Protank MicroCoil Discussion!!

[MacTechVpr]

I like the nice blue color on your coil.
Sorry if I wasn't clear on the sigelei and it happens with Pico if even at same wattage.So it could be 15 watts just isn't enough power.
The vapor production is thick and cloudy but tempatures are too cool.
Mine does same thing and anything below 1.3 ohms shuts it down.
Im using 27 gauge now,1.30hms,I'll try 29 gauge and see what happens.
I have a nautilus clone but it vapes poorly and needs drilling.

Think any dual-coil arrangement is going to put you below 1.3Ω wtih 29 or thicker. I've run Immo's on Sig's and Vamo 15's with single-coil. Sorry perhaps I should have been clearer. On your Pico I'd go for the sweet spot (see Mod range | Steam Engine | free vaping calculators) for the res target. Prolly between .7-1.2Ω. Not sure which eleaf spec best conforms to yours. Hold off on the 29 till you find the power range center. A 27x1 10/9 2.4mmØ = 1.409Ω will let you try a single in the 454 with the Sig.

Good luck and nudge us if need be.

p.s. That blue color is where you want to be covering as much of the coil as poss except end turns. Just fire it up at low voltage and it'll happen. Whistle on it if need be.

 

[Robbert]

I put a dual 9 of 27gauge and got 0.66ohms in my pico and 454 does great.
I tried a single using same number of turns with Sigelei it was a bit warmer but not quite there yet.

 

[MacTechVpr]

Winding t.m.c.'s is all about maximizing vaporization density. Getting the most production from the wire and power we use. Immediately that means two things a richer vape but also a cooler vape. I love the first but not at the expense of being unable to moderate the temperature. With strain and a good selection of gauges you can find the exact combo of wire capacity, flow and power that suits your temperature comfort zone. The density to make that happen will always be there. Then dial up all the warmth you need.

Thanks for the ack's guys. Appreciated.

Good luck.

 

[MacTechVpr]

I might try a Protank and modify coil like the thread started if I can find one at a reasonable price.
Did anyone find the later versions or the minis to perform better than the original Protank?

Consider as well the 22mm Aerotank Mega. Somewhat less leaky than the PT series do to its base design. Takes the PT3 heads (longer head assy, needs more of a top wick if rebuilt). Much better juice cap and airflow. As well a v2 base with bigger airhole. Works reasonably well from low watts to ~18W with the stocker head. Lots of parts for this and the PT series at Lightning Vapes. So it's sustainable. One huge advantage for the Kanger line.

However, with the Subtank RBA you can build from low W to high, at high density or diffusion under power. You can't beat the Mini's versatility. And…it is possible to rebuild the OCC with conventional spaced, twisted and the example I've posted here of a three post dual twisted center-lead t.m.c.

Twisted center-lead (3-lead) dual-coil

• MacTechVpr
• May 31, 2015
• mactechvpr microcoil tensioned

A number of practical and inexpensive long term remedies. Hope others kick in on the other side. Just thought to make sure you got an answer on this PT thread.

Good luck Rob.

 

[Robbert]

I think I seen a post where your using a mech mod or the Smok Magneto.
Are mech mods more efficient on battery life than let's say VW?
I'm tempted to try a Protank.Does any of them have liquid flow adjustment?
I might try modding the aspire nautilus clone I got a bit more.Air flow is restricted and liquid flow is terrible.
I drilled out one air hole to 1/8.Better but not quite there yet.
I'm guessing increase the wick size holes in those disposable pre made coil inserts to increase liquid flow?
If I can improve by using the premade coils,then I'll try a wound coil.

 

[MacTechVpr]

If you're running 1/8" air @ <10W than you haven't begun to approach the density or vapor vol I'm talkin' about. That's a lot of air for the miserly juice flow of most clearo's. Production was def there with the early nauty but not density. I need beaucoup both.

If you'd like to take a stab at the PT coils which can def go 15W and above but are great in that 7-10W zone...

Kanger Mini Protank 3 Clearomizer - Mt Baker Vapor - Electronic Cigarettes Coupon (vapeon10)

Yes, it'll Ego thread to the magnetto…what I mentioned was my fav pocket vape for ages. And you can do light wire twisted rebuilds in the PT3 heads (like I said provided adequate top wick). Used to run the mag with a Kick to keep it near peak watts. You can drill out the air holes in the base. This helps but it's best to try and find the slotted airflow based for the mini for its adjustment. Thing with clearo's is the wick saturation can vary with vacuum pressure. It's great to be able to open up the air and apply more power. With the slotted base, that condition is easily addressed by just lightly blowing in the air slot with a primer fire. This dries out the wick adequately to resume a normal flow. A lot I know. Choose wisely my friend.

Good luck.

 

[Robbert]

Sounds good.
I got to try my limitless plus with an istick 100 tc.
The Clapton coils are okay but the limitless plus uses liquid very quickly and I need to increase the liquid flow to the coils.

 

[Robbert]

Exactly which one of the Protank 3 are you modifying,
the Protank 3 mini or Protank 3?

 

[MacTechVpr]

Have worked with all of them but the PT mini is the match-up for the Magnetto which you mentioned. A few posts back I said the Aerotank Mega is really the latest and preferred version I feel for it's tank capacity and also PT3 head compatible. The airflow is much better and so more versatile for this small coil. But realistically your limited to under 15W I think. The Subtank mini's RDA deck is flexible enough to allow you to build lower and higher watts. And it couldn't be any easier whether single or multi-strand.

G'luck shopping.

 

[Robbert]

I looked at a few reviews and now I know why I was so confused on the Protank version.
They all are very close to the same tank.The mini,toptank,Protank,and nano seem to have interchangeable parts.

 

[MacTechVpr]

Lifted from the VU thread…Nichrome ruined me | Page 2 | Post #100 | for info here.

-I guess I need to be educated. What is an alumina layer and what does this have to do with vaping/taste/vapor density?

Rather than repeating myself as one of the few who've talked about alumina, I'd prefer to note…

The dearth of information on VU about alumina, an alloy developed a century ago, reveals more than my courteous nature allows me to explain here.

Kanthal is an alumina exuding ferric wire type specifically adapted for resistance wire. The popular adoption of Kanthal and its properties led me to consider quitting and succeed after 47 years. I can't imagine a more beneficial contribution to vaping than this singular advent (Kanthal) other than a furtherance of knowledge on its simple effectiveness and safe practical use.

The established and most supported benchmark for vaporizing elements is Kanthal.

What fascinates me is the facility with which Kanthal and it's optimal platform (mechanicals) have been displaced by producers and retailers to exclude it with a comparatively little explanation as to merits. How and why have we been so readily redirected to raw horsepower as the solution rather than efficient use of resistance?

It's for others I suppose to argue for the universality or superiority of alternatives. Several years back you would have seen a far broader discussion and interest. Today the complexity of alt wire technologies make an appreciation of electrical fundamentals irrelevant and increasingly difficult for the novice vaper. We more and more are encouraged to assume those who provide vape goods know what works and what's good for us.

Seems to me as a former smoker, I fell for that once.

Good luck jim.

 

[MacTechVpr]

@penstyle, welcome neighbor. Let us know if ya need anything.

G'luck.

 

[Alien Traveler]

Lifted from the VU thread…Nichrome ruined me | Page 2 | Post #100 | for info here.



Rather than repeating myself as one of the few who've talked about alumina, I'd prefer to note…

The dearth of information on VU about alumina, an alloy developed a century ago, reveals more than my courteous nature allows me to explain here.

Kanthal is an alumina exuding ferric wire type specifically adapted for resistance wire. The popular adoption of Kanthal and its properties led me to consider quitting and succeed after 47 years. I can't imagine a more beneficial contribution to vaping than this singular advent (Kanthal) other than a furtherance of knowledge on its simple effectiveness and safe practical use.

The established and most supported benchmark for vaporizing elements is Kanthal.

What fascinates me is the facility with which Kanthal and it's optimal platform (mechanicals) have been displaced by producers and retailers to exclude it with a comparatively little explanation as to merits. How and why have we been so readily redirected to raw horsepower as the solution rather than efficient use of resistance?

It's for others I suppose to argue for the universality or superiority of alternatives. Several years back you would have seen a far broader discussion and interest. Today the complexity of alt wire technologies make an appreciation of electrical fundamentals irrelevant and increasingly difficult for the novice vaper. We more and more are encouraged to assume those who provide vape goods know what works and what's good for us.

Seems to me as a former smoker, I fell for that once.

Good luck jim.

I do not see any real difference between Kanthal and nichrome both in health and vapor production terms.

 

[MacTechVpr]

I do not see any real difference between Kanthal and nichrome both in health and vapor production terms.

I do AT when minimally and adequately oxidized at low voltage K-A1 can run appreciably cooler…and stable at temperature. In my first year of testing the impact of strain I couldn't achieve as effective oxidation with Nichrome. It is I would agree not much different. But as I recall K-A1 has a specific component to enhance alumina development. Perhaps that is in play. Please bear in mind too that I'm talking in the context of the simple winding method I've described to the working user solution. It is quite likely both may be made to perform similarly. And I've no doubt you would know.

Done thousands of the Kanthal t.m.c.'s and replicated the results with many users. Why I can confidently count on the conclusion. Most are outside the community of ECF, Reddit, etc. and they sit there scratchin' their heads pondering with me what it is we're all thinkin' over here. You see I make sure to run 'em through the gauntlet of alternatives. My intellectual vanity prevents me from insisting on my ideal…as often as I'd like to (save time).

Would love to have more support on the science AT as I do think contact winds represent a very important starting point for new users. The better we can make them the more likely users may succeed at finding their vape sweet spot to join us in this pitched battle against those who would suppress the art.

Appreciate your many excellent contributions, remarks here and earlier (your microscopy too) as well as any help you may provide. If I've been off on some conclusions as to material chemistry and effects on performance, understanding the "why of it" has always been the goal for the benefit others as well as myself. And as I've freely acknowledged, ECF has been a great and fruitful laboratory for this concept and the testing of a great many assumptions.

Good luck AT.

 

[MacTechVpr]

Sounds good.
I got to try my limitless plus with an istick 100 tc.
The Clapton coils are okay but the limitless plus uses liquid very quickly and I need to increase the liquid flow to the coils.

Hey Rob, you went through quite a variety of vapes in quite a short time. Still pull out the Mega from time to time to proof juices at low watts and run a few of my tabs run regularly at 19, but I'm up from there to about 45W mostly with t.m.c.'s (vaping like 60 on factory coils). Just curious where you've ended up so far. Hope it's all good.

Good luck.

 

[Robbert]

I got a few with both types of 510 pin for bottom feeding.
I finally got the limitless plus to not dry hit,but it's just too airy for me.
The Tobecco Velocity V2 is simply a great RDA.Great flavor on both inhale and exhale.So far it's my favorite.No metallic taste like some of my tanks.
I got a Lemo drop but it's a clone,paid for authentic,so it'l
get returned.I was hoping for flavor tank that doesn't leak that I can stick in my pocket for on the go vaping.

 

[MacTechVpr]

Yeah, it's been hard for me to find an alt for the old reliable Subtank (and I do prefer the big one, with the mini a good practical carry). Good reliable single-wind vape at 25W.

IMG_1699a

• MacTechVpr
• Sep 15, 2016

Been lookin' at both the Limitless and Avocado. But it's a challenge to get the wicking, flow right. On RDA's I use all types but not the two-post just yet regularly. Although I've built out a number of them for others. Gotta lean to 24/22 AWG thick wire tmc builds in the .25-.35Ω range. Those I build for would tell ya they're significantly outperforming multi-wire on both counts, flavor and vapor.

These folks have the advantage of either seeing or learning the oxidation process I use. So I'd urge you to keep workin' the option. A 45 vs 60 watt comp of TCM to multi-wire is about typical, for comp performance. But frankly the tmc has more density potential. That's pretty much where I'm at right now. Showin' folks how to get there.

Hey keep us posted here if you do an alt tank Subtank comparison. Otherwise, join us on the Tensioned Next thread.

Good luck R.

 

[Robbert]

I put a 4mm vertical coil on limitless,split the wick,and it does good but has to be tilted if chain vaping.
I think the griffin mini 24 is a RDTA.It has both top and bottom air flow with adjustable liquid flow.It might make a good no leak portable tank.My melo 3 mini does great on vapor but has a metallic taste when the tank is full.Once it gets 1/2 empty it gets much better.
I keep trying to find an authentic kanger subtank mini but can only find 1:1 clones.
Is there any videos showing the oxidation process you use?

 

[Robbert]

Mac,
I found some subtank mini that are supposed to be authentic.
Does Kangertech use authentic codes?

 

[Robbert]

I ordered a Kanger sub tank mini.
They're supposed to be authentic so I'll see when it arrives.


Mac,
Did you say you have both the avocado and limitless plus?
Im curious if the avocado has a more restricted air flow than limitless plus.