Message from Bill Godshall of Smokefree Pennsylvania
- Thread starter Bill Godshall
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I can start one up. I'll get it going tomorrow morning. Had planned on doing it soon, anyways.
Ivisi
That is exactly how it was for me. I have smoked continuously for almost 40 years, 38 to be exact. I have tried countless times to quit smoking, tried all the useless and expensive gimmicks the government sponsored pharmica comes out with.<p>
I have serious health problems as a result of all these years of smoking, and am a step away from being permanently confined to a wheelchair with attached oxygen bottle. I've had the heart attacks, have the heart and lung disease, and need a CPAP machine to breathe at night. <p>
In a last act of desperation, even though e cigarettes are said to be illegal, and there aren't any retail sources available, I was finally able to obtain a couple, and a couple bottles of e liquid with nicotine. In fact I met with my 'dealer' (yes, it felt like I was making a drug deal, meeting with this guy I have never seen before in a Macdonalds parking lot, and have him approach my vehicle and hand me a box containing "the stuff") the same day I was picking up my CPAP machine. <p>
Within ONE day, the first 24 hours of using my E-cigarette, I went from smoking 2 packs of cigarette to smoking only SIX!! And that was without even trying very hard. I decided that I would try these e cigarettes without trying to fool myself by resisting any urge to smoke a cigarette. What I found is the e cigarette greatly reduced my nicotine fits, leaving me to fight the habit of smoking without that additional burden, which is exactly the same principle behind most other quit smoking aids such as the patch or nicorette inhalers, pills and gums. <p>
All the cigarettes I did smoke that first day were the ones I picked up and lit strickly out of habit, reflex action. I estimate only two were to replace nicotine levels in my blood, because the e liquid I had bought was not quite strong enough to maintain the levels I was accustomed to. I kept on using this e liquid, firstly, because it was all I had, and secondly I plan on reducing my nicotine dependance gradually until I no longer require it, and can enjoy "vaping" much more pleasant tasting nicotine free e liquids when ever i get an urge to have a cigarette. <p>
I have been 'vaping' for three weeks now, and have reduced my cigarette consuption from two packs a day, to one pack during my first week of vaping, and one pack for these last two weeks of "vaping". ( I just HAVE to have that first cigarette of the day with my first cup of caffiene, which is an addiction overlap.
The reason E cigarettes are so effective is not just because it satisfies the nicotine addiction, it's because it directly replaces the habits associated with cigarette smoking, the hand to mouth action, the subconcious habit of reaching for a cigarette during the times most people who smoke have become accustomed to feeding their nicotine addictions, which vary for everyone according to how they live their lives, where they work, the type of work they do, smoking and driving habits, and times of stress where the calming effect of nicotine is needed.
There is also two other things E cigarettes do that no other nicotine replacement theropy can do, is fullfill the visual aspect, and the <i> feeling</i> and <i>taste</i> components of cigarette smoking. You <i><b> feel</b></i> as if you are smoking, although you actually are not. It's no more harmfull as breathing in the visible water vapors put out by a room vaporizer people use to reduce the discomforts of a bad cold. (complete with vaporized glycerol used in vicks vaporizer products, so government claims that vaporized glycerine needs to be studied is comeplete B.S.).
Aready I feel better in just the three weeks I have been vaping. My chest is no longer aching from the strain of just trying to breathe in enough air, especially at night during the little sleep I get because of the damage done by years of smoking which has resulted in a severe case of sleep apnea.
I literally stop breathing in my sleep, which usually wakes me up, and even scarier, sometimes I don't and literally begin dying. My dog and cat have saved my life countless times, because they have this uncanny sense to paw at me to wake me up when I stop breathing. This is why I had to get a CPAP machine to literally force air into my lungs, and make breathing easier.
The costs of my smoking related illnesses have been literally in the Millions these past few years. why the government would want me to continue smoking when such a fantasic devise, the electronic cigarette is already starting to improve my condition, and keep me out of the hospital, reduse the number and cost of all the drugs I have to take is baffling.
FANTASTIC!!!! The more I hear about people being helped by these devices the more encouraged I become. I was just chatting with a friend in LA that said our chat could be used as a marketing ad and I agreed. I preach the health benefits to everyone I know that use cigarettes or cigars as a nicotine delivery system. These are SO much better. If the government, which I helped to elect, bans these I will be very disappointed. I'm hoping cooler heads will prevail. we'll just have to wait and see. either way I'm not going back to analogs!
Bob-
You make some valid points I will grant you but - Consider how many drugs we have seen being advertised with FDA approval and a long long list of negative side effects (in some cases death) - Many of them have follow up adverts in a year or so that say something like "DID YOUR LOVED ONE DIE FROM TAKING THE NEW DRUG WE SOLD YOU LAST YEAR? THEN SUE!" -
Seems that there are two different arguments at play here -
1 - What will likely happen in reality?
2 - If that reality is just or fair?
By the rules at play - you are correct - there should have been efforts to prove saftey before going global with the sale of the substance - However - It is the random ignorance with wich the rules are applied that is upsetting. The big pharmacutical companies go through all the right proceedures, pay all the proper fees and buy all the right politicians and produce FDA approved killers all the time. Exotic compounds that truly have no extensive real world trials - If the Letter of the law is upheld - Then let the Spirit of the law be damed -
The ingredients in the e-juice are VERY WELL KNOWN and do not change into some magically toxic brew when inhaled - That's the ideology -
Reality?
What I forsee happening is a regulation on the e-juice containing nicotine - The devices will be sold with nicotine free flavor mixes - Just as Vaporizers and "water pipes" for illicit smoke are sold today along with little bags of dried out 10 year old tobacco that no one thinks is ever actually going to be smoked in the "water pipe" - Then you will just get your e-juice on the black market - I can make you 5 gallons in a week - It ain't rocket science -
The FDA would have NO CONTROL if the nicotine was taken out of the juice. - Remember they are not talking about outlawing nicotine - which can still be found - Or tobacco - Which can very easily be used to extract the nicotine - It is the combination of the nicotine and the PV - the new drug delivery system - If they do actually ban the devices - go buy one of the legal vaporizers and put tobacco in it - The "water pipe" guys have devices that vaporize dry plant matter and elimnate combustion and they work real good too
The big e-cig industry error was not taking a clue from the "water pipe" guys. The nicotine and the device should never have been boxed together - That's what makes it a "drug delivery device" and whoever started making them look like a real cigarette and encouraging users to flaunt them in the face of smoking bans - That was just stupid - The flags really went red then -
Of course the final step will be to have nicotine juice become legal - Manufactured buy Phizer - Available only with prescription and costs $250.00 for a 10ml bottle -
Peace ~
Bones
Been free of tobacco for 2 weeks - I LOVE MY KISSBOX - If they wanna take it it'll be . . . . . FROM MY COLD DEAD HANDS!
Well said, my friend. With both being marketed together, the only way juice is going to be approved, is by a large multi-national pharma snapping up any available patents for juice, going through the FDA approval process and then marketing it available with a prescription for a high dollar amount. But then again, no one said that juice can't be marketed another way. I recall "poppers" going that route.
Bottom line, is that the device and juice need to be marketed seperately or it WILL be classified as a drug and drug delivery device.
Hi all, im a newb.. been off analogs for a little under a week now (after 12 years of smoking). Tried patches, tried prescriptions, tried the gum.. nada. It took me less than 1 day to lay down my regular cigs after trying my vapor friend. After a few days i am no longer waking up with congestion and can smell and taste food better.
It is amazing that the FDA can do anything to block imports of the devices themselves. If you walk to any smoke shop in Arizona you can buy one of 50 varieties of crack pipes (im sorry but nobody smokes tobacco from these things), yet stick a battery in it and all of a sudden it is a medical device? really? Why not market them with a different shape and sell them with water cartridges as a "personal lung humidifer" ? Anyone willing to wager that vaping these is safer than filling your house with incense? I would...
I would challenge all in the fields of health sciences or biology / biochem to seek grants to study the effects of vaporized PG / nicotine.
It is amazing that the FDA can do anything to block imports of the devices themselves. If you walk to any smoke shop in Arizona you can buy one of 50 varieties of crack pipes (im sorry but nobody smokes tobacco from these things), yet stick a battery in it and all of a sudden it is a medical device? really? Why not market them with a different shape and sell them with water cartridges as a "personal lung humidifer" ? Anyone willing to wager that vaping these is safer than filling your house with incense? I would...
I would challenge all in the fields of health sciences or biology / biochem to seek grants to study the effects of vaporized PG / nicotine.
Yep, and they'd never make something as harmless as pot illegal either.
It's amazing what you hear. My mother hasn't had a cigarette in over a month. Wait, didn't you hear what I said. MY MOTHER for crying out loud! She's been smoking for about 50 years! Yes, I do remember her trying hynoisis and some weird shots in the face (it was the 80's you know). The patch, the gum, and the pills. Don't take it the wrong way, but she really never had the determination or willpower to quit. And now she's cigarette free.
My work will give let you get the patch and the pills for FREE! Isn't that awesome! They started that about two and a half years ago because they really care about lowering health costs...I mean...care about their employees. I think that's great. Um...as soon as I hear about anyone it worked for, I'll post it right here! The smokers on my team spent their own money on e-cigs when they saw me using one. Every one of them is now tobacco free.
It works. Get it.
--Prof Daffy
Saw this statement from Lautenberg after the FDA release-
LAUTENBERG STATEMENT ON NEW FDA REPORT REGARDING PUBLIC HEALTH RISKS OF E-CIGARETTES
WASHINGTON, DC - Senator Frank R. Lautenberg today released the following statement on a new Food and Drug Administration report regarding potential public health risks of e-cigarettes.
"This report proves what we feared - that e-cigarettes may be unsafe and need to be taken off the market immediately. Not only can these products fuel a life-long addiction to nicotine, but now the FDA has found that they contain cancer-causing chemicals. The research revealed by the FDA today is a wake-up call that we must be more vigilant in protecting Americans from this new public health concern."
Sen. Lautenberg, one of the Senate's leaders in protecting Americans from the dangers of smoking, was the first to call on the FDA to protect the public from potential dangers of e-cigarettes. He wrote a letter to FDA Acting Commissions Frank Torti in March 2009.
MICHAEL PAGAN can be reached via email at Michael_Pagan@Lautenberg.Senate.Gov.
I immediately followed up with an email on my own situation. I think he need to hear from a lot of us.
Mike,
How can you work for such a closed minded individual! This FDA "study" did little to indicate the value or lack of value to PV devices (personal vaporizers as opposed to E Cigs). No mention was made as to where the FDA obtained the 18 samples. They supposedly found Diethylene glycol in 1 of the 18 samples (sounds like quality control issues. They supposedly found certain tobacco-specific nitrosamines, which are human carcinogens, in half the samples- with no notation as to whether there was more or less than you'd find in traditional cigarettes. They also found a few other tobacco specific impurities suspected of being harmful to humans, but not proved and again not compared to traditional cigarettes.
Off this very crude investigation, Mr Lautenberg is demanding that the product be removed from the market. How about an exhaustive study comparing tradtional cigarettes which we know to be quite harmful both to the user and to those the receive second hand smoke from those cigarettes to these nicotine delivering devices.
If they are not "safe" but safer than traditional cigarettes, I'd like to see Mr Lautenber demand to immediately take traditional cigarettes off the market in favor of this newer product. Of course that is not going to happen because it attacks the fabric of some of our great traditions- the tobacco industry, the Pharma industry and our tax structure.
I find it hard to believe that this method of feeding the nicotine habit isn't safer than the one I've had for some 40 years. I've only a week experience with these new products, but my anecdotal experience has me very strong on the side of these newer products. I have gone the full gamut of trying to quit over the years from gum to patches, to drugs to hypnosis- none of which had any lasting effect. The only thing that happened was that every time I tried to quit and lost I smoked more. At last count I was over two packs a day and counting. What was worse is when the government decided to add the FSC flame ......ant to cigarettes and whatever additional chemicals were added. I couldn't stop coughing.
I bought four packs of cigarettes last Friday waiting for my PV order to come in. It arrived on Saturday and I opened it and started using it around 3PM on Saturday. I had already finished one pack and half way through a second. It's now five days later and I've only smoked 10 cigarettes as opposed to the 200 that I would have had over that period. With the PV I don't need to sit there and finish the cigarette, a couple hits and I'm done. I have stopped the coughing, I feel better and I breath easier.
I bought a medium level nicotine and am sure that I shall reduce that level on my next order if closed minded people like Mr Lautenberg don't shut the door. I didn't buy these things as a stop smoking product, but I certainly see the potential after a week.
LAUTENBERG STATEMENT ON NEW FDA REPORT REGARDING PUBLIC HEALTH RISKS OF E-CIGARETTES
WASHINGTON, DC - Senator Frank R. Lautenberg today released the following statement on a new Food and Drug Administration report regarding potential public health risks of e-cigarettes.
"This report proves what we feared - that e-cigarettes may be unsafe and need to be taken off the market immediately. Not only can these products fuel a life-long addiction to nicotine, but now the FDA has found that they contain cancer-causing chemicals. The research revealed by the FDA today is a wake-up call that we must be more vigilant in protecting Americans from this new public health concern."
Sen. Lautenberg, one of the Senate's leaders in protecting Americans from the dangers of smoking, was the first to call on the FDA to protect the public from potential dangers of e-cigarettes. He wrote a letter to FDA Acting Commissions Frank Torti in March 2009.
MICHAEL PAGAN can be reached via email at Michael_Pagan@Lautenberg.Senate.Gov.
I immediately followed up with an email on my own situation. I think he need to hear from a lot of us.
Mike,
How can you work for such a closed minded individual! This FDA "study" did little to indicate the value or lack of value to PV devices (personal vaporizers as opposed to E Cigs). No mention was made as to where the FDA obtained the 18 samples. They supposedly found Diethylene glycol in 1 of the 18 samples (sounds like quality control issues. They supposedly found certain tobacco-specific nitrosamines, which are human carcinogens, in half the samples- with no notation as to whether there was more or less than you'd find in traditional cigarettes. They also found a few other tobacco specific impurities suspected of being harmful to humans, but not proved and again not compared to traditional cigarettes.
Off this very crude investigation, Mr Lautenberg is demanding that the product be removed from the market. How about an exhaustive study comparing tradtional cigarettes which we know to be quite harmful both to the user and to those the receive second hand smoke from those cigarettes to these nicotine delivering devices.
If they are not "safe" but safer than traditional cigarettes, I'd like to see Mr Lautenber demand to immediately take traditional cigarettes off the market in favor of this newer product. Of course that is not going to happen because it attacks the fabric of some of our great traditions- the tobacco industry, the Pharma industry and our tax structure.
I find it hard to believe that this method of feeding the nicotine habit isn't safer than the one I've had for some 40 years. I've only a week experience with these new products, but my anecdotal experience has me very strong on the side of these newer products. I have gone the full gamut of trying to quit over the years from gum to patches, to drugs to hypnosis- none of which had any lasting effect. The only thing that happened was that every time I tried to quit and lost I smoked more. At last count I was over two packs a day and counting. What was worse is when the government decided to add the FSC flame ......ant to cigarettes and whatever additional chemicals were added. I couldn't stop coughing.
I bought four packs of cigarettes last Friday waiting for my PV order to come in. It arrived on Saturday and I opened it and started using it around 3PM on Saturday. I had already finished one pack and half way through a second. It's now five days later and I've only smoked 10 cigarettes as opposed to the 200 that I would have had over that period. With the PV I don't need to sit there and finish the cigarette, a couple hits and I'm done. I have stopped the coughing, I feel better and I breath easier.
I bought a medium level nicotine and am sure that I shall reduce that level on my next order if closed minded people like Mr Lautenberg don't shut the door. I didn't buy these things as a stop smoking product, but I certainly see the potential after a week.
While this is all fine and dandy and not a bad idea, maybe we should also let these "regulators" know that we are going to continue vaping these electronic products whether they "approve" them or not. One way or the other they will not stop the free will of the people.
Damn, im sure glad I dont live "down under". Sounds like your government has some serious "control" issues. Maybe they need a slap upside their heads.
Trying to post this around so people that hear it....I was thrilled ....Thanks Bill...
Drew
http://a1135.g.akamai.net/f/1135/18...A-AM&PCAST_CAT=News/Talk&PCAST_TITLE=Up_Front
Drew
http://a1135.g.akamai.net/f/1135/18...A-AM&PCAST_CAT=News/Talk&PCAST_TITLE=Up_Front
Actually in Australia I believe the ban is on importation with the intent to sell. For personal use you are not considered a criminal.
Yes. It IS a trap!!
Here's what happened in Europe: on the past 08th November, they tried to medicalize the e-cig (Can you imagine, non-alchoolic beer having to meet pharma regulations to be on the market (as a therapeutic aid to fight/prevent alchool abuse), while regular beer keeps being sold as a consumer product, having to meet quality standards of a consumer product, only ?)
Yes, that has been tried. It would have been a de-facto ban. Our ELECTED MEP's voted against that. Then, the UNELECTED pharma and tobacco lobbysts started doing what they do best: scheming and manipulating politics behind closed doors, as if we, the VOTERS, had no right to know about the 'negotiations' that will affect our lives...!
Now, the e-cig is to be lumped in the new Tobacco Producs Directive... that means irrational limits to nicotine levels AND e-liquid volume in a single cartdridge, NO refillables (only sealed ones, 'for the security of the children'), only those flavours already used in other NRT's - EXCEPT for those that 'might be appealing to children' (BP will, however, be able to keep selling those same flavours), no MOD's, not even Ego's. Only cig-alikes - the ones that are most likely to FAIL new vapers.
Worst: not even ALL cig-alikes would be permitted. 'Security' standards would be so irrationally high, that for all practical purposes, only those cig-alikes Big Tobacco is about to sell would be permitted! If you look closely at the proposed legislation, and then at what BT is about to sell, one must wonder if this proposal was not drafted specifically to deliver the 'normalized' e-cig market, on a silver platter, direcly to the hands of BT !!
That has been our war here in Europe: first, to keep the e-cig out of BP's hands (it is NOT a medicine, it is an alternative, much like non-alchoolic beer), and now, to keep the e-cig out of the TPD, because it is NOT a 'tobacco product'. It MAY have nicotine in it (NRT's ALWAYS have nicotine, but are not a 'tobacco products'), and it does NOT have the negative health risks associated with tobacco (Allegedly, those risks were behind the stricter tobacco regulation when compared to consumer products).
NO, WE DO NOT WANT E-CIGS PAIRED WITH TOBACCO!! Nor with medicines, for that matter. Our fight here has been to make legislators regulate the e-cig in it's proper class: a consumer product, properly regulated by quality and safety standards already in place for that kind of products. When those fear-mongering nay-sayers tell us that the e-cig 'is not regulated', they're lying: IT ALREADY IS. What they're trying to accomplish, is a de-facto ban by demanding that it should be further regulated, when there is ample evidence that further regulation is NOT necessary, when you look at the relative risk involved.
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