House of Hybrids featuring the Zenesis PV

[JunkyRock13]

Totally agree with you Zen, I have had a problem with these members going out and getting something as simple as the Kick, and because they got 3 of them for a vendor, and only need 1. They sell the other 2 for $90 each. That is 2 times the price they paid for, and just because they are not in stock any where, people will pay whatever just because they want the item. I looked at a Zen the other day on the classys, just a standard, and it was priced at $400. Is that what we are doing here, just screwing each other!! Keep up the great work Zen!!!

 

[the ob]

Perfectly said.

I do want to tell you, I completely understand everything you are saying.

Every few months I purchase several HUNDRED thousand dollars worth of product and pray to god I can sell it. I just like you have expenses to pay each month (about 73,000 to be exact). I also get how slim the profit can often be. I wonder sometimes if people just think that everything is free to you and you are just making money hand over fist.

I also understand what glitches such as your site going down can mean for you, your family and your life.

I think that is one small reason I feel for you when these things happen. I am not saying I understand better than anyone else, but when these things happen that is why I am often so quick to have your back.

That is the end of my rants for tonight.

I hope to now resume my smart assey ways

Glad your close to being up and running now.

I guess what I am trying to say is we got your back.

 

[K-man]

Personally, I think your APV's are worth a few bucks more. I can't say this from the experience of owning one......yet, but I assure you, I have read and learned a LOT in my time here on ECF and in this thread. There is excellent value in a Zenesis. I'm a firm believer that "you only get what you pay for". And with a Zenesis, and YOU standing behind it, the Zenesis is worth more than what's out there. Customer service is worth a fortune. There's absolutely no point in you doing this if you're not going to make a buck. A GOOD buck. After all, I for one want to know that you'll be there for my next one and the one after that, and the one after that. That can't happen if House of Hybrids isn't a financial success. So make a few bucks will ya? I really think that most will agree with me on that. Even if you made a hundred dollars a unit. A thousand units will GROSS you a hundred grand. What the heck is that gonna be after your expenses? After your time? What will that NET you? I'll tell you. Not much! Not much at all!
Make a buck Mike and don't feel bad doing it! You've risked too much not to.

I know that you know everything I just wrote. I wrote it anyways because a lot of people don't know it, or don't know the blood and sweat that goes into something like this. Once they do, and they understand it, they won't mind paying a little more. That I guarantee.

 

[bradstaj]

I'm new to the whole forum thing. But I've been reading this thread for a couple of days and I am sooo happy that I can finally post in here. And with my first statement I have to say that I really admire all of the people who post on here (especially Zen~ of course). It actually seems to be a real community of kind people with common interests helping each other. Like I said, I am new to forums and was skeptical about ever joining one. But now I see that I was just naive. Why oh why did I wait so long. I could've been more informed and possibly skipped over buying a blu cig for my first vaping experience...lol.

 

[cigarbabe]

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
They shut me down and I didn't even show nipples for crying out loud!
Next time I may have to show more than a tiny bit of cleavage and bra!
Heading to bed got a huge headache from drinking two watermelon slushtini's!
I do apologize for keeping you folks from having any fun at TVN tonight.
Sorry to all the Zenfidels who were there.
C.B.

 

[tybin]

welcome bradstaj

oh, and Zen. here's to better times and gotta say I LOVE your bolt descriptions on the site

 

[Zen~]

welcome bradstaj

oh, and Zen. here's to better times and gotta say I LOVE your bolt descriptions on the site

I was banned from here by the sith lord... I had to do SOMETHING to kill some time.

 

[tybin]

don't know which was better- the fingerprints or the biker bar line

 

[BluSwatch]

I had to look up a Paul Jr Roadtirp Grill ....

 

[UA72Riddle]

damn, and I missed it!?

Ill have my iPad back tomorrow ( left it on the plane on the way to China for those that didn't remember), and will have my computer back in a couple of days...not gonna miss it next time!!!

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
They shut me down and I didn't even show nipples for crying out loud!
Next time I may have to show more than a tiny bit of cleavage and bra!
Heading to bed got a huge headache from drinking two watermelon slushtini's!
I do apologize for keeping you folks from having any fun at TVN tonight.
Sorry to all the Zenfidels who were there.
C.B.

 

[*ASH*]

Morning for some and goodnight for others. Hope that you all well .
It's take from me 40 mints to read every things lol . Glad that all are foine and Grats Zen in Advance here I am still waiting .

 

[bradstaj]

This might be a stupid question but I have a provari and am wondering if I should wait for the z-atty-pro or try to buy a zenesis...any input would be greatly appreciated.

 

[tybin]

I'm starting with the atty for now.

 

[TMC81614]

This might be a stupid question but I have a provari and am wondering if I should wait for the z-atty-pro or try to buy a zenesis...any input would be greatly appreciated.

Why not both? Z-Atty P for the ProVari and Zenesis as a primary (ProVari as a back-up)

 

[tybin]

Do i need to ad some of those extra insulators when I buy the atty?

 

[Bamrz]

This might be a stupid question but I have a provari and am wondering if I should wait for the z-atty-pro or try to buy a zenesis...any input would be greatly appreciated.

Either one! I have a Standard now, and I'm waiting on a ZAP so I don't have to get rid of my Provari. I'm one of those that has multiple devices set up with different flavors, so it will work out fine for me.

Do i need to ad some of those extra insulators when I buy the atty?

Nope. Everything you need comes with it. The insulators are only if by some chance you've melted yours. It shouldn't happen very often, so you may never even need them.

 

[bradstaj]

That's a very good point. Having both sounds like a little slice of heaven. You may have just made up my mind for me. I just can't wait to stop using cartos.

 

[tybin]

Thanks! ....

 

[emonty]

morning all, Wow great news on the e-commerce!!!!!!

 

[RippleInStillWater]

ripple just to clarify.

I think the reason why so many were upset was in part because of the timing.

the person in question sold their device while zens site was down. The person profited more than zen would for the devices he is selling and I think that made us and zen upset. Here is a guy who is doing the best he can and has a lot on the line. He is literally put a lot on the line and wants and probably needs to sell these to secure deposits and whatever else. It just seemed like the person took advantage of the timing. Zen was upset (I think. this is my opinion) because he was stuck and not able to make his own profit on there while someone else was profiting.

He can obviously speak for himself, but this is my 2c.

I think many are upset that a device that is really supposed to be doing all of us some good by keeping us from harming ourselves, was being used as a way to make money.

I think there is something about this hobby that makes many want to help others in any way that they (we) can. Think about all the love and support you have received from others here. So to take advantage in some way rather than have a "pay it forward" attitude, makes people upset.

One more point.

The person who sold it kept a lot of the pieces to use with another device. It is not as though they were quitting or at least as far as I know did not have a extreme circumstance that led to the sale. It just SEEMED as though they wanted to make money.

Obviously it is a free society and anyone can do what they want. I think zen (once again he can speak for himself ) would just like people to act like he does all the time. To treat others with respect and to live by some set of higher morals.

once again, just my 2c

Oh, I know, I have been reading every post for 2 weeks now, I haven't missed anything but I have gotten thin-skinned because wealthy euros keep buying stuff.....the GG line has been beset by speculators for a long time now, I just hate getting lumped in with the people who don't actually love them like I do, turning around maltreated GGs has afforded me the opportunity to buy more......and that makes some jealous that I can find them I guess.......my problem, noy all of yours.........

Cigarbabe had her channel shut down for one hour because she was shaking her boobies.

DAMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think you summed it up pretty well.

But I would like to add a bit to it...

When I created the Zenesis PV I had a goal to sell the Standard for 200 bucks... and the first five or six did... These were all hand made by me in my shop... When I calculated my time, I wasn't making very much per hour... not a lot of meat on the bone at 200 bucks.

So I set forth to put an extra 25 bucks in my pocket and raised the price to 225, and introduced the mini at 195... I really wanted a PV to be at that 200 dollar price point... that's why the mini was introduced... The problem is, the mini costs about 3 bucks less to make than the standard. The additional savings came from a less expensive case, and a smaller profit margin.

Then the demand went through the roof, and I realized I couldn't possibly make them all myself... I found a machine shop.

And the price remained the same.

What people do NOT realize is the expense of getting these things into a shop. Tooling, fixtures, CAD, Programming... it all adds up... The FIRST run of 200 PVs cost me WAYYYY more than I sold them for when you factor in the tooling and incidentals, and on an endeavor such as this, there's no way of knowing if there will even BE a second run... all the initial costs are "at risk".

Feb and March PVs generated just shy of 50,000 in sales... and the machine shop bill was about 39,000 PLUS another 10,000 was spent on the small parts, cases, kanthal, wicks etc. So that's 49K roughly against 50K in sales...

The switch problem set me back another couple thousand because I was in a rush... I still haven't got all of that settled...

OH yes... tanks that were not up to snuff didn't help either.

Paypal and Square fees, plus other expenses not including postage ate up roughly 4%... that's about 2K.

I earned NOTHING on the first two months of sales... In fact I LOST more money in those two months than some people in this thread MAKE in two months.

But without risk... there is no reward, right?

So the shops finally get the Z-attys ready, and the next 200 PVs are ready to assemble too...

The parts cost money... lots and lots of money. So this time the machine shops get even MORE money... after all, there's 375 Z-attys to pay for and 25 Titanium Standards... and WOW this bill will pay for a SERIOUSLY NICE ITALIAN SPORTS CAR...

And I pay it...

And then eCommerce gets shut down...

For a month...

The bottom line is at this point there is no bottom line... I'm ALL IN, and it will be a long haul digging out, and doggonit... it's WORTH it!

I'm seeing aspects that are unique to my design showing up in other peoples work now. It's flattering, even if it is unethical. No biggie... I created the Zenesis... I feel good about it.

I'm committed to 1000 stainless PVs this year... it was foolish to do Titanium and Aluminum and dilute my own efforts... but I wanted to do MORE... no risk... no reward!

So think about my mindset for a moment.

This is kinda scary, isn't it? Can people see what's on the line? Can people see why I might be on edge?

So... then we get a guy, that for NO other reason than being at the right place at the right time... sells one of the PVs I built... at my risk... with my precious time... with MY money... they up and sell it for a hundred bucks more than they sell for.

I wish I could make a hundred bucks that easily.

WE built a community here... all of us... WE created the value of the brand... All of us... And being a part of this community has to stand for something.

There are literally DOZENS of people in this community that don't have a device yet... and some guy buys one... goes outside the community and sells it ... no... SCALPS it for 100 bucks over fair market value. So WHAT if he traded it, by the way... the trade was based on his asking price and negotiated from there.

So far people that have sold their PVs have made more money than I have.

I value this community.

But the very fabric of this group is threatened by this behavior.

So... in the spirit of full disclosure... The eCommerce thing scared me... a lot.

Having parts without an ability to sell them... well... that's the scariest thing on earth at the moment. So if I've been on edge, testy, or even rude... that's why.

But I'm not backing down from the scalping issue.

So here's what I consider to be scalping:

1) If a person sells their Zenesis PV at a price over the current retail price... it's scalping.

2)If a person buys a PV for 250.00 plus 6 bucks shipping and they sell it for 256 PLUS SHIPPING to the next person, it's scalping.

3) If a person pays 250 plus shipping for a PV, and they sell it for 250 NOT INCLUDING THE CASE AND REMAINING ACCESSORIES... It's scalping.

The following is NOT scalping:

1) A person sells a Discontinued, a BAM or a LIMITED for above what they paid... it is NOT scalping. It is selling a PV that is no longer available at the price the market will bear.

2) A person sells a current production PV for the price they originally paid for it, less original shipping.

3) A person sells a current production PV... PLUS ADDITIONAL ACCESSORIES WITH REAL VALUE for a price above the current retail value, but not exceeding the combined real retail value.

So that's what I consider the reality of this all.

Thanks for your undertsanding and compassion for my situation.

I really appreciate it.

Love ya' Zen, well said........

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
They shut me down and I didn't even show nipples for crying out loud!
Next time I may have to show more than a tiny bit of cleavage and bra!
Heading to bed got a huge headache from drinking two watermelon slushtini's!
I do apologize for keeping you folks from having any fun at TVN tonight.
Sorry to all the Zenfidels who were there.
C.B.

Man oh man, you are absolutely murdalizing me here, CB, just when I thought I couldn't feel worse about missing your shows .......why didn't you shake your boobies at me at vapebash?!?!?!