Need advice on righ gauge of wire spool

[Punk In Drublic]

Thanks a lot for your help, one last more question, which diameter fused clapton wire do you recommend? Any higher resistance K1 recommendation?

Are you looking for Kanthal Fused Clapton wire?

 

[Viper2020]

Ok. Understand that by using 2 coils in Parallel you half the resistance. You can increase resistance by adding more wraps. But in doing so, you add mass to the coil(s) which will require more power and will be a hotter vape. Higher mass also effects how quickly a coil can heat up.

But i don't have room left inside the tank if i add one more wrap.

 

[Viper2020]

Are you looking for Kanthal Fused Clapton wire?

Yes, i am looking for Kanthal Fused Clapton wire.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

But i don't have room left inside the tank if i add one more wrap.

Unfortunately these are some of the challenges we face with building coils. Personally I think the Geekvape wire is better suited for a single coil application. But that is just my opinion.

Let me see what is available in Kanthal

 

[Viper2020]

Unfortunately these are some of the challenges we face with building coils. Personally I think the Geekvape wire is better suited for a single coil application. But that is just my opinion.

Let me see what is available in Kanthal

Link would be great.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Link would be great.

Is there a reason why you want over 0.2ohms? What RTA/RDA are you using?

 

[Viper2020]

I think it's safer to use +0.2 ohms and i like to vape around 40-45 watts maximum, and a double battery lasts me a day even if i chain vape it. I have Geekvape Creed 25mm Rta and Geek Vape ZEUS X 25mm RTA.

 

[Viper2020]

Is there a reason why you want over 0.2ohms? What RTA/RDA are you using?

I think it's safer to vape +0.2 ohms coils and i like to vape around 40-45 watts maximum, and a double battery lasts me a day even if i chain vape it. I have Geekvape Creed 25mm Rta and Geek Vape ZEUS X 25mm RTA.

 

[greek mule]

The coils in your photo are 4.5 wraps.
0.284 Ohm each.Dual coil set up gives total resistance 0.142 Ohm.
After dry burning the coils to work the hot spots ,resistance might change a little bit.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

I think it's safer to vape +0.2 ohms coils and i like to vape around 40-45 watts maximum, and a double battery lasts me a day even if i chain vape it. I have Geekvape Creed 25mm Rta and Geek Vape ZEUS X 25mm RTA.

Cool. I won’t debate what you feel is safe – we all have our own values and needs which can’t be debated. However……

On a regulated device you set your power based on the mass of the coil, not the resistance. The mass dictates how quickly a coil will heat up and or cool down. It will also dictate how much heat the coil retains which could transfer to the atomizer making it unbearably hot.

Clapton type coils are of high(ish) mass so they require more power. Using 2 Clapton coils doubles the mass which requires even more power.

You are going to be challenged at using 2 Clapton type coils, keeping your resistance above 0.2ohms all while trying to keep the mass low so that you can operate within your preferred 40 watt range.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Here’s an example:

Your Geekvape wire 3.5mm ID 4.5 wraps = 0.284 ohm per coil and 576mg of mass. 2 coils = 0.14 ohms and 1152mg off mass

A non fused Clapton of Kanthal 26awg core/36 awg wrap. 3.5mm ID 5.5 wraps = 0.814 ohms and 143mg off mass. 2 coils would be 0.4 ohms and 286mg of mass.

So with the Geekvape wire at 40 watts would require ~2.5 seconds to raise the temperature by 200°C. Same 40 watts for the non fused Clapton would only require 0.6 seconds.

To note: This is dry firing a coil. This does not account for juice saturation and air flow. No idea how to calculate that for it can vary quite significantly. But adding juice and air will increase that time.

 

[Viper2020]

The coils in your photo are 4.5 wraps.
0.284 Ohm each.Dual coil set up gives total resistance 0.142 Ohm.
After dry burning the coils to work the hot spots ,resistance might change a little bit.

Thanks for the info. I used to use prebuilt coils, I’m new to wrapping my own.

 

[Viper2020]

Here’s an example:

Your Geekvape wire 3.5mm ID 4.5 wraps = 0.284 ohm per coil and 576mg of mass. 2 coils = 0.14 ohms and 1152mg off mass

A non fused Clapton of Kanthal 26awg core/36 awg wrap. 3.5mm ID 5.5 wraps = 0.814 ohms and 143mg off mass. 2 coils would be 0.4 ohms and 286mg of mass.

So with the Geekvape wire at 40 watts would require ~2.5 seconds to raise the temperature by 200°C. Same 40 watts for the non fused Clapton would only require 0.6 seconds.

To note: This is dry firing a coil. This does not account for juice saturation and air flow. No idea how to calculate that for it can vary quite significantly. But adding juice and air will increase that time.

It’s getting a little bit late and have to get up early tomorrow morning. Thanks for all of your help, you helped me understand how coils work better.

We can continue tomorrow if you’re available.

Have a good night.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

It’s getting a little bit late and have to get up early tomorrow morning. Thanks for all of your help, you helped me understand how coils work better.

We can continue tomorrow if you’re available.

Have a good night.

NP – glad to be of assistance. You can ask more questions tomorrow if you wish

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Thanks for the info. I used to use prebuilt coils, I’m new to wrapping my own.

Don’t have to answer now, but what premade coils did you use?

 

[greek mule]

To make your coils to get a satisfying heat flux 300mw/mm² at 50 watt,each coil must not exceed a mass over 85 mg.I suggest to use SS316L Superfine MTL Fused Clapton Wire 30ga X 2(=)+38ga from Vandy Vape.
This is a spool of wire,use your coil jig,3mm id,3.5 wraps to achieve the proper mass of coils and heat flux.
Total resistance of dual coil build 0.17 ohm.
Vape Wires | VANDY VAPE® Full Steam Ahead

 

[Punk In Drublic]

To make your coils to get a satisfying heat flux 300mw/mm² at 50 watt,each coil must not exceed a mass over 85 mg.I suggest to use SS316L Superfine MTL Fused Clapton Wire 30ga X 2(=)+38ga from Vandy Vape.
This is a spool of wire,use your coil jig,3mm id,3.5 wraps to achieve the proper mass of coils and heat flux.
Total resistance of dual coil build 0.17 ohm.
Vape Wires | VANDY VAPE® Full Steam Ahead

Heat Flux in Steam (if that is what you used) is 1 watt divided by the calculated surface area of the coil. There is a connection between mass and surface area given the same metal. But Heat Flux within Steam is not dependent on mass. You can have 2 coils with the same surface area but different mass, the Heat Flux will be the same for both.

I’m on the fence with how Steam calculates Heat Flux. It somewhat gives an indication of how hot/cool your vape will be, but unsure of how accurate that is when mass and airflow comes into play. Entering one of my preferred Fused Claptons, to achieve a Heat Flux of 200mw/mm², Steam tells me I need to apply 170 watts. Thats ... NUTS. I get a nice warm vape in the 50 watts range. At 70+ watts I would be changing my name to Margaret Houlihan (Hot Lips!)

 

[greek mule]

Heat Flux in Steam (if that is what you used) is 1 watt divided by the calculated surface area of the coil. There is a connection between mass and surface area given the same metal. But Heat Flux within Steam is not dependent on mass. You can have 2 coils with the same surface area but different mass, the Heat Flux will be the same for both.

I’m on the fence with how Steam calculates Heat Flux. It somewhat gives an indication of how hot/cool your vape will be, but unsure of how accurate that is when mass and airflow comes into play. Entering one of my preferred Fused Claptons, to achieve a Heat Flux of 200mw/mm², Steam tells me I need to apply 170 watts. Thats ... NUTS. I get a nice warm vape in the 50 watts range. At 70+ watts I would be changing my name to Margaret Houlihan (Hot Lips!)

I suggested to keep mass of coils low so OP get fast ramp up due to lower heat capacity of coils.

 

[Zakillah]

To make your coils to get a satisfying heat flux 300mw/mm² at 50 watt,each coil must not exceed a mass over 85 mg.I suggest to use SS316L Superfine MTL Fused Clapton Wire 30ga X 2(=)+38ga from Vandy Vape.
This is a spool of wire,use your coil jig,3mm id,3.5 wraps to achieve the proper mass of coils and heat flux.
Total resistance of dual coil build 0.17 ohm.
Vape Wires | VANDY VAPE® Full Steam Ahead

Yeah; if you´re shooting for 40-45W using a fat dual coil build isnt going to work very well.
I´d look for the type of wire that greek mule suggested; 30G cores with a 38 or 40G wrap.
Stuff like this:
$3.41 Authentic Coilology Ni80 MTL Fused Clapton Heating Wire - 2*30/40 AWG / 2*0.25mm/0.08mm dia. / 3.74ohm/ft / 10ft at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

$4.43 Authentic Vandy Vape Kanthal A1 Superfine MTL Fused Clapton Heating Wire - 32*2/38 AWG / 0.2mm*2/0.1mm dia. / 6.71ohm/ft / 10ft at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

Also, dont pay too much attention to the resistance. Doesnt really matter. Coil size and mass are whats really important.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

I suggested to keep mass of coils low so OP get fast ramp up due to lower heat capacity of coils.

Agree – just sharing thoughts on Heat Flux and how Steam calculates it.