Evolv-ing Thread

[awsum140]

The blanket statements are so irritating. "Nicotine is addictive" for example. Nicotine, by itself, has been studied in humans many times and if it were addictive it wouldn't be studied in humans just because of medical ethics. Nicotine combined with the enhancers in cigarettes is certainly addictive. In terms of health hazards, from all the studies and info I have seen, it is about the same as caffeine. What's next, ban coffee, tea and colas?

vaping, undoubtedly, has its' own hazards, but it is hard to imagine that those hazards are anything close to the hazards a tobacco cigarette poses. The diiaceytl thing is another one, one person who inhaled immense amounts of it got cancer therefor diacetyl is cancer causing. Most anything, at those kinds of concentrations, are very hazardous. Of course, no one mentions the level of diacetyl in an e-cig is about 1% of the level in a tobacco cigarette. That doesn't make good scare headlines.

 

[Tpat591]

The blanket statements are so irritating. "Nicotine is addictive" for example. Nicotine, by itself, has been studied in humans many times and if it were addictive it wouldn't be studied in humans just because of medical ethics. Nicotine combined with the enhancers in cigarettes is certainly addictive. In terms of health hazards, from all the studies and info I have seen, it is about the same as caffeine. What's next, ban coffee, tea and colas?

Vaping, undoubtedly, has its' own hazards, but it is hard to imagine that those hazards are anything close to the hazards a tobacco cigarette poses. The diiaceytl thing is another one, one person who inhaled immense amounts of it got cancer therefor diacetyl is cancer causing. Most anything, at those kinds of concentrations, are very hazardous. Of course, no one mentions the level of diacetyl in an e-cig is about 1% of the level in a tobacco cigarette. That doesn't make good scare headlines.

The diacetyl thing is called popcorn lung because people who popped popcorn for years in production developed it and it is the most reliable example of what can happen when you inhale it. It is a legitimate risk.

We had 2 poppers in operation 18hrs a day for 3mo at MSG during RBBB Circus and that blue smoke is utterly horrendous to breath in for an extended period when that production is going on, believe me. It is essentially vegetable oil & butter flavoring which is essentially what they are vaping so the risk is legit in UNREGULATED devices & excessive use of those flavors.

The high limits in those poppers were 375f operating & 425f fusible link safety.

 

[cigatron]

Never found a device that compares to a DNA, but of all the products I've tried the FSK is damn good & will vape just like a DNA when properly set up

Do the FSK mods have dc-dc converters for TC? If not, I don't see how it can compare to a DNA in TC; even if it regulates temp accurately. DC in TC is where it's at for me. No offense intended Tpat. I haven't tried an FSK product but if it's PWM in TC like most every other TC mod I've tried, I can tell the difference in flavor.

 

[cigatron]

The diacetyl thing is called popcorn lung because people who popped popcorn for years in production developed it and it is the most reliable example of what can happen when you inhale it. It is a legitimate risk.

Really? I heard it was people who worked in a diacetyl manufacturing plant ie breathing the vapors coming directly from the heating vats. Now I don't know what to believe.

 

[mikepetro]

The diacetyl thing is called popcorn lung because people who popped popcorn for years in production developed it and it is the most reliable example of what can happen when you inhale it. It is a legitimate risk.

We had 2 poppers in operation 18hrs a day for 3mo at MSG during RBBB Circus and that blue smoke is utterly horrendous to breath in for an extended period when that production is going on, believe me. It is essentially vegetable oil & butter flavoring which is essentially what they are vaping so the risk is legit in UNREGULATED devices & excessive use of those flavors.

The high limits in those poppers were 375f operating & 425f fusible link safety.

From I read (no citations as I dont remember them), it all gets down to concentration and length of exposure, and most ejuice pales in comparisons to what the popcorn employees were exposed too.

 

[mikepetro]

Really? I heard it was people who worked in a diacetyl manufacturing plant ie breathing the vapors coming directly from the heating vats. Now I don't know what to believe.

The "popcorn lung" reference is accurate.

 

[Steamer861]

Well the first anti-lock brakes were terrible, they would pulse the brake pedal so bad it would scare the hell out of people. The first year Audi came out with them three of us mechanics took one out on a snowy day for a test drive, each one of us took a turn and none of us was impressed. Pulling the fuses was true, we had customer's come in demanding we disable the system, we couldn't do it due to liability but we did show them where the fuse was located.

All True! But in theory they were Great. The very first devices weren't the greatest either.
But there constantly getting better just like the breaks did
I was just drawing a comparison to prove my point.

It's frustrating when you know the truth, But others wont listen.
Eventually they will all know,vaping saves lives!

 

[Tpat591]

Really? I heard it was people who worked in a diacetyl manufacturing plant ie breathing the vapors coming directly from the heating vats. Now I don't know what to believe.

Probably both. I remember some of the case studies were centered around popcorn production because I ran those poppers when we were short handed so I have had a lot of exposure to the conditions. That's why I remember it.

 

[Tpat591]

Do the FSK mods have dc-dc converters for TC? If not, I don't see how it can compare to a DNA in TC; even if it regulates temp accurately. DC in TC is where it's at for me. No offense intended Tpat. I haven't tried an FSK product but if it's PWM in TC like most every other TC mod I've tried, I can tell the difference in flavor.

Its a smooth signal, not PWM. I could probably dig up a picture of the board somewhere if I search the threads to find that supplier who sells the boards separately.

I'm getting old and my memory is shot.

 

[Flavored]

The Rest of the Story: Tobacco News Analysis and Commentary: New Study Finds that Average Diacetyl Exposure from Vaping is 750 Times Lower than from Smoking

I don't think popcorn lung is what they put on the side of a pack of cigs . . .

 

[awsum140]

The Rest of the Story: Tobacco News Analysis and Commentary: New Study Finds that Average Diacetyl Exposure from Vaping is 750 Times Lower than from Smoking

I don't think popcorn lung is what they put on the side of a pack of cigs . . .

My point, exactly. The cases always cited are extreme exposure cases, or at least very high exposure for extended time periods. Whether it was exposure during production or exposure during popping the exposure was rather high. Both the time and the concentration is so high compared to vaping, even in an overheated dry hit, that it is probably, and I stress probably, inconsequential.

Just my opinion, worth what you're paying for it. I am not a doctor, do not play one on TV and didn't stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

 

[mikepetro]

The truth will eventually be known, and I for one anxiously await knowing what it is.

Alas, in the meantime vaping is getting more and more villanlized because the CON side has more propaganda money and clout..

 

[mikepetro]

Really? I heard it was people who worked in a diacetyl manufacturing plant ie breathing the vapors coming directly from the heating vats. Now I don't know what to believe.

"n 2004, The US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) reported several cases of bronchiolitis obliterans in workers in a microwave popcorn plant in Missouri in 2000. Bronchiolitis obliterans is a serious and irreversible condition in which the tiny air sacs in the lungs become scarred. After investigation by the NIOSH (National Institute of Occupation Safety and Health), it was discovered that a flavoring agent, diacetyl, was used to give the popcorn a buttery taste, and that inhalation of this flavoring likely contributed to the development of the illness. The disease that results often is associated with cough and shortness of breath, similar to that seen in people with chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD). This process is irreversible by current therapy."

Do Vaping & Ecigs Cause Popcorn Lung Disease?

 

[classwife]

@mikepetro

Just a heads up since it was pretty much set up just for your COOPS...and we won't be doing any more COOPS...

The expanded amount of members in a conversation has been set back to the normal 5.

If you remember, the only way that j0ker could get Hosts the ability to have more people in a convo was to make the entire Verified Member group have it.

So, yea...it's been reverted to "Normal"

 

[mikepetro]

FALSE: Vaping Proved to Cause 'Popcorn Lung'

By Snopes, a reputable source IMHO, and this is a good read.

 

[mikepetro]

@mikepetro

Just a heads up since it was pretty much set up just for your COOPS...and we won't be doing any more COOPS...

The expanded amount of members in a conversation has been set back to the normal 5.

If you remember, the only way that j0ker could get Hosts the ability to have more people in a convo was to make the entire Verified Member group have it.

So, yea...it's been reverted to "Normal"

Thanks for the heads up @classwife

Times, they are a changin......

 

[classwife]

Thanks for the heads up @classwife

Times, they are a changin......

Sadly so - they were fun while they lasted.
Who woulda ever thought that the little group buys in the PIF Forum would have started all the COOPS !!

 

[mikepetro]

Sadly so - they were fun while they lasted.
Who woulda ever thought that the little group buys in the PIF Forum would have started all the COOPS !!

It was good run, supported by many folks, and helped a lot of folks. In no small part to you!
Now I fear it will all be relegated to dark little corners of the Webz.

 

[mikepetro]

So, yea...it's been reverted to "Normal"

"Normal"!!!!
Well I nevah......

 

[SlickWilly]

My point, exactly. The cases always cited are extreme exposure cases, or at least very high exposure for extended time periods. Whether it was exposure during production or exposure during popping the exposure was rather high. Both the time and the concentration is so high compared to vaping, even in an overheated dry hit, that it is probably, and I stress probably, inconsequential.

Just my opinion, worth what you're paying for it. I am not a doctor, do not play one on TV and didn't stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

When in doubt I just ask my wife, she's a manager of a Holiday Inn Express and she knows EVERYTHING. But then again she knew everything before then too....