I feel the same way you do, papa---I love macerated natural tobacco extracts more than any other method---but my palate is clearly not the same as FlyBoy's.
Natural Tobaccos - Part Deux
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I feel the same way you do, papa---I love macerated natural tobacco extracts more than any other method---but my palate is clearly not the same as FlyBoy's.
My thoughts on him if shared would require me to ban myself, so I'll keep them to myself. I have no respect for somebody that cannot conduct themselves with respect for others. I'm out on this topic..
Yeah, i wasn't sure what his current standing is at ECF. He had some issues with ECF a few months ago, the details of which i forget, so i just wanted to be on the safe side and not mention the name. The message is more important imo. I do like that he is taking some of the major e-liquid manufacturers to task on this issue, and i do wish more of us would do the same.
Great little comparison Bill. I always enjoy your reviews.
I am similar in that I have a broad range of atomizers and tanks that I use with are contrasted in design and technology. I will go from an aspire mini nautilus to an 801 or a CE4. I won't exclusively vape one of these older devices all day but one of them will be sitting in my desk or in my bag alongside the newer devices.
Why do I still use older devices? 3 reasons.
1) they are actually new and still in the wrappers I purchased them in. I purchased them at a time when they were new and popular and still have not used them due to the rapid influx of newer and innovative products that would quickly supersede the current inventory.
2) I have 18-24 mg nicotine liquids I purchased 2-3 years ago which I occasionally still put in my rotation and I match them to the older low voltage driven attys and tanks that were commensurate with the nicotine strength of liquids that were widely used in that generation. I tend to match the hatch. There is no point putting old FSUSA liquid in a kayfun or magma. The nicotine alone would blow my head off.
3) the vintage car syndrome. Sometimes I like to try something new by vaping something from a foregone era. Some of those older atty and tanks (particularly the Cisco spec class) produce amazing flavour. Many of the early Joye and Cisco spec atomizers were the first true micro coils. The draw is right and almost like a vacuum in some of those 510 Cisco spec atomizers. It's something I've not been able to produce in a rebuildables.
I also still very much enjoy the occasional 306. The flavor is superb on those due to the proximity of the liquid to the mouth.
Hmm. Think I might fill an old new Boge cartomizer I still have lying around. Why the blazens not!
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He is a lot more mild mannered and gracious in person. I too, agree that he comes across as offensive and disrespectful in cyberspace. He has a major issue with what he considers censorship and goes to great ( sometimes childish ) lengths to test the boundaries of what is and isn't acceptable. He is a rabble-rouser, no doubt, but he does bring about awareness on issues important to vapers and goes to great lengths to take on the government in regard to these issues. His means, i often do not agree with and he likes to strike attitudes, often for no good reason.
I don't intend to defend or attack him, just my take on him based on my interaction with him.
As per our Suppliers Manager, we've never pressured any of our Suppliers to join any of the Groups spoken about on ECF.
Thanks Bill! good info. I will try a few things, continue to steep em, and now that I have a better VW MOD, I can try the NETs' like Dusty said on a little lower setting, say 14-20 range. I have a few builds floating around I can play around with. It certainly could simply be my palate is just different or even unique lol. I also kind of set myself for this as I smoked a decent amount of "Pipe" tobacco analogs/roll yer own and therefore assumed the NET's would be spot on with those. Gonna let em steep more (Theyve been sitting there for 2 months now)
Fair enough, not ECF' place to do, i suppose. I was never sure what it means to be an ECF supplier btw, but i did/do feel a little more comfortable ordering from them for the first time, all else being equal.
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Mazinny, sent you a PM link for you to contemplate.
sent you a response !
While it may not be ECF's place to pressure suppliers to follow certain standards or join certain groups, I believe it is the duty of every consumer to pressure said suppliers to do the right thing. Based on the little reading I've done on the matter of which juices have what in them, I just tossed a few bottles away (none from vendors relevant to this thread).
And, IMO, it is ECF's duty to make sure consumers are aware of this study and other relevant information, so that everyone is aware of the issue and then can choose their response to their juice vendors/makers. This does not go against the existing practices of the forum. ECF frequently posts warnings about safety matters - battery safety, subohm vaping, etc. - so I see official posts on the latest news and studies about juice safety as equivalent.
I, for one, am somewhat annoyed that I am only finding out which brands have said chemicals in their juices through hearsay, and hope the good Doctor Farsalinos will eventually release the full results of his test, naming names, after he has given them adequate notice so they may rectify their issues without causing undue harm to their business.
I'm also annoyed that I don't have clear guidelines on what types of flavors can contain these chemicals. Should I be concerned about any or all of the straight NETs I prefer these days? Or is it really only certain types of sweet flavorings that may contain them?
I am also glad to see at least one vendor discussed in this thread who has taken a pro-active stance on this matter. IMO, every vendor should handle this issue as he did. (Not mentioning the name, don't know if doing so is appropriate in this thread)
I will be contacting all the vendors whose juices I favor and asking for lab certificates at some point.
And, IMO, it is ECF's duty to make sure consumers are aware of this study and other relevant information, so that everyone is aware of the issue and then can choose their response to their juice vendors/makers. This does not go against the existing practices of the forum. ECF frequently posts warnings about safety matters - battery safety, subohm vaping, etc. - so I see official posts on the latest news and studies about juice safety as equivalent.
I, for one, am somewhat annoyed that I am only finding out which brands have said chemicals in their juices through hearsay, and hope the good Doctor Farsalinos will eventually release the full results of his test, naming names, after he has given them adequate notice so they may rectify their issues without causing undue harm to their business.
I'm also annoyed that I don't have clear guidelines on what types of flavors can contain these chemicals. Should I be concerned about any or all of the straight NETs I prefer these days? Or is it really only certain types of sweet flavorings that may contain them?
I am also glad to see at least one vendor discussed in this thread who has taken a pro-active stance on this matter. IMO, every vendor should handle this issue as he did. (Not mentioning the name, don't know if doing so is appropriate in this thread)
I will be contacting all the vendors whose juices I favor and asking for lab certificates at some point.
I am not sure if you meant Ethervapes, but if you did, i want to re-emphasize that from the vendors listed in the first page of this thread, MOV has also taken these steps, in January of this year. They are now a member of AEMSA and every single liquid ( finished product ) in their line-up has been tested by an independent lab.
I don't mean to cast any doubts on the safety protocol of the other vendors mentioned on this thread, by mentioning MOV by name, and i am not implying that the product of other vendors talked about on this site is less safe. I am sure that there are other vendors who have taken these steps in the past, and i know of another one that is taking steps currently.
Not every vendor is as established as MOV, and can afford to take all the steps necessary to be AEMSA certified, but i plan to find out as much as i can about their safety protocol. I have already written emails to some of them, and will be sending emails to more, asking if their product is diacetyl and diketone free, and if so, do they test the finished product at an independent lab themselves, or if they are relying on what their suppliers claim.
All i need is transparency and honesty from vendors.
It's interesting you say this.
The 1st time I ordered NETs I had the same experience. They had a mustiness I didn't like and wrote them off. I actuallu hated them.
I stayed with the vapeland flavors I was used to and put them away for a number of months.
I came back to the N-E-T juices I had and found that they no longer had that same flavor to me. not sure what changed, but I wound up really enjoying them.
the one thing I've found is that NETs do smell a bit odd out of the bottle, oily, musty etc... but they don't often taste the same way they smell.
I also found that if I vaped them like a pipe, short puffs and exhaling through my nose as opposed to inhaling them into my lungs, they had a completely different flavor. They were indeed very tobacco-y when exhaled nasally.
I'm still not sure if it's my taste that have changed, if I was overly sensitive since I was still only a few months into vaping ,or what. But after coming back and "learning" what i consider to be the ideal way to taste them, (nasally), I really enjoy them now. When done right, NETs are the closest smoking experince i can find but I do seem to take some getting used to, as well as not vaping them like their fruit or pastry flavors...
I also notice they have a very tobacco-y room odor as well, but a sweet tobacco leaf odor, not the odor of combustion.
Maybe put them down for a few weeks and steep them as well and come back and try the "pipe" style of vaping and see if you get the tobacco experience I now am very happy with...
ALSO: keep those coils clean, or change them often. You get really quick carbon buildup and that will ruin the flavor. I dry burn at least once a day and am digging these a lot now...
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RBFS Petner's Pipe loaded up in a KFL this morning. First impressions running at 12W on the ZNA make it out to be another lovely offering by Brian.
Heady bright Virginia plays at the back of the throat and nasal passages on the exhale and the Burley adds an almost muted nutty note to the vape. I almost, almost detected a slight coconut hint during a couple of the hits but it could be my mind playing tricks on me. I was expecting this to be a sweeter overall vape considering the Rum/Raisin reference, but those flavours don't jump out in an obvious manner. Overall a very nice solid vape that I would not mind re-ordering.
Now to see how well it does over the course of the tank in the KFL.
Admirals Pipe did not make it through an entire tank. Wick needed changing after around 3 ml.
Heady bright Virginia plays at the back of the throat and nasal passages on the exhale and the Burley adds an almost muted nutty note to the vape. I almost, almost detected a slight coconut hint during a couple of the hits but it could be my mind playing tricks on me. I was expecting this to be a sweeter overall vape considering the Rum/Raisin reference, but those flavours don't jump out in an obvious manner. Overall a very nice solid vape that I would not mind re-ordering.
Now to see how well it does over the course of the tank in the KFL.
Admirals Pipe did not make it through an entire tank. Wick needed changing after around 3 ml.
I love the bottom ports of the magma, gives a warm tasty vape. All the other newer designs I've tried just seem like variations on the old brass monkey which is a good dripper but the magma is unique.
Right now just filled it with Ether's new Dark Skyes, what I nice vape. Not my favorite vanilla flavoring (I love the way vaporite does vanilla) but the Cavendish takes control and makes this a fine vape. Really full of body like vanilla pudding in a way.
Also tries St. Stephen and its a good vape just not a fan of English blends, I prefer Nomad for Latakia.
I brought this up several months ago and don't consider these methods as "natural tobaccos>" Ahl groupies nearly ran me out of here.
Just first glance looks like beauracracy we don't need. The thing is with e-juice is just order a small bottle, if it tastes good its is good, if it doesn't let it steep a few weeks and try again. Taste is subjective and I don't see how certification can help.
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Hi, hope everyone is well. Been incredibly busy lately and haven't had time really even get online.
Anyway, I did my juice re-up at the beginning of the month from Ahlusion. I saw they have several new flavors. One called "Neutral". It's tobacco, but I can't really put my finger on what type of tobacco it is. Is it even a NET? It's clear when fresh but it's getting yellow now that I've had it for a week or so.
Anyone tried Neutral? What do you think of it. Oh, Alpha Centauri is pretty damn good, too. So are the new teas, especially Peach White Tea.
Anyway, I did my juice re-up at the beginning of the month from Ahlusion. I saw they have several new flavors. One called "Neutral". It's tobacco, but I can't really put my finger on what type of tobacco it is. Is it even a NET? It's clear when fresh but it's getting yellow now that I've had it for a week or so.
Anyone tried Neutral? What do you think of it. Oh, Alpha Centauri is pretty damn good, too. So are the new teas, especially Peach White Tea.
I am not sure if to take this comment seriously, but just in case you are being serious, i want to point out that 'taste' is not the point of all this. These are issues of safety and transparency. Besides taste, i care about the following as well, for obvious reasons ( at least obvious to me )
Purpose
The purpose of these Standards is to create a responsible and sustainable practices and process for the safe manufacturing of
“e-liquids” used in electronic cigarettes. Our members believe we have a responsibility to self-regulate the e-liquid manufacturing
process based on professional criteria. AEMSA aims to accomplish this by creating, implementing and upholding standards for
the manufacture of e-liquids. One of AEMSA’s primary goals is to provide consumers with higher degrees of confidence our
members’ products are manufactured with professionalism, accuracy and safety
AEMSA standards are established based on the following Core Beliefs:
• We have a responsibility to verify the accuracy of any nicotine content in the products we distribute.
• We have a responsibility to ensure the quality and safety of all ingredients in our e-liquids.
• We have a responsibility to prepare our products in a clean, sanitary and safe environment.
• We have a responsibility to ensure our products are packaged and delivered in a safe manner.
• We have a responsibility to provide a level of transparency into the monitoring and verification process.
The 2012 AEMSA Standards are living documents and subject to changes according to the AEMSA corporate structure and
procedures.
bu·reauc·ra·cy
byo͝oˈräkrəsē/
noun
noun: bureaucracy
a system of government in which most of the important decisions are made by state officials rather than by elected representatives.
When our vaping rights are under attack by bureaucrats everywhere, it would be wise to do all we can, not to give them added ammunition. This diacetyl issue has already been reported on by the BBC and Forbes.
Ya, pretty much what the movie industry did way back when the government wanted to step in... They decided to 'self regulate' and put a rating on each movie to show what the content was and who was meant to watch it. That is how we got the Rating system used today. Yep, its self imposed by Hollywood themselves
But it worked.- Status
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