Lots of bad news about vaping recently?!?

[Eitje]

Please understand, the average American.....
- reads at a 6th grade level
- cannot find the United States on a world map
- most likely cannot tell you the name of the current Vice President
- cannot speak a 2nd language (which for many is understandable), but has serious difficulties with their native language.

It should come as no surprise that the "average American" blindly parrots what they hear on television, or from others....whether it is about e-cigs, or anything else. Unfortunately, the dumbing down of our country has been going on for quite some time now.

I'm afraid it is not limited to the US. Its seems to have spread as far as Europe I'm sad to say.
People are praising one liner, bad haircut, populist politicians & not being able to distinct between their Muslim neighbors and an IS fundamentalist in Syria. People seem to have lost all will to even inform themselves but rather stick to shouting with the masses. (Much easier I admit)
I'm glad this forum still has plenty Americans and others that seem to give a damn and challenge and debate topics and even go to great length figuring out what is and what's not.

 

[Jman8]

Read every post in the thread (except for the 30 or so that got deleted).

It does disappoint me how lopsided the data on eCigs has become in short order. But also stimulates my intellectual / rebel side. Helps that vaping has a whole lot going for it, and that opposition is clearly grasping at straws. But stinks that they have popular opinion on their side and that vaping is seen as 'very bad thing to do.'

Was watching NY Eve stuff on TV (CNN, I think) and amidst all the visible drunk people, even some of the people doing the reporting were visibly drunk, I see them pause on the reporting to note a guy is vaping behind them. They used the word vaping. Ask him, "are you vaping?" He being all festive and jovial is like, "yep" with smile on his face. And then they proceed to look into camera and scoff at the idea that someone would do that sort of activity. Wasn't too over the top, but enough of a public scolding to have me take notice. Again, this amidst lots of drinking/drunk people with kids presented as spectacles for viewing audience. I probably spent more time on this paragraph than they did with what I'm conveying, but it was epitome of what I see us up against.

To me, it's the anti-smoking battle continuing to be waged. It's quite popular to hate on smokers. Can get plenty of that here on ECF, and very few (here) will think that is out of line. It's like anything in life where a group of people dislike something and all feel comfortable bashing on that. From my perspective, the shaming part is the ultimate motivator for ANTZ. I get that BT, BP, BG et al stand to gain/lose big money depending on how deeming looks today, a year from now, 10 years from now. I recognize all that matters. I also recognize that one could think that shaming is just a part of the larger picture that says "it's all about the money." IMO, it is not. It's all about the shaming. Having lots of money (or having too little) can be grounds for shaming.

There's a very obvious, clear opposite to shaming, and in my observations it happens the majority of the time. Even with regards to vapers. I could read 5 articles today about how vaping is dangerous, needs to be regulated, is bad, etc. etc. and then go out into public vaping away, probably thinking I'm doing something that others may not like and after all of 3 minutes realize most people really don't care if I'm vaping in their presence. I was out on NY eve at part with around 20 people present and kinda sorta knew going in that I would be the only vaper. After an hour, I confirmed this. About 3 hours later, I asked host if it would be okay for me to vape and they were like, "of course, why not?" From that point on, it very much was a non-issue for everyone there. But because of how conditioned I feel things have become in say last year or so, I was hesitant to even ask. I knew I could just go to restroom and do it without anyone noticing. I'm still going to vape everywhere with respect, but the idea of this being an activity that others find shameful is something I've managed to tune into. Perhaps falsely so, and depending on the situation, I'll perhaps be very respectful of what I think non-vapers would want in a public place, while at other times, I may show up as not caring (and yet will still be respectful).

I'm not sure if things will swing the other way unless it also swing the other way for smoking, as in a majority no longer treat it as deserving of shame. I don't think it needs to happen with just vaping/smoking, but with larger issue of "shall we shame others just because we can?" For most part, I don't think it is the majority opinion / behavior to shame others. But with vaping/smoking, it is turned up a notch and there are maybe 2 other behaviors that come to mind, both of which are less visible to the human eye that I can think of as treated worse than smoking/vaping. Because of how visible vaping/smoking are, I think they are the most popular things that get shamed right now.

And it is sad/disappointing, but also really not a big deal given how utterly easy it is to vape in people's presence and have them show up as clueless to it.

 

[Rossum]

It's quite popular to hate on smokers.

I wonder if the "hate on smokers" that so many former smokers have isn't some sort of defense mechanism they've developed to help keep themselves from slipping back to smoking?

Of course not all former smokers do this, and in my observation, vapers do it less than former smokers who've quit using other means, but it does seem to me that the those who hate on smokers the most loudly tend to be "reformed smokers" themselves.

 

[Coldrake]

it's always the negative articles getting all the attention and that is because their really isn't that many positive articles being put out there. I don't buy that pro vaping causes are doing their part in countering negative articles..but to each their own.

I can only assume that you didn't click on the links in the posts below.

CASAA - The Consumer Advocates for Smoke-free Alternatives Association

American Vaping Association | Vaping to Quit Smoking American Vaping Association

Home INFO link

Investing in our Future

Homepage - SFATA | Smoke Free Alternatives Trade Association

NOT Blowing Smoke

The Vaping Militia

The truth is out there and being published every day. Now, the Main stream Media has no interest in Truth or Lie, only Sales and Hype.
Truth is - Opponents to Vaping have Far more Dollars to Carry their word to the public and have had Decades to refine their tactics.

The Lie is accepting News as Fact of Truth.

As to where is the money going - A lot of it is Lobbying on our behalf, some of it is Smaller publication as Budget allows.
Most of these people are working on our behalf as Unpaid Volunteers.

<iframe src="GLIMMER OF HOPE? - ONTARIO DELAYS VAPING REGULATIONS, REST OF THE COUNTRY BRACES – REG WATCH (E20) from Brent Stafford on Vimeo" width="500" height="281" frameborder="0" webkitallowfullscreen mozallowfullscreen allowfullscreen></iframe>



<iframe src="A BILLION LIVES - EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW W. AARON BIEBERT - REG WATCH (E17) from Brent Stafford on Vimeo" width="500" height="281" frameborder="0" webkitallowfullscreen mozallowfullscreen allowfullscreen></iframe>

I'd like to add this link. vapers.org.uk Hundreds and hundreds of links to pro-vaping articles. You can subscribe on the front page. As crxess said, they just don't make the headlines.

 

[Jman8]

I wonder if the "hate on smokers" that so many former smokers have isn't some sort of defense mechanism they've developed to help keep themselves from slipping back to smoking?

Of course not all former smokers do this, and in my observation, vapers do it less than former smokers who've quit using other means, but it does seem to me that the those who hate on smokers the most loudly tend to be "reformed smokers" themselves.

Agree with all this.

My never smoking friends can at times be vocal about their dislike for smoking, but very rarely engage in shaming. My ex-smoking friends are pretty vocal in their dislike and engage in shaming tactics more than non-smokers. When I went cold turkey, I did all I could to not be like this and pretty much was around 98% of the time.

 

[CasketWeaver]

Ok after getting caught up on the last series of pages I read some things that caught my eye:

"The dumbing down..." - The entire world is suffering from 'dumbing down'. It's sad, but true. The reason they're being dumbed down... I'm not sure, but as one pointed out - they will be easier to control if they're stupid. While I don't take that too seriously, you guys might be on to something...

"Common sense..." - It's not just uncommon anymore, it's becoming a super power. Something not seen too frequently or at all. Those that do possess this great thing called 'common sense' should be referred to as 'super hero's'.

"Self education" - Shouldn't self education fall into the category of 'Common Sense'? I don't know... personally I feel it should. If a person takes the time, the effort, and tries to read up on a topic before they insert proverbial 'foot-in-mouth', we'd all be better off.

"Smoker Slamming" - People actually do this. I'm guilty of slamming cigarettes by themselves - if it offends people of me saying "stay away from those combustible coffin nails"... I apologize... preemptively.

"Collateral Damage" - To the admins... can I have some of my hair back please? When you guys were cleaning up the damage I think some of my hair got knocked off in the blast and since I got a bad case of receding hairline... I just wanna get some of it back so I can glue it back to my toupe.

As for whether or not the 'vapor' I inhale is an aerosol or actual vapor... does it matter? I just posted my observation - didn't think there was anything wrong with my observation either. When held to a light at the right angle, it appears to be an aerosol - but without that light - it appears to be vapor. As far as ohm's law, battery safety, and the other stuff we look into when it comes to vaping... I did a bit of studying before I went on my way to advance to mechanical mods and other various unregulated devices. I actually took the time to read up on the stuff, granted... I didn't understand it fully, but I grasped the basic concepts of it. And for some... the basics are all you need. I did some "toying around" with super low resistances that would be deemed "suicidal" to some, "downright dangerous" to others, and here I am... with all fingers, eyes, lungs, lips, and nose intact, playing with coils and atomizers that most would deem "perfectly ok". As a new vaper, playing with "Genny's" was not something everyone would recommend, but I played with them. Experimented with them and loved the 'hands-on' I got from working with them. Had I not dabbled in genesis style atomizers, I would have never started rebuilding... and more than likely would have went back to smoking instead. I still have a genesis atty in my arsenal today. Still love every second of vaping on it too.

The moral of the story: Some people learn from listening while others learn from doing.

 

[herb]

The word "fear mongering" is really overblown , fear mongering is saying you should not do that because you will suffer health consequences .

Fear mongering is not " be aware of the chemicals your vaping since data on possible health consequences are not available and won't be for some time since vaping large amounts of e juice at high wattage has never been studied . That should be obvious though since most people have only been doing it approx two years.

There are no definitive conclusions with those statements just "common sense" warnings.

 

[crxess]

The word "fear mongering" is really overblown , fear mongering is saying you should not do that because you will suffer health consequences .

Fear mongering is not " be aware of the chemicals your vaping since data on possible health consequences are not available and won't be for some time since vaping large amounts of e juice at high wattage has never been studied . That should be obvious though since most people have only been doing it approx two years.

There are no definitive conclusions with those statements just "common sense" warnings.

You pull that 2yr. rabbit out of your Hat?
ECF Established 2007, but only a small # of the total of Vapers world wide. Then and Now.


Your Statement in Proper News Etiquette

Warining - Ecigs May Be As Bad As Smoking Because there are chemicals your vaping since data on possible health consequences are not available and won't be for some time AND vaping large amounts of e juice at high wattage IS RISKY

Flipping context is their job, not ours and That IS Fear mongering

*Note: I do not disagree with what you are saying, I simply recognize they Never say it that way.

 

[anavidfan]

Yes, there is a lot of neg experiences on vaping lately.

It sucks. Really it does. Conspiracy? Maybe?

SO why dont WE who have positive opinions and experiences slam the internet with GOOD things about vaping.

It sounds silly but Im doing it as often as I can. Even if the posts sound silly, why not ?

 

[MyMagicMist]

Read every post in the thread (except for the 30 or so that got deleted).

It does disappoint me how lopsided the data on eCigs has become in short order. But also stimulates my intellectual / rebel side. Helps that vaping has a whole lot going for it, and that opposition is clearly grasping at straws. But stinks that they have popular opinion on their side and that vaping is seen as 'very bad thing to do.'

Was watching NY Eve stuff on TV (CNN, I think) and amidst all the visible drunk people, even some of the people doing the reporting were visibly drunk, I see them pause on the reporting to note a guy is vaping behind them. They used the word vaping. Ask him, "are you vaping?" He being all festive and jovial is like, "yep" with smile on his face. And then they proceed to look into camera and scoff at the idea that someone would do that sort of activity. Wasn't too over the top, but enough of a public scolding to have me take notice. Again, this amidst lots of drinking/drunk people with kids presented as spectacles for viewing audience. I probably spent more time on this paragraph than they did with what I'm conveying, but it was epitome of what I see us up against.

To me, it's the anti-smoking battle continuing to be waged. It's quite popular to hate on smokers. Can get plenty of that here on ECF, and very few (here) will think that is out of line. It's like anything in life where a group of people dislike something and all feel comfortable bashing on that. From my perspective, the shaming part is the ultimate motivator for ANTZ. I get that BT, BP, BG et al stand to gain/lose big money depending on how deeming looks today, a year from now, 10 years from now. I recognize all that matters. I also recognize that one could think that shaming is just a part of the larger picture that says "it's all about the money." IMO, it is not. It's all about the shaming. Having lots of money (or having too little) can be grounds for shaming.

There's a very obvious, clear opposite to shaming, and in my observations it happens the majority of the time. Even with regards to vapers. I could read 5 articles today about how vaping is dangerous, needs to be regulated, is bad, etc. etc. and then go out into public vaping away, probably thinking I'm doing something that others may not like and after all of 3 minutes realize most people really don't care if I'm vaping in their presence. I was out on NY eve at part with around 20 people present and kinda sorta knew going in that I would be the only vaper. After an hour, I confirmed this. About 3 hours later, I asked host if it would be okay for me to vape and they were like, "of course, why not?" From that point on, it very much was a non-issue for everyone there. But because of how conditioned I feel things have become in say last year or so, I was hesitant to even ask. I knew I could just go to restroom and do it without anyone noticing. I'm still going to vape everywhere with respect, but the idea of this being an activity that others find shameful is something I've managed to tune into. Perhaps falsely so, and depending on the situation, I'll perhaps be very respectful of what I think non-vapers would want in a public place, while at other times, I may show up as not caring (and yet will still be respectful).

I'm not sure if things will swing the other way unless it also swing the other way for smoking, as in a majority no longer treat it as deserving of shame. I don't think it needs to happen with just vaping/smoking, but with larger issue of "shall we shame others just because we can?" For most part, I don't think it is the majority opinion / behavior to shame others. But with vaping/smoking, it is turned up a notch and there are maybe 2 other behaviors that come to mind, both of which are less visible to the human eye that I can think of as treated worse than smoking/vaping. Because of how visible vaping/smoking are, I think they are the most popular things that get shamed right now.

And it is sad/disappointing, but also really not a big deal given how utterly easy it is to vape in people's presence and have them show up as clueless to it.

Wow! That was expressed quite well. One day, when I decide to finally grow up, I want to grow up to be like you. And I only half mean that jokingly.

Understand exactly where you're coming from about shaming. From age for to about age twenty or so, had a stepfather who ensured I understood clearly what less than human meant. Apologies in advance, to this day I am still weary around truck drivers. It was what he did. Yes, I know he was not all truckers and not saying he was.

 

[Vaslovik]

If you look at google news "vaping - Google Search" you can see there are lots of articles saying vaping is bad.

Doesn't this make you sad, if I was a smoker looking to quit I would most likely be persuaded to quit, I truly think vaping is a lot healthier than cigarettes but I think this is detering people to quit.

What do you guys think?

Oh gosh, the vaping is bad meme is out there, spurred on by the haters of vaping, and I have to deal with them at work every day. They know nothing at all about vaping except that they hate it on sight, because to them it looks like smoking, which they already hated, because it's something others do that they don't, and they hate anyone doing anything they don't, because that's just what we have come to as a society anymore.

Ignore them. They are haters motived by ignorance, and undifferentiated rage and frustration in life, and they just need to take it out on someone. Who is more obvious a target than someone blowing a cloud of questionable nature that they can attack with no information?

 

[herb]

You pull that 2yr. rabbit out of your Hat?
ECF Established 2007, but only a small # of the total of Vapers world wide. Then and Now.


Your Statement in Proper News Etiquette



Flipping context is their job, not ours and That IS Fear mongering

*Note: I do not disagree with what you are saying, I simply recognize they Never say it that way.

I was referring to the overwhelming majority of vapors who only recently started going through much much more juice and have adopted high wattage vaping mainly due to the sub tank explosion.

In the past people did not vape nearly the amount of juice and most used very low wattage devices, not the case these days.

There was sub ohm vaping going on back then but not nearly to the extent nowadays.

 

[Jman8]

The word "fear mongering" is really overblown , fear mongering is saying you should not do that because you will suffer health consequences .

Fear mongering is not " be aware of the chemicals your vaping since data on possible health consequences are not available and won't be for some time since vaping large amounts of e juice at high wattage has never been studied . That should be obvious though since most people have only been doing it approx two years.

Hey guess what? We strongly disagree on this.

Your first assertion is saying: if someone tells you not to jump off the cliffs of the Grand Canyon because you will fall to your death, then they are just engaged in fear mongering.

Your second assertion is saying: be careful of the air you breathe, because it could possibly hurt you, though no one knows for certain, as no one has been around long enough to truly know. This isn't fear mongering, this be common sense.

There are no definitive conclusions with those statements just "common sense" warnings.

Fear mongering rests on uncertainty and doubt. No one actually knows what could happen, so be afraid, be very afraid. Oh, and pay no attention to all those people who appear to be doing fine, and have visited their doctors and are told their health has greatly improved. Ignore all that, and just trust that one day they will likely be told bad news about their health. Which is why you should be very cautious right now. You are probably hurting yourself, and this is common sense.

The same cautions provided to vaping right now could be applied to literally all human activity, and with all others where there are very few incidents of harm, it would be perceived as fear mongering. Hey, don't do any scientific experiments because no one knows for sure that won't kill you. Better safe than sorry. Just providing you with a 'common sense' warning.

 

[StarreLabelle]

I used to catch pneumonia every winner when I smoked. I started out having walking pneumonia at a very young age to double pneumonia that was more severe every time I had it. Only quitting tobacco stopped the pneumonia, and last time I had it I felt like I might really die. So vaping saved my life; I haven't had pneumonia in the 3 years I've been vaping. Fact that smoking causes respiratory diseases, and I'm fine on e-cigarettes!!!

Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk

 

[StarreLabelle]

Would you rather scrape your knee or amputate your leg? That's the difference between smoking vs vaping. People just want to be skeptical because we actually enjoy vaping, and the haters don't like that! Lol,,, get a life...

Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk

 

[crxess]

Only 2 simple Rules to follow:
Never toss in the Direction of another person
Never stand in the target area of oncoming Darts

And yet this simple Game has been Banned worldwide.

Pic#2 is Actually From an Anti - Terrorism Warning.
Lawn Darts Added to Growing List of Terrorist Watch Words -- THE LAPINE

OTTAWA — Warning that lawn darts are banned and could be dangerous in the wrong hands, Prime Minister Stephen Harper said today that he has begun adding his own words to the list surveillance agents are scouring for in Canadians’ e-mails, Tweets, Facebook messages, and garage sale ads.

And CTV is reporting this morning that lawn darts, #killbillc51, and the name Abu are recent additions to the words that Harper says are “bright red flags that someone could be thinking pre-terrorist thoughts”.

What Chance does something so complex and sophisticated a Vaping have?

* Granted, the right things in the Wrong hands can be dangerous. Look what Government has done to Vaping through Pseudo-science*

 

[Rossum]

thinking pre-terrorist thoughts

I guess I'll just keep my thoughts about the lawn darts and the Canadian version of the USA Patriot Act to myself then.
Or not.

 

[TruSound]

The why has nothing to do with a lack of Good Articles.
The Why is the Same as for TV and Bad Publicity.

We know The Good and are satisfied it exist - No Need to Preach to the Preachers.
We Bring the BAD into Light here, out of Disgust and need for others to know it.

I for one do not wand to sit around reading Vaping Fluff stories while the Anti's tear us down again and again.

Many of those Negative stories have Comment sections. Believe me, if so, I Blast them with more than they bargain for and I fully intend to keep doing it.
Bring on the Bad, I have something to say

There's a very simple solution that'll squash all the naysayers, BT and all the rest...they'll run for cover and never bother us again.

If we start a crxess vape for life kick starter campaign and the funds are raised we'll release him to systematically eliminate all who oppose us, once in the field it'll take him about 10 days.

 

[Woofer]

Pic#2 is Actually From an Anti - Terrorism Warning.
Lawn Darts Added to Growing List of Terrorist Watch Words -- THE LAPINE

ABOUT THE LAPINE
The Lapine is Canada's Best Satirical Online Newspaper. It satirizes politics, life, media and the human condition, with a special focus on Canada. No Lapine content is intended to hurt even the most delicate of feelings…but it’s bound to happen. Get over it. But if you have concerns, let us know. Did we mention that The Lapine is satire?

Trump Says Uncircumcised Men are Un-American and Smell Bad -- THE LAPINE

 

[crxess]

ABOUT THE LAPINE
The Lapine is Canada's Best Satirical Online Newspaper. It satirizes politics, life, media and the human condition, with a special focus on Canada. No Lapine content is intended to hurt even the most delicate of feelings…but it’s bound to happen. Get over it. But if you have concerns, let us know. Did we mention that The Lapine is satire?

Trump Says Uncircumcised Men are Un-American and Smell Bad -- THE LAPINE

Busted