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Whether or not the Darwin is a good FIRST mod is probably a better question. I myself would stalk to classifieds and just pick a big battery mod for 1/3 the price. As I said, variable wattage is for the picky vaper. A cheap VV would be my advice. You can always recover your costs when buying used (can sell later).
Wasn't recomending a provari either, as mine has been benched for quite a while. There was a time when I needed, VV, but I don't really anymore. I know how to match the ohms of my attys and cartos to the voltage I have 8)
But I'll list the bad points of the provari also:
1)Weight: It's stainless steel. I have the extender cap, but I don't use it anymore. The cap + the 18650s makes the unit waaay to heavy. Still lighter and smaller then my GGTS + UFS, but it wasnt comfortable.
2)Circuit protection is too low. It will only take a 1.5 ohm dual coil to around 3.5 volts before it turns off the circuit. This was the ULTIMATE fail of the provari, and why it is benched as much as it is now. Those dual coils changed my whole view on cartos, and to have them shut off early was dissapointing. 2.0 ohm Dual Coils were much better.
3)People think its a sex toy. Still don't know what is worse, vaping out of a juice box, or something that looks like a vibrator sitting on my desk.
4) Warranty: no transferable. I actually had to warranty my provari 1 time because it just started glitching out. I had one of the first units made though, and there were problems on initial release.
If I had to recomend a Mod, I would recomend a Reo Mini. I've owned all the bad ... ones, but that Reo is absolutely fantastic + cisco 1.8 ohm attys. I even have 14250 3v bats comming so I can run 6v on it, hahaha. I needed VV to teach me where the sweet spot was for my Vaping, Its not needed anymore. I'll load up 1.5 ohm dual coils and run them at 6 volts. If I need to ohm an atty, or have some that were just a tad out of spec, I'll drip them on the provari.
I could get onboard with this concept. Honestly, for a first VV mod, I wouldn't recommend dumping more than $100 (or around there) for a mod. Anything over $150 starts to get into the higher end and really for finicky or picky vapers.
Honestly, both a Darwin and ProVari have pros/cons. Deciding which is right for you can be expensive if you don't really know what you are looking for or like in a VV mod to begin with.
The Lil sis from Ken's box mods, and the VV unit from Madvapes are super cheap alternatives if someone just wants to experiment with VV.
I'd actually recommend the Grand over the Mini, unless size is a really huge factor (although the Grand isn't much bigger than the Mini). Mini takes 14500 and the Grand takes an 18650. You can throw 2 123's in the Grand, I didn't try the 14250s in the Mini (when I had it). My only complaint on the Mini, was battery life. I was going through 3 batteries a day. My Grand goes an entire day and then some. But, that's due to battery capacity and is pretty evident.
Really dont enjoy my grand, it's just too big. I agree on the battery life thing. I have been a hardcore AW high drain for a very long time now, but I went ahead and gave the flame jacket trustfire 14500s a try for the last couple of weeks. Pretty noticable difference in life, and I honestly can't tell much of a difference in performance on them vs the high drain. Swapping bats has never been a big deal for me, as I'm always near a charger. It was reloading juice that bugged me all the time, and made me buy every tank available out there. Still have a ggts+ UFS but sold the 2nd one my wife used. Even spent $200 on the apex alpha because of it resevoir on top, hated the switch on that mod though.
Ultra IFR 14250 LFP 3.2v Rechargeable Batteries-Pair: Your source for the best electronic cigarettes / personal vaporizers in the world.
is the link to the 3v 14250s, he had to special order them. Lots of 3.7v 14250s out there, but no other 3v ones besides here atm.
Can click my profile, I have an album set up with pics and size comparisons of all the great mods.
Ultra IFR 14250 LFP 3.2v Rechargeable Batteries-Pair: Your source for the best electronic cigarettes / personal vaporizers in the world.
is the link to the 3v 14250s, he had to special order them. Lots of 3.7v 14250s out there, but no other 3v ones besides here atm.
Can click my profile, I have an album set up with pics and size comparisons of all the great mods.
Vapourguy happened to mention the Eclipse EQ in a PM, and since I'd never heard of it I spent the last hour or so checking them out. It pretty much covers every one of my desires in a MOD that I mentioned earlier.
Frankly, I think I'd prefer the display in the Darwin to the circle of lights menu system in the Eclipse, but aside from that the Eclipse looks like a truly badical device IMO, albeit a bit large looking.
Decisions, decisions, decisions.
Frankly, I think I'd prefer the display in the Darwin to the circle of lights menu system in the Eclipse, but aside from that the Eclipse looks like a truly badical device IMO, albeit a bit large looking.
Decisions, decisions, decisions.
Vapourguy happened to mention the Eclipse EQ in a PM, and since I'd never heard of it I spent the last hour or so checking them out. It pretty much covers every one of my desires in a MOD that I mentioned earlier.
Frankly, I think I'd prefer the display in the Darwin to the circle of lights menu system in the Eclipse, but aside from that the Eclipse looks like a truly badical device IMO, albeit a bit large looking.
Decisions, decisions, decisions.
The menu system is fail on the Provari level but I hope to buy one anyway
Beamed from my DroidX
Yeah, watching the Basilray video made me realize I'd probably have to carry around the user manual for a while until I really understand the menu system, because as it stands it looks a bit on the confusing side. With all of the thought and gadgetry packed in there I'm a bit surprised they didn't give it a real display.
Folks...with all respect, just want to clarify that the menu system on the ProVari is ridiculously simple; as simple as simple can be. Give the button 5 quick presses, you're in the menus. From there, you just scroll through to the desired one, wait a second...and there you go.
Pu = Power Up
Pd = Power Down
Po = Power On / Off
Cb = Check Battery
Ro = Resistance (Ohms)
Lo = Light On / Off (for the button)
I had absolutely no difficulty whatsoever comprehending the menu system of the ProVari. It was so simple & intuitive, that it was an immediate breeze. Mind you, it helps if you've actually done a bit of reading about the unit you're intending to purchase, beforehand...or at least watched a video review or two. Scott Bonner's video review is perfect on that score, as he goes through the menu system one by one & shows you how incredibly simple & easy it is. (See the bottom of this post for the vid.)
Also, ProVape doesn't include a physical user manual with any of its units anymore; we didn't get one. They have their manuals available electronically, in PDF form on their site, for anyone who wants to read them. They do this because it's better for the environment...you know, to save some trees. Yay!
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I realize the ProVari isn't everyone's cup of tea. Ditto the Darwin; ditto the impending Eclipse eq. Ditto the 510 for that matter, lol.
Sometimes a feature that attracts one person to a model, repulses another person. I know that I personally have no desire for a juice-feeding PV, for example...top or bottom. Yet for some folks, this is an essential feature.
All I can say is that the ProVari exceeded my expectations by far. I'm very happy with it, and can't think of anything I'd change about it. There are no negatives that I can see, at least for me.
Just wanted to address the menu question really, with this post. It may sound like it's a pain in the behind...but trust me, it really isn't. Once you see how simple & easy it is, you don't even think about it. You rarely need to even access the menus anyway; most of the time, you're just vaping!
Anyway...happy vaping folks & all the best!
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P.S. Here's Scott's video review of the ProVari:
Pu = Power Up
Pd = Power Down
Po = Power On / Off
Cb = Check Battery
Ro = Resistance (Ohms)
Lo = Light On / Off (for the button)
I had absolutely no difficulty whatsoever comprehending the menu system of the ProVari. It was so simple & intuitive, that it was an immediate breeze. Mind you, it helps if you've actually done a bit of reading about the unit you're intending to purchase, beforehand...or at least watched a video review or two. Scott Bonner's video review is perfect on that score, as he goes through the menu system one by one & shows you how incredibly simple & easy it is. (See the bottom of this post for the vid.)
Also, ProVape doesn't include a physical user manual with any of its units anymore; we didn't get one. They have their manuals available electronically, in PDF form on their site, for anyone who wants to read them. They do this because it's better for the environment...you know, to save some trees. Yay!
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I realize the ProVari isn't everyone's cup of tea. Ditto the Darwin; ditto the impending Eclipse eq. Ditto the 510 for that matter, lol.
Sometimes a feature that attracts one person to a model, repulses another person. I know that I personally have no desire for a juice-feeding PV, for example...top or bottom. Yet for some folks, this is an essential feature.
All I can say is that the ProVari exceeded my expectations by far. I'm very happy with it, and can't think of anything I'd change about it. There are no negatives that I can see, at least for me.
Just wanted to address the menu question really, with this post. It may sound like it's a pain in the behind...but trust me, it really isn't. Once you see how simple & easy it is, you don't even think about it. You rarely need to even access the menus anyway; most of the time, you're just vaping!
Anyway...happy vaping folks & all the best!
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P.S. Here's Scott's video review of the ProVari:
Dog nor I had any difficulty understanding the menu system. That wasn't any issue at all. Dog's issue with the menu system, mine as well, is the nature of having to change something can be overburdensome. Change the voltage? Sure, 5 clicks to get to the menu option, however many clicks to get to your desired voltage. Didn't want to go up? 7 clicks to get to the menu option, however many clicks to get to your desired voltage. Miss your voltage? Sucks to be you, gotta roll it around the bend to get back to where you needed to be. Button sticky or miss when you try to get to your voltage? Sucks to be you, gotta roll it around the bend to get to where you need to be. Different juices hit at different voltages so it's kind of a pain if you are swapping out carts, even if they are the same resistance. Granted, the system seems daunting at first and it's easy enough to get use to, but compared to any dial type voltage (Infinity, Darwin, etc) it really isn't the same. But yes, the menu is simple in it's layout format. However, it's usability leaves something to be desired and that is specifically what Dog and I are referring to. I know, because he made the same exact comments when he got a chance at my ProVari. I've done HFE/HSI work before and trust me, it is the only weak area on the ProVari but it's a significant fault.
If you think the only reason why a manual isn't provided in print format is to save the environment, that's your opinion and you are entitled to it. Fact is, printing takes money. Prior to going to print you have to make an electronic one anyway.
If you think the only reason why a manual isn't provided in print format is to save the environment, that's your opinion and you are entitled to it. Fact is, printing takes money. Prior to going to print you have to make an electronic one anyway.
I respect your opinion, ClayK. The ProVari is obviously not everyone's cup of tea. Just pointing out that it's a subjective issue, rather than an objective one. From my subjective perspective, it's not an issue at all. The menu selection never feels 'burdensome' to me. I wouldn't change a thing.
Oh and yes, I understand that not printing up manuals saves ProVape money too. But it's also good for the environment. No one nowadays really needs a printed manual.
At any rate, happy vaping!
Oh and yes, I understand that not printing up manuals saves ProVape money too. But it's also good for the environment. No one nowadays really needs a printed manual.
At any rate, happy vaping!
wow ... lots of good posts here dealing with specifics of each and also a broader discussion of state of the art vaping a la 2011.
Folks, we're in the first stages of the next level of vaping technology... "smart" pv's will become more refined and eventually the chaff will be weeded out, and the wheat will be synthesized into more spot-on pv's.
I have been a Provari fan since they came out, got in on the first run, and now have 2. It seems the best for me, and after considering the various perspectives and expectations on this thread, i can see why there are valid issues all around.
I have been obsesssed with vaping for a year... been through all the bottom feeders, before I got the Vari. I am a "picky" vaper, but ironically it's because I haven't found a better way to vape than the tried and true dripping technique. I claim that you just can't get the very best taste from any other method.
I agree with Stownz that if you know enough about batts and attys, Ohms, amps, watts etc, you can pick and choose your weapons, but for me, I just love the convenience of regulated and variable power... every vape is true voltage regulated down to the last volt in the batt discharge cycle. (i switch out at the blinking light 3.5 v)
For me the range of use on the Vari is perfect: 2.0 to around 4 Ohm attys.
I prefer 2.2 to 3.5 Ohm... On the Vari, any lower is fail, and any higher is a stretch, but I consider that a wide range to get the optimal vape from.
I think all the concerns about each difference in the Darwin and Provari are valid, and depending on what you are looking for, the complexities need researching.
I've had a Darwin and in spite of it having a few more factors in its technology, the neg. issues it does have made me choose to keep my Vari.
I won't go into them all as they seem to be covered well here, and so have the good points about it which can't be denied.
No one so far has mentioned that the Buzz and Infinity from Notcigs.com are regulated as well (Buck boosted). The original Buzz and Infininty needs a screwdriver to adjust, and no LCD screen, but a new *Pro Series is due out around the time of the Eclipse (a few weeks) and they also have a VVPV model that is a top feeder.
I hear they were the first to come out with regulated power (Buzz). The Pro series will include a wheel for adjusting, it uses protected batts that last much longer, and will handle LR. Volt range 3.+ to 5.5 ( i think) true voltage.
(the Eclipse is an automatic top feed and it remains to be seen how well it simulates hands on dripping).
Thanks all you Canadians ! maybe we in the U.S. have been too busy vapin away on our "smart PV's" to be able to get a broader view of what's what... jk.
Rachel, your batt times on the Vari indicate you are not a heavy vaper.... i agree with most what you say, except to me, it's been proven, USB and batt times are a plus for Darwin ( i have 5 18650's in rotation between my 2 Vari's daily and i easily use 4 a day)...
I am planning on grabbing a Buzz Pro as soon as it gets out.
I have been on the list for the Eclipse, but I think i will pass, as it is a feeder, and even if it proves to be the first good Top Feeder, you still are locked into 6ml....
I currently drip about 10 different flavors a day.
My dream set up would be 4 or 5 Vari/Darwin/Buzz/Infinity ... so i can dedicate to different flavors.
Folks, we're in the first stages of the next level of vaping technology... "smart" pv's will become more refined and eventually the chaff will be weeded out, and the wheat will be synthesized into more spot-on pv's.
I have been a Provari fan since they came out, got in on the first run, and now have 2. It seems the best for me, and after considering the various perspectives and expectations on this thread, i can see why there are valid issues all around.
I have been obsesssed with vaping for a year... been through all the bottom feeders, before I got the Vari. I am a "picky" vaper, but ironically it's because I haven't found a better way to vape than the tried and true dripping technique. I claim that you just can't get the very best taste from any other method.
I agree with Stownz that if you know enough about batts and attys, Ohms, amps, watts etc, you can pick and choose your weapons, but for me, I just love the convenience of regulated and variable power... every vape is true voltage regulated down to the last volt in the batt discharge cycle. (i switch out at the blinking light 3.5 v)
For me the range of use on the Vari is perfect: 2.0 to around 4 Ohm attys.
I prefer 2.2 to 3.5 Ohm... On the Vari, any lower is fail, and any higher is a stretch, but I consider that a wide range to get the optimal vape from.
I think all the concerns about each difference in the Darwin and Provari are valid, and depending on what you are looking for, the complexities need researching.
I've had a Darwin and in spite of it having a few more factors in its technology, the neg. issues it does have made me choose to keep my Vari.
I won't go into them all as they seem to be covered well here, and so have the good points about it which can't be denied.
No one so far has mentioned that the Buzz and Infinity from Notcigs.com are regulated as well (Buck boosted). The original Buzz and Infininty needs a screwdriver to adjust, and no LCD screen, but a new *Pro Series is due out around the time of the Eclipse (a few weeks) and they also have a VVPV model that is a top feeder.
I hear they were the first to come out with regulated power (Buzz). The Pro series will include a wheel for adjusting, it uses protected batts that last much longer, and will handle LR. Volt range 3.+ to 5.5 ( i think) true voltage.
(the Eclipse is an automatic top feed and it remains to be seen how well it simulates hands on dripping).
Thanks all you Canadians ! maybe we in the U.S. have been too busy vapin away on our "smart PV's" to be able to get a broader view of what's what... jk.
Rachel, your batt times on the Vari indicate you are not a heavy vaper.... i agree with most what you say, except to me, it's been proven, USB and batt times are a plus for Darwin ( i have 5 18650's in rotation between my 2 Vari's daily and i easily use 4 a day)...
I am planning on grabbing a Buzz Pro as soon as it gets out.
I have been on the list for the Eclipse, but I think i will pass, as it is a feeder, and even if it proves to be the first good Top Feeder, you still are locked into 6ml....
I currently drip about 10 different flavors a day.
My dream set up would be 4 or 5 Vari/Darwin/Buzz/Infinity ... so i can dedicate to different flavors.
oh btw i forgot to mention (among other things) that the Vari weight even with the extension for 18650 is not the slightest problem for me.
I've had mine for about 8 months and i still marvel at how well made these are.
I've had mine for about 8 months and i still marvel at how well made these are.
I had a buzz a long time ago, really hated the screwdriver thing. Would have been onboard with the release of the infinity, but since quality was absolutely horrible, and too many people ...... off about that, I skipped it. Then Buzz decided he was going patent ALL VV technology like he invented it. Will never again do business with notcigs due to that. His patent will never go through, but the fact that he wants to own the entire VV market with some seriously over-rated mods---nah. If buzz had it his way, there would be no Provari, or Darwin, or VV ali, or Lil Sis, ect... The competition in this market is what allows us better and better mods everyday.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/notcigs/185067-variable-voltage-patent.html
The thread that ended all business with anything made by buzz.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/notcigs/185067-variable-voltage-patent.html
The thread that ended all business with anything made by buzz.
I respect your opinion, ClayK. The ProVari is obviously not everyone's cup of tea. Just pointing out that it's a subjective issue, rather than an objective one. From my subjective perspective, it's not an issue at all. The menu selection never feels 'burdensome' to me. I wouldn't change a thing.
Oh and yes, I understand that not printing up manuals saves ProVape money too. But it's also good for the environment. No one nowadays really needs a printed manual.
At any rate, happy vaping!
I agree that most things are subjective, however, usability from a Human Factors Engineering (HFE) / Human Systems Integration (HSI) are not necessarily subjective. They are rooted in the science of what is usable or more easily usable to a human. Granted, it's partially a subjective science, but one whose basis is in subjective probability. It becomes less subjective and more objective when statistical probability and analytical rigor is applied to it. I stated it was an area that I'm all to familiar with, I hate to bore anyone (or you) with the details of it. Suffice to say, I base my "opinion" on that experience and knowledge. You can call it subjective all you want, it doesn't necessarily make it so, my experience and statistical background would disagree with your opinion. So, I hope you can understand why I disagree with your assessment that is just my "opinion". It's more of a fact than an opinion. The fact that it doesn't bother you, that's fine as well. It's what we call an outlier in statistical probability. That is to say, you are outside the normal statistical range.
Like Stownz, I'm an honest broker.
Agreed though, happy vaping!
I'll take a stab at this one... with all due respect Clay, (and i knew i'd get into the nitty gritty too... lol)
I think "sucks to be you" is a little overstated...
because although true, an issue, imo it isn't as "over burdensome" and doesn't suck (if you will) as much as some of the downsides to the Darwin imo.
It's the overall sum of pro's and cons.... and how or to what degree they or it "sucks".
haha just kiddin around... but i have to agree with rachel that the Vari is better because it's "concerns" (?) are less burdensome, and when you focus in on what the Vari does well, in my case I have claimed, and still do, that the Vari is simply easier to use.
In my case that would be for the ultimate in vaping experience (imo); dripping.
I can't speak for those that use cartos or tanks and the like, but in the whole, because the Darwin button is hard to press and hold, my opinion involves all.
Darwin: I love the idea of seeing all the info on the LCD (although too small for most to read easily, and lighting is not the best) and the watts factor, and the range of Ohm attys it handles, the USB, and the batt charge cycle time.
Vari: the button on the Vari is a delight... the form and materials, drip well, bright LCD, blinking warn signals, protection circuits, on/off... make the Vari better ... imo.
the Darwin can be better to handle more varied atty resistances, and have more increments of wattage, but the Vari, in its range, is just as good... just easier and therefore more of a pleasure to use.
hope i haven't made a mess of logic here...
I think "sucks to be you" is a little overstated...
because although true, an issue, imo it isn't as "over burdensome" and doesn't suck (if you will) as much as some of the downsides to the Darwin imo.
It's the overall sum of pro's and cons.... and how or to what degree they or it "sucks".
haha just kiddin around... but i have to agree with rachel that the Vari is better because it's "concerns" (?) are less burdensome, and when you focus in on what the Vari does well, in my case I have claimed, and still do, that the Vari is simply easier to use.
In my case that would be for the ultimate in vaping experience (imo); dripping.
I can't speak for those that use cartos or tanks and the like, but in the whole, because the Darwin button is hard to press and hold, my opinion involves all.
Darwin: I love the idea of seeing all the info on the LCD (although too small for most to read easily, and lighting is not the best) and the watts factor, and the range of Ohm attys it handles, the USB, and the batt charge cycle time.
Vari: the button on the Vari is a delight... the form and materials, drip well, bright LCD, blinking warn signals, protection circuits, on/off... make the Vari better ... imo.
the Darwin can be better to handle more varied atty resistances, and have more increments of wattage, but the Vari, in its range, is just as good... just easier and therefore more of a pleasure to use.
hope i haven't made a mess of logic here...
Any mod has downsides, I agree with everyone for their criticism on both ends of the spectrum. While I haven't had the chance to use a provari, I have briefly used a Darwin. I like how solid the device feels, the way it looks and the way it functions (The vape from the Darwin has not been rivaled since I tried it) but it is not a durable mechanical mod like some people need.
It's rather expensive as well, but if you count the accessories, batteries, etc for the Provari you will ultimately spend about the same for either unit imo. If I had to choose it would still be a Darwin, but that mod would never leave the house. I'll take my much more durable Icon along with me if I am charging my eGo.
So a $200+ home device is not on my priorities list... But it would be nice to have.
It's rather expensive as well, but if you count the accessories, batteries, etc for the Provari you will ultimately spend about the same for either unit imo. If I had to choose it would still be a Darwin, but that mod would never leave the house. I'll take my much more durable Icon along with me if I am charging my eGo.
So a $200+ home device is not on my priorities list... But it would be nice to have.
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