My Boba's clone

[HappiVappi]

EddieAdams & HappiVappi is there any chance you could PM me your BB & GJ Recipes please!

I've really wanted to try these two juices for so long, i'm a little partial to tobac flavours, one of my fav's atm is farts maxx blend

I don't have a GJ recipe. My interpretation is called Monkey juice and it is just a couple of posts above (#2120)...

Cheers.

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[buffaloguy]

I agree with your premise Levitas. I can understand the perspective completely. However I think the disconnect is in how we percieve the flavor "change". While Ive never experienced a flavor turning into something entirely different, what I tend to experience is notes changing. Throughout the juices life span there will be some notes that come upfront, and then blend away over time to be replaced by something else. Much as you would experience with different vintages of the same type of wine.

I notice all my tobaccos do this. Even bobas did so for the first few weeks. It eventually did kind of settle in tho flavor wise and stay pretty consistant after that time. Which does happen with some juice.

Btw, if you take my recipe several pages back and add about 1%-2% TPA ripe bananna its a tasty vape as well. I stay away from ripe bananna tho. Ive tried it before. That ripe bananna is bad news for me tho, triacetin... blah.

 

[Levitas]

Right, that was an extreme point, flavoring completely changing into another flavoring (which someone, and perhaps others actually believe).

Flavor difference, and how it tastes, that's something we can all agree on. What's actually happening to cause said change in taste, well, that's when I generally digress into the same old tune,

Though, it's not terribly difficult to think that there are pH differences between the base we use, and the flavorings involved. Perhaps that could cause a chemical reaction to change a flavoring, but no one has shown the data to show it (as far as I know). I'm not one to just believe it because one or two of my senses tell me so

At any rate, I digress yet again, and my wife-to-be is giving me the evil eye (we're going out for dinner).

 

[buffaloguy]

At any rate, I digress yet again, and my wife-to-be is giving me the evil eye (we're going out for dinner).

Hmmmm, yeah I know that look all to well. When the boss give the evil eye you know thats more important than eliquid.

 

[Porksmuggler]

I'm sure many will disagree with my theory, and assessment. But no one has been able to show actual proof, aside of, again, empirical evidence. So, it's all just speculation at this point.

Totally get your desire to see it with your own eyes point of view, but yeah totally disagree. Certainly not speculation, just basic organic chemistry. Not sure what evidence you'd need as proof. Time plus heat is all that's needed to effect change. It's more than just dispersion of solutes.

 

[Levitas]

Totally get your desire to see it with your own eyes point of view, but yeah totally disagree. Certainly not speculation, just basic organic chemistry. Not sure what evidence you'd need as proof. Time plus heat is all that's needed to effect change. It's more than just dispersion of solutes.

I'm talking about the act of sitting, or as many call it, 'steeping'. Not utilizing a device that warms the liquid.

Thus why I mentioned the possibility of change due to pH levels, and interactions. Because without an outside influence, i.e. heat, how could flavorings completely change into something different merely by sitting.

 

[EddieAdams]

As an aside to this thread and only because it will help all our efforts:

All tobaccos continue to change throughout their shelf life. From first made to two years, they will change. All tobaccos must be steeped. Period. Some more so than others. It does not matter if its a forced steep via a crock pot, a UC, or left in a closet for a month. Just varied rates of change. I have tobaccos I like fresh, that I appreciate how they change over time. And I have tobaccos that need two weeks minimum before I touch them, and from there on I can appreciate how they mature. A crock or UC gets you there faster, in little time.

The key in both was the temperature and time used for both the crock pot and the UC. 150° constant temp for 4 hours. Both method produced consistant and very very similar results. Only a slight edge from the UC was noted. In the end, after numerous reviewers tried them, we all felt there was little difference of note between the two methods. Either method used will shave a little more than 2 weeks off wait time vs just putting it in a closet.

As I am the one who nailed down the process for steeping at or near 150°, I agree with Mike's findings and they were very scientifically done. The jury is out. Both UC and crock offers the same benefits. The key is constant temp and heat, as I have said for nearly 2 years now.

One hour in a UC is not enough to change a darn thing, much less if it isnt a heated UC.

He stated in his post that additional time after UC or CP wouldn't change anything. Basically ,"that liquid is steeped after UC or CP treatment "...
Which from my experience isn't the case.

A single 50 minute cycle in my HEATED ultrasonic cleaner actually makes a big difference in steep time. Cutting it by half most of the time. So it does do a darn thing. Shaking and "burping" the bottle daily without anything else shortens the steep time. There are plenty of ways to speed up the steep without gadgets, all that effect overall time.

We also concluded that this type of steeping those 3-4 days you are mentioning is not making a dent any more.

Back to BB' clones I'd say....don't want to hijack this thread.

Cheers.

 

[buffaloguy]

Eddie, You are missing the point of his post comletely. What he his saying is you arent doing YOUR UC steep long enough to eliminate the need for the extra 3-4 days of steeping you spoke of in your post. You are only running your UC for 50 mins. Thats fine and itll speed it along a tad, but not much based on the tests that were done.

If you ran it a full 4 cycles and at 150° you would see that those extra 3-4 days you wait arent necessary anymore. Its a DRAMATIC difference between one hour in a UC vs. 4 hours. Shaking beyond first mixing isnt even necessary but if it makes you feel better go for it. It wont change the results much, if any. Ive done this over 2 years with hundreds of mixes. MikePietro just did it scientifically and Im glad he did.

Back to bobas discussion. If youd like to see the steeping info and tests its in the UC thread part 3. There is no denying the results.

Ill have the two flavorings Im missing to make your recipe on Wed Eddie. I have my reservations but Im gonna try it. I even ordered more more Nicotiana tabacum Bulgarian absolute just in case I need it. TFA may not have a source, but I do

 

[vapolator]

Can you describe me the taste of this Black Jack please ?

 

[JohnnyDill]

As far as UC steeping, I use a cheap Harbor Freight unit that just has 3 minute cycles. But if you put a squeeze clamp on the power button, it stays on as long as it is plugged in. I plug it in to a timer for 30 min on / 30 min off cycles for 12 hours with all new mixes. The temperature gets very warm. I don't care if a crock pot is almost as effective as I use the UC for cleaning attys and tanks, too. Very effective!

My point is that the color change in e-liquid after 12 hours of UC cycling is dramatic. Then the juices sits overnight with the caps off. This method really gives the steeping a head start; -always more than good enough to vape the next day. I am NOT trying to hijack this Boba's thread, just sharing my experience regarding UC steeping.

 

[Porksmuggler]

I'm talking about the act of sitting, or as many call it, 'steeping'. Not utilizing a device that warms the liquid.

Thus why I mentioned the possibility of change due to pH levels, and interactions. Because without an outside influence, i.e. heat, how could flavorings completely change into something different merely by sitting.

Ignoring the completely change into something else part, because that's not what anyone else said, and isn't how I've ever seen steeping mentioned, but yes there are several catalysts. Time alone is enough if the flavoring isn't stabilized, like I mentioned about TFA Marshmallow. The organic compounds in the flavoring interact with each other, on their own. Of course once mixed with other flavorings and especially nicotine, these reactions just increase, even without light, heat, or air.

You're referencing this stuff like it's theoretical, it's not, maybe discuss with a chemist, or even better, a flavor chemist.

 

[Oiisu]

There has been no proof, other than color change, and taste (empirical evidence) that there is any actual change happening with 'steeping'

My HPLC system, IR and NMR spectrometers should be coming in the mail this week

And how do you just get to discount color change like that? It's not like it can just change color without anything else changing

 

[vapolator]

Damned, you have tons of steeping threads to fight you about sonic, crock, hot dogs (i've seen it), voodoo and all you want steeping things.

Please keep this thread clean and focused on formulas and aromas ref.

 

[EddieAdams]

I steep my liquid by placing the bottle in my ultrasonic cleaner, placing my ultrasonic cleaner in my crockpot both set at 153° while M.J.Fox holds it....fully steeped in 7 minutes....

 

[clh2121]

I steep my liquid by placing the bottle in my ultrasonic cleaner, placing my ultrasonic cleaner in my crockpot both set at 153° while M.J.Fox holds it....fully steeped in 7 minutes....

So M.J. holds the crockpot? or the ultrasonic in the Crockpot? (Yep, I'm enabling this particular trolling post.)

 

[EddieAdams]

So M.J. holds the crockpot? or the ultrasonic in the Crockpot? (Yep, I'm enabling this particular trolling post.)

The whole setup. The extra shaking makes the difference. Occasionally pulls the plugs out though...

 

[HappiVappi]

I steep my liquid by placing the bottle in my ultrasonic cleaner, placing my ultrasonic cleaner in my crockpot both set at 153° while M.J.Fox holds it....fully steeped in 7 minutes....

I am using the very same setup. However, I take this a step further....
Bottle in the UC, UC in the crock pot, crock pot in the microwave, microwave in the oven, oven on the BBQ grill - this way I can serve any side dish you can imagine at the same time...

Cheers.


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[aceswired]

Excited about Eddie's recipe. Won't ask for a PM as I have not contributed to this clone. But hoping Eddie decides to unleash it on us someday.

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[EddieAdams]

Hey, maybe a bit more TA in that recipe....just maybe....

Or maybe none at all and increase the first ingredient...

 

[andreashadji]

Getting back on the gj with tpa black honey tobacco and ready banana juice is a no go....I am also interested to see the boba recipe if possible.keep up the good work guys!!!


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