Didn't know lower class people had computers and internet connections. How do afford all the mods ??
Maybe stop with the sob stories ??
Clones... Why?
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Didn't know lower class people had computers and internet connections. How do afford all the mods ??
Maybe stop with the sob stories ??
I said lower class not homeless... And if you think thats a sob story your wrong...
And my mods are all clones
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My thing is, I enjoy having "nice things" just like the next guy, so I have no problem shelling out $200+ for a high quality mech mod if I feel like I'll like it.
Conversely, I also enjoy performance. So if I find out that there's a clone out there that hits just as hard as the original, I won't think twice about buying the clone version, purely from a utilitarian standpoint. For instance, I bought an EHPro Caravela Clone that hits just as hard if not harder than the 3 or 4 $200+ mech mods I own. So I consider that a win-win situation. I saved a bit of money and got something that performs REALLY well....
So I guess I am a good mix of the 2; I will buy a nice mech if I feel like I want to (ie: I paid $230 for an authentic Origin as it is a fantastic piece of engineering), but I will also go with the clone option if I think that I can get a solid performer for a good price...
It has nothing to do with how 'well off' you are, that's irrelevant IMO.....
Conversely, I also enjoy performance. So if I find out that there's a clone out there that hits just as hard as the original, I won't think twice about buying the clone version, purely from a utilitarian standpoint. For instance, I bought an EHPro Caravela Clone that hits just as hard if not harder than the 3 or 4 $200+ mech mods I own. So I consider that a win-win situation. I saved a bit of money and got something that performs REALLY well....
So I guess I am a good mix of the 2; I will buy a nice mech if I feel like I want to (ie: I paid $230 for an authentic Origin as it is a fantastic piece of engineering), but I will also go with the clone option if I think that I can get a solid performer for a good price...
It has nothing to do with how 'well off' you are, that's irrelevant IMO.....
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A mech mod has no regulation, no short protection and no battery protection. It's quite simply, a metal tube with a 510 connection. There is no way in hell im paying $200 plus for a pretty metal tube.
Regulated mods are a different story. The way I see it, you are paying for the quality chip that can handle a higher amp limit than the battery inside. I will gladly pay $300 for a 30+ watt mod. But a Mech is never going to be worth that much to me.
Regulated mods are a different story. The way I see it, you are paying for the quality chip that can handle a higher amp limit than the battery inside. I will gladly pay $300 for a 30+ watt mod. But a Mech is never going to be worth that much to me.
Right, and money is nothing but paper and ink, no way I'm working for that...
You aren't buying safety or technology when you buy a mechanical mod, your buying a hand crafted item that is both functional and attractive to you.
I'm certainly not buying a provari on looks, and the chip doesn't do anything I would want if I were interested in a technology laden device.
Value like beauty is in the eye of the beholder, simple as that.
I happen to prefer brunettes, that doesn't mean blonde girls are not interesting to me.
Maurice
You aren't buying safety or technology when you buy a mechanical mod, your buying a hand crafted item that is both functional and attractive to you.
I'm certainly not buying a provari on looks, and the chip doesn't do anything I would want if I were interested in a technology laden device.
Value like beauty is in the eye of the beholder, simple as that.
I happen to prefer brunettes, that doesn't mean blonde girls are not interesting to me.
Maurice
Double or nothing? I'd throw in $400 on this (for the two on the opposition)
I have read through this thread and may have skipped over a post or two but I have pondered why the clone makers don't leave their products devoid of engravings and art. The obvious reason is that MANY (not all) of their customers are buying the products as a vanity item. Much like purchasing a fake handbag or watch with a popular brand logo.
There are technical aspects of mechanical mods that I prefer (recessed bottom switch, floating positive pin) which many original mod makers employ in their design. I prefer a mechanical mod without any engravings or art work logos.
If the clone makers just left the vanity markings off their products and just employed technical aspects of popular mods how would people view that? I suggest considering that many authentic mods already borrow design aspects from other authentic mods.
There are technical aspects of mechanical mods that I prefer (recessed bottom switch, floating positive pin) which many original mod makers employ in their design. I prefer a mechanical mod without any engravings or art work logos.
If the clone makers just left the vanity markings off their products and just employed technical aspects of popular mods how would people view that? I suggest considering that many authentic mods already borrow design aspects from other authentic mods.
There are some that are more comfortable with it...however the really small scale modders tend to have a problem with this I think, as that's where a lot of the originality in design comes from, and is subsequently imitated from. But I personally think not copying logos and mod names (essentially "brand names") is a lot better than what's going on now in the majority of cases. In that case, why not name it something different, maybe change up the design a bit?
Being inspired by original creations and even imitating those original creations to an extent, is a natural part of the creative process, methinks. Plagiarism just isn't...
I'll play.
Yes, I'd still pay $150+ for the exact same quality mod and the only difference would be without markings. As I've said before, this thing is in my hand 24/7 and I want a high quality device, not just a name or logo.
Does it mean more to me that I have the artist's signature or logo and a serial number, yes it does. I enjoy collecting something that has a bit of rarity and exclusivity and there's nothing wrong with that. Does it annoy me that pretty much anytime someone now posts "my Caravella"or "my Nemesis" that the chances it's a counterfeit are 99%? You're damned right it does. You've done nothing but facilitate theft of intellectual property just so you can say you have whatever high end mod that you can't or won't acquire when you really don't.
The mantra of the FastTech cowboys that "it's just a battery tube with a button" is such BS that it ain't even funny. There are some very unique designs out there that take the "just a battery tube & button" to a whole different level. Not to even mention the finished quality is a lot better. Hmm..skilled craftsman getting paid for what his skills are actually worth vs some poor sap toiling away in a mass production factory 16 hours a day for $0.25 an hour. You tell me who's going to turn out better quality.
I want a Rolex badly and one day I'll save the cash to get one but there's no way in hell I'd buy a fake. I don't care if it's the best fake in the world and no one would ever know, it's still a fake.
To put it bluntly, if you can't afford it, or won't spend the money for it or can't find it in stock then it's not for you. It's that simple. Yeah that may sound elitist but oh well. You're not entitled to something just because you want it.
There are many quality devices that are available and reasonably priced and not blatant rip offs of someone else's work. Why not buy one of those?
Now, your turn...
Would you still buy your exact same counterfeits if they didn't have the original artists stolen signature and or logo?
Would you still deal with the issues of the fake Caravella's if it didn't have Pedro's stolen signature and markings or would you look for a better quality device for the same price?
So much fail here...spoken like someone who has no clue to the facts and only regurgitating things they've heard by others who are equally misinformed.
First off the cost of Rolex service is closer to $500 or more depending on whether or not new parts are needed.
However since the OEM warranty is only 2 years and the OEM recommended service interval is every 5 years your first statement is quite false. You also get a 1 year warranty on the service itself each time as well.
Secondly, any mechanical watch is not going to be as accurate as a $10 quartz. That's just the nature of the beast.
A COSC certified watch is only accurate to -4 or +6 seconds per day. You don't buy a mechanical watch because it's the most accurate thing, thats what Quartz watches are for. My Marathon that's in my avatar gains about 15 seconds a day and is my daily wearer. My much more accurate Quartz sits in my watch case and rarely sees the light of day.
A Rolex is a quality tool watch that if maintained properly will last for generations. My father in law was buried in his cheap quartz Casio and I felt no loss of an heirloom. My grandfather's mechanical Citizen from the 70's is sitting in my safe and works quite well and means the world to me. It will be passed on to my heirs and hopefully cherished as well.
I don't get this debate when the cost is soooo different. It's about 10:1. I think that is something we can agree on. So, the person that was 100% going to pay $200 for an original but then saw a clone for $20 and bought the clone, does not exist. At least in my opinion. The person buying originals (multiple mods), I'm going to say will 99% of the time buy originals. But the person buying clones might actually step up and buy an original or two more often than the person buying originals stepping down to buy a clone.
And I'm with the guy who said it's a tube holding a battery. I just can't pay a lot for it. Engrave it all you want, I just can't do it. I'm not a collector or connoisseur, it doesn't work for me.
And someone mentioned, if you can't afford it, don't buy it. You sound like that Jordan wearing guy driving his WRX with his Beats headphones on and bright red Ray Bans. A douche. Don't put down people that aren't on your higher level of humanity yet. So would you not vape with someone that was just all about the clones?
And I'm with the guy who said it's a tube holding a battery. I just can't pay a lot for it. Engrave it all you want, I just can't do it. I'm not a collector or connoisseur, it doesn't work for me.
And someone mentioned, if you can't afford it, don't buy it. You sound like that Jordan wearing guy driving his WRX with his Beats headphones on and bright red Ray Bans. A douche. Don't put down people that aren't on your higher level of humanity yet. So would you not vape with someone that was just all about the clones?
Nope. Drive a Tacoma, wear Dr Martens or Clarks, wear a 3 year old pair of Oakleys and wouldn't touch Beats if you gave them to me. As I said, I'll pay for quality not simply a name or logo which is all Beats are.
I have all kinds of bad things to say about liberals and democrats but I still associate with them
If a tube and battery is all it is to you then that's great, whatever keeps you off the analogs. Do you really need stolen intellectual property to quit smoking?
I do agree with your first points about who will buy what, but again to me it all boils down to theft. You can buy a great $20 mod that may or may not compare in performance to a $200 device but you don't need to have logos and artwork of the originals on your $20 device...or do you?
I have all kinds of bad things to say about liberals and democrats but I still associate with them
If a tube and battery is all it is to you then that's great, whatever keeps you off the analogs. Do you really need stolen intellectual property to quit smoking?
I do agree with your first points about who will buy what, but again to me it all boils down to theft. You can buy a great $20 mod that may or may not compare in performance to a $200 device but you don't need to have logos and artwork of the originals on your $20 device...or do you?
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It's all about the Sennheiser's. Those are real mass-produced headphones.
And I'll agree with the logo/artwork. I got the Panzer clone because every other mod looks like a shiny tube to me. I could do without the engraving. I'd like something on the button though, but it doesn't have to be exactly like the original or the flashlight even. But some mods, Rai Vape clones in particular, are just so generic, cloning is very easy. But like I said, I'll agree with you, the Nemesis and others shouldn't have copied artwork.
So.....Rand Paul 2016?
Oh yeah, 1986 GMC Sierra Classic for me.
And I'll agree with the logo/artwork. I got the Panzer clone because every other mod looks like a shiny tube to me. I could do without the engraving. I'd like something on the button though, but it doesn't have to be exactly like the original or the flashlight even. But some mods, Rai Vape clones in particular, are just so generic, cloning is very easy. But like I said, I'll agree with you, the Nemesis and others shouldn't have copied artwork.
So.....Rand Paul 2016?
Oh yeah, 1986 GMC Sierra Classic for me.
Rand Paul 2016 most definitely!
I know I'm a little too vocal on counterfeits so I've kinda stopped posting against them lately. However after a stressful day and a few shots of Maker's Mark tonight I kinda went off a wee bit
I know I'm a little too vocal on counterfeits so I've kinda stopped posting against them lately. However after a stressful day and a few shots of Maker's Mark tonight I kinda went off a wee bit
Rand Paul 2016 most definitely!
I know I'm a little too vocal on counterfeits so I've kinda stopped posting against them lately. However after a stressful day and a few shots of Maker's Mark tonight I kinda went off a wee bit
Maker's Mark is nice. If you haven't tried it before, Pendleton 1910. Excellent. A bit sweet if you like that. I love it. Also, if you want to try something very different, Bowen's. It's a locally made whiskey with a smoky flavor. We can cheers those in a year and few months.
Bowen's Whiskey » Pure California Whiskey
OP, sorry for the thread hijack.
Willett Pot Still Reserve is nice, I'm not a huge fan of bourbon but it is one I will drink from time to time alone or with a single ice cube is best.
Maurice
PS "something about clones and how they are bad for the economy and landfills ... yep we are still on topic ;-) "
Maurice
PS "something about clones and how they are bad for the economy and landfills ... yep we are still on topic ;-) "
Lagavulin 16 or Caol Ila 18 for me please... (neat with a spoonful of water). Bourbon tastes like somebody mixed Mezcal with Canadian Club!
PS, on the clones issue, the other day I met a guy at the local B&M with a Provari topped with a "The Russian" (real thing). He was kind enough to disassembly it for me to see. I had with me a Kayfun 3.1 ES clone from FastTech.. The apparent quality differences were huge, mainly because of the finish, but the actual manufacture was not that different. Actually my cheap clone was as smooth threading as this guy's USD$120 vaping jewel and mine was 1/5 the price, not counting S&H which in the case of the FT was zero, null, cero... Oddly enough, most of the pieces were interchangeable between the two. Considering The Russian is also a clone of the original (and even more expensive) Kayfun 3.1 from Svoemesto, I felt very pleased and smart.
Now, there are clones and there are clones. The one from FT I can fill from the bottom and won't leak. Not one drop. OTOH, this one from e-liquid.cn is a sieve. It also doesn't include the middle SS tank section nor the double-ended keyring screwdriver. $25 vs $17. That is a no-brainer; I'll take the good one anytime even at twice the price, but five times as much? Hmmm. The vape is the same in all three. This is no Mercedes vs Ford comparo, not even real Ferragamo loafers vs Chinese knockoffs. For me, these are utensils, not adornments or dress accessories.
Please be advised, I can distiguish and appraise quality items. Were it a car, a motorcycle or even a watch, I would concede. After all a true Rolex Submariner can be had for not a penny less than $7000, while a "replica" (a good one with an ETA caliber) that is virtually identical -on the outside at least- even side by side goes for about $600. I know, I have a real Sub (two actually) and a buddy of mine got himself a replica. Both are equally (in)exact. What would probably be the watershed would be taking them underwater, something I shall refuse to do with mine; that's what dive computers are for. In any case, the Rolex is a jewel, the replica is just a posture; however, they keep the time as well as each other.
Now, there are clones and there are clones. The one from FT I can fill from the bottom and won't leak. Not one drop. OTOH, this one from e-liquid.cn is a sieve. It also doesn't include the middle SS tank section nor the double-ended keyring screwdriver. $25 vs $17. That is a no-brainer; I'll take the good one anytime even at twice the price, but five times as much? Hmmm. The vape is the same in all three. This is no Mercedes vs Ford comparo, not even real Ferragamo loafers vs Chinese knockoffs. For me, these are utensils, not adornments or dress accessories.
Please be advised, I can distiguish and appraise quality items. Were it a car, a motorcycle or even a watch, I would concede. After all a true Rolex Submariner can be had for not a penny less than $7000, while a "replica" (a good one with an ETA caliber) that is virtually identical -on the outside at least- even side by side goes for about $600. I know, I have a real Sub (two actually) and a buddy of mine got himself a replica. Both are equally (in)exact. What would probably be the watershed would be taking them underwater, something I shall refuse to do with mine; that's what dive computers are for.
In any case, the Rolex is a jewel, the replica is just a posture; however, they keep the time as well as each other.My only mods are two super t precise+ 18650's and there basically plain metal tubes the only engraving is a small P on the bottom switch and honestly i don't care about the logos. I also use an old DID that has no markings on it.
I like precision engineering not logos, serial numbers or decoration. I use one mod all day every day it never misfires, the switch is perfect. Both mod and atomizer function flawlessly 100% of the time and thats after two years. Thats why i paid here in the czech republic around $350+ for the setup i use. I'm not a wealthy man, I did not buy it to take it out and say hey look at me. I'm also not careful this thing has hit the pub floor 100's of times it's built like a tank.
I just would not pay for a mod because it looked nice. I smoked for 20 years and my cigarettes worked every single time I light one up! I expect the same from my PV. I never took a cigarette out the pack and though, what this thing needs is some big ... engraving down the side.
Each to there own
Dave
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