Do you like money? Why everyone *should* DIY.

[Walrus]

My husband picked up a few of the LorAnn's tonight for me at Walmart - (grape, pina colada, and rootbeer).

Before I open the packaging, can anyone tell me if the ingredients are okay or safe in your mind (have you used them or would you)?

1) rootbeer - art.flavor, water, caramel color, PG, polysorbate 80, potassium sorbate

2) grape - art. flavor, PG, water, red 40, blue 1

3) pina colada - water, PG, art. flavor, alcohol


I think that the pina colada would be my favorite of the three but I don't know anything about the alcohol (I love my beer, however I'm sure that the 'alcohol' in this isn't the same ) Is it something to avoid when buying the flavors?

Thanks again everyone!

I've got a post around here someplace, but the Polysorbate 80 and Potassium Sorbate are fine. Actually used in nasal inhalers. The colors haven't stopped or hurt me yet, either.

 

[4myhealth]

Thank you Walrus - oh, please, can you please tell me how to mix this stuff - I have the LorAnn's flavors as mentioned above, Wilton's Glycerin, and Distilled Water. So, what would be the appropriate % for each? I am on the zero nic plan....

I would appreciate your help if you have some time.

 

[rsngfrce]

I've got a post around here someplace, but the Polysorbate 80 and Potassium Sorbate are fine. Actually used in nasal inhalers. The colors haven't stopped or hurt me yet, either.

Just want to mention, not for Walrus, but for 4myhealth, the general consensus seems to be to avoid coloring, which rules out the grape and root beer

 

[Walrus]

Thank you Walrus - oh, please, can you please tell me how to mix this stuff - I have the LorAnn's flavors as mentioned above, Wilton's Glycerin, and Distilled Water. So, what would be the appropriate % for each? I am on the zero nic plan....

I would appreciate your help if you have some time.

If you are set on 0 nic, look at the first post in this thread. I'd get a hold of some PG, unless you are allergic. VG by itself is too thick, and I'd avoid using the water as it makes the atomizer run cooler & harder. If you must use VG only, I haven't worked out those percentages yet, but I'd assume very little water... just enough to thin. For PG/flavor only, I'd go 80%/20%. For PG/VG/flavor, I'd use 40/40/20, adjusting the flavor level to suit your taste.

 

[Walrus]

Just want to mention, not for Walrus, but for 4myhealth, the general consensus seems to be to avoid coloring, which rules out the grape and root beer

Ah, but the consensus is based on speculation, not evidence. Kate made assumptions, and everyone else went along. I've not seen anything anecdotal to sway me one way or the other.

 

[4myhealth]

Well, the glycerin (VG?) was easy to come by but the bottle of PG, I'm stumped. I've called just about every pharmacy and the consensus is that they will not sell, cannot sell, cannot order, etc....

I don't think I am allergic to the PG, as I have the Wilton's butter flavoring which says it contains PG but have used it only in very short bursts...

So, I should possibly look at returning the grape and rootbeer, BUT the one I was most concerned about was the pina colada due to the alcohol - is that not an issue?

I appreciate the knowledge and advice that all of you share

 

[Walrus]

Well, the glycerin (VG?) was easy to come by but the bottle of PG, I'm stumped. I've called just about every pharmacy and the consensus is that they will not sell, cannot sell, cannot order, etc....

I don't think I am allergic to the PG, as I have the Wilton's butter flavoring which says it contains PG but have used it only in very short bursts...

So, I should possibly look at returning the grape and rootbeer, BUT the one I was most concerned about was the pina colada due to the alcohol - is that not an issue?

I appreciate the knowledge and advice that all of you share

PG is really cheap, cheaper than Glycerine. You can order it online, and I had it at my doorstep in 3 days. Here's that link:

Generic - Propylene Glycol #338-230-Z

It's $6.49 for a 16oz bottle, and $22.99 for a gallon.

The alcohol in there is not an issue. You'd actually end up with very little in your mix. As far as the colorings go... it depends on what risk you are willing to take. As I've mentioned, there has been no anecdotal evidence that it is harmful, or not. One poster made assumptions, and everyone else followed. Considering all the crap that is in regular cigarettes, it was a risk I'm willing to take until I see something that convinces me otherwise.

 

[Tasdad]

From This Thread, August-08:

Food coloring is propylene glycol and dye. That's it. I've smoked it before, both the red and green. I had hoped I could snort red "smoke" from each nostril, and freak out my environmental friends by puffing green smoke at them. Didn't work out for coloring the vapor ... but it colored everything else inside the cig and cartridge. Took me a long time to clean it all out. I won't do that again.

Plus, if my doctor ran a fiber optic into my lungs, I'm not sure what he'd make of the red/green color he'd find. I'd probably have a disease named after me!

I think this is what started all of this.

Not sure how much coloring it takes to cause problems. Just don't try PURE coloring!!!

 

[WillPower]

Could anyone of you gentlemen and ladies tell me the taste and throat hit difference between: 1) 36mg "Marlboro" liquid diluted to 18mg with PG; and 2) 18mg off-the-shelf the same flavor liquid? Or maybe even 18mg unflavored liquid?

Being new to vaping, I am not sure what taste and throat hit comes from flavor or the nicotine itself. It was a kind of a moot point in analogs (except for menthol) and not planning to go back. I guess with DIY, diluting/"cutting," now, this is a matter of choice.

Thank you.

 

[Walrus]

From This Thread, August-08:


I think this is what started all of this.

Not sure how much coloring it takes to cause problems. Just don't try PURE coloring!!!

If you are talking about food colorings that you buy in the grocery (or for easter eggs) I wouldn't touch the stuff. The colorings in Lorann's have not colored my tongue, stained my teeth or fingers, left visible traces (notice I said visible) in my atomizer, or anything else that would cause me concern. Of course, I haven't seen my lungs yet. So there is that possibility.

 

[Walrus]

Could anyone of you gentlemen and ladies tell me the taste and throat hit difference between: 1) 36mg "Marlboro" liquid diluted to 18mg with PG; and 2) 18mg off-the-shelf the same flavor liquid? Or maybe even 18mg unflavored liquid?

Being new to vaping, I am not sure what taste and throat hit comes from flavor or the nicotine itself. It was a kind of a moot point in analogs (except for menthol) and not planning to go back. I guess with DIY, diluting/"cutting," now, this is a matter of choice.

Thank you.

I haven't tried the same flavored juices in different strengths, so I'm only hypothesizing. I would think that any strength in purchased form should taste the same. A bottle of TW 36mg Menthol should taste the same as their 24mg or even their 0mg. That's kinda the point of buying it.

I can tell you with certainty that cutting 36 down will not taste the same as a pure 18mg. You are cutting the flavor as well. I know that the unflavored actually does have a flavor... but that's not why I bought it so I'm not worried about losing it's taste when I cut it.

I don't think anyone short of a manufacturer (or chemist) can tell you precisely where the throat hit comes from. I'm planning on doing some experimentation in the field later this week.

 

[WillPower]

I haven't tried the same flavored juices in different strengths, so I'm only hypothesizing. I would think that any strength in purchased form should taste the same. A bottle of TW 36mg Menthol should taste the same as their 24mg or even their 0mg. That's kinda the point of buying it.

I can tell you with certainty that cutting 36 down will not taste the same as a pure 18mg. You are cutting the flavor as well. I know that the unflavored actually does have a flavor... but that's not why I bought it so I'm not worried about losing it's taste when I cut it.

I don't think anyone short of a manufacturer (or chemist) can tell you precisely where the throat hit comes from. I'm planning on doing some experimentation in the field later this week.

Thank you, Walrus. Look forward to seeing your lab results.

This is the way I see this issue. Realistically, we can get 90 cents/ml for e-liquid, maybe little more or little less depending on where you get it. PG is about 2 cents/ml at most.

average 2ml/day x 365 days/yr x 90 cents/ml = $657/yr

Even if you cut this to only 60 cents/ml (not (90+2) / 2 = 46 cents), including the flavor, the cost drops down to $438, $219 less per annum. Granted not a lot, considering the time and efforts, but not small, considering the economy. Of course both beats analogs by well over $1000 per year!

On the flip side, I think the problem is that the competition among US e-cig suppliers are too intense. The profit margins are getting little too slim for import retailers. In particular, somehow, as a community, we need to fund our defense against legal and regulatory challenges (which usually done by suppliers in other industries). I think, in the long run, we would definitely need more than just signing petitions. We would need a lobbying and self-regulatory org for us.

It is a dilemma, isn't it? Perhaps, we should pass around a hat for donation or all of us end up making "moonshine" e-liquid by squeezing tabacco leaves. But not sure paying more for e-liquid would address this problem (indeed, I am sure it wont, knowing how the market economy works).

My 2 cents or 1ml of PG

 

[mamu]

If I want cherry or chocolate e-liquid, I could simply buy the cherry or chocolate flavorings and add to it.

So I'm curious - what flavoring would you add to e-liquid if you want a Marlboro or Camel taste or even a regular tobacco taste?

Thanks

 

[AnimeFur]

Posts like this are why the FDA crackdown on
the unit itself bother me so much.Someone tell Radio Shack
the fortune they could make buying batts and atomizers please.

 

[funkyZero]

"My supplies sit in a nice cool, dark cabinet waiting for me to use them"

Hey W, just curious. I've been trying to stock a few bottles of 36 for buffer whilst I hunt for new supply. I try to keep 2 months worth. However, with the pending uncertainty I was thinking about mass quantity purchases to hold me over for "years" if possible.
I've read quite a few threads about this and since this is a cost saving thread.....
Does anyone know technically of the 2 year shelf life that is commonly repeated have any weight behind it? Will this stuff actually last longer and retain its nicotine value?
Also, against the wishes of my strongly opinionative wife, I keep my juice in a lock box in the fridge... around 38deg F. Is the fridge better than a dark shelf at room temp? I'm trying to figure out what storage method actually makes more sense for long term scenarios. I want to shelve enough of this stuff to last me in the case it gets banned.
I know I go over the edge a bit. Before the US tax increase on April 1, I stockpiled a small truckload of loose tobacco. Maybe I just need counseling instead? heh

 

[virraszto]

LOL-FunkyZero, I did too! Bought 20 lbs of loose tobacco, and still have 17 lbs when I discovered vaping.

I want to stock up too, but I'm not sure what strength I should buy. I've already made the mistake and ordered 36 mg menthol, and I am a menthol light smoker. The 36 just about killed me, so I would like to cut it down to about 11 or less. If I buy VG and the 36 mg menthol, I'd like to cut it down.

Now, about stocking up--I wonder if I should buy the 36mg unflavored and mix it with VG and flavoring? Or should I buy the flavored liquids I want in a 36mg mg and mix it with the VG to make it weaker.

I'd love it to be cost effective, but still be able to smoke it.

 

[mamu]

I went the route of trying to be cost effective and still vape a flavor close to my menthol light cigarettes. I did the 36 mg unflavored and added PG/VG/menthol crystals to get an 18 mg nicotine level. Didn't give me that menthol taste I wanted - it was a menthol alright, but not quite right and somewhere I lost the throat hit.

So I tried 18 mg menthol from a lot of vendors. The cheapest was $9.50 for 30 ml from ruyandirect and the most expensive was $30 for 30 ml from totally wicked. Even though it's more expensive, I keep going back to the totally wicked because of the great taste of their menthol. I've mixed a little hilton flavor in it and now I have that perfect taste I've been looking for. woo-hoo!

So for about $60 a month in juice, I'm still saving tons over what I spent with analog cigs.

 

[Elle]

cute cat mamu!!

and with all the good stuff i keep hearing about TW menthol i might just have to break down and get some... that price just kills me though!!

 

[Walrus]

"My supplies sit in a nice cool, dark cabinet waiting for me to use them"

Hey W, just curious. I've been trying to stock a few bottles of 36 for buffer whilst I hunt for new supply. I try to keep 2 months worth. However, with the pending uncertainty I was thinking about mass quantity purchases to hold me over for "years" if possible.
I've read quite a few threads about this and since this is a cost saving thread.....
Does anyone know technically of the 2 year shelf life that is commonly repeated have any weight behind it? Will this stuff actually last longer and retain its nicotine value?
Also, against the wishes of my strongly opinionative wife, I keep my juice in a lock box in the fridge... around 38deg F. Is the fridge better than a dark shelf at room temp? I'm trying to figure out what storage method actually makes more sense for long term scenarios. I want to shelve enough of this stuff to last me in the case it gets banned.
I know I go over the edge a bit. Before the US tax increase on April 1, I stockpiled a small truckload of loose tobacco. Maybe I just need counseling instead? heh

Well... the liter bottle I bought direct from a manufacturer has this printed on the label: "PRD 04/14/2009 EXP 04/13/2011"

So... they are saying 1 year, 364 days.

It may be like milk and food... it may last past the exp date, but not retain it's freshness.

 

[mamu]

Well the one thing I can say about having to store liquids is that it makes sense that the liquids stored in dark amber glass bottles would keep their strengths and flavors longer than the ones stored in plastic bottles.