Bumping this to add that I started vaping 12 days ago; I used to smoke about a pack and a half, two packs a day. I've been experiencing a feeling of discomfort in my left side, not quite chest pain, not quite near the heart either. Someone used the word tightness to describe it? that's what it feels like. I've been vaping 8mg or 11mg liquid from TW and Widowbeads. This sensation started two days ago. Going to see a doctor tomorrow, hopefully it's nothing.
Chest Pains?
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You can't inhale a PV like you would an analog, well you can but it won't do any more for you then not, also deeper and harder inhales will/can cause liquid to go into your mouth. Some of the chest pains people are experiencing could be from muscles you usually don't use when smoking, you use different muscles for a different type of inhale.
Try inhaling into your mouth then lungs, not straight into your lungs, and if you are using high strength nicotine liquid cut it down some.
That being said people should try to see a doctor anytime they have unusal pains, esp in their chest.
Hope you all feel better.
Try inhaling into your mouth then lungs, not straight into your lungs, and if you are using high strength nicotine liquid cut it down some.
That being said people should try to see a doctor anytime they have unusal pains, esp in their chest.
Hope you all feel better.
Just asking... I have to ask. You joined ECF two weeks ago and your very first post here is to say you're having discomfort in your chest? You had nothing, in this whole website, to contribute until you had some strange feeling in your body you decided to attribute to vaping? I'm not saying you don't have a pain, or even questioning its relation to vaping, I'm just wondering if this is really the very first thing you wanted to contribute to this site... Like, no questions about how best to drip, or what's a good liquid, or my first PV sucks, or even a post about what kind of cat you have...??? I'm just asking...
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Chad, I'm with you on this. It does seem peculiar that all of sudden new posters are having problems unlike what most people experience. That's not to say that it isn't happening, but you do wonder if there aren't some anti-vapors being deceitful. No way to tell really, unfortunately.
But for anyone having a side effect...don't mess around with your health...stop doing whatever "new" you're doing and get to a doctor. Even young folks can have hidden hearth problems...I had a cousin die at age 19 from a massive heart attack and he had no clue ahead of time that he had heart problems.
But for anyone having a side effect...don't mess around with your health...stop doing whatever "new" you're doing and get to a doctor. Even young folks can have hidden hearth problems...I had a cousin die at age 19 from a massive heart attack and he had no clue ahead of time that he had heart problems.
Poor sleeping habits, poor diet, too much caffeine, and high cholesterol. I asked him about the e-cig and he said stop smoking anyway and see if it gets better. I guess I'll try.
Be careful trying to connect cause and effect. A perfect example of flawed thinking is a study presented to my social science stat class. They presented what seemed to be irrefutable evidence that eating ice cream and committing murder were strongly related. Sounds absurd, but the stats presented to support the hypothesis sure could be used to make a strong case. Of course, as the study was dissected, it was obvious that ice cream consumption increased dramatically when temperatures rose but so did anger, anxiety, intolerance to irritations of any kind and especially if those irritants were other people. Just a cautionary tale about coming to "logical" conclusions without considering many other possible contributions to a negative situation. By all means find out whether chest pains are cardiac problems. After that, there could be tons of environmental/emotional factors contributing to the symptoms either separately or as an accumulation of many interrelated factors. Fear can wreak havoc with health without any help from other things.
I'm not being flip at all when I highly recommend learning to meditate. Meditation has been the most important contributing factor to my own health and happiness than all other coping methods combined.
I'm not being flip at all when I highly recommend learning to meditate. Meditation has been the most important contributing factor to my own health and happiness than all other coping methods combined.
I learned this in a smoking cessation class:
Keep in mind that if you've been smioking a long time, your lungs are going through a healing phase. Depending on how long and how much you smoked, this phase can last from a few weeks to a year or more for hard-core smokers.
As your lungs heal and work to expel the by-products of accumulated contaminants from smoking, you may experience some mild chest discomfort during this healing phase. You may even feel worse for a little while.
Having said that, if you are experiencing chest pains that seem more than just mild discomfort, accompanied by pain in the arms, jaw, or neck, by all means go to a doctor ASAP. If it's affecting your daily life adversely, than you need to have it checked out now.
Otherwise, I'd recommend you wait a few days and see if you feel better. If you experience any of the adverse symptoms I mentioned above, than get it checked out. And even if you don't, if you just don't "feel right", trust your gut and get checked. Hope this helps.
Keep in mind that if you've been smioking a long time, your lungs are going through a healing phase. Depending on how long and how much you smoked, this phase can last from a few weeks to a year or more for hard-core smokers.
As your lungs heal and work to expel the by-products of accumulated contaminants from smoking, you may experience some mild chest discomfort during this healing phase. You may even feel worse for a little while.
Having said that, if you are experiencing chest pains that seem more than just mild discomfort, accompanied by pain in the arms, jaw, or neck, by all means go to a doctor ASAP. If it's affecting your daily life adversely, than you need to have it checked out now.
Otherwise, I'd recommend you wait a few days and see if you feel better. If you experience any of the adverse symptoms I mentioned above, than get it checked out. And even if you don't, if you just don't "feel right", trust your gut and get checked. Hope this helps.
For those that are experiencing chest pains, if you don't have insurance and $$ is a concern and you think you may be having a heart attack, get a friend to drive you to the ER and sit out in the parking lot. I know it's sounds strange, but I've done it.
I had some mini-strokes over a period of a month about 15 yrs ago. I got SO tired of them and was disgusted. The first trip was to my family doctor who called an ambulance. Cardiologist, medications, the whole bit.
So one morning while it was still dark when it was happening again, I loaded up my then 12 yr old son in the car and we drove to the ER. Sat in the parking lot. Whatever was going on would be worse if I was laying down, so I was ok to sit up and drive.
We sat there until my cardiologist opened across the parking lot.
Extreme yes? Relieved that I didn't sit home and 'wonder'. you bet!
I figure if it gets worse, I'm there in the parking lot. If it passes, no harm done.
Many, many ppl have no health insurance, so something to think about in a jam.
I had some mini-strokes over a period of a month about 15 yrs ago. I got SO tired of them and was disgusted. The first trip was to my family doctor who called an ambulance. Cardiologist, medications, the whole bit.
So one morning while it was still dark when it was happening again, I loaded up my then 12 yr old son in the car and we drove to the ER. Sat in the parking lot. Whatever was going on would be worse if I was laying down, so I was ok to sit up and drive.
We sat there until my cardiologist opened across the parking lot.
Extreme yes? Relieved that I didn't sit home and 'wonder'. you bet!
I figure if it gets worse, I'm there in the parking lot. If it passes, no harm done.
Many, many ppl have no health insurance, so something to think about in a jam.
There are copious links in this forum to symptoms of over-vaping and what to expect when you begin. Did you bother reading any of them? Of course not.
There are studies, such as the New Zealand study, demonstrating the comparative safety of vaping over cigarettes. Did you read it? Of course not.
You feel "insulted nobody advised [you]?" Oh, my. Did you post on here saying "Hey guys, I'm wondering what problems anyone's experienced when they start vaping...?" Of course you didn't. I suppose we were just supposed to somehow fathom that you needed advising, without you ever having posted.
If you had done your homework, you'd already know which manufacturers list their complete ingredients and you'd be familiar with the effects of vaping too much. We'd all love to see more studies too, if only to prove conclusively how much better these are than cigarettes. They will come. E-smoking is in its infancy.
People who expect others to do all their work for them as if it's their due will ultimately be the reason e-cigs are banned.
It sounds to me like you want to go back to smoking and are just waiting for a reason.
I think there is something to this for some people. Compared to smoking analogues, e-cigs are a godsend, however, more than one of my non-smoker friends who have tried my 901 (with a zero nicotine cartridge) have said that they feel it in their lungs and that it feels weird, and made their throat dry and raspy. (To be sure, many of my friends who have tried my e-cig have experienced no discomfort.)
I read the scant information on e-cigs available, and it is a statement in the Health New Zealand report that gave me pause and that may back up some of the people's chest pain concerns:
"Repeated exposure to inhalations of theatrical smoke, including PG, was studied by Varughese and colleaguesin 101 employees at 19 sites. They did not report propylene glycol effects separately. They found wheezing and chest tightness correlated with higher cumulative exposure to smoke over the previous 2 years. Glycol fogs in particular were associated with acute cough and dry throat. Those with greater proximity to fog source showed significantly decreased lung function."
I try to walk 5 miles a day, and if I vape a lot before walking, I experience more tightness in my chest and feel out of breath; I use 0 nicotine juice. The information quoted above is anecdotal (as are my own experiences), but I would like to see more research done on this (and other elements of e-cigarettes) to put my mind at ease. We need more and better studies...
But in the interim I will continue to use my 901 as I can't imagine that vaping can be as bad as smoking cigarettes.
I read the scant information on e-cigs available, and it is a statement in the Health New Zealand report that gave me pause and that may back up some of the people's chest pain concerns:
"Repeated exposure to inhalations of theatrical smoke, including PG, was studied by Varughese and colleaguesin 101 employees at 19 sites. They did not report propylene glycol effects separately. They found wheezing and chest tightness correlated with higher cumulative exposure to smoke over the previous 2 years. Glycol fogs in particular were associated with acute cough and dry throat. Those with greater proximity to fog source showed significantly decreased lung function."
I try to walk 5 miles a day, and if I vape a lot before walking, I experience more tightness in my chest and feel out of breath; I use 0 nicotine juice. The information quoted above is anecdotal (as are my own experiences), but I would like to see more research done on this (and other elements of e-cigarettes) to put my mind at ease. We need more and better studies...
But in the interim I will continue to use my 901 as I can't imagine that vaping can be as bad as smoking cigarettes.
Hmmmm... Read this whole thread from the beginning, and I am kinda purplexed why some folks seem to be surprised by this kind of symptoms...
Changing levels of nicotine - up or down - can cause chest symptoms, light headedness, GI symptoms of all sorts. It's not at all uncommon among smokers who change how much they smoke or what they smoke - why should it not be the same for inhaling nicotine in vapor?
But, also, I would think that even though presumably vaping is better for us than smoking (and I am assuming it is, or I wouldn't be doing it), look, we are still inhaling foreign substances, and I'd be surprised if some people *didn't* have symptoms...
Plus the very physical act of vaping might be causing muscle discomfort, as someone pointed out.
I am not trying to make light of anyone's symptoms - honestly - and I am very sympathetic...
Heck, I'm enjoying it, I like it waaaay better than analogs (though I can't quite quit yet), but I've had heartburn, acid reflux, asthma attacks, chest pains, migraines, strange dreams, and a whole slew of symptoms. All of them related to either overdoing or underdoing nicotine, and getting used to inhaling something my lungs didn't what to have anything to do with. And another thing: analogs actually have dilators in them last time i checked - get off them, and you might very well end up with asthma symptoms for awhile, quite irrespective of vaping...
Just my two pennies. Hope i haven't offended anyone. Hope everyone with unpleasant side-effects feels better soon and checks with their doc just in case.
Cheers,
Briar.
Changing levels of nicotine - up or down - can cause chest symptoms, light headedness, GI symptoms of all sorts. It's not at all uncommon among smokers who change how much they smoke or what they smoke - why should it not be the same for inhaling nicotine in vapor?
But, also, I would think that even though presumably vaping is better for us than smoking (and I am assuming it is, or I wouldn't be doing it), look, we are still inhaling foreign substances, and I'd be surprised if some people *didn't* have symptoms...
Plus the very physical act of vaping might be causing muscle discomfort, as someone pointed out.
I am not trying to make light of anyone's symptoms - honestly - and I am very sympathetic...
Heck, I'm enjoying it, I like it waaaay better than analogs (though I can't quite quit yet), but I've had heartburn, acid reflux, asthma attacks, chest pains, migraines, strange dreams, and a whole slew of symptoms. All of them related to either overdoing or underdoing nicotine, and getting used to inhaling something my lungs didn't what to have anything to do with. And another thing: analogs actually have dilators in them last time i checked - get off them, and you might very well end up with asthma symptoms for awhile, quite irrespective of vaping...
Just my two pennies. Hope i haven't offended anyone. Hope everyone with unpleasant side-effects feels better soon and checks with their doc just in case.
Cheers,
Briar.
since 10 month i have heavy cheast pain ,i start with freesmoke and ruyan liquids and depost high medium and zero then my cheast is so pain that i go to the hospiatl and check up my cheast and my heard ,but is all ok, my problem is analog i have not this problems only when i smoke e.cigs ,
and now i have intellicig zero eccopure but my cheast pain is not finnish but it is not so much pain !i dont no where come this cheast pain but it is a big point in e-cig that we anallyse,then many doctors have not information what e-cig is !
and now i have intellicig zero eccopure but my cheast pain is not finnish but it is not so much pain !i dont no where come this cheast pain but it is a big point in e-cig that we anallyse,then many doctors have not information what e-cig is !
Read the rest of the studies. Do you know how much glycol had to be inhaled by volume?
And it wasn't a cumulative effect, it was repeated peak effect. Glycol and PG based fogs are the recommended base for fog machines because there is no long term, cumulative effect, and it presents (when used appropriately) no harm to the fog technician, or to the entertainers (or their vocal chords for that matter).
Sorry, but bad information makes me cranky.
Me too. Imprecise info, out of context quotes, and half-truths are utter bulls**t. Thanks for setting the record straight!
Thanks for the information, SLDS181. It was not my intent to make anyone cranky. I was just looking at the information that others in these forums have told me to read. I've been lurking here for months, and I'm sure I'm just looking in the wrong place...I read all of the links I could find so far and did not come across the information you referenced on exposure and long term effects. Any chance you could post or send me links?
I have only found scant information for long term exposure, and that information talked little about quantities, density, and duration in terms that could not be compared to vaping.
chad, I respectfully disagree with your statement. I quoted nothing out of context. i provided the information that was in the report as it was stated. If there are half-truth in the Health New Zealand report then I am glad I brought it up. What are they? I'm not a fan of bulls**t either...
In the time I have been reading these forums I have noticed an unfortunate trend. Attack anyone who questions the dogma that electronic cigarettes are 100% safe. Just because someone asks for more information, or questions the integrity or validity of data does not mean that they are somehow attacking you or the technology. No need to be so sensitive, as far as I can tell everyone here is on the same side. We are all pro electronic cigarettes.
I'm merely asking for more and better studies on the subject...The more we know the better, right?
I have only found scant information for long term exposure, and that information talked little about quantities, density, and duration in terms that could not be compared to vaping.
chad, I respectfully disagree with your statement. I quoted nothing out of context. i provided the information that was in the report as it was stated. If there are half-truth in the Health New Zealand report then I am glad I brought it up. What are they? I'm not a fan of bulls**t either...
In the time I have been reading these forums I have noticed an unfortunate trend. Attack anyone who questions the dogma that electronic cigarettes are 100% safe. Just because someone asks for more information, or questions the integrity or validity of data does not mean that they are somehow attacking you or the technology. No need to be so sensitive, as far as I can tell everyone here is on the same side. We are all pro electronic cigarettes.
I'm merely asking for more and better studies on the subject...The more we know the better, right?
Whoa! Sorry brother. My comment was not directed at you. I don't attack anyone and certainly don't subscribe to any dogmas. Check my previous posts to be sure.
I was merely expressing my feelings that there is alot of out-of-context quotes, imprecise info, and half-truths in regards to e-cigs. Translation: E-cigs are highly politicized.
I'm all about finding out as much information as possible and there are some good resources here (amongst alot of fear, uncertainty, and doubt). Unfortunately, people have a tendency to take one piece of info that supports their fears or desires and run with that. It's just not the whole picture.
Now, that said, everyone reacts differently to anything they introduce into their bodies. Some might get a cough, or a headache, turn blue, or whatever. It's a great thing to have more studies done on e-cigs. Keep in mind however, that they didn't spring up yesterday and there has been research on them. These things have been around for five or more years - popularity is just increasing now.
Your New Zealand study quote could be considered "out-of-context" though, because you quoted a short passage about PG (in theatrical smoke) without citing amounts ingested, duration of exposure, or other pertinent information. Furthermore, if you look around here (and other places on the net), you'll find that PG is also used as a suspension medium in inhalers, nasal sprays, and a few other ingestible applications. Side-effects listed are often the same ones you've mentioned in those things as well (and that doesn't necessarily mean those things are "not safe").
Just as SLDS181 said, there is more information in the NZ study (like amounts, etc..) that could have been provided in your post but wasn't. It's important that we share all information we find but realize that there have been many, many, many posts here about research and studies that provided a more complete picture of things.
Sure thing.
http://www.actorsequity.org/docs/safesan/finalreport.pdf - Fog Juice, PG/VG mixes, peak/long term exposure, etc. Maximum peak limits of inhalation given, applies quite nicely.
http://www.esta.org/tsp/documents/docs/ANSI_E1-5_2003.pdf - ESTA standards based on a variety of studies.
go to Spikey's site for the LI vapers- vapersclub.com - and you'll see a ton of links and information.
Also, read the FDA's report, then read GRAS requirements (Generally Recognized As Safe), and DEG (diethylene glycol) allowable limits in products consumed by just about everyone.
Lots of good info there.
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