Mik!! We want a Janty e-pipe!!!!

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TreverT

Full Member
Sep 10, 2010
63
0
Greensboro, NC
One pipe guy's wish list for a Janty pipe... (Coming from the perspective of someone who has been smoking and collecting pipes for 20 years, and has never smoked cigs)

The biggest problem I see with all the epipes so far on the market is that they're marketed and designed like cigs, and designed to appeal to the low cost, "throw away" mentality of cigarette smokers. Pipe smokers are a completely different bunch. We want different things, and no epipe on the market now seems to have a handle on the fundamental differences between pipes and cigarettes, and what pipe smokers want. Crucially, it isn't something "just like an ecig, but with a different form factor". FWIW, here's a list of what I want from an epipe:

** LONG smoking time. Pipe smokers don't sit and have a quick cig break, or stand outside under the awning burning through a 5 minute cig. We smoke for hours. I want an epipe that I can charge, then sit and read a book for two solid hours, puffing all the while, without any perceptible performance drop off. The 601 epipe I have now will just about manage this, but from what I hear, the eGo and others can do much better (I've got an eGo on the way, as it happens!). The form factor has a large mass of pipe bowl as part of the equation, so cram all the battery in there that you can.

** Permanence. buy a quality pipe, and if you take care of it, it will last the rest of your life. I realize that atomizers are disposable and need replacing by nature, but make the body and stem of the pipe such that it's something you can buy once and keep. I'm really appalled at the fact that the entire bowl of my 601 has to be tossed out to replace the atomizer - That's horrible design, and never should have made it past the initial concept stage. Make the atomizer so it's easy to get out and easy (and cheap!) to replace. I also tend to favor some sort of standardized battery, like AA, instead of these custom batteries that we might not be able to replace in future if the company goes out of business or stops production of the custom battery. If I buy a briar pipe, even if the company that made it goes bankrupt tomorrow, the pipe will still be working fine for me ten years from now. I realize that isn't possible when working with purpose-designed atomizers, but this is a big selling point/problem for making epipes appeal to traditional pipe smokers.

** Beauty and uniqueness. A handmade briar pipe is one of the few bits of personal "jewelry" that is still largely made by human hands. Form and attractiveness are the reasons many briar pipes sell for thousand dollar price tags. Whatever you do, make it handsome! The mini-pipe/ladies' pipe out now is horribly ugly, as is the G500. The 601 is tolerable but looks like what it is, a $50 smacked-together cheapo job. While a cigarette smoker may burn through a cig without a second's thought, pipe smokers like our pipes - We like to look at them, admire them, appreciate the grain of the wood, and choose pipes to smoke for different occasions based on what they look like. Briar is a natural material and that's a HUGE part of the appeal of the pipe, because even if two pipe guys buy the same shape from the same maker, each of their pipes will be unique, because each will have distinct grain that makes it the only pipe in the world to look like it does. While I can see the knock-around appeal of a metal or carbon bowl, that misses out on a huge part of the appeal of a pipe, in selling to pipe smokers. That's the kind of look that a pipe guy will buy one of, as a toy or traveling tool, rather than buying a dozen of for the sake of admiring the grain or having an interesting collection. I realize that wood cracking has been a problem with the cheapo epipes so far, but that's because they're cheapo, not because it's wood. Properly dried, stabilized, and drilled wood can last decades without cracks.

** A range of shapes. A collector will buy one of every shape you make. Pipe guys like a variety, depending on our mood - Straights, bents, deep bents, traditional shapes, freehand shapes, exotic shapes... Again, it's not like an ecig or cig, where one buys it, smokes it, and throws it away, or doesn't care about the look. Pipes are moods, and the more variety you offer, the more you will sell.

** Capacity. This goes along with battery life. Again, we buy large pipes so we can sit and smoke one for an hour or more without having to refill it. If we wanted something we had to refill every 5-10 minutes, we'd smoke cigs. I don't know how you could practically manage this, but in my ideal epipe, I'd be able to fill it with juice and sit back and smoke it and not think about fiddling with it for at least an hour, preferably more.

So! I have no idea if any of this will be the slightest bit useful or not, but I thought I would at least take the time to write out what I see as the basic differences between pipes and cigs, and why designing an marketing an epipe to pipe smokers is a very different challenge than marketing to ecig smokers. Whole different audience with different desires and prefs. So far, all the epipes I see are designed as if they were bigger, disposable ecigs, which is like saying, "Horror films and comedies are just alike, because they're both films, so horror fans should be perfectly happy if we make a comedy that uses horror movie title fonts, and call it a horror movie." For my part, I am really hoping the Janty epipe will be the first epipe I will love, and have my wallet at the ready, if it looks like it will be a good, long lasting PIPE, instead of something cheap that I'm expected to throw the bowl away every month or two.

I hope this will help, or at least give a little insight into what traditional pipe smokers are looking for from epipes.
 

tector

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Jun 28, 2010
335
9
37
Israel
One pipe guy's wish list for a Janty pipe... (Coming from the perspective of someone who has been smoking and collecting pipes for 20 years, and has never smoked cigs)

The biggest problem I see with all the epipes so far on the market is that they're marketed and designed like cigs, and designed to appeal to the low cost, "throw away" mentality of cigarette smokers. Pipe smokers are a completely different bunch. We want different things, and no epipe on the market now seems to have a handle on the fundamental differences between pipes and cigarettes, and what pipe smokers want. Crucially, it isn't something "just like an ecig, but with a different form factor". FWIW, here's a list of what I want from an epipe:

** LONG smoking time. Pipe smokers don't sit and have a quick cig break, or stand outside under the awning burning through a 5 minute cig. We smoke for hours. I want an epipe that I can charge, then sit and read a book for two solid hours, puffing all the while, without any perceptible performance drop off. The 601 epipe I have now will just about manage this, but from what I hear, the eGo and others can do much better (I've got an eGo on the way, as it happens!). The form factor has a large mass of pipe bowl as part of the equation, so cram all the battery in there that you can.

** Permanence. Buy a quality pipe, and if you take care of it, it will last the rest of your life. I realize that atomizers are disposable and need replacing by nature, but make the body and stem of the pipe such that it's something you can buy once and keep. I'm really appalled at the fact that the entire bowl of my 601 has to be tossed out to replace the atomizer - That's horrible design, and never should have made it past the initial concept stage. Make the atomizer so it's easy to get out and easy (and cheap!) to replace. I also tend to favor some sort of standardized battery, like AA, instead of these custom batteries that we might not be able to replace in future if the company goes out of business or stops production of the custom battery. If I buy a briar pipe, even if the company that made it goes bankrupt tomorrow, the pipe will still be working fine for me ten years from now. I realize that isn't possible when working with purpose-designed atomizers, but this is a big selling point/problem for making epipes appeal to traditional pipe smokers.

** Beauty and uniqueness. A handmade briar pipe is one of the few bits of personal "jewelry" that is still largely made by human hands. Form and attractiveness are the reasons many briar pipes sell for thousand dollar price tags. Whatever you do, make it handsome! The mini-pipe/ladies' pipe out now is horribly ugly, as is the G500. The 601 is tolerable but looks like what it is, a $50 smacked-together cheapo job. While a cigarette smoker may burn through a cig without a second's thought, pipe smokers like our pipes - We like to look at them, admire them, appreciate the grain of the wood, and choose pipes to smoke for different occasions based on what they look like. Briar is a natural material and that's a HUGE part of the appeal of the pipe, because even if two pipe guys buy the same shape from the same maker, each of their pipes will be unique, because each will have distinct grain that makes it the only pipe in the world to look like it does. While I can see the knock-around appeal of a metal or carbon bowl, that misses out on a huge part of the appeal of a pipe, in selling to pipe smokers. That's the kind of look that a pipe guy will buy one of, as a toy or traveling tool, rather than buying a dozen of for the sake of admiring the grain or having an interesting collection. I realize that wood cracking has been a problem with the cheapo epipes so far, but that's because they're cheapo, not because it's wood. Properly dried, stabilized, and drilled wood can last decades without cracks.

** A range of shapes. A collector will buy one of every shape you make. Pipe guys like a variety, depending on our mood - Straights, bents, deep bents, traditional shapes, freehand shapes, exotic shapes... Again, it's not like an ecig or cig, where one buys it, smokes it, and throws it away, or doesn't care about the look. Pipes are moods, and the more variety you offer, the more you will sell.

** Capacity. This goes along with battery life. Again, we buy large pipes so we can sit and smoke one for an hour or more without having to refill it. If we wanted something we had to refill every 5-10 minutes, we'd smoke cigs. I don't know how you could practically manage this, but in my ideal epipe, I'd be able to fill it with juice and sit back and smoke it and not think about fiddling with it for at least an hour, preferably more.

So! I have no idea if any of this will be the slightest bit useful or not, but I thought I would at least take the time to write out what I see as the basic differences between pipes and cigs, and why designing an marketing an epipe to pipe smokers is a very different challenge than marketing to ecig smokers. Whole different audience with different desires and prefs. So far, all the epipes I see are designed as if they were bigger, disposable ecigs, which is like saying, "Horror films and comedies are just alike, because they're both films, so horror fans should be perfectly happy if we make a comedy that uses horror movie title fonts, and call it a horror movie." For my part, I am really hoping the Janty epipe will be the first epipe I will love, and have my wallet at the ready, if it looks like it will be a good, long lasting PIPE, instead of something cheap that I'm expected to throw the bowl away every month or two.

I hope this will help, or at least give a little insight into what traditional pipe smokers are looking for from epipes.


Well Said...

Any Updates on the Epipe?... its getting harder to hold my breath for so long..
 

franklyspeaking

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ECF Veteran
Mar 17, 2009
1,231
48
Arlington, Texas
www.pharceapp.com
I agree. Well stated. The battery issue will be the hardest issue I think. None of the mainstream batteries out there offer the type of longevity that would be needed, save the 18650 but I think to incorporate a battery of that size you would need a "peace" pipe design. I'd rather not embark on my morning commute to work with a monster like that. :)

If Janty hits all of your other points it will be a winner for sure. I just don't see how they'd make a e-pipe with the performance stamina on par with the eGo without going to a proprietary battery design. As far as looks go I just hope they do away with the cheesy bedazzled plastic caps on top of the bowl as found on the lady pipe and 601. In any case, whether this is released in a month or February I'll be first in line for one as I've been very impressed to see the progress Janty has made in design starting from the kiss box all the way to the eGo every model has shown large improvements in functionality, practicality and performance.
 

TreverT

Full Member
Sep 10, 2010
63
0
Greensboro, NC
I agree. Well stated. The battery issue will be the hardest issue I think. None of the mainstream batteries out there offer the type of longevity that would be needed, save the 18650 but I think to incorporate a battery of that size you would need a "peace" pipe design. I'd rather not embark on my morning commute to work with a monster like that. :)

But I wouldn't mind having an e-calabash to smoke at home :laugh:
For anyone who's unfamiliar, this is a calabash pipe. Think how much battery you could fit into that bowl!
WBxlW.gif


Hmm, as a random aside, something that resembled the removable bowl tops of calabash pipes would be a nice way to cap off an epipe battery compartment...

If Janty hits all of your other points it will be a winner for sure. I just don't see how they'd make a e-pipe with the performance stamina on par with the eGo without going to a proprietary battery design. As far as looks go I just hope they do away with the cheesy bedazzled plastic caps on top of the bowl as found on the lady pipe and 601. In any case, whether this is released in a month or February I'll be first in line for one as I've been very impressed to see the progress Janty has made in design starting from the kiss box all the way to the eGo every model has shown large improvements in functionality, practicality and performance.

Everything I read about Janty is impressive. I'm beginning to think they may become the Dunhill of the esmoke world.

I hope my comments were helpful. I was a bit concerned my post might come off as too pushy, but figured, well, I've got a lot of experience with the "analog" version, may as well try and lay out what (in my mind) makes the difference between pipes and cigs, and why an epipe needs to fit those requirements to satisfy pipe guys.
 
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tinstar15

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ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Sep 29, 2009
901
227
Lakeland, FL
I agree with the posts above as well, but a part of me would also like to see something futuristic. It's weird for me to say as I love classic pipe styles. I remember seeing a carbon fiber designer pipe once and thought that would be slick to have. I posted earlier in this thread that a modular design would be the best IMO, as it gives you the ability to switch parts to suit the end user. Think of it in terms of a cell phone shell or a computer skin. You could make your pipe look like a nice Meerschaum or a briar or an ebony or even a corn cob just by taking the operative parts and transferring them to a different shell. You could have a straight pipe or a deep bend or even a long stem just by changing a few parts around.

Whatever the end result of Janty's work is, unless it looks like a two foot water ...., I will undoubtedly buy. Hell I even liked the looks of the upsized minipipe with eGo attys that was posted earlier and the 601 pipe style looked fine to me. Wouldn't be what I was hoping for but hell, beggars can't be choosers. I've begged every manufacturer I know for something better than a 601 and Janty is the only one that ever listened.
 

PaulT

Full Member
Sep 21, 2010
12
0
Huntsville AL
I would also like a nice, permanent epipe. I agree with everything Trever said above. I would also like to add that I would not mind having the option for a manual. I don't much care for having to pull on a pipe at a certain flow rate to trigger the sensor on my 601. Also, the juice tends to run down in to the bottom of the bowl and gurgle. I understand this is a reason for eventual failure of the pipe. I do like being able to puff "hands free" but I also hold the pipe while smoking so the loss of the automatic feature would be minimal and well worth the gains. Of course, if you guys at Janty can make an automatic that does not collect juice through the sensor hole, and has a free and effortless pull that's all the better!
For me, one of the best pipe smoking experiences is a lot of smoke with little effort to draw. Pipe smokers tend to puff gently, with little or no inhalation. Heck, I don't even get nicotine in my juices. I just like the mechanics of smoking, so an epipe will have to have similar qualities of the smoking experience as a regular pipe.

I'm looking forward to seeing what Janty comes up with.
 
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Twan013

Senior Member
ECF Veteran
Aug 10, 2010
114
10
Jasper, AL
I'm brainstorming, so this post might should go ignored. But I'm thinking, "why not supply is with the mechanics of an e-pipe, so we can retrofit them into a real pipe?" Here are the only problems I foresee. One, we might have to do some crafting to our pipes to fit the atomizer. But I'm thinking we could just drop a battery pack in the bowl and route the wires through the shank to the atty. Two, a new atty with a plug would be a good idea (I think most of them now just use contact to heat up). Three, I can't imagine a way to fit a cart, unless you wanted to direct drip.. Actually, some pipes are filtered (Dr. Grabow, Medico, and some others). So there's already a little chamber in the shank so you MIGHT could fit a cart and atty. Or do a cartomizer perhaps? The problem is that these filters are either 6 or 9 mm (depending on brand of pipe), and I don't know if any standard atty/cart would fit. Y'all may think this whole thing is the dumbest idea ever, but I personally would like this as an option.
 

TreverT

Full Member
Sep 10, 2010
63
0
Greensboro, NC
I'm brainstorming, so this post might should go ignored. But I'm thinking, "why not supply is with the mechanics of an e-pipe, so we can retrofit them into a real pipe?" Here are the only problems I foresee. One, we might have to do some crafting to our pipes to fit the atomizer. But I'm thinking we could just drop a battery pack in the bowl and route the wires through the shank to the atty. Two, a new atty with a plug would be a good idea (I think most of them now just use contact to heat up). Three, I can't imagine a way to fit a cart, unless you wanted to direct drip.. Actually, some pipes are filtered (Dr. Grabow, Medico, and some others). So there's already a little chamber in the shank so you MIGHT could fit a cart and atty. Or do a cartomizer perhaps? The problem is that these filters are either 6 or 9 mm (depending on brand of pipe), and I don't know if any standard atty/cart would fit. Y'all may think this whole thing is the dumbest idea ever, but I personally would like this as an option.

I have.... already been thinking in this direction for quite some time. :2cool: And that's really all I can say about it at the moment. FWIW, though, a 9mm filter is a good bit larger than my eGo cart, and would have a lot of liquid capacity, probably close to the carts on my 601.
 

Twan013

Senior Member
ECF Veteran
Aug 10, 2010
114
10
Jasper, AL
I don't know how other companies work, but here's something to think about.. Just before apple comes out with a new product, they go silent and shut their website down for a couple of days. We haven't heard a response from mik or anybody else in a few days and the janty site is down until the 4th. I think. I could be wrong, and to be honest I probably am. Maybe I just want to get people excited and chuckle when someone complains about getting their hopes up. Yeh I'm weird like that
 

DCrist721

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Feb 15, 2009
684
5
Long Island, NY
I know what youre saying, but rest assured we are working as hard as we can on getting these things done! :)

I realize you want to make sure everything is perfect before releasing it, but isn't there any information you can give us? Pictures, spec. details, a 3d model mock-up, even just a silhouette? :(
 
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