I resent ECF's campaign regarding the New Mexico State Rep. Liz Thompson

[zapped]

Did a bit of diggin...
Someone posted this on the OMG evil liberal ECF seems to hate's FB page.
"You're a Democrat, and you need to know that e-cigarette people are encouraging folks to help your opponent. PLEASE modify your stance! I'm a proud Democrat and I quit smoking cigarettes with the help of a vaping device. Please understand that they have so much less risk than the real ones."

OK her response ....
"I am not anti e cigarette. I don't believe that they should be available to children. We do not know that they are safe for anyone, but they may be less harmful. I am in favor of discouraging anyone to begin smoking any tobacco/nicotine product, and to encourage those who do do to quit. Thank you for your comments." https://www.facebook.com/pages/Elizabeth-Thomson-for-NM-House-24/261180410637092

“We don’t know everything about them, but we know we don’t want them in the hands of children,” said Rep. Elizabeth Thomson Lawmakers, governor concerned about e-cigarettes | Albuquerque Journal News

And hell the bill to tax ecigs she was part of.... a couple dudes called "them" explained their concerns and ecigs was removed. Just like that. Real serious about that one!

Ya I see what yall are saying She is TOTALLY OUT of LINE.

Correction: SHE doesn't know anything about e-cigs...but that doesnt stop her from forming an opinion anyway??

What the hell happened to people knowing what they are talking about before opening their mouths? ...much less attempting to pass legislation on it?

If a Bill or Law were to pass my desk asking for my endorsement and I didnt know much about the subject you can bet Id research both sides of the issue before forming an opinion. An opinion based on FACTS.....not feelings.

She goes on to say that she is against people smoking any nicotine product.

Well so am I because smoking a patch or chantix is a very bad idea. So is setting an e-cig or pv on fire.

I joke, but her statements show her absolute ignorance on the subject. Ecigs dont produce smoke or in fact combust anything.

Also this industry has done quite a bit in the past 5 years to ensure that children dont have access to e-cigs or juice.

Someone with even a cursory knowledge of vaping and miniscule grasp of reality should be aware of those facts by now.

I think a large part of her ignorance stems from self-delusion and believing that tired old lie that liberals are so much smarter than the rest of us.

And with that being said, I dont think you even see half of what were saying...and even then its just the parts that support your agenda/allegiance and allows you to stave off cognitive dissonance for just a while longer.

With "friends" like these who needs enemies?

ANTZ are probably laughing their tails off as idiocy like this causes us to self destruct from the inside out.

 

[sub4me]

I'm an attorney and during law school I was the volunteer Legislative Director for CASAA. I'm now the President of the American Vaping Association, a research fellow with the Heartland Institute (almost exclusively writing articles about e-cigarettes or other tobacco issues & speaking at hearings), and I have a consulting company that I occasionally take work through.

Most of my time is spent volunteering with vendors in various different states helping them form associations, get lobbyists, and defeat threats.

Any vendor in a state where vaping has been threatened has probably dealt with me before.

Thanks for your response and transparency.

 

[kristin]

Why is it disconcerting?

Heartland argues "that smokers already pay too much tax, that proposals for further restrictions on tobacco and smoking are based on "junk science", that lawsuits against the tobacco industry are an example of "lawsuit abuse", that bans on smoking "hurt small businesses and violate private property rights", that the harm caused to smokers can be reduced by "educating" them "about their options" and that restrictions on smokers violate "the basic libertarian principles that ought to limit the use of government force."

What is not true there? Other than "smoking increases the risk of heart disease, stroke, lung and oral cancers and COPD, and second-hand smoke in homes also slightly increases health risks to family members," everything else the ANTZ say about tobacco, second-hand smoke in public spaces and outdoors and third-hand smoke is complete and utter BS. They lie about those things the same way they lie about vapor products and e-cig companies. In fact, that's how they learned to do it.

 

[WhiteHighlights]

I never even heard of the Heartland Institute before yesterday, but this is a bit disconcerting:

Heartland Institute and tobacco - SourceWatch

Did you read this to the end? Although the most recent references were 2009, the end paragraphs were interesting.

In February 2009 Heartland lists 5 of its personnel as being "Tobacco Policy Experts".[21] These were Joseph Bast, Ralph Connor, the Local Legislation Manager; John Nothdurft, Heartland's Legislative Specialist; Brad Rodu, from the University of Louisville and W. Kip Viscusi, a Professor of Law at Vanderbilt University Law School.

Heartland also currently lists "Tobacco" as being one of its seven priority topic areas. In an essay -- titled "Tobacco and Freedom" -- Heartland's senior fellow - legal affairs, Maureen Martin and President, Joseph L. Bast, argue that smokers already pay too much tax, that proposals for further restrictions on tobacco and smoking are based on "junk science", that lawsuits against the tobacco industry are an example of "lawsuit abuse", that bans on smoking "hurt small businesses and violate private property rights", that the harm caused to smokers can be reduced by "educating" them "about their options" and that restrictions on smokers violate "the basic libertarian principles that ought to limit the use of government force."[22]

The introduction to Heartland's tobacco portal claims that it "cuts through the propaganda and exaggeration of anti-smoking groups by giving you access to the best available research and commentary from scores of independent research organizations, publications, and government sources."[22]

It also promotes Bast's July 2006 book of essays on tobacco, Please Don’t Poop in My Salad. Introducing the book, Heartland concedes that "defending smokers is a thankless task in today’s politically correct environment." While stating that "Bast doesn’t deny that smoking is an unhealthy habit" it argues that cigarette taxes and bans on smoking go too far and that there is a need to respect "the rights of smokers and the owners of bars and restaurants."[22]

I have no dog in this fight. I'm from MA - home of Martha Coakley and Ed Markey. I'm in trouble as it is.

 

[Smann245]

SourceWatch (formerly Disinfopedia) is a wiki operated by the Center for Media and Democracy (CMD), a progressive non profit organization.

SourceWatch is a joke.

You guys just keep throwing crap at the wall hoping something will stick huh?

 

[UntamedRose]

If yall dont have the foresight to comprehend why shacking up with the organization that is the laughing stock of the science world....Might Might be a bad idea and not work out well.

IDK what to say.

 

[zapped]

If yall dont have the foresight to comprehend why shacking up with the organization that is the laughing stock of the science world....Might Might be a bad idea and not work out well.

IDK what to say.

<...>

Gimme a break here.

This is a VAPING forum and I'm actually surprised and more than a little sickened that people who claim to be vapers, and spend a good portion out of their day on these forums, have such divided loyalties, and are so incredibly confused on an issue that affects all of us.

<...>

 

[zapped]

If yall dont have the foresight to comprehend why shacking up with the organization that is the laughing stock of the science world....Might Might be a bad idea and not work out well.

IDK what to say.

Is that according to the CMD and Huffington post or are you talking to us about feelings again?

 

[sonicdsl]

Keep the tone down in here folks... this is NOT the Outside.

Thank you

 

[ProjektMayhem]

Which is being trampled on like crazy.

Our rights are slowly being taken away one by one.

 

[Empress Kitty]

I think you mistake my intentions entirely here.

I dont post to sway the opinion of "progressives" since I've already given them up as a lost cause.

IMO thats just as futile as trying to teach a brain-damaged chicken how to perform calculus while playing the ukelele.

Left to their own devices most of them will destroy themselves anyway...the issue is that theyre hell bent on taking the rest of us along with them.

I post to let those who share my opinions know they aren't alone, that there's still a glimmer of hope left in this world, despite your party's misguided and delusional efforts to destroy it....and vaping as well........all in the name of false progress and change.

An argument would imply equal footing/common ground and apparently some of us arent even on the same planet.

Libertarians "left to their own devices" would fare better?

*cough* Galt's Gulch Chile *cough*

http://www.salon.com/2014/09/16/ayn...e_inside_story_of_a_libertarian_scam_partner/

 

[Nermal]

Love the avatar, Sonic.

 

[Empress Kitty]

The entire idea of a two party system was to function as another set of checks and balances.Both sides have plusses and minuses and its this tension that generally results in good laws and compromises that work for both sides.

I forget who said it but When faced with two extremes, the truth more often than not is usually found firmly in the middle of the two. Ive yet to find this to be untrue in 44 years of life.

My biggest beef with progressives of late is their blatant attempts to skew the balance in their favor by any means necessary....and as you have so eloquently stated, to force their ideals on everyone else......taking away individual choice and personal responsibility.

I seem to recall a 'man" who came to power in Germany who used the same tactics....and that should frighten us all, red, yellow, black, white, brown, liberal, conservative etc.

In case theres any confusion on who I am referring to it was Adolf Hitler who said:

“The best way to take control over a people and control them utterly is to take a little of their freedom at a time, to erode rights by a thousand tiny and almost imperceptible reductions. In this way, the people will not see those rights and freedoms being removed until past the point at which these changes cannot be reversed.”

Godwin? Really?

Do you have an issue with the Religious Right taking away the freedom of a woman to choose to get an abortion?

The knife cuts both ways my dear.

 

[btc76vapo]

<...>

Gimme a break here.

... I'm actually surprised and more than a little sickened that people ... are so incredibly confused on an issue that affects all of us.

<...>

Like advocating votes for the Rep that received contributions from Monsanto, Conrad James?

I'm not saying I'm advocating for the rep going after vaping. I'm just saying vote the balance of issues. Voting for a single issue without looking at the whole picture is just as blind as voting Right/Left because Right/Left 'Murica. If you can look at everything and then say, "OK, the balance of each of their stances, including vaping, leads me to x or y candidate" then, well-done.

Me, personally - if I had to vote between a Monsanto beneficiary where Monsanto affects my entire family versus a candidate against vaping which, of the people I love, only affects me - I MIGHT vote for the Anti-Vaping wack-a-do. But, then again, I'd need more info on all the other issues. Throw a stance on Pro-Life (I'm very Pro-choice) in there and I'm outtie.

 

[Strings]

Gonna risk getting in trouble here, I think. Pardon my using an illegal substance to illustrate a point...

For those saying "a ban couldn't happen!"... think long term, and look at ......... laws. That particular substance (a {OTHER STUFF}, which ANYONE can grow), went from legal to illegal in the space of what... 50 years? All because of pushing from those in power (Hearst started the ball, IIRC, to shut down hemp).

Now... if that can happen to a plant that anyone can grow, what safety is there for a chemical mixture only used by a small (and divided) segment of society?

I'm a gun owner. I know a LOT of folks who have stated "Aww... they cain't ban 'em! That's foolish talk!". Funny: there was a period of 10 years where they made a hell of an attempt on it (pm me if you want some fun details). And remember: politicritters don't tend to be the brightest bulbs on the porch (see the California AWB, which banned the m41a1 Pulse rifle. Yeah... the gun from Aliens)

 

[Avid]

I have no dog in this fight. I'm from MA - home of Martha Coakley and Ed Markey. I'm in trouble as it is.

Don't forget Elizabeth Warren... She's going to do and say whatever carp Markey does. You're right - we ARE in trouble here.

 

[Fuzzy Bruce]

Cause for trouble? Probably, but, I applaud anyone for taking a stand and sticking to it. I may not agree but I put time in service so others could have the choice.

 

[spartanstew]

Why is it disconcerting?

Regardless of their feelings toward the fight for smokers rights, I'm cautious about any organization that is funded by Big Tobacco. Big Tobacco would rather vaping just went away.

 

[Vermonster13]

Reality means so little compared to perception with politicians. What they can get a majority of voting sheep to believe is all that matters to them. Right, wrong, truth, lies, etc are all mutable concepts to be used to build power. We're all just numbers and acceptable losses are part of the numbers so long as their goals are achieved. Politics was never meant to be a career or full time profession at the start of our country.

 

[bluecat]

Chris Christie and John Boehner are just as bad for this country as Hillary Clinton and the Obamas IMO.

As a voter in Boehner's district I can agree that his time shoudl be done. I won;t necessarily put him on a comparable basis with the Clinton's and Obama's. We have been trying to get him out, but it near impossible. Everyone is afraid to run against him. Again.. he is unopposed. The last tea party candidate fizzled. A couple years ago another republican running against him left the race. Yes, I have been to Boehner's office more than once to discuss vaping.

Term limits will solve this career politicians. Sadly, the house will have to vote that in. The houses of the government should be a representation of the people. It is no longer the case. If that representation of the people goes against my beliefs then so be it, at least let it be a representation.