"Experienced Vapers'" SNOBBERY

[ahop]

i have talked to experienced vapors who use rba's who dont know anything about ohm's law all i can think is thats dangerous no battery safety there

 

[AndriaD]

I'll tell you one thing that does kinda irk me about this forum. I'm pretty new to all this too, just started vaping toward the end of January, so naturally I have LOTS of questions. So, I ask questions, the ones to which I need answers. Rather than answering the question, someone just gives me a link to a thread, or a video. AUUUUUUUUUGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!! If I wanted to read an entire thread or view a video, I would have ASKED for that, not simply asked a question. I realize they're trying to be helpful, and that the question has probably been asked and answered 10,000 times before me, but it's still irritating that they can't simply answer the question, and THEN say, if you want to know more, go here and read this, or view this video.

For instance... as noted somewhere above, I'm getting interested in this "mod" thing. But I'm really afraid of them, because of what was said just above, I know little to nothing bout resistance or electronics in general, and apparently you need a degree in electronics to use some of those things safely. I saw a thing on one site, a fuse, which apparently will break the connection before any mayhem ensues, but how do I know if I need that? How do I know which mod, or which battery, or which *whatever* to buy? I could ask, if I could figure out which forum to do it in, but someone is sure to point me at a 500 post thread, or tell me to watch a video (or recommend something that's approx half my husband's paycheck!). I HATE videos! My computer has maybe 4 bits video ram, so they all jerk and stop and bounce and freeze, never in sync with the sound, so watching videos on this thing is an exercise in torture. Besides which, I can READ way faster than anyone can TALK.

So I probably won't be getting any kind of "mod" other than this iTaste vv3, for the foreseeable future, because no one seems able to simply answer a question anymore.

Andria

 

[rtm355]

Hate to say it but thats a lot of forums not just ECF,I'm into trucks and have been a member of a forum for like 4 years and it happens all the time, I understand where you are coming from but, its just one of those things. Sometimes it is easier just to look it up because the link they give you is already linked to your question. please do not take this the wrong way I only have like 7 post on here .

 

[Katya]

I'll tell you one thing that does kinda irk me about this forum. I'm pretty new to all this too, just started vaping toward the end of January, so naturally I have LOTS of questions. So, I ask questions, the ones to which I need answers. Rather than answering the question, someone just gives me a link to a thread,

Are you sure they are linking you to a long thread? You see, I sometimes provide links that look like links to a thread, but are actually links to a particular post in that thread--one single post that answers the question. Since many questions have already been answered in great detail, it's often much easier to provide a link to an answer.

But thanks for bringing that up--I never realized that when I link to a post, somebody may think I'm linking to a lenghty thread. From now on, I'll just add a post number.

So I probably won't be getting any kind of "mod" other than this iTaste vv3, for the foreseeable future, because no one seems able to simply answer a question anymore.

So what is your question? maybe I (or somebody else) can provide a simple answer.

 

[Katya]

In the N.E.T. forum, when I mentioned googling "Virginia Slims taste" someone piped up with "yeah, go to google, they know LOADS more than we do about tobacco..."

Well, got news: that google link led me RIGHT to the e-juice I was hunting for... the kind that TASTES LIKE VIRGINIA SLIMS! Which nobody here apparently knew about...??? So... neener neener.

Andria

Google is very useful. I use Google all the time. I don't know everything, and even when I think I do, I like to double check. You have no idea how many questions we get here daily that can be answered by conducting a simple search. So I (and other helpers) end up doing a Google search ourselves--in order to be able to answer OP's question.

 

[rtm355]

Are you sure they are linking you to a long thread? You see, I sometimes provide links that look like links to a thread, but are actually links to a particular post in that thread--one single post that answers the question. Since many questions have already been answered in great detail, it's often much easier to provide a link to an answer.

But thanks for bringing that up--I never realized that when I link to a post, somebody may think I'm linking to a lenghty thread. From now on, I'll just add a post number.



So what is your question? maybe I (or somebody else) can provide a simple answer.

yea sometimes the link you send to people trying to help them doesn't necessarily put it on the answer they are looking for and you might have to read the entire page to get your answer which is normal. But that's a forum for you, can tell you one thing the ECF does have one of the best search engines I've ever used on a forum.

 

[Katya]

yea sometimes the link you send to people trying to help them doesn't necessarily put it on the answer they are looking for and you might have to read the entire page to get your answer which is normal. But that's a forum for you, can tell you one thing the ECF does have one of the best search engines I've ever used on a forum.

I had no idea... Thanks! From now on, I'll just copy and paste my answer from another thread--or include post number(s).

 

[rtm355]

oh I dont care, probably learn more from it also. It was AndriaD that had a little issue . NO BIG I HOPE

 

[Katya]

I'm glad she brought that up.

 

[AndriaD]

Are you sure they are linking you to a long thread? You see, I sometimes provide links that look like links to a thread, but are actually links to a particular post in that thread--one single post that answers the question. Since many questions have already been answered in great detail, it's often much easier to provide a link to an answer.

But thanks for bringing that up--I never realized that when I link to a post, somebody may think I'm linking to a lenghty thread. From now on, I'll just add a post number.



So what is your question? maybe I (or somebody else) can provide a simple answer.

Well, mainly I just need to know what to look for, as far as safety is concerned. I'm quite limited by budget, but I have found some mechs that were not very costly -- I just don't know if they're safe, this thing about regulated vs. unregulated... or how to make it safe, with a proper battery, or maybe that fuse thing. When I was just looking for starter kits, I figured most of them were pretty much safe. But now, I really see the benefit in a more advanced, or perhaps *less* advanced, since they're mech instead of electronic, type of device, for the potential future of all this anti-vaping legislation -- I'd really like a device in which I could change the batteries instead of just scrapping the whole device, if in the future they're going to be WAYYYYYYYY more costly than they are now. So mainly, I'm interested in safety -- I already survived 2 almost-fires, I sure don't want any real ones! But I'm looking at mechs because I'm also interested in adaptability, and potential for survival over the long run.

And you may be right, when the URL is long the forum does that ... thing, so I don't know for sure that I was being directed to a long thread in all cases; sometimes I have clicked them and gone to find exactly what I needed to know, but other times, not so much; I read very fast, but there is a certain time element involved in just loading this forum, it's so vast.

Thx!
Andria

 

[AndriaD]

Oh, and.. you can be sure that my next computer, which is planned for next year, will be all set for video everything, since everything is a video nowadays. This computer is approx. circa 2005, when most folks still had dialup or that newfangled thing called DSL... snicker... I had it too... Videos weren't the big thing then, as they are now, with broadband everywhere.

But till then, I have to suffer thru stop-motion video, even for the videos I really want to see, like the one about dry-burning a coil. It's like, I have to close EVERYTHING ELSE... close all other tabs... compress memory... and only then can I watch a video that doesn't stop dead right in the most important part. It's exasperating but until I get another PC, I have to live with it.

The Video-Challenged...
Andria

 

[Drozd]

I'll tell you one thing that does kinda irk me about this forum. I'm pretty new to all this too, just started vaping toward the end of January, so naturally I have LOTS of questions. So, I ask questions, the ones to which I need answers. Rather than answering the question, someone just gives me a link to a thread, or a video. AUUUUUUUUUGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!! If I wanted to read an entire thread or view a video, I would have ASKED for that, not simply asked a question. I realize they're trying to be helpful, and that the question has probably been asked and answered 10,000 times before me, but it's still irritating that they can't simply answer the question, and THEN say, if you want to know more, go here and read this, or view this video.

For instance... as noted somewhere above, I'm getting interested in this "mod" thing. But I'm really afraid of them, because of what was said just above, I know little to nothing bout resistance or electronics in general, and apparently you need a degree in electronics to use some of those things safely. I saw a thing on one site, a fuse, which apparently will break the connection before any mayhem ensues, but how do I know if I need that? How do I know which mod, or which battery, or which *whatever* to buy? I could ask, if I could figure out which forum to do it in, but someone is sure to point me at a 500 post thread, or tell me to watch a video (or recommend something that's approx half my husband's paycheck!). I HATE videos! My computer has maybe 4 bits video ram, so they all jerk and stop and bounce and freeze, never in sync with the sound, so watching videos on this thing is an exercise in torture. Besides which, I can READ way faster than anyone can TALK.

So I probably won't be getting any kind of "mod" other than this iTaste vv3, for the foreseeable future, because no one seems able to simply answer a question anymore.

Andria

I will try to answer your questions...
First, if you're not intending to get into rebuildables and just use standard prebuilt toppers....then which battery is slightly less critical...
For this purpose let, s say there are 3 types of batteries...Li Ion (protected and unprotected), and LiMN (otherwise known as high drain or IMR)
In a mechanical, running the battery down too low, or at a higher amp draw than it's rated for can damage the battery, damaging the battery or a short can cause it to get hot...this is where the batteries differ...Li Ion batteries have a lower temperature where they are stable before going into thermal runaway (vent/explode) about 190 F...better made protected batteries have a wire inside them that will break and stop the reaction though some gas may vent, unprotected no such luck, and the gas that vents is often an oxydizer so it flames and feeds itself....now the IMRs are a safer chemistry, and stay stable at a much higher temperature, and the gas is not an oxydizer...further they can handle higher amp draws...so the IMR are better for our purposes...
Not all batteries are created equal...better vendors have the specs of what the maximum charging rate is as well as max discharge often listed as a "C" rating... maximum amp draw is figured by taking the battery's mAh and multiplying by the C rating...take the 2 different AW 18650 IMR for example... the 2000mAh one has a max amp rating of 10A continuous draw, but the 1600mAh one says it has a 15C discharge rate so its good for 24A...
Now...voltage * voltage / resistance = Watts (heat)
And... Voltage / resistance = Amps

So you can play with resistance to get the wattage that satisfies
But you have to make sure that you aren't building coils so low that your Amp draw doesn't exceed the max continuous amp rating of your battery...
So which mod will be dependant on which batteries fit in it which depends on what you want to run on it resistance wise....

How was that

 

[Drozd]

Well, mainly I just need to know what to look for, as far as safety is concerned. I'm quite limited by budget, but I have found some mechs that were not very costly -- I just don't know if they're safe, this thing about regulated vs. unregulated... or how to make it safe, with a proper battery, or maybe that fuse thing. When I was just looking for starter kits, I figured most of them were pretty much safe. But now, I really see the benefit in a more advanced, or perhaps *less* advanced, since they're mech instead of electronic, type of device, for the potential future of all this anti-vaping legislation -- I'd really like a device in which I could change the batteries instead of just scrapping the whole device, if in the future they're going to be WAYYYYYYYY more costly than they are now. So mainly, I'm interested in safety -- I already survived 2 almost-fires, I sure don't want any real ones! But I'm looking at mechs because I'm also interested in adaptability, and potential for survival over the long run.

And you may be right, when the URL is long the forum does that ... thing, so I don't know for sure that I was being directed to a long thread in all cases; sometimes I have clicked them and gone to find exactly what I needed to know, but other times, not so much; I read very fast, but there is a certain time element involved in just loading this forum, it's so vast.

Thx!
Andria

Cheapest route and possibly most versitile....something like a K100 mechanical mod (around $40 ish) ...which will allow for 18350, 18490, and 18650 IMR batteries (around $10 for AW) ...
You could choose to use the 18490 battery with a kick2 chip (which would add variable wattage and extra protection) (totally optional but another $40 ish)...
And then a decent intelligent charger... (I'm partial to the xtar vp1...but it's about $40)

That would allow you to top it with just about anything at all you wanted...with the 24A AW 18650 battery mentioned in my previous post would let you build down to about .3 ohm safely...

 

[treehead]

Are you sure they are linking you to a long thread? You see, I sometimes provide links that look like links to a thread, but are actually links to a particular post in that thread--one single post that answers the question. Since many questions have already been answered in great detail, it's often much easier to provide a link to an answer.

But thanks for bringing that up--I never realized that when I link to a post, somebody may think I'm linking to a lenghty thread. From now on, I'll just add a post number.






So what is your question? maybe I (or somebody else) can provide a simple answer.

I feel the same way sometimes, it just feels like "passing the book" although I know it's convenient. I think the coolest part about getting a real answer from a human is just that it's something the person is interested in and knowledgeable about, and best of all it's not an answer from 2006 it's real time real world answers that are up-to-date. Personally I think those more personal answers is what makes ECF different from all the other sites I personally like typing my own personal answers to the asker. Plus it's more money for the owners!

 

[NoMentholPlease]

MY SETUP IS BIGGER AND BETTER THAN YOUR SETUP! ITS MY WAY OR THE HIGHWAY!

Look I'm subohming at 0.1 ohms, I LIVE ON THE EDGE.

THIS WILL BE THE BEST $200 DOLLARS YOU WILL SPEND ON A TANK (When something that costs $20 can do precisely the same thing)


Thats how I see many 'experienced' vapers, not just on here but in general. Oh well it humours me so carry on guys!

 

[Katya]

I feel the same way sometimes, it just feels like "passing the book" although I know it's convenient. I think the coolest part about getting a real answer from a human is just that it's something the person is interested in and knowledgeable about, and best of all it's not an answer from 2006 it's real time real world answers that are up-to-date. Personally I think those more personal answers is what makes ECF different from all the other sites I personally like typing my own personal answers to the asker. Plus it's more money for the owners!

Usually, I provide a link to a post I typed myself--like 20 minutes earlier!

But I understand your point.

 

[Katya]

MY SETUP IS BIGGER AND BETTER THAN YOUR SETUP! ITS MY WAY OR THE HIGHWAY!

Look I'm subohming at 0.1 ohms, I LIVE ON THE EDGE.

THIS WILL BE THE BEST $200 DOLLARS YOU WILL SPEND ON A TANK (When something that costs $20 can do precisely the same thing)


Thats how I see many 'experienced' vapers, not just on here but in general. Oh well it humours me so carry on guys!

They are not experienced--they are obnoxious bullies who are all about self-promotion and not helping others. Not the same thing. And many of them are going through nicotine withdrawals, so don't be too harsh on them.

It's grade school behavior--my toy is better than your toy, my daddy drives a better car...

 

[NoMentholPlease]

They are not experienced--they are obnoxious bullies who are all about self-promotion and not helping others. Not the same thing. And many of them are going through nicotine withdrawals, so don't be too harsh on them.

It's grade school behavior--my toy is better than your toy, my daddy drives a better car...

Precisely!

Nicotine withdrawal could be an easy excuse for plain old fashioned egomania though

 

[Terrell]

It's not so much a "snobbery" issue that I have found, but more that there's a lack of understanding by some users that their hobby is still incredibly new to large swaths of the population. And yet the technical jargon that is just EXPECTED to be understood baffles me.

I get that some of you like your box mods and your Provari and lord knows what else... but if I need to read a physics textbook to understand how that benefits me as an end user because some of you can't boil down what happens when I turn the knob to a different number in less than a full paragraph, forget it. It becomes of zero value to me. And that is where I believe the root of any "snobbery" people find comes from.

The industry and the people in it could really use a "dumbing down" for casual users so we can actually understand all the benefits to more advanced gear. Until that happens, I fear that such snobbery will continue and people will continue to use things because they're easier to understand, even if that means they aren't going to get an experience that's ideal for them.

Even worse, vendors don't make this any easier, by selling equipment that people just quite simply shouldn't buy because it's inferior to everything else on the market. I'd still be on CE4 clearomizers and lost faith in vaping if I didn't spend HOURS trying to understand the differences between top coil and bottom coil, what causes that occasional burning taste (which I finally figured out is what people were calling "dry hits"), what liquids cause tanks to crack, etc. before I settled on the T3S for most liquids (which is still on the lower end of the scale, I know) and a Protank for the the tank-crackers, which seemed to be the best bang for my buck. I shouldn't HAVE to be doing that much reading to realize that this CE4 that everyone sells that matches what my battery came with is what was causing my inability to enjoy vaping. No one should be selling it at all when it's obvious (based on this forum, anyways) that no one actually sticks with them, even though they keep being sold. It causes too many layers of abstraction that benefits no one.

Sorry... just my opinion, people are free to correct me.

 

[Katya]

Hi Terrel. Alas, there is some math involved, but not much, if you want to use APVs correctly. I'm sorry--vaping is a bit more complicated than smoking--but not much. But there's no bypassing that learning curve.

Tank cracking juices: citrus, cinnamon, licorice, cherry, banana. Most juice vendors started to include warnings on their sites.

Electricity and Ohm's Law--this is all you need to know to happily vape forever: I aploogize.

Disclaimer: This is the most simplistic explanation and is addressed to new vapers mostly or vapers who are happy within the recommended "just right" power zone (4.5-8 watts). If you are using dual coil atomizers or are interested in high wattage vaping, it's a different conversation altogether. You will also have to understand the concept of amp limits and how it applies to high power vaping. In short, dual coil atties consist of two coils configured in parallel, which means that a 2.1Ω atty is really two 4.2Ω coils--so calculate your wattage based on the 4.2Ω number--not 2.1Ω--roughly. To make it simpler--dual coil atties require more wattage than singles, but not quite twice as much. They produce more vapor due to increased surface. When in doubt--start low and adjust up as needed.

Ohm's Law as it pertains to vaping is really not that complicated--and it's very useful when you want to know what you're doing.

Voltage and wattage are often misunderstood by new vapers. Wattage is the power (heat, sweet spot) that your PV (battery and atomizer) generates. Wattage = Voltage (of your battery) squared divided by Resistance (Ω) of your atomizer [P=V[SUP]2[/SUP]/R]. If you're not good at math, don't worry, use this easy calculator:

Online Conversion - Ohm's Law Calculator

Of course, if you own a VW (variable wattage) device, you don't really need this calculator because your device will do the math for you.

The wattage you want, especially at the beginning of your vaping career, should be somewhere between 4.5 and 8.5 Watts. Anything lower than 4.5 watts may not vaporize your juice properly and will not produce enough warmth and vapor. Anything above 8.5 watts increases the risk of burning the filler in your cartomizers (if you're using them) and even some juices, especially the delicate ones.

There are, of course, other variables, like eliquid and JDD (juice delivery devices) that you're using on your batteries. Seven watts on a filler type cartomizer may feel different than the same 7 watts on a fillerless clearomizer or a dripping atomizer. The same is true for different eliquids; tobaccos, chocolate and coffees generally require more wattage (heat), while fruit and other delicate flavors do better with less heat. Everyone's sweet spot is different--those are just very general guidelines.

Experiment and you'll find your own bliss in no time!

The chart below is a good guide to safe vaping, even though some think it's a bit conservative.