval U3 Foam Pads.
It’s fibrous with slightly larger cavities than Aquaclear. Great for thicker liquids. Almost same as Aquaclear but it is a tad more expensive and I feel that with hard draws this one allows a little more liquid in the rear chamber or mouth.

Fluval 304/305 404/405 Polishing Pad.
This one is close to the factory filler but the fiber is a little different. Just about more “open” so it is “friendlier” for dense liquids but not yet “good”. Not as absorbent either and just a little bit better to handle after cleaning it. I would rate it better than the factory filler being somewhat cheap and handling better in long/hard draws not allowing passing much liquid.

Blue foam (from strictly juice)
Fibrous with small cavities. As an overall a great choice for any kind of juice. Not really friendly for thick liquids and tends to clog with them requiring cleaning several times. Since it is pre-cut is easy to use with a good value. With thin liquids is great but could leak if you keep your PV pointing down. It requires constant topping with dense liquids and you need tweezers or a paper clip to move it and/or squeeze it to fill the cart.

Bonded Filter Sleeve by Marinelad.
I got this one to try something new and I really like it. It would be consider the most expensive among fillers but does a great job. It is like the factory filler but more “fibrous”, having more spacing. This one could be considered in between the blue foam and the fluval polishing pads. It’s an overall great filler for thin and middle-of-the-road liquids and easy to clean. It does not allow as much liquid into the back chamber or your mouth in long/hard draws.

Finally, I did a little containment/release exercise to check how each one of the fillers handled with the most basic liquid: water.
This exercise is simple; using 10 drops of water on a clean empty cart then placing the fillet at the top and finally with tweezers moving it down to soak it in the water. Turned the cart upside-down and wait 5 seconds. Using the cart as a seal in a paper towel to see how many times it could “imprint” (draw water) every 3 seconds and how much until it ran dry. Take out the filler and check how much water was retained.

Factory Filler.
It “printed” water mediocre 12 times, 8 times bad, got back in life for 3 times and finally 12 more times with almost no water. The filler remained very humid and had a lot of water when removed.

Aquaclear (Foam filter insert).
As expected, it released a lot of water 8 times, then 4 more with little water. The filler was almost dry when removed.

Fluval U3 Foam Pads.
It released a lot water (more than the Aquaclear) 8 times, then nothing.
When removing it, it was very wet.

Fluval 304/305 404/405 Polishing Pad.
This one, released water very good 15 times, then 7 mediocre, then get back to life 20 times so-so.
When removing it, it was wet, but not much; it retained way less than the factory filler.

Blue Foam.
This one acted very weird. After the exercise process (explained before) it released just a little water twice. Nothing more, it was totally dry at the top of the cart. After moving it and soaking it at the bottom of the cart twice, it released water 12 times. It was very dry when removing it.

Bonded Filter Sleeve by Marinelad.

I am really impressed with this one. It released water constantly 16 times, twice mediocre and got back to life for 11 more times. When removing it, it was somewhat wet.

In chain vaping with Atomic Cinnacide at 10% VG, each one of the fillers acted very good; none of them got burned .

So far in my tests and preferences I say:
Bonded Filter Sleeve by Marinelad. Everyday use. My favorite on the go with thin and middle liquids.
Fluval U3 with thick or all VG liquids at home or when I’m not moving much my PV.
Aquaclear when on the go with very thick or all VG liquids.
Fluval Polishing Pads and Factory Fillers. For my backup carts at my case/PCC because the low leakage.
I’m somewhat disappointed/confused with the blue foam. In my experience it’s been giving me mixed results, sometimes it works great, sometimes it clogs quickly and requires to be moved to refill.
I like a lot the PTB mod, but I find it leaks too much on the go and clogs frequently with medium liquids and it’s difficult to fill with thick liquids.
I hope this can help somebody.
Feel free to add in the thread your experiences.

 

[WillyB]

Interesting findings. I think it may have been better if you had used PG instead of water or a PG/VG mix. In other words more akin to actual application.

 

[jfdpl686]

Interesting findings. I think it may have been better if you had used PG instead of water or a PG/VG mix. In other words more akin to actual application.

Thanks.
In fact, I started doing it with PG but since the liquid is more dense, the "transmission" test was getting too long with some of the fillers and because I was holding the carts (to make it more “real” instead of hanging them without move, the liquid was flowing in different areas so it was difficult to ponder the amount of drawn liquid on each step. VG was even worse! So I decided to go for the quickest one to alt least, have an idea on how each material can handle.

 

[deusXmchna]

The "bonded filter sleeve" by ML. Is this the one with a blue side, and a white side? Did you only use the blue side, or did you kinda co-mingle both substrates?

 

[deusXmchna]

And the Aquaclear- is that made by Hagen?

 

[BababooeyHTJ]

I just picked up some blue foam from strictly ejuice which seems to work well enough so far but is a pain to top of since like you said it needs to be moved around which is a no, no at work for me. It also doesn't seem to hold liquid as well as the factory filler and leaks.

I'm going to stop at a pet store and pick up some fluval on my way home from work tomorrow so I can try that out.

Thanks for the comparison I was wondering what filler was the way to go today.

 

[WillyB]

I just picked up some blue foam from strictly ejuice which seems to work well enough so far but is a pain to top of since like you said it needs to be moved around which is a no, no at work for me. It also doesn't seem to hold liquid as well as the factory filler and leaks.

I'm going to stop at a pet store and pick up some fluval on my way home from work tomorrow so I can try that out.

Thanks for the comparison I was wondering what filler was the way to go today.

If you are experimenting you might as well try the original replacement filler from WalMart.

One thing to remember is that the amount of filler and how far into the cart you go can change things. And what works fine for one liquid may not work right for another.

 

[jfdpl686]

The "bonded filter sleeve" by ML. Is this the one with a blue side, and a white side? Did you only use the blue side, or did you kinda co-mingle both substrates?

Yes, it is the white and blue one. I use both parts. The material is the same, only the color is different; so I made some fillers blue and some white. As Willy said, the most important is the amount you use for your carts. I tryied it in 302 carts and works perfectly too.

The Aquaclear is by Hagen and it is called Filter Insert Foam, I got the small one "For 5-20 Gallon Aquarium" for $1.29.

 

[deusXmchna]

Much appreciated. I used to work in the aquarium industry. Guess it's time to hit the storage container, and start putting every filter substrate I can find into the cartridges.

Nice work. Nice process, and nice pics.

-and have been playing with the blue foam form strictlye.j. - and have also been disappointed. Unfortunately I bought a bunch of bags of them, fortunately they were cheap- but now I've got like a hundred little squares of blue foam haunting my life.

 

[jfdpl686]

I know the feeling! But hang in there and keep them. Sooner or later you’ll face a very think liquid so you can use them.

I really thought “sponges” would be better than “fibrous” and is when you realize the reason the fill the cart with the material they use… it’s the perfect balance/compromise for the money and production.

Lately I’ve been thinking about testing all fillers with different mods, perhaps as plugs leaving totally open the bottom of the carts to hold more liquid and I want to test them in the XL carts (I’m waiting for an order)… what I really need is more liquid when I’m out and can’t drip so maybe the blue foam will help us there.

 

[BababooeyHTJ]

If you are experimenting you might as well try the original replacement filler from WalMart.

One thing to remember is that the amount of filler and how far into the cart you go can change things. And what works fine for one liquid may not work right for another.

Thanks for the tip. I just saw a similar looking bag when I was at petco. I thought about picking it up too. I ended up just getting some fluval which seems to be working pretty well for the liquid that I'm using now. I'm new to all of this so I haven't tried much. I should have enough juice coming in over the next week though.

Anyways, I figured that I would mention that I tried out a cart from cignot that came prefilled with a pyramid tea bag. It worked really well but I seemed to need to refill more often than I would like which is a pain while at work.

 

[jfdpl686]

I figured that I would mention that I tried out a cart from cignot tat came frefilled with a pyramid tea bag. It worked really well but didn't I seemed to need to refill more often that I would like which is a pain while at work.

PTB is great, liquid transmission is good and flow constant. I use Kristin’s PTB made easy”. But yes, I found it requires too much topping and is not very friendly for transportation.

Now, what I do, is having carts at home and office with different fillers, so I pick the correct one for the moment.

Once you start experimenting with different liquids is a good idea to know which one is better. Simply, first try your new liquid dripping, so you taste the flavor and from there test the fillers.

I love Atomic Cinnacide but I find the flavor too strong, so I like using the blue foam with it, since the transmission is too slow, it doesn’t allow much liquid when chain vaping giving me the flavor I like. It is only matter to test and retest to find your sweet spot.

 

[SuZamme]

Wow, thanks for the detailed analysis of the different fillers. I found your results to be similar to what I have experienced with them.

One filler you did not mention that I have used with some great success on a variety of juices is the ole roll-your-own cig filters. Paper peeled, cut in half, a tinyiest pinch off the side, and put in a regular 510 cart, they seem to handle roads trips etc. with no leaking, absorb the varieties of juices well, last thru many washings and filling.

Vape On!!!!!

 

[jfdpl686]

Sezamme, I'm more than interested in trying it. Why don't you post a couple pictures or give me the specs so we can add it to the list?

 

[SuZamme]

Sezamme, I'm more than interested in trying it. Why don't you post a couple pictures or give me the specs so we can add it to the list?

I got the blank filters from CVS. I think they were TipTop Brand...doesn't really matter what brand.
They come 100 to a box.
I peel the outside paper off of the filter, careful to also take off a very thin inside paper as well.
Cut the filter in half (for a 510 cart) with a pair of scissors.
I pinch a few strands off one side so it will fit in the cart without being too tight.
I fill the cart with 8-10 drops of juice depending on how thick it is.
Push the filter into the cart slowly until it is even with the top of the cart and it sucks up the juice. Top off with a few more drops of juice until it doesn't soak in anymore.
Pop it on and vape away.

If I could figure out how to get pics on photobucket or anywhere else? from my dial-up at home, I would post pics. So far, they just don't load before I get a time-out.

 

[DaveP]

I just went through the blue foam straw mod and was really impressed with the carts emptying each time. Then, my shipment of new juices came in from Awesome Vapors. AV juices are all PG and are thinner. I started sampling the juices. The first one, RY4, worked well. I started sampling the others and put the BFM in some empty carts. The result was that I flooded the atty twice using the thin juice and the BFM. I went back to poly and by that time I had sampled 4 or 5 juices in a row and had flooded the attys to much that I had also burned out my taste buds! Everything tasted metallic and all the juices tasted alike.

I cleaned both my working attys by running them under hot water and allowed them to dry overnight on a paper towel. This morning, I installed an unopened polyfill Marlboro cart from my initial shipment and topped it off with some 555. Life is good again, but my tongue is a little sore from the burnt and metallic taste from oversampling PG.

I'm thinking that the Blue Foam Mod is good only for thick VG based juices and I need to stay with either a standard 510 polyfill or go to an Ego for longer cart life between fills. I typically top off an cart once or twice an hour either way with the standard 510 carts.

Just when I thought I had the answer with the BF mod, the environment changed with new juices. I think I'm better off sticking with polyfill and carrying a 3ml bottle for topping off when I go out.

 

[WillyB]

It's not just the filler material it's also about how much you use, a tight pack vs. a looser pack and how full you choose to fill the cart. A small top cap, a half fill etc.

 

[Kirssstens]

Great Post! Your time and effort is very much appreciated.

 

[skydragon]

I got the blank filters from CVS. I think they were TipTop Brand...doesn't really matter what brand.
They come 100 to a box.
I peel the outside paper off of the filter, careful to also take off a very thin inside paper as well.
Cut the filter in half (for a 510 cart) with a pair of scissors.
I pinch a few strands off one side so it will fit in the cart without being too tight.
I fill the cart with 8-10 drops of juice depending on how thick it is.
Push the filter into the cart slowly until it is even with the top of the cart and it sucks up the juice. Top off with a few more drops of juice until it doesn't soak in anymore.
Pop it on and vape away.

If I could figure out how to get pics on photobucket or anywhere else? from my dial-up at home, I would post pics. So far, they just don't load before I get a time-out.

Hello SuZamme,

Can you refill without have to take the filler out?