Looks like the ProVari may have a rival.

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cozzicon

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Slurp812

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The filter smooths the output (carto/atty) pluses making it closer to DC, as opposed to large pulses. Some ripple would still remain on the DC, how much is a function of the quality (size/complexity) of the output filter. A single capacitor would be the simplest filter. Too much filtering would not be necessary when driving a coil of resistance wire, and would also hurt efficiency...
 
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Hottody

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Sounds like you know your stuff! Very interesting!
The filter smooths the output (carto/atty) pluses making it closer to DC, as opposed to large pulses. Some ripple would still remain on the DC, how much is a function of the quality (size/complexity) of the output filter. A single capacitor would be the simplest filter. Too much filtering would not be necessary when driving a coil of resistance wire, and would also hurt efficiency...
 

atavanhalen

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I'm just curious what is meant by a "filter". I've heard that alot lately. A PWM voltage is a voltage that is instantly on for a period of time, then instantly off for another period of time (duty cycle). Let's say you have a 9v signal for 333ms "on" and 667ms "off", you'd have a 33.3% duty cycle with an average voltage of around 3v, although the peak to peak voltage of the initial pulse is 9v. Where does this "filter" come in and how can it affect the PWM? I would say it doesn't because the nature of the signal is such that the modulation from 0-9v and back to zero is already filtered.......else how did it get from 0-9v and back again. Provari lovers like to say that their device's PWM is "filtered" and hence make them MUCH better....

Just a BTW...."most E-cigs are using PWM".....is absolutely incorrect. Most E-cigs are using direct current derived by a Lithium-ion battery directly coupled to a coil via a switch. A small percentage, i.e. Provari, Lavatubes, etc use PWM to make their products more attractive and prolong battery life. ANY device that is employing PWM is, by definition, already filtered.......

Just watch this and pay attention to the technical stuff from around 12 min till about 26 min. You may not understand it, but it explains it. A PBusardo Review - The V-Max by SmokTech - All About Vapor - YouTube

Paul

There are a lot that do, the joyetech ego uses pwm. I would not say that most use it but there are a lot out there that do.
 

niczgreat

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I'm just curious what is meant by a "filter". I've heard that alot lately. A PWM voltage is a voltage that is instantly on for a period of time, then instantly off for another period of time (duty cycle). Let's say you have a 9v signal for 333ms "on" and 667ms "off", you'd have a 33.3% duty cycle with an average voltage of around 3v, although the peak to peak voltage of the initial pulse is 9v. Where does this "filter" come in and how can it affect the PWM? I would say it doesn't because the nature of the signal is such that the modulation from 0-9v and back to zero is already filtered.......else how did it get from 0-9v and back again. Provari lovers like to say that their device's PWM is "filtered" and hence make them MUCH better....

Just a BTW...."most E-cigs are using PWM".....is absolutely incorrect. Most E-cigs are using direct current derived by a Lithium-ion battery directly coupled to a coil via a switch. A small percentage, i.e. Provari, Lavatubes, etc use PWM to make their products more attractive and prolong battery life. ANY device that is employing PWM is, by definition, already filtered.......

Just watch this and pay attention to the technical stuff from around 12 min till about 26 min. You may not understand it, but it explains it. A PBusardo Review - The V-Max by SmokTech - All About Vapor - YouTube

Paul

It would be interesting to add the Ego, Lava, Provari,Smoktech Gripper, Ovale, VMax and a bunch of others together. I think they just might be a majority. I welcome others to add more Manufacturers using PWM technology.
 

ShogaNinja

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Anyone here when the VARIO will be in stock?

I taked to Tim for a LONG time today and he is THINKING that they will be available after three weeks time. I will be getting one (hopefully pre-release) and I will be doing a full review on it. I'll let you know if things change.
 

ShogaNinja

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Can't go wrong with a Provari, it's my favorite device! The VARIO looks nice for an Asian made VV device though. When you think about it, there are only so many ways you can change the design of an electronic vaporizer! I think the VARIO does a nice job from a design perspective. We will have to see how it performs. Looks like the VARIO will accommodate an ego vision tank without an adapter which many will appreciate!

You can go wrong with the Provari's price. Often that is not stated. It's just a tube with some circuits and an LED screen. It also hasn't undergone any major design changes while the Ecig world changes around it, as evidenced by the fact that it doesn't fit Stardusts (vision clearomizers as you referred to them as). Not that the Stardust is an awesome clearomizer, it USED to be, but now there's the E1-V and the Vivi Nova Mini, but that's the point. You NEVER know what's coming next and versatility is key in this market. What if tomorrow there's a new clearomizer that uses ego cone threads like the Stardust? With the Provari you'd need an adapter. If I was wrong about the Provari's price point then there wouldn't be a lavatube market. It is that same market that will likely make the Vario a lavatube killer. If it performs well and is durable it may even be the Provari Killer. But let's not speculate. Let's take this one step at a time.

I'll be in touch with Tim as he gets the Beta review model here shortly and I will let you know what he says. I am going to get some face time with him and do an interview about the Vario ASAP.

As you said, there are few things you can do to improve the Provari, but Provapes hasn't been doing them. The Vario is attempting to change the game. The one thing that would be cool about the Vario is if you could change the tube sleeves. That would be an awesome feature.
 

ShogaNinja

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This design looks really great to me! It is indeed different with the chrome and painted finish. To me...this looks better then anything I've seen from Asia. There are only so many ways one can modify a VV battery mod, so slight changes are appreciated. To me this looks like a next generation Provari and that's a compliment. I also like the name and logo of the Vario very much!

Vaporbeast is an AWSOME vendor so I do wish them luck with this device. :)

Yeah, I think I'm coming around on the name. Plus, it does look better than the lavatube and maybe even the provari. Who doesn't want a dang lightsaber? When I get one I am going to make a jedi belt like Luke had and walk around like that lol.

Vaporbeast is gonna be the darkhorse of ecig vendors coming from the rear of the pack for an upset victory. Who doesn't like free shipping on ALL orders big or small, and hassle-free returns? If you consider the cost of shipping that you'd have to pay with another vendor (at least with small orders) they may have the lowest prices on the internet.
 

ShogaNinja

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that was mentioned as a possible co-op,,it is from china

From the mouth of Tim himself, it's from China, but so are 99% of all ecigs. If Chinese ecigs didn't work then there would be no vaping community. China shouldn't be an ugly word. If there's a problem with it he'll take care of it and send you a new one before you know it.
 

cozzicon

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You can go wrong with the Provari's price. Often that is not stated. It's just a tube with some circuits and an LED screen. It also hasn't undergone any major design changes while the Ecig world changes around it, as evidenced by the fact that it doesn't fit Stardusts (vision clearomizers as you referred to them as). Not that the Stardust is an awesome clearomizer, it USED to be, but now there's the E1-V and the Vivi Nova Mini, but that's the point. You NEVER know what's coming next and versatility is key in this market. What if tomorrow there's a new clearomizer that uses ego cone threads like the Stardust? With the Provari you'd need an adapter. If I was wrong about the Provari's price point then there wouldn't be a lavatube market. It is that same market that will likely make the Vario a lavatube killer. If it performs well and is durable it may even be the Provari Killer. But let's not speculate. Let's take this one step at a time.

I'll be in touch with Tim as he gets the Beta review model here shortly and I will let you know what he says. I am going to get some face time with him and do an interview about the Vario ASAP.

As you said, there are few things you can do to improve the Provari, but Provapes hasn't been doing them. The Vario is attempting to change the game. The one thing that would be cool about the Vario is if you could change the tube sleeves. That would be an awesome feature.

Well.. there are things about the Imotion2 V+/Vario that don't look that great going forward.

I'm just going to assume that they have fixed the F2 errors on atties below 3.0 ohms. So that's a moot point.

But going forward, this unit is heavier than a Provari, and heavier than a Provari mini. The finish is easily damaged. There's issues for low watt vapers- this thing does not turn itself down far enough which means the duty cycle/power output of the PWM is not accurate against the displayed voltage. Smoktech made that error with the VMAX and paid for it.

Does the regulation work? Yes- it appears so. But I've not put it on a scope. No idea yet about voltage sag under load...

I do have a final version coming to me which should have the following (Note- just told by Skype it will ship today):

1. Spring in the end cap.

2. Vent holes.

3. F2 errors solved.

So, assuming those problems are solved, is it a good PV?

Yes.

A Provari killer?

No.

It might appeal folks due to cheaper price. But it's not comfortable as an all around PV. It's an enthusiast item. And if the voltage calibration remains uncorrected it's going to leave low watt (less than 7 watts) vapers out in the cold unless they use 3.0 or higher atties/cartos- that's the majority of vapers.

I'm glad people are jazzed about a new device comign out. I'm a Provari owner, and I'm really looking forward to something better coming out. Because then I'll be even happier right?

But this doesn't really compete. It destroys just about every Lavatube revision out there and leaves Evolv/Provape product standing tall. It matches the VMAX in performance, but not durability. The Zmax, which I have seen the specs for, Might actually be a "Provari killer"- but it will cannibalize Evolv sales as well.

If the final product revision makes a change to those impressions- any review I do will reflect that.

I just hate to see a lot of hype floating around a unit like this. It's a good PV. Better than *anything* we ever dreamed of when I started vaping. But against the current crop of VV/Regulated mods it's pretty middle of the road. Based on it's projected price, it will sell. And no one should be ashamed to own one. But it's not going to put anyone out of business- let alone Provape.

If the ZMAX does what it's supposed to do... then you will see the market change. But specs on a spreadsheet aren't enough to predict that.
 

ninfreak

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it may have been stated in this thread i have not read the whole thing.....i like that if my provari breaks it is under warranty, and if not it is repaired for cheap! if my china mod breaks i am out of luck. have to buy a new one if it is past a few months old. i would rather pay a lot for something once for many years of use then pay cheap for something i have to replace every few months. you get what you pay for!

o did i mention i can use my provari as a hammer and smash it into a wall and it wont break......try that with your el cheapo china mods.
 
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Hottody

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cozzicon, Good points above! I love my Provari, and my expectations for the VARIO are controlled! I think from a desighn perspective, the VARIO looks great, although the bigger size and heft will certainly not appeal to everyone!

I'm still very much looking forward to this new device! I think your comments above are realistic and provide a fair comparison!
 

cozzicon

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Way to go coz
Somebody has to look out for us
If you don't put it on the scope
I will

Dude... please lets work that out.

I've been fighting buying a scope for some time. I've got one in my garage which I *built* when I was 12. LOL. But it's water damaged.

I'd love to see the output on this thing.
 

cozzicon

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cozzicon, Good points above! I love my Provari, and my expectations for the VARIO are controlled! I think from a desighn perspective, the VARIO looks great, although the bigger size and heft will certainly not appeal to everyone!

I'm still very much looking forward to this new device! I think your comments above are realistic and provide a fair comparison!

I like the Imotion2 V+/Vario as well. Vaped it all day with a 3 ohm carto. Good vape.

Since I just hosed the battery (the only 18650 I have lol) I've gone back to the Provari until morning.

It will get road tested tomorrow as I'm driving to Michigan. But I'll get annoyed at the bulk of the thing and whip out the LT-Mini at some point. Neither the Provari or the Imotion2 V+ are really great for driving.
 

ShogaNinja

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Well.. there are things about the Imotion2 V+/Vario that don't look that great going forward.

I'm just going to assume that they have fixed the F2 errors on atties below 3.0 ohms. So that's a moot point.

But going forward, this unit is heavier than a Provari, and heavier than a Provari mini. The finish is easily damaged. There's issues for low watt vapers- this thing does not turn itself down far enough which means the duty cycle/power output of the PWM is not accurate against the displayed voltage. Smoktech made that error with the VMAX and paid for it.

Does the regulation work? Yes- it appears so. But I've not put it on a scope. No idea yet about voltage sag under load...

I do have a final version coming to me which should have the following (Note- just told by Skype it will ship today):

1. Spring in the end cap.

2. Vent holes.

3. F2 errors solved.

So, assuming those problems are solved, is it a good PV?

Yes.

A Provari killer?

No.

It might appeal folks due to cheaper price. But it's not comfortable as an all around PV. It's an enthusiast item. And if the voltage calibration remains uncorrected it's going to leave low watt (less than 7 watts) vapers out in the cold unless they use 3.0 or higher atties/cartos- that's the majority of vapers.

I'm glad people are jazzed about a new device comign out. I'm a Provari owner, and I'm really looking forward to something better coming out. Because then I'll be even happier right?

But this doesn't really compete. It destroys just about every Lavatube revision out there and leaves Evolv/Provape product standing tall. It matches the VMAX in performance, but not durability. The Zmax, which I have seen the specs for, Might actually be a "Provari killer"- but it will cannibalize Evolv sales as well.

If the final product revision makes a change to those impressions- any review I do will reflect that.

I just hate to see a lot of hype floating around a unit like this. It's a good PV. Better than *anything* we ever dreamed of when I started vaping. But against the current crop of VV/Regulated mods it's pretty middle of the road. Based on it's projected price, it will sell. And no one should be ashamed to own one. But it's not going to put anyone out of business- let alone Provape.

If the ZMAX does what it's supposed to do... then you will see the market change. But specs on a spreadsheet aren't enough to predict that.

I don't plan on carrying the Vario around in my pocket. If anything, I'm going to build a lightsaber belt for it, like Luke :). Plus, I work out so lifting a little puny APV will be a good cool off. Weight isn't necessarily a factor for me. Heavier sometimes means better quality. Maybe I'll throw a Vivi Nova tank with a metal tube on it and use it as a last resort self defense weapon.

As for the other things, I will look into it. No one's trying to put Provapes out of business, if anything it'd just force them to innovate their design. What you said really kinda stinks about the finish. That's the kind of stuff you don't figure out from the pretty pictures. I guess there's always primer and paint. Of course, if you're going to hold that against the Vario you should hold it against the Lavatube too. How many people have Lavatubes that don't say lavatube any more. How many people are vaping a L----UBE? I don't know if they addressed that issue with the Lavatube 2.0 but from what I have seen of it so far it's not much of an improvement over the first one. I haven't seen anyone put it on a voltage meter with a dual coil carto and see if it still regulates it (without your knowledge) down to 3.85v or whatever it was (very close to that surely). At $79 (which by the way the Imotion2 V+ is supposed to sell for a whopping $120 from what I have seen in a cursory look through google) I think function-over-form is the objective.

Umm btw it only goes up to 6v, so what's this 7v talk? A typo? If you're a low watt vaper what the heck would you want an APV for? The Twist has that section on lock down. People who go for APVs are usually either one of two categories of people: reckless throat hit chasers, or people who must absolutely have the best of the best. The Vario only services one of these types; the reckless throat hit chaser. As for portability, I also think the Ego Twist has that category in the VV department. I'd much rather figure out a better way to fit the long-as-heck twist in my pocket than carry around a flashlight. That is, until I get my lightsaber belt. :)

I would greatly appreciate you telling me (even in PM perhaps) what you discover from this new shipment. Also can you please give me the specs to the Zmax? I should very much like to see them.
 

ShogaNinja

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I like the Imotion2 V+/Vario as well. Vaped it all day with a 3 ohm carto. Good vape.

Since I just hosed the battery (the only 18650 I have lol) I've gone back to the Provari until morning.

It will get road tested tomorrow as I'm driving to Michigan. But I'll get annoyed at the bulk of the thing and whip out the LT-Mini at some point. Neither the Provari or the Imotion2 V+ are really great for driving.

That was my point in my previous post. The provari really isn't any better at portability, so for one who has never held one, this added weight is nothing. It's a pet peeve discovered only because of something you are more familiar with; a nitpick, a bias. That's where smaller VVs come into play. I don't see anyone stuffing a provari or a vario in their pocket and going through a work day like that, so I can't hold the weight or size against either of them. Stealth vaping an APV of this size is next to impossible. To me they are home vapes, unless perhaps I am a passenger on a road trip.
 
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