New ECF approved Buzz Pro name POLL !

What Name do we use ???

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markfm

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So at least in part it sounds like it isn't necessarily that someone have 3 really large slots, perhaps, as that there be reasonable (a bad word, imprecise) venting occurring over both batteries.

If swelling is a concern, venting gets more interesting, accounting for where it occurs. http://www.fire.tc.faa.gov/pdf/systems/lithium-ion_battery_04112006.pdf is not directly germane, but discusses a bit about how things fail, testing 18650 response to overheating from a fire.

Sorry for the sidetrack.
 

rolygate

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So at least in part it sounds like it isn't necessarily that someone have 3 really large slots, perhaps, as that there be reasonable (a bad word, imprecise) venting occurring over both batteries. ......

Sort of. There could be other solutions as yet not suggested.

But that isn't the real issue: there are vendors out there who don't have the slightest concept of what engineering is really about (they want to blame any kind of problem on the user), who will cut any corner they can to save money, and who absolutely refuse to take any responsibility for the safety of their product.

The main task is to make it impossible for those people to wreck the safety features. This is actually the real job here. If it was simply a question of all the mod makers appreciating that engineering involves not selling something that the user can hurt themselves with, we could maybe say: "Drill enough holes in enough places that the mod can't explode." Some would do it right and drill three lines of 3 x 3/8" holes. Other would drill four 1/8" holes and say they had complied. The buyer sees some holes and thinks they are OK.

With three slots 2" long the job is done - it can't be evaded and short-cutted to make it ineffective. Along with the other safety features that Mike has in the Buzz, it makes it a very safe prospect when used with good batteries.
 
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Bovinia

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Yeah, Mike kinda forgot to actually put names on the poll, so in true Buzz Army fashion, we voted out of fun ;)

Honestly Mike, I would take a que from one of Roly's suggestions and go with that and call it ready for inspection.

Some would do it right and drill three lines of 3 x 3/8" holes.

or

With three slots 2" long the job is done - it can't be evaded and short-cutted to make it ineffective
 

Big Screen D

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Yes there is a big difference. But the blowout plug was iteration #1 and it didn't stand up to subsequent examination and test. Forgetting about the Buzz for a moment, and looking at any/all (other) mods:

- On some mods the plug might be fixed too hard, with stainless threads for example, and there may be a possibility the atomizer might blow off first.

- There is an issue with cells swelling up that was pointed out to me. When a cell fails it tends to swell, and this could block the tube. Two swollen cells is something that cannot be overlooked. It could lead to a situation where the pressure is much higher at the top of the tube. This may be what happened in one or two recent blowups.

- When a blowout plug has been employed, and has worked successfully, there was always damage to the user (2 reports). The reaction vector caused the mod to punch into the user's face with a fast, sharp shock, which caused damage. This included a cut tongue / face / broken teeth. If the mod was pointed at the eyes when this happened then an eye would certainly be lost.

- On CPF there are pictures of the damage done by an endcap blowing off a flashlight when a blowup occurred. It hit an oak door and caused visible damage. If a child had been in the way it's likely that injury would have occurred.

Admittedly a flashlight is not a PV and the issues are different, nevertheless a blowout plug is not the ideal solution to this issue. Slots fix every aspect of the problem because they provide a gas vent facility at all points in the tube (top, middle and bottom), and above all they cannot fail. They can't be short-cutted or corner-cut to save costs (as some vendors will always do) - you can look at them and see them, they can't have hidden shortcuts.

As I'm sure you understand, the implications of the current situation are massive for the electronic cigarette world, and something has to be done that is absolutely and without fail going to solve the problem - saving injury and stopping the media reports. Half-measures are no good because by the time the usual corners have been cut, the safety margin has been eroded yet again and it doesn't work.

Look, everybody hates ECF because of [insert here]. Three years later everybody is saying "The situation in [insert here] is far better now than it was, luckily", and they forgot it was ECF who 'forced' it on the community. We don't care as long as it gets fixed.

Apparently we were APPROVED then DIS APPROVED because they could not get their heads around the shape even though I calculated the area for them ???

ECF has no idea what it wants or what it is doing , sorry but it is true , I have bent over backwards to make this happen , they now say they have to SEE a unit to approve it WTH is wrong with you guys , we are ALL OVER ECF our specs are well known , they are on my FORUM on MY web SITE where the hell else should I put them ??

They are afraid other companies will try to scam them ( they are an organizing body after all ! NOT ) because of the DESIGN and it is NOT straight ??????????

Roly even said in his POST that the area is what matters and that is goes the length of the tube !!! I DID THAT ALREADY KIDS .

QUOTE "
1. Three or more milled slots in the metal tube body
For a standard mod taking 1 x 18650 cell or 2 x 16340 cells, the slots should be about 50mm x 4mm, or 2 inches x 5/32nds.
If full-length 2" slots cannot be used then four slots should be fitted. The key is the total cross-sectional area of the gas vents.
End Quote"


I am fed up with this ....

I actually applaud ECF for attempting to mitigate the risk both to users from physical harm, as well the industry itself from sensationalized press. Explosions always make good copy.

Can you elaborate at this time what is it about the current redesign that is causing an apparent delay regarding ECF certification?
 
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