Ecig from Big Tobacco

[schaedj]

Naw, mass market won't drive the price down. Look at the pricing on gum, patches, etc. They're insanely priced by fiat, not by necessity.

Gum and patches are priced that way because of the FDA and regulation associated with them. They are still controlled by the Pharma industry. The key is to look at the price of cigs outside the US. Mass production has the pack price at somewhere around $1.10 a pack. (Marlboro) You can buy in-country cigs for .60. Same deal is true for loose tobacco, even in the US.

If the big boys drive the market to produce a low cost heating element (the weakest link in the vaping chain) and they start to source nic liq production in high volume, the key elements of te e-cig will get cheaper. If they are "legalized" based on medical studies and come to market under the Big T auspices, experienced vapers should be able to find channels to access the key supplies at a greatly discounted rate (leaving us lots of free cash to buy the latest HV mods and flavorings)

 

[da dude's girl]

Gum and patches are priced that way because of the FDA and regulation associated with them. They are still controlled by the Pharma industry. The key is to look at the price of cigs outside the US. Mass production has the pack price at somewhere around $1.10 a pack. (Marlboro) You can buy in-country cigs for .60. Same deal is true for loose tobacco, even in the US.

If the big boys drive the market to produce a low cost heating element (the weakest link in the vaping chain) and they start to source nic liq production in high volume, the key elements of te e-cig will get cheaper. If they are "legalized" based on medical studies and come to market under the Big T auspices, experienced vapers should be able to find channels to access the key supplies at a greatly discounted rate (leaving us lots of free cash to buy the latest HV mods and flavorings)

I like your optimism! Let's keep our fingers crossed...I want to be a V4L customer for many years to come!

 

[Belletrist]

i get what you're saying, steph (btw, gum/patches are over the counter, here at least), but this isn't going to be real competition in terms of driving down prices. i have no doubt that once devices like the one darr described hit the market, we won't be buying refill liquid at all--because the legislation that follows will dictate "child safety measures" like an un-refillable device. they'll be unrefillable and not rechargeable for, yanno. the children *sigh*. so unless you end up happy with the BT version of an e-cig, it's essentially the same thing as a ban.

 

[5cardstud]

Maybe thats their version. Instead of vapor you get juice. They could market it as a stop smoking device cause 1 taste would make you want to stop if thats the only alternative.

 

[AJMoore]

Belletrist - good points.

I've heard all over this forum that BT was behind the scenes in trying to ban e cigs. This flies in the face of that.

How many tobacco leaves does it take to manufacture a ml of nic juice? This is not a joke question, I really wonder if anyone knows. Maybe Leaford in China??

The reason I ask is because we still need tobacco leaves to produce nic so the farmers won't be out of biz, right??

 

[maxx]

Maybe I am jaded....and cynical, but everything we are seeing has been planned out long before most of us ever heard of e-cigs, let alone buy one. IMO, it's all one big orchestration, even down to the state level. BT and BP likely had gameplans to deal with imported e-cigs ten years ago if not longer. Next step in tobacco evolution. Industries that big and powerful don't get blind-sided by anyone or anything.

How is this scenario....too paranoid?

BT and BP knew e-cigs are coming a long time ago. They bide their time until enough people are using the devices. Then they turn lose their FDA and politician lackeys to knock out all the "little guys" bringing in those imports, and introduce their own devices. Suddenly the FDA feels they are not medical devices afterall, but are...in fact...tobacco products. Done deal, sell em' and tax em' high....

 

[AJMoore]

Wow Maxx, cynical, yes...possible, that too.

 

[maxx]

I'm only paranoid because eveyone is against me....

 

[AJMoore]

I think you're on to a screen play. Big Gov, Big Tobacco, Big Pharm, unsuspecting public.

 

[keyzygirl]

Someone should do an ecig documentary about getting healthier like the one about eating Mcdonalds for a year.And I agree about eliquid being gone,non refilable ecigs that can control dosage will be it.Someone better tell those anti cartomizer people to pipe down or we could end up with nothing.

 

[bobtow]

Just to clarify... The company that I received this from doesn't SELL ecigs... yet! They are just sending out samples for us retailers to try so that when they can sell them, they'll already have a foot in the door.

Also to clarify... None of the 3 samples I opened worked at all. When I got a mouthful of liquid, it was not vaporized at all. My guess is that all 3 batteries were dead right out of the package, with no way to charge them.

Were there any instructions with the ecig? I bought a couple of throw aways,that had a switch in the light area. You had to turn it counter clockwise to turn it on. I can't see them selling one without a switch to conserve the battery.

 

[deadman31299]

Maybe I am jaded....and cynical, but everything we are seeing has been planned out long before most of us ever heard of e-cigs, let alone buy one. IMO, it's all one big orchestration, even down to the state level. BT and BP likely had gameplans to deal with imported e-cigs ten years ago if not longer. Next step in tobacco evolution. Industries that big and powerful don't get blind-sided by anyone or anything.

How is this scenario....too paranoid?

BT and BP knew e-cigs are coming a long time ago. They bide their time until enough people are using the devices. Then they turn lose their FDA and politician lackeys to knock out all the "little guys" bringing in those imports, and introduce their own devices. Suddenly the FDA feels they are not medical devices afterall, but are...in fact...tobacco products. Done deal, sell em' and tax em' high....

I stand behind you 179% my friend. You are NOT paranoid, you are NOT cynical. I believe you are simply a ultra conscious human being. That comes at it's cost though, lack of happiness, and no sense of real freedom, worry, anxiety. At least that's how i feel. Tobacco industries see themselves losing cash to small companies, and people trying to provide us an alternative to smoking, which kills. They cannot have that. They need our money. Tobacco kills people, it's no secret, yet it is legal. Booze too, that's a whole different boat though.

What we as a U.S. population know of our government, and it's plans for most anything, including us is very little. A lot of things don't make sense! Like REX84 camps. Supposedly in place for our safety upon attacks from "terrorism", and natural disasters. A lot of these camps have been around for 20+ years. But was one employed during the horrid aftermath of Hurricane Katrina? No. Really? Why? That's what they are there for isn't it?

AJMoore said "I think you're on to a screen play. Big Gov, Big Tobacco, Big Pharm, unsuspecting public." Not far from the truth at all! But what a sad movie. I suggest it is our best interest as living humans that we stay unsuspecting, passive!

I dearly apologize for this post. I don't want you guys to get the wrong impression of me, and i don't want to start some huge anti-government thread war. I am not a conspiracy theorist, simply a person with a mind. I am awake and aware. I wish i wasn't sometimes!!

I simply think we should enjoy the things in life that we have, while we have the chance. The past 70 years should be some kind of inclination, some kind of clue, that anything can, and WILL happen. It's just a matter of when.

 

[AJMoore]

So did man land on the moon or not?

 

[deadman31299]

O. M. G.!(yeah i said it) AJ. I would love to discuss that with you! I love to hear what people think on that one as well. There is a definite answer for that one too. You are really pulling on my heart strings here man! Lol.

 

[Adrenalynn]

>> a low cost heating element

The heating element in there currently is a couple tenths of a cent in volume to produce. It's nothing but a short wound piece of wire ultimately. In fact, of all the fiddly-bits - it's by far the cheapest fiddly-bit. The threaded insert in a cartomizer is a bunch more expensive and a bunch tougher to produce.

 

[AJMoore]

Deadman - all in fun. It's like someone once said, "Do you believe in flying saucers?", well it's not that I do or don't however, I believe in the possibility.

 

[sleepy jean]

Dar, did they want you to do a review on this thing or what, it sounds horrible, after 40 years of controlling my life, I will never go back to the Big T's, and they won't get any more of my money, I' find an e-cig supplier somehow.

 

[Darrigaaz]

Were there any instructions with the ecig? I bought a couple of throw aways,that had a switch in the light area. You had to turn it counter clockwise to turn it on. I can't see them selling one without a switch to conserve the battery.

No instructions.. and I removed the plastic (vinyl) wrap around the ecig... it was a smooth tube with no way to turn, flip, switch anything.

Sleepy Jean - Nobody asked for a review... It was just a couple samples brought in by our BT rep so a co-worker and I tried them out (we both vape and our equipment is all V4L stuff). BT rep just wanted us to try a few so that we can make decisions about selling them in our 300+ stores.

 

[maxx]

Well, I don't know what your stores are, Darrigaaz....but unless you are a pharmacy, I would say that is proof that the FDA's 'Medical drug delivery' nonsense is really just a smoke screen as I supsect. BT wouldn't be getting ready to market e-cigs unless they know the things are headed for tobacco status...

 

[schaedj]

>> a low cost heating element

The heating element in there currently is a couple tenths of a cent in volume to produce. It's nothing but a short wound piece of wire ultimately. In fact, of all the fiddly-bits - it's by far the cheapest fiddly-bit. The threaded insert in a cartomizer is a bunch more expensive and a bunch tougher to produce.

Don't have ANY experience with cartomizers. All I know is that there's a hundred people making battery mods using NO OEM components (except the atty threads, if they don't cut their own), we have dozens of alternatives for the carts, including some homegrown from scratch, but all I see on the Attys is how to remanufacture the original. Either the original design was perfect (riiiight), or creating these from scratch is a major challenge. I know it's only 5 cents worth of nichrome, but I'm not going to wrap, splice, solder and machine threads (or some alternative connector) to save the 5-10 bucks they cost. If I could buy (or strip from a disposable) a mass produced heating element with a longer life or better resistance profile, it might be worth it to give it a shot. There's some really cool silicon, printed circuit and ceramic micro heaters out there now, but no one is targeting the e-cig form factor. If they were, and volume brought the price down, you might see a whole new realm of mods (total departures from the old tube and tip. How about a harmonica mod!)