Cold maceration of tobacco

[Chinook]

johni, are you following this thread?

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-extract-full-strong-buzz-moderate-flavor.htm

If you do, what do you think? It sounds like they're making weaker NET extracts than we'd like (but obviously with more alkaloids than our regular NETs). But I'm not 100% sure... It's not that complex to try. It sounds like it might be easier on the coils though.

 

[johni]

johni, are you following this thread?

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-extract-full-strong-buzz-moderate-flavor.htm

If you do, what do you think? It sounds like they're making weaker NET extracts than we'd like (but obviously with more alkaloids than our regular NETs). But I'm not 100% sure... It's not that complex to try. It sounds like it might be easier on the coils though.

They're trying to make WTA and the resulting extract would not be very flavorful if not downright nasty. I'd say stay away from this unless you are not getting satisfaction from nicotine juice.

 

[Chinook]

They're trying to make WTA and the resulting extract would not be very flavorful if not downright nasty. I'd say stay away from this unless you are not getting satisfaction from nicotine juice.

Thanks! I'm satisfied with the nicotine juices, I'm looking forward to vaping my first cold extract later this week

 

[johni]

Thanks! I'm satisfied with the nicotine juices, I'm looking forward to vaping my first cold extract later this week

Cool! Hope you dig it as much as I'm digging mine.

 

[Lastlokean]

They're trying to make WTA and the resulting extract would not be very flavorful if not downright nasty. I'd say stay away from this unless you are not getting satisfaction from nicotine juice.

First of all this thread is in the 'Liquid extraction from tobacco sub forum'. If you are getting satisfaction from regular ejuice, and consider tobacco extracts 'nasty', what are you doing here? I'm not certain how that conclusion was drawn from my thread on ethanol based tobacco concentrates.

The composition of the concentrate is currently unknown. There is wild speculation regarding what it is/isn't at this point and I such behavior distasteful. I can for certain at this point summarize my experiences with vaping such concentrates, which I have. The flavor is far from downright nasty, if anything it is moderate (7/10), but clearly existing.

In comparison to a straight room temperature PG soak, there is no reason to believe the result will have any more or less alkaloids or flavor(terpenes) depending on the dilution one chooses of the resulting concentrate. At least with the ethanol concentration you have some approximate idea the resulting potential strength.

There seems to be some vaguely defined terms such as NET and WTA floating around, whether this meets the qualifications to be considered either of these I don't know at this point. All that is occurring in that thread is soaking tobacco in alcohol, then evaporating the alcohol to 'concentrate' a so called 'naturally extracted tobacco'. The theory: By using freezing cold ethanol it is possible to minimize plant oil/chlorophyll contamination while extracting tobacco alkaloids.

At what point in purity by removing impurities does a NET become a WTA? At what point of purification / manipulation has a WTA become standard lab-grade freebased nicotine? How stable are the various minor alkaloids found within tobacco? All of this seems quite unknown.

In comparison the classical NET warm/room temperature PG tobacco soak is a soup of alkaloids, flavoring, chlorophyll and various plant oils of unknown strength. Why not try to remove the plant oils and chlorophyll and standardize the extract to a quantifiable strength through basic procedure? (mg extract / ml ejuice).

 

[johni]

I'm not about to argue what qualifies as a NET and what doesn't. I enjoy flavorful NETs from a variety of vendors that use a variety of extraction methods to to extract primarily flavor from tobacco. I find the juices to be quite satisfying and understand that trace amounts of nicotine and other alkaloids as well as some gunk are extracted along with flavor. I can live with that to enjoy real tobacco flavor.

I have been smoke free for over a year now and credit NET juices as a big part of that success. I seek to emulate those products with my own extraction efforts to add variety to my vaping while saving a few bucks. I'm quite happy that I have been able to make some flavor rich extracts with minimal investment in equipment and time.

Increasing the alkaloid levels in my extracts is of no interest to me. In fact, I'd rather not add anything to my juice that I don't need to remain smoke free and happy! That's me but if you need higher alkaloid levels in your vape, knock yourself out but until you make something that elicits responses along the line of "damn, that's good", you can keep it!

 

[harvinstl]

johni, where are you buying your loose tobacoo from here in town?

 

[johni]

johni, where are you buying your loose tobacoo from here in town?

Hi Harv. I've been buying tobacco online at PipesAndCigars.com - Pipe Tobacco, New Pipes, Estate Pipes, Cigars - PipesandCigars.com, and Pipes, Pipe Tobacco, Premium Cigars and Accessories at Milan Tobacconists Cigar and Pipe Shop in Roanoke, Virginia. Bulk, 1 ounce packaging works nicely.

 

[Lastlokean]

That's me but if you need higher alkaloid levels in your vape, knock yourself out but until you make something that elicits responses along the line of "damn, that's good", you can keep it!

Having something accurately measured does not make it 'stronger'. It becomes quantifiable and known. In such a manner you could ensure your NET is not stronger than xxx mg/ml.

IT is hard to get a response such as "damn, that's good" when I have people like you discouraging replication of my experiment based on the completely unfounded claim of being nasty. If anything the ethanol NET has less dangerous compounds than the classic NET.

 

[johni]

Having something accurately measured does not make it 'stronger'. It becomes quantifiable and known. In such a manner you could ensure your NET is not stronger than xxx mg/ml.

IT is hard to get a response such as "damn, that's good" when I have people like you discouraging replication of my experiment based on the completely unfounded claim of being nasty. If anything the ethanol NET has less dangerous compounds than the classic NET.

We're obviously after different things here. The only quantification I'm after is great flavor and decent performance. I'm sure some people will jump right on your ethanol extraction method and hope that makes you happy. Prove to me that the flavor is as good as that from a simple PG soak and that I can do it without bringing along alkaloids that I don't need or want and I might try it. I'll follow your thread for any further developments. Bye.

 

[johni]

Pulled small samples of my three working pipe tobacco extractions (10 days in) and mixed up. Flavor has developed nicely but nuances should continue to develop so I'll give them another couple of weeks. I'm happy enough with my results that I haven't made a juice purchase in over four months!

ETA: Extracts filtered by the method I detailed in Post 1 are relatively clean. My juice seems to gunk coils no faster than most of the vendor NETs I enjoy utilizing RDAs, both top and bottom fed.

 

[johni]

I've completed six extractions since my last post in this thread. All have excellent flavor and good performance so I'm a happy camper!

 

[FaceHole]

I've completed six extractions since my last post in this thread. All have excellent flavor and good performance so I'm a happy camper!

What would you say has been the ideal amount of time to soak before filtering the extraction?

 

[johni]

I'm getting plenty of flavor at 28 days. I pulled small samples of the last batches at around 18 days and it was good, just not quite full strength. Some are going as long as 60 days but I'm happy with 28.

 

[FaceHole]

I'm getting plenty of flavor at 28 days. I pulled small samples of the last batches at around 18 days and it was good, just not quite full strength. Some are going as long as 60 days but I'm happy with 28.

Thanks for the tip. I'm coming up on 30 days soon, i'm glad I can get around to moving forward with the stuff

 

[johni]

Thanks for the tip. I'm coming up on 30 days soon, i'm glad I can get around to moving forward with the stuff

Good luck, hope it works for you. My biggest challenges have been tobacco selection and filtration. Once I got the filtration down, I just shop for blends that sound good and wait for them to soak.

 

[PaulBHC]

Going to give this a try. I bought some NET.com and like it but would like to try my own mix. I ordered supplies from WL for regular DIY and a nic test kit. I have a one cup filter cone for Melitta style filters that I got around ?? years ago with a Starbucks sample pack (before they were on every corner and you had to mail order).

Any suggestions for a RYO tobacco for a former cig smoker just starting out?

 

[johni]

Hi Paul. I have not extracted any cigarette tobacco but others seem happy with American Spirit, Nat Sherman, and other all natural RYO tobaccos. Pipes and cigars dot com carries Daughters and Ryan RYO tobaccos which look interesting.

 

[PaulBHC]

Thanks. We have a few smoke shops in the area but seem to cater to another crowd. There is one in a town I go to tomorrow that might have a high end selection. Perhaps I will have some time.

 

[johni]

I checked out a local smoke shop in a mall recently and found a wonderful selection of cigars that I had no idea they had. Will be extracting a couple soon. Good luck.