Si le déluge est inévitable, mieux vaut d'avertir que de rien faire.
How to Get Around Future E Cig Taxes
- Thread starter V8porism
- Start date
- th_trl_thread_readers 0
-
- Tags
- ecig taxes taxes
- Status
Si le déluge est inévitable, mieux vaut d'avertir que de rien faire.
Don't know, Sensei..I both agree and disagree with ya.
I believe if we weren't living in a world we never made (apologies to Howard The Duck)
that course of action would work.
But in this reality, in my humble opinion, that's too idealistic. Getting friendly representatives elected is an
iffy mission and a gamble. Politicians are by nature crooks even if they carry juice and a mod.
Again, pardon my cynicism but I disagree with you bout elections not being rigged.
Sorry man, but I live in Florida. Elections are indeed rigged and messin with the outcomes is not very hard to do.
It's much easier than we were counting chads..
Regards,
Hazy
First off much kudos for the Howard the Duck reference!
The trick WAS to create an apathetic society that didn't bother to vote.
Basic government isn't even taught in school anymore.
Where do you think congressmen and senators rise from?
They are local politicians first.
You know....those "meaningless" local elections no one participates in anymore?
Our founding fathers envisioned citizen legislators who went serve their terms and then went back to work.
We have enabled carter politicians to take control of out government.
Remember.. We do not elect political "leaders", we elect representative of the will of their constituents.
Constituents= you and I.
If they don't do what we want them to, it's 100% up to us to change it.
Hazy, I lived in Florida for almost 20 years.
Indian rocks beach, (Tampa/St Pete).
I'm famiar with southern style politics too.
You think all those retired Florida seniors don't vote?
Remember the "FL auto import tax", or the bogus "emission testing laws"?
If not for voting seniors you would still be paying those illegal fees.
If you think your vote doesn't count you have already been beaten.
Hey, I thought you were from Ontario, not Quebec. Knock it off.
You should have heard the former Toronto mayor in Jamaican patois...... (hint: search "Rob Ford patois" on youtube; WARNING - not office safe).
Elections most certainly ARE rigged, by the political parties -- they will not offer us anyone who will rock their boats to that extent. Just like prosecutors won't seat anyone on a jury who says they hate cops. The political parties are like casinos -- they appear to offer something valuable, knowing all the while that the entire effort is rigged to the "house's" benefit. Those who run for office are not in it to do public service -- they're in it for SELF service. They want the fame, the money -- the power. And to hell with those who were big enough suckers to vote for them.
Andria
Sure do. I'll PM them to ya.
Regards Fellow Floridian
Hazy
why PM?
post the link(s) here - this thread is very loose
I have a crazy idea. If the governments agenda is to make e cigarettes obsolete through taxes, for the sole purpose of revenues through cigarettes....
Why isn't our agenda to make everyone quit smoking tobacco? CVS stopped selling tobacco products, why dont we push other places to do the same? Why not push to raise taxes on cigarettes even more although it will slowly decrease demand? This may cause an unfavorable consequence on e cigarettes for the present time, but through future studies, one then could claim that a sin tax on Ecigarettes is unlawful. Why not push for the legalization for the recently legalized drug so their sin tax revenue is obtained from that? Why not push for the education of the low income citizens who are known to use tobacco products that it is a terrible habit?
If the government wants to do this to retain revenue, then we should find alternative ways for them to get that revenue. If not, then don't let the people give them the revenue they want. It's not like all the money the government has goes to waste... You'd be surprised how many things you take for granted come from the government.
Why isn't our agenda to make everyone quit smoking tobacco? CVS stopped selling tobacco products, why dont we push other places to do the same? Why not push to raise taxes on cigarettes even more although it will slowly decrease demand? This may cause an unfavorable consequence on e cigarettes for the present time, but through future studies, one then could claim that a sin tax on Ecigarettes is unlawful. Why not push for the legalization for the recently legalized drug so their sin tax revenue is obtained from that? Why not push for the education of the low income citizens who are known to use tobacco products that it is a terrible habit?
If the government wants to do this to retain revenue, then we should find alternative ways for them to get that revenue. If not, then don't let the people give them the revenue they want. It's not like all the money the government has goes to waste... You'd be surprised how many things you take for granted come from the government.
Last edited:
Why waste money rigging them? No one votes against them any more.
You Do realize prosecutors(DAs) are voted in too, right?
"They" Don't "offer" us candidates. It is up to US to rise up and elect better representatives.
This is STILL America.
Rights are like muscles...if you don't exercise them, you will lose them.
I don't think Hazy will mind spreading the info:
We haven't heard CASAA or the Militia talk about it.
Scroll down to the last few pages, pp 34-36 for the pertinent stuff.
http://www.myfloridahouse.gov/Sectio...ftc+2-3-15.pdf
60% Tax on manufacturers, wholesale distributors and 25% on retail sales.
Coming soon to a locale near you. July 01, 2015
The following are the statutes regarding tobacco products already on the books in Florida.
What the proposed legislation does is it
SPECIFICALLY ADDS vapor and vapor products to the list of tobacco products to which existing law will be applied.
AS OF JULY 01, 2015
Chapter 877 Section 112 - 2014 Florida Statutes - The Florida Senate
SECTION 210.276. Surcharge on tobacco products., PART II. TAX ON TOBACCO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN CIGARETTES OR CIGARS, CHAPTER 210. TAX ON TOBACCO PRODUCTS, TITLE XIV. TAXATION AND FINANCE, Florida Statutes
SECTION 210.30. Tax on tobacco products; exemptions., PART II. TAX ON TOBACCO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN CIGARETTES OR CIGARS, CHAPTER 210. TAX ON TOBACCO PRODUCTS, TITLE XIV. TAXATION AND FINANCE, Florida Statutes
Fight could be brewing over the taxing of e-cigarettes - Local - Northwest Florida Daily News
This organization may be able to provide you with more info:
http://www.vistatruth.org/
Last edited:
After reading your post I would, however, like to ask...
--Were you aware that CASAA had a meeting with the FDA?
--Were you aware that CASAA has helped organize people to attend local legislative hearings?
--Were you aware that CASAA members have even flown to attend some of those local legislative hearings themselves?
--It is also something of note that CASAA also gave rise to the founder of AVA
There are many other things CASAA has done through the years...
And I just didn't know if you were aware of them or not.
What I don't understand about your position is why you wouldn't at least sign up to be a member.
It costs nothing, and it helps grow their membership numbers and hopefully become more influential.
Here are some things that might interest you...
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...a-officially-launches-its-board-advisors.html
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/casaa/656230-some-background-casaa-calls-action.html
And again, sorry, I was not intending to say you were bashing.
That post was aimed at someone else, and most know who that is.
Last edited:
I joined CASAA the first week I was on ECF, and donated to them just about the same time I became a supporting member here. But I have to admit that I'm a bit underwhelmed by their efforts. I totally grok that they are volunteers, and they can't storm Washington and headlock the idiots preaching against e-cigs... but it seems they could do somewhat more than they are...
Andria
Yes Andria, but it costs a lot of money. As soon as you go federal, the cost goes through the roof. For local politics you can often get by with mobilising locals to appear at hearings and stuff. That costs you a couple of g's to pay for basic services, the occasional flight & hotel, things like that. When it goes federal then you start at $50k and go up.
There are other approaches that come around from time to time, according to the climate. For example a really good toxicology review was needed, so they paid for that. Right now a strong counter-propaganda campaign is needed more than anything else, but CASAA (and probably no one else currently set up) is capable of doing that. It would have to be funded mostly by the trade anyway, and CASAA can't get too close to them or their credibility will suffer in some ways.
There's enough research to be going on with, what is needed now is a fightback against the propaganda. The purpose of the propaganda is to create a climate in which restrictive legislation and taxes can be imposed without a mainstream objection. It's succeeding.
There are other approaches that come around from time to time, according to the climate. For example a really good toxicology review was needed, so they paid for that. Right now a strong counter-propaganda campaign is needed more than anything else, but CASAA (and probably no one else currently set up) is capable of doing that. It would have to be funded mostly by the trade anyway, and CASAA can't get too close to them or their credibility will suffer in some ways.
There's enough research to be going on with, what is needed now is a fightback against the propaganda. The purpose of the propaganda is to create a climate in which restrictive legislation and taxes can be imposed without a mainstream objection. It's succeeding.
I agree that a counter-propaganda campaign is an excellent idea; how might that be accomplished? Internet social media, mainstream advertising and/or interview/essay publication...? I might say newspapers but they seem to have gone the way of the beeper and dinosaurs.
It occurs to me to wonder where is the ACLU in all this? If you say "ACLU" to people, they know what that means, and might or might not fear them, but if you say "CASAA" most people will likely say "gesundheit." To me it feels a lot like my civil liberties are being violated, or are about to be violated, or might be violated soon, if my access to a life-saving product is in any way impeded. And for the gov't to trample my civil liberties in such a cavalier fashion is unconscionable, simply intolerable. And that goes not only for every current vaper, but also every current smoker who might at some point like to stop being a smoker without having to suffer too much to do it.
I am not criticising CASAA; I am simply wondering what is going on, what is likely to be going on in the future, to help stop this wholesale trampling of liberty to save our own lives.
Andria
A fight back against propaganda needs to be an international effort because it's happening everywhere. Because no current group can manage the publication of appropriate materials in different countries, it would have to be a new collective. There have to be people from each country that funds publicity as the issues are different.
A regular campaign is no use as that is based on big funding. Our opponents can take that route as they have unlimited funds. Our response would need to be a guerrilla style campaign as the cost of a commercial campaign with a PR firm and all that involves is out of the question.
It's not something I can take on anyway, except as a helper.
A regular campaign is no use as that is based on big funding. Our opponents can take that route as they have unlimited funds. Our response would need to be a guerrilla style campaign as the cost of a commercial campaign with a PR firm and all that involves is out of the question.
It's not something I can take on anyway, except as a helper.
Funny
Just a few weeks ago, the notion that tax could or would happen at every level of the supply chain was publicly called absurd on these very boards. (though the source of the attack had no credibility.)
i can't say i didn't see this coming. just didn't know where it would begin.
Are there any lawyers on this forum that can chime in here? I'd love to hear your take.
Can't we win challenges to Vaping bans based on using 0-Nic juice?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
CMD-Ky,
Are you an attorney & former judge? I'd love to have an attorney chime in on whether or not these bans can successfully be challenged.
It would seem like a successful legal challenge in a small municipality would set a precedence & make all the others back off.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
