Is " Start Simple" Really a Good Option for Noobs?

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The Ocelot

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There didn't used to be as many choices. I quit smoking just fine with a joyetech 650mAh eGo kit and these blank cartridges you stuffed with foam and shoved into an atty. I thought I was in freaking heaven! It was a steal at about $70.00.

With so many options now it could be that new vapers have the feeling that that there's a perfect vape hiding somewhere in the hardware if they could just find it.
 

chrismikehead

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I'm in the "start with an eGo style" camp, although I'd recommend an EVOD or T3s clearo. Simple, not too big, and easy to use. Add in that it makes a great backup if/when you decide to upgrade, and it is a solid choice to start out.

Also, it is a great unit to have for a loaner/PIF for someone who is interested in vaping. Then they can start out with an MVP right out of the gate. :D
 

Credo

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All depends on the 'noob'.

Listen...
Someone who puffs on half an ultra lite a few times a day will have very different needs than someone who deep inhales 3 packs of full flavor non-filtered Lucky's a day!

Do they like pipes? Cigars? Are they into collecting stuff? Do they enjoy working with their hands or not? What about lifestyle? Do they sit at a desk most of the day or are they chunking 80 lbd tools around in extreme weather? What's the budget? Any disabilities (vision, arthritis, shaky hands, missing fingers, etc.)? Do they have big hands or small ones? How do they like their coffee (steaming hot...luke warm...not at all..etc.)

It's important to ask these kinds of questions if someone is seeking help picking a first PV. These days there are hundreds of choices...nearly all of them good for various needs/reasons.

If someone with a 3 pack a day full flavor habit asks me for advice...I steer them straight to the big stuff (high powered mods), along with encouragement, but sincere warnings that there will be a learning curve to safely get enough kick out of an eCig to fill the gap of 50+ filterless smokes a day. The shape and nature of the devices I'd show them first would be in accordance to their lifestyle. I.E. Someone that sits at a desk most of the day and owns a briefcase full of eGadgets would probably enjoy USB based stuff with built in LiPo batteries. In contrast, a shipyard welder would be more inclined to enjoy something that's built like a tank...won't break if it's chunked in a box or belt full of heavy tools, with easily changeable batteries (preferably compatible with his existing arsenal of tool batteries and chargers if possible) since they probably work and move around in a LARGE space over the course of the day. A sportsman would probably need waterproof stuff that's as light as possible...etc. A Pro Golfer might better be served by a fist full of mini-cig-a-likes with auto-air-switches (hands free mouth hangers).

Little things matter as well.
Do they wear lots of rings on their fingers? If so, how would the PV you're showing them interact with their jewelry (If they have a hand full of gold and platinum rings...might wanna steer them to something soft enough that it won't destroy them...of leave flecks of finish in their stone settings, etc...). Right handed or left handed? Are they allergic to anything (some people's skin and low quality metals just don't get along at all). Does the area they live in have long cold winters (it sure would be nice to be able to vape without having to pull off the driving gloves or snow mittens)?

So...really, the whole point here is LISTEN...sometimes we're too eager to 'talk and lecture' about what 'I' like in a PV. It's good to share your experiences, preferences, and why...but if you're gonna vape coach...spend 4 minutes LISTENING and OBSERVING them for every 1 minute you 'speak and lecture'.

As for what to screw on the end...no one can answer that but the person vaping. Think of lifestyle, price, etc...when recommending the stuff to 'try first'...but really, a variety of things in the beginning is probably wise...so they can form their own opinion.

Everyone is different, and while it's true we should never 'assume' people are 'ready' for 'complexity'...the reverse is also true. Many people are ready, and SHOULD start with something more complex (particularly if they have 'complex' vaping needs). The only way to know is to chat with the person to see what they already know about batteries and such, and what they like in a 'smoking' experience...and of course...what sort of lifestyle they enjoy most.

It's good not to overwhelm a noobie...but at the same time...'simple' isn't necessarily always the best 'just because' it's a noob's first PV.

Wordy Philosophy from Experience:
As a music teacher the discussion constantly comes up: Should they be started on the simplest/cheapest thing available for 'beginners' or should they just skip straight to a mid-line instrument or better? In a way it depends on the child (and choice of instrument) and the family's budget, but at the end of the day kids that start out on an upper-line instrument are FAR LESS likely to give up and quit. It plays better and puts them at a slight advantage from day one! Less fighting the thing to make it sound good. It's more of an 'investment', so it's a little harder for them to just quit after one bad lesson or experience. It has 70% or better resale value...where getting the 'starter' horn has pretty much ZERO. It can be 'fixed' when something goes wrong, where the starter line is much closer to disposable (these days that is).

In the USA sometimes we superior type A folks get preoccupied with 'dumbing things down' so those 'beneath us' can undersand, and it's KILLING US as a nation.

Look at a newly formed band program in Japan after only 8 weeks of meeting an hour a day. They start them on THE BEST equipment available from day one...8 weeks later, they're already outperforming programs here in the states that have been organized for 3 or 4 years. While we're convinced things have to be 'kept simple' or kids can't do it....we're often stuck with a gut wrenching squeaky rendition of "Three Blind Mice" (even given identical rehearsal hours and raw talent that is on par with any other group of kids in the world)...while the kids in Japan are already Playing Grade 5 "Stars and Stripes Forever" by first year's end and doing it well!

Granted the best equipment alone won't make a good orchestra...but it DOES make a BIG difference...no question about it.

There are good arguments for the beginner line stuff too...but again, it depends on so many factors other than 'keeping it simple'.
 
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madqatter

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2 days ago I recieved my MVP V2 with an iClear 30 and now I look at the other purchases and can't help but think "Why didn't I just buy this in the first place!"
Lots of great responses so far.

I've spent a lot of time trying to explain to people that eGo-style batteries are not as massive as they think they are. It's really hard to sell them on something like the MVP....

"I can't carry that huge thing around!"
"It's smaller than a box of 100s. It fits in your hand. You carry smokes around with you all the time."
"It looks so HUGE! I just want something that looks like a cigarette!"

:laugh:
 

Credo

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Lots of great responses so far.

I've spent a lot of time trying to explain to people that eGo-style batteries are not as massive as they think they are. It's really hard to sell them on something like the MVP....

"I can't carry that huge thing around!"
"It's smaller than a box of 100s. It fits in your hand. You carry smokes around with you all the time."
"It looks so HUGE! I just want something that looks like a cigarette!"

:laugh:

So true...
I still remember my first eCig. In my mind...I wanted a 510 or 808!
I even tried it and LIKED it, but after about 2 weeks it was clear it wouldn't be enough to get me off the stinkies. Today I use high powered mods, but I still love a good auto battery mini for the golf course...whimpy vape, but not at all in the way of the game.

Some of us are hard-headed...that's ok :)
Just smile and lettum know there are literally THOUSANDS of models out these days.

I fell in love with the Darwin years ago because I live in a USB world...I have friends that would not touch it with a 200ft pole because you can't just 'pop in a fresh battery'.

That's the cool thing about PVs right now. If they say they don't wanna big fat Ego...OK...they can try an 808 or 510 kit :)

Something else you might show them are some of the old Pen Styles (if you can still find them). I.E. the 801, the LEO. They're about the same size as an EGO, but because it looks like an ink pen...there's a different psychological impact. Some of those models (Higher end LEOs) had MORE punch and battery life than a standard EGO, but looked like a really fine executive ink pen in your shirt pocket :)

Folks have choices these days :)

Observe, Listen...help them find it...something probably exists for them :)
 
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Durdan1

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After reading and studying this forum I went from ego c twist to provari...then I went to protank to ibtanked then trident but I sold it on eBay with m16 mechanical mod because it wausent my thing...now waiting for kayfun 3.1 clone in mail. But I'm pretty happy where I'm at now with ibtanked and boge cartomizer after all I went through. Hey! What's important is that you stopped smoking! And started vaping.
 

jjuice

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Lots of great responses so far.

I've spent a lot of time trying to explain to people that eGo-style batteries are not as massive as they think they are. It's really hard to sell them on something like the MVP....

"I can't carry that huge thing around!"
"It's smaller than a box of 100s. It fits in your hand. You carry smokes around with you all the time."
"It looks so HUGE! I just want something that looks like a cigarette!"

:laugh:

What would you suggest for an easy maintenance tank to go with the MVP2?
 

ShariR

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This is an excellent thread and great opinions voiced by all. I picked up a Blu on a whim while buying a carton of cigarettes. Tried it and even though it would never work for me to quit smoking, as I smoked 2 pad for 45 years, it intrigued me enough to do a google search and find ECF. It took well over two weeks of research and driving the vets in New Members Forum crazy from all the questions I asked, but they taught me enough to find out that the Myvaporstore Vision Spinner 1300mah kit and Evods was to be my first setup. I still have and use them. I got my MVP2 last week.

I wanted something that looked and tasted exactly like a cigarette. If that is what I would have bought and tried to use, I would have failed and would still be smoking today. Sometimes we just need to keep the newbie engaged long enough to learn what will work for them. I usually suggest the spinner/evod setup to most new people if I can get them past the must be exactly like a cigarette stage.
 

bosun

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KISS principle. Buy a $50.00 cig-alike kit for minimum fiddling. Some juice. Have the seller educate you. Try it. If it works, you've beaten the coffin nails! Treat yourself to a bigger cig-alike setup. Then you can start the chase for newest and shiniest and the perfect juice.
If it doesn't you're out fifty bucks. Give it to someone else to try.
 

rhean

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"Simple" is deceptive. The most common vaping options most people see are the cigalikes sold in gas stations, Walmart, and Walgreen's. These seem like the simplest option, in that they are visibly there, but they are far from simple in that they're expensive and less effective than a battery+clearomizer. Getting to the battery+clearomizer stage is complicated, as you have to do research, which takes time which many people don't have. I have time (housewife lol) and I ran into the non-cigalike option by accident, while looking for ways of refilling cigalike cartridges myself.

If you do the research, you sadly face terminology which makes what really is a very simple set up (battery+tank+juice) sound far more complicated than it is.

I am, literally, the only human being I have ever seen vaping in Wisconsin. The reason imo is the ineffectiveness and expense of what is most readily available, and the difficulty of understanding, then procuring the truly simple, effective, inexpensive set up that will work for most people--battery+tank+juice.
 
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dice57

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No, no, no, get a Provari, a mech mod, a vtr, a 134, 5 rba's half a dozen batteries, and 2 chargers, and lots of juice. That way you'll be in it so deep, you'll never pick up smokes again.

Actually, I'm with you. Get a quality regulated device to start off with. Pair it up with a good tank, that will produce the vape. Whether it be a cartomizer or replaceable coil head atty, like the Aspire BDC or Iclear 30s or 30. Then maybe look into an rba or rda, if you feel you need more vape and want to build. Once you find your flavors of juice and nic levels and VG/Pg ratio, then consider DIY juices.

Although vaping is a progressive and expanding learning experience, and one shouldn't take to big of steps at once, getting a quality powerful battery device mod, is a great place to start, and can grow with it as you expand your vape learning base.
 

K_Tech

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Is " Start Simple" Really a Good Option for Noobs?

Yes, I think so, because there's always going to be those folks that find they like it and stay with it.

(I'm not one of those folks because I like tinkering with new, shiny things).

I think starters should get the disposable ones for 7-10 dollars for a few weeks and if there sticking with it should then upgrade to something your using now. I also did the same thing as you at first, must've spent 100 on different sized batteries then spent another hundo on a variable voltage variable wattage system in the first month.

I have to respectfully disagree, because my dissatisfaction with those 7-10 dollar disposables is what kept me smoking for several years before accidentally stumbling into vaping. I've now had my longest cigarette-free streak ever because of vaping, and I can't say I ever went more than a day without bumming a cigarette or buying my own pack when I was messing with those disposables.
 

chanelvaps

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I spent a fortune on ecigs, Blu, cheap gas station vaps and kept smoking analogs and hiding it-wondering why it was not all working for me. Have a drawer full of gadgets.
Once I found the world of real vaping I have not wanted a cig. Loved my Egoc twist and learned about stuff with that (Mah, resistance, etc) now I am torn between Vamo and SVD-I agree that one should never have to mess around with anything other than a Twist or an MVP to really get the experience. You will just closet smoke and never really get it.
 

Stosh

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No, no, no, get a Provari, a mech mod, a vtr, a 134, 5 rba's half a dozen batteries, and 2 chargers, and lots of juice. That way you'll be in it so deep, you'll never pick up smokes again. .....

Never thought of it in that perspective....:laugh:

Actually, I'm with you. Get a quality regulated device to start off with. Pair it up with a good tank, that will produce the vape. Whether it be a cartomizer or replaceable coil head atty, like the Aspire BDC or Iclear 30s or 30.

And miss out on the fun of rebuilding as a coil just so you can get a vape?? Coil the wire with your hands that are shaking from nicotine withdrawal, carefully slide the wire you can't even see unless the light hits it just right into a hole that is not even smooth all the way through, so the end catches and bends, get it all together and thread a wick into the new coil, wet it down with juice, fire it up and it pops!! :facepalm:

If I started out trying this, I would likely still be smoking, and need help burying the dead bodies....:laugh:
 

Ref Minor

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The vast majority of people get along fine with prefilled cig-a-likes. We are the odd people, the people here on ECF are in no way representative of vapers, just the hobbyist wing.

As others have said listen to what people want. Someone coming here saying I smoked 10 a day, money is no object, I want something small and simple is probably suited to a Blu or Greensmoke. Someone else who says I want something cheap and simple, size not important to replace 60 a day will be happy with a Vamo/Protank. Someone who says I want the best regardless and am happy to fiddle should get a Provari or Semovar with a good RBA.

The problem I see here is people on here recommending what they are currently using regardless of what information the OP has supplied, we end up with someone who is a light smoker and a technical klutz who wants something cheap and simple that looks like a cigarette so they can smoke at work without looking like a freak being recommended a Provari with a Kayfun and told to recoil their wicks and DIY their own juice.
 
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