Literal definition aside, buying something you know full well is not an original is completely different than buying something you think is original because someone counterfeited the details and sold it as such.
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Clones... Why?
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Literal definition aside, buying something you know full well is not an original is completely different than buying something you think is original because someone counterfeited the details and sold it as such.
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I'd love to see a gunsmith crank out one of these and all of the components in 15 minutes by hand or a hundred per day, even without the engraving.
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For some of us it is all about quality and durability. I have a flashlight that cost more, and I can't even vape out of it...
Do you REALLY think it's that difficult? Honestly?
I can assure you it's not.
Take a good look at that gun. The ONLY pieces that were prefabricated were the barrel, internal trigger mechanism, and the screws. Every single bit of the rest of it is hand carved, hand cut, hand engraved, hand inlaid, hand formed, hand polished, and hand finished.
My father was the gunsmith who produced this weapon, and I know several other master gunsmiths as well.
I can assure you that the average competent gunsmith could fabricate the average mech mod in about 15 minutes by hand if you don't include engravings or etchings. And those threads you think are oh-so difficult to produces and require big expensive lathes, I've got a newsflash for you, they had be done by hand with a gunsmiths thread tap in a matter of minutes, and will be gunsmith quality, not the shabby work done by the typical mech mod producer.
And unlike your typical mech mod I can assure you that a mech mod made by the gunsmith will have buttons that work flawlessly, batteries that never rattle, and it will work every time you press the button without fail.
It's not hard. It shouldn't take a long time. Making them by hand in a decent workshop, a single person could easily produce a hundred per day. At $200 per unit that's $20,000 per day income on a material investment of less than $50 and a time investment of only 8 hours. At that profit rate they could easily pay for their entire workshop in the first week and pocket more than $95,000 in pure profits per week after that.
You're paying premium prices for high school level design and machine work. One needs look no further than the common button problems, connector pin problems, voltage drop issues, and fitment issues to know that most producers of original mech mods are simply vapers who happened to have access to a machine shop and figured it was an easy way to make a fast buck. The quality of the vast majority of mechs would be considered rejects by industries that rely on precision design and machine work and yet sell their products for less.
A Nemesis has 17 parts 3 aren't metal, so that's 14 metal parts that need to be made. The 2 insulators are machined plastic, the 1 o-ring is likely purchased.
At 5 minutes a part for setup machining cleaning and fitting that's 70 minutes of work, I think thats a bit optimistic really. Let's call it an hour just for fun.
That's
8 a day at 5 minutes per part.
16 a day at 2.5 minutes per part.
32 a day at 1.25 minutes per part.
64 a day at .625 minutes per part.
I'm thinking an estimation of 100 per day is slightly off for a hand machined fairly simple mod like the Nemesis.
Maurice
If a mod was made in 15 min that's 4 per hour that's 32 per 8 hour shift that's no breaks and 160 per week selling at 200 per mod that comes to 32000 a week
And trust me I work on lathes every day lathes the size of bedrooms and horizontal lathes vertical lathes you name it I cut jet engine parts for a living ibwork at Pratt and Whitney can't take pics it's illegal but trust me they don't always work the way they are suppose to so you also got to count the mods that the lathe messed up on
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Now you get it.
This is how clones are made and RETAILED at $20.
Now.....You really don't think legit modders are slaving away on a 40 hour work week do ya?
Nope.
They don't have to at 200$ a pop.
They just release a few runs a year and make their money.
And clones are made with cheaper matterial and worked on at a cheaper pay grade. And the specs aren't as high and they aren't treated the same way as originals
If you know ANYONE who can do 15 a min work 8 hours and pop it 100 easy then they have learned to baffle scientists by bending time and space at their own free will
Most clones are 1:1.
The threads on my kings, chi you's and Nemmy clones will interchange with the originals.
Stock materials aren't expensive.
You have brass and copper pipes in your home.
Labor and quality control are the difference.
Chinese workers do not charge $100 an hour to run a lathe.
Nor should anyone, IMHO.
If you believe originals are worth ten times more than clones because of materials and craftsmanship you are in for a nasty reality check.
Well, in the US of A maybe. In other countries, like the Philippines (where a lot of mods come from), unfortunately no.
Here, a lot of people live off $2/day. How can you justify buying a $200 mod?
Just to prove a point, I have a computer and internet connection but will not spend $200 on a metal tube.
I'm fairly certain the clones are CNC produced. On machines that can easily turn out a part in 30 seconds.
No human is going to make even the locking ring on a Nemesis in 30 seconds. Can't be done, and that would be the 2nd most simple part on the device after the little switch pin. Even that part isn't a 30 second job.
Let's be a bit more realistic here, nobody is chunking out 100 mods a day. They just can't.
If a machinist can hand machine, clean, fit and assemble a Nemisis in 15 minutes, I'd have one made in all sterling silver and gladly pay his or her hourly rate. Where is this super machinist?
Maurice
No human is going to make even the locking ring on a Nemesis in 30 seconds. Can't be done, and that would be the 2nd most simple part on the device after the little switch pin. Even that part isn't a 30 second job.
Let's be a bit more realistic here, nobody is chunking out 100 mods a day. They just can't.
If a machinist can hand machine, clean, fit and assemble a Nemisis in 15 minutes, I'd have one made in all sterling silver and gladly pay his or her hourly rate. Where is this super machinist?
Maurice
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A hand crafted mod will be expensive, simply for the hours put into them. If you are into this, it can be worth the money. You just paying somebody's labor.
However this says nothing about the quality. I seen many handcrafted items including original mods that were of lesser quality than mass machined ones.
Machines, when properly setup and configured, work consistent and with an accuracy far surpassing any human could. They even do so at a fraction of the time.
Its all about the manufacturing process.
Clones are great and if you can afford an original, do sponsor the guys that came up with it. However don't pretend all originals to be way superior just because they are an original, cause they are not.
Based on my nemi experience... Got 3 of which one is from Greece and the other two China
However this says nothing about the quality. I seen many handcrafted items including original mods that were of lesser quality than mass machined ones.
Machines, when properly setup and configured, work consistent and with an accuracy far surpassing any human could. They even do so at a fraction of the time.
Its all about the manufacturing process.
Clones are great and if you can afford an original, do sponsor the guys that came up with it. However don't pretend all originals to be way superior just because they are an original, cause they are not.
Based on my nemi experience... Got 3 of which one is from Greece and the other two China
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4 minutes and 48 seconds per mod in an 8 hour day equals 100 mods completed. No breaks, no mistakes, that's 16.9 seconds per part on a Nemisis.
I might be wrong but that isn't humanly possible.
Maurice
I might be wrong but that isn't humanly possible.
Maurice
Like I said before I am a machinist whom works on lathes daily for 8 and sometimes 12 hours a day. For detailed stuff it's going to take quit some time. Like the connections to the batt those tiny ads things would time time the tube actually would take about 5 to 10 minutes everything else about 10 to 20 min you can't rush that stuff or you will mess up
I own a couple of Super T Precise+ mods and a couple of original DID's I've never owned a clone, that said the originals are bloody expensive (outside the usa especially) the first super T i got hold of was 140 GBP and the DID at the time was 77 euro, so about 340 USD throw in a 30 USD super t drip tip and you looking at about at about $400 bux including delivery. I own two of this setup now and thats really all i use, but it did cost almost 800 USD and it took me a couple of months to source.
I'm considering buying a Nemesis clone. The reason i'm thinking about a clone is I just can't get one, and even when i can I'm going to pay 200+ USD for it. I'd never buy a cloned device from mmvapors.com as Jim always has this stuff in stock and it's finished to a fantastic standard. If he can do it I can't see why Atmomixani can not.
Seems to me a lot of manufacturers keep the stock low to add exclusivity and push the price up this is fine, but for me personally i'll pay for quality not exclusivity. I don't care if a million people own the same mod as me. Same as queuing outside a club then paying 20 bux for a drink i don't mind paying for a quality liquor but i'm buggered if i'm going to que up to do it.
Also for me the two mods I own are more than enough. I'm buying a clone just for fun if it's crap i'll just bin it there only about $25 bux so... if I like it i'll try and grab an original if i'm ever allowed to buy one!
All the best
Dave
I'm considering buying a Nemesis clone. The reason i'm thinking about a clone is I just can't get one, and even when i can I'm going to pay 200+ USD for it. I'd never buy a cloned device from mmvapors.com as Jim always has this stuff in stock and it's finished to a fantastic standard. If he can do it I can't see why Atmomixani can not.
Seems to me a lot of manufacturers keep the stock low to add exclusivity and push the price up this is fine, but for me personally i'll pay for quality not exclusivity. I don't care if a million people own the same mod as me. Same as queuing outside a club then paying 20 bux for a drink i don't mind paying for a quality liquor but i'm buggered if i'm going to que up to do it.
Also for me the two mods I own are more than enough. I'm buying a clone just for fun if it's crap i'll just bin it there only about $25 bux so... if I like it i'll try and grab an original if i'm ever allowed to buy one!
All the best
Dave
I agree with a lot thats been said in here, and it made for some good reading. I feel conflicted when it comes to clones and authentics, with that said, yes I do own both. When I have a little extra cash part of me doesn't mind spending it on something nice for myself, but then the other half of me is saying im spending upwards of 200$+ for metal. Now I know I have no teaching in this subject and dont know what goes into the craft of making these high end devices, but at the end of the day if I can get a good vape on something that cost me 50 bucks as apposed to 200 bucks thats great to me. Like for instance I just bought the penny mod a couple weeks ago for 200$ I figured what the hell I wanted it, I havent bought anything recently so I went for it. Im all for supporting US made vape gear, but when I got it in the mail 3 days later I was completely disappointed with this thing. The threads on the top cap were horrid and just plain missing in some spots, none of my rda's sat flush on it cause of a problem he's having with the pins. Ok no problem, but then I start seeing all these other problems others are having like me on his facebook and instagram and hes telling people "oh its copper and its soft just force the top cap on and sand that pin down, it hits harder that way". No?? Im sorry I shouldnt have to modify my 200$ mod just for it to do what it was supposed to do from when I got it. Long story short you never know what your gonna get, whether its 250$ or 50$, whether its made right here in the US or from China, you just never know sometimes.
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Before you armchair experts stroke your egos any more,
Please follow this link and scroll down to : "supply ability"
http://m.alibaba.com/product/1618267872/China_2014_Latest_Full_mechanical_mod/specifications.html
Kamry E cig can supply/manufacture 5000 hammer mods per week.
That's just hammer clones. They make a ton of products.
Impossible for you, not for a professional.
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