Hahyeah.. hairy balls lol
What the hell happened to your post???
ʇɐɥʇ ʇɔǝןɟǝɹ pןnoɥs ʇxǝʇ ǝɥʇ pǝɹnƃıɟ ˙˙˙pǝddıןɟ ıit's done through a webpage called flip my text
Church?
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ʇɐɥʇ ʇɔǝןɟǝɹ pןnoɥs ʇxǝʇ ǝɥʇ pǝɹnƃıɟ ˙˙˙pǝddıןɟ ıit's done through a webpage called flip my text
Fortunately, Westboro Baptist Church is shunned by most other religious institutions. They really are an embarrassment to Christianity.
There are Christians that focus on their relationship with God and share it with others. Then there are other Christians that choose to get involved in the protest (among other protests) that you have mentioned. Just know that there are many other anti-gay groups out there that are not Christian based groups. Why were they not mentioned as well? You can't only point the finger at them.
As a Christian, I believe in loving all your brothers and sisters regardless of race, color, religion or sexual preference. There are many Christians out there that feel the same way I do. Not all Christians go out and protest against gay marriages. I have gay and lesbian family and I still love them with all my heart.
We are not perfect. If we were perfect, then who would need God?
And just for your information, God does not condem the people, he just condems the act. However, whatever the act, God does show mercy and grace to his son's and daughters.
I don't want to go off topic here because I can keep on writing. I just do not want to see any heated arguments and/or debates going on here.
Let's just let the dust settle a little bit, gather our thoughts, and "discuss" the topic of vaping in a church.
There will be some for it, and others against it. No matter what...that will never change.
Are you and atheist? What is your problem then? vaping in the First Atheist Church? Do atheists often go to church to pray to the God in whom they believe not?
What I really am asking you is to respect other people´s needs, wishes and rights. Even though you defecate every day and see nothing bad in defecating, I still believe it is not the best possible manner to defecate in front of people who might dislike the sight of you performing this very normal activity.
where my problem lies is that you accussed me of being an ..... when my original intent in this thread at all was to defend against an accusation that because one didnt agree with another persons opinion that they were "teenage minded".. ie incapable of adult thought...
of course i wouldnt defecate in a chuch.. that would be disrespectful... would i vape in a church.. to behonset.. i dont know.. i feel the presence of a higher being more in a restroom than in a church anyways.. most CHURCHES are all about thier money and control of thier congregation..
would i drink in a church.. better yet..would i bring alcohol into a church.. of course not.. but does that mean nobody ever should??.. it's suppossedly a house of GOD... if you're gonna go.. at least be yourself.. dont be a perfect little boy for a couple hours then run tothenearest convenience storeand get drunk right afterwords... honestly.. knight was right... this should just lay down and die... and thats exactly what im gonna let it do..
asi said before.. if christ himself cant lead you to tolerence.. im gonna get nowhere trying.. do what you feel is right and i shall do the same.. be well and "god" bless
ps.. im not atheist..i was RAISED atheist.. i am agnostic
Um yes, someone walking down into church smoking a crack pipe is probably high and unstable. They pose a safety threat to the people there, especially the children and the elderly. Escorting the person out is the wise and prudent thing to do for the safety of everyone there. Offering the person help should also be done, but letting them hang around is just plain unsafe.
OK, talk about WAY off topic. The "church" referenced is not a church in the usual sense of the word. Its a guy and his family who stir up homophobes. It has 71 members (according to the ADL) and that includes Phelp's family. Its hardly a church and hardly anything that could be called a movement.
Nice strawman.
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Where I see a problem here is that the "some people" seems to only refer to Christians. When Christian faith is insulted, demeaned, and made fun of they should grow thicker skin.
Yet a simple argument about vaping in church gets turned into an argument about Christian theology on sexuality. What does one have to do with the other?
Second, the Christian faith was demeaned and lauged at in this thread but to call such behavior childish caused "holy heck" to break out.
I find the noise of this double standard to be deafening.
yeah i know... such a threat
i forgot... yer of the lepers should be shunned, prostitutes should be stoned. and jews and muslims killed kinda christian ilk
y'know the funny part is.. i'm wondering why Lu has been taking the brunt of my rather polite argument whilst defending YOUR statements
to be honest.. i started to write arather long reply... buti just changed my mind.. you're inability to form your own argument and not demean others makes you not worthwhile of my "diminished capacities"
i'll just link you to some literature to read and if you actually READ it.. you might get the understanding of where you have gone astray... but i believe honestly that your reading comprehension skills may make you unable to do so
BRI/TIM - The Holy Bible - The New King James Version
good luck with it
LOL, yes, high and unstable individuals are a threat.
Give me a break. If you saw a high and unstable person you wouldn't sit your small child or elderly mother right next to them and you know it.
Um, nice strawman argument. Where has anyone said anything even remotely clost to any of that?
Like I said before, some can dish it out but sure as heck can't take it.
I have a Master's degree in Theology (and social work), I don't need internet links thank you.
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Wow, nothing pissing me off more than when someone throws me (a believer in Jesus Christ) in with a large crowd of self worshiping bigots that have nothing better to do (maybe they could try focusing on God for a minute) than preach their message of hate. They are not christians (a christian being someone who is christlike) which even the atheist in this thread knows what christ should be like. I used to be on the payroll at my church and was asked to step down because of my addiction, and you know what, being respectful and mindful of my choices versus how i believe that as a christian it isn't exactly christlike to let a chemical control my life (and honestly, i'd feel the same way if I had to have a cup of coffee every morning) I stepped down. Thats not to say it isnt possible to lead others in worship even though you let a substance control your life, but it isnt a good example. for the same reason, vaping in church would just be out of the question for me, if for no other reason than the concern that little johnny on the third row might see my blue L.E.D. shimmer and think its the coolest thing in the world and decide he wants to grow up addicted to a chemical as well. and lets be honest, how many of us picked up smoking because someone we respected (for whatever reason, good or bad) smoked. but anyways, to stay on topic, I think it is incredible insensitive and anyone that understands respect should realize it isnt appropriate to vape, smoke drink or otherwise do anything that could remotely be described as a bad personal decision (I smoke and drink, btw) during a church service. after the service, i dont think it would be terrible bad to smoke in a classroom or office, or if you are with a group of adults that understand your addiction and are ok with the idea. rawr. I'm sorry for the rant, but i really hate it when someone confuses christianity for bigotry or intolerance.
/end rant
-Ben
/end rant
-Ben
Though I no longer go to church, I still believe in God but my faith has been less in the past. I used to be heavily involved in church I even worked for a church at one point. I became a Christian in a church who's doctrine was judgmental and hateful, over time I realized this was wrong. Christianity isn't what get publicized, the fear, and hate mongering bigots. Christianity is the following of Christ and his teachings, not going to church, and defiantly not hating or judging people. Now I am far from perfect in that respect, but where I lack compassion and love its defiantly not from my believe in Christ, in fact I think it keeps me from a better understanding of him. Church is made by man, so it is prone to failure.
I know that there are some terrible people who "represent" Christianity, I am sorry for them. Nuck, I like you, and personally I don't mind your jokes but they are very disrespectful. No one was being an ....... christian in this thread, so why be an ....... to them about what they believe?
I know that there are some terrible people who "represent" Christianity, I am sorry for them. Nuck, I like you, and personally I don't mind your jokes but they are very disrespectful. No one was being an ....... christian in this thread, so why be an ....... to them about what they believe?
I went back over my responses and they were quite tame compared to my assholishness in many other threads. I would be happy to illustrate the differences
I read your post and thought of a question for you, or any christian vaper. Im an Athiest btw, but have researched your religious doctrin beyond what I care to admit to.
I have often wondered, isnt it unbiblical to put anything foreign into your body? I know there is a quote about taking plants and things and using them (what most marijuanna users go to to biblically support its use), but isnt there something that says you are not supposed to? So wouldnt that make vaping, or smoking, unbiblical? Just wondering
My best,
-VP
I have often wondered, isnt it unbiblical to put anything foreign into your body? I know there is a quote about taking plants and things and using them (what most marijuanna users go to to biblically support its use), but isnt there something that says you are not supposed to? So wouldnt that make vaping, or smoking, unbiblical? Just wondering
My best,
-VP
I read your post and thought of a question for you, or any christian vaper. Im an Athiest btw, but have researched your religious doctrin beyond what I care to admit to.
I have often wondered, isnt it unbiblical to put anything foreign into your body? I know there is a quote about taking plants and things and using them (what most marijuanna users go to to biblically support its use), but isnt there something that says you are not supposed to? So wouldnt that make vaping, or smoking, unbiblical? Just wondering
My best,
-VP
I've read through the bible several times and never saw a verse that could be used to say it is okay to smoke anything or anything about plants. I'm a Christian myself and happen to carry this addiction with me from my life before Christ. The body is a temple and should be holy (meaning set aside for worship or use in worship). I can't say from my reading of the bible that smoking/ or vaping is a sin. Now the fact that tobacco use is bad for you and damaging to a temple I'm certain is not being respectful to God, and therefore un-Christlike. But we, even the Christians are all sinners, and as long as we live we will always be sinners. Everyone has their vices, and we, Christian or not, should recognize this and try to put them behind us. I'm trying, and am weening myself off of nicotine by vaping. Also, I don't think that vaping itself is a sin, especially once you get past the addiction of nicotine. However, there is a verse in the Bible (referring to Christians eating meat that may or may not have been sacrificed to idols) that says you shouldn't do something in the prescence of others if those people might find it offensive.
Oh, and for the non-believers who are up for a challenge, or the Christians who may want something more to further solidify their faith, I recommend a series of Books by Lee Strobel. He has a degree in law and was one of America's top journalists. He was an atheist and his wife found Christ and he kind of set out to debunk Christianity. He did a lot of research, as any lawyer would do, to present his case that Christ was not the son of God, that there is not even a God, etc. He then, being the journalist that he is, went and sought those who believed otherwise. He interviewed scientists who were atheists, got there PHD's, went into their fields of studies, and become, of all things, Christians.
The series of books include: "The case for a creator," "The case for Christ," and "The case for faith"
Prior to arguing with this, I really challenge you to take me up on this.
Once you know the facts, it takes more faith to be an atheist than it does a Christian.
Thanks. You had me right up until you went on your tangent starting with Lee Strobel. How about this, if any christians want a challenge, I can recommend several books for you to read. Would you read them? Of course not. I can give you one book in particular that was written by a bible thumping fundamentalist... turned Athiest. Do you care? Of course not. Would that book change your faith? Absolutly not. To ask an Athiest to read your one sided books will do nothing. Just because a scientist turns x-tian means nothing really. Other than they have relinquished their scientific mind to faith.
You say once we know the facts (what facts?), it takes more faith to be an Athiest than a christian. Thats incorrect for the most part, since Atheism disregards faith as supernatural, and unprovable . Your belief REQUIRES you to have faith... if you, or any christian, doesnt have faith... your belief falls on its face. Am I correct?
And a friendly fyi... I need not read your recommondations to debate
My best,
-VP
Having the knowledge of the scientific fields that are discussed in these books, it would take more faith to be an atheist than a Chistian.Thanks. You had me right up until you went on your tangent starting with Lee Strobel. How about this, if any christians want a challenge, I can recommend several books for you to read. Would you read them? Of course not. I can give you one book in particular that was written by a bible thumping fundamentalist... turned Athiest. Do you care? Of course not. Would that book change your faith? Absolutly not. To ask an Athiest to read your one sided books will do nothing. Just because a scientist turns x-tian means nothing really. Other than they have relinquished their scientific mind to faith.
You say once we know the facts (what facts?), it takes more faith to be an Athiest than a christian. Thats incorrect for the most part, since Atheism disregards faith as supernatural, and unprovable . Your belief REQUIRES you to have faith... if you, or any christian, doesnt have faith... your belief falls on its face. Am I correct?
And a friendly fyi... I need not read your recommondations to debate
My best,
-VP
This is science. It does not require disregarding science to have faith. The science actually backs up the belief. These are educated men interviewed here. Real studies, real facts, real science. Men who had different opinions completely, one sided in the opposite direction, whose beliefs were turned upside down by their findings. You say these books are one-sided, and they're not. Quite the opposite I'd say. They are the best arguments from both sides, and they are all based on science (the case for a creator and the case for christ, the other one, case for faith is different, its like answers to the "Big 8" about faith). Real science requires testability and observability. If this were some one sided book that wasn't challenging and didn't contain perspective from both sides, it would mean nothing. Check it out...
Darwin himself said if such a thing as irreducible complexity were ever discovered, the theory of macro-evolution would fall flat on its face.
Without intervention, how do you explain the Cambrian explosion.
How do you explain the "design" of DNA, this is information encoding
How do you explain that their was once nothing, nothing at all physical, and then all of a sudden something went boom. What could've gone boom if there was nothing physical and nothing to interact, unless there is something not subject to either time, or physics.
If you don't believe in the Big Bang, then how do you explain that anything physical could possibly exist for an infinite amount of time.
How do you explain out of body experiences.
How can you explain the perfect balance of gravity (not just on earth, but the gravity of the universe), helium to hydrogen conversion, and the other micro-tuned to infinitesimal accuracy balance of all things in the universe.
How can you explain 3rd party accounts, from atheist historians that state very clearly that Jesus performed miracles.
How do you explain morals, the general knowledge of right and wrong.
Unless you can answer all of these questions better than the leading scientists in each of these fields (as well as several others), then you have faith in atheism that is not based on knowledge, or anything provable!
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I have been disrespected by Christians several times just when I stated my beliefs. I don't mean to be rude but Christians are constantly ridiculed by people who are atheist/agnostic. A lot of what you say is completely outrageous and creates a stigma that makes Christianity look very unappealing. (knight is a prime example of what a good Christian is)
Don't mean to offend anyone it's just that when you don't believe in god and someone suggests that you should vape the blood of Christ, that it's freakin HILARIOUS!
Don't mean to offend anyone it's just that when you don't believe in god and someone suggests that you should vape the blood of Christ, that it's freakin HILARIOUS!
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