Rayon wick, better flow, flavor, saturation and Nic Hit!

[Blackl1sted]

Image isn't mine, but that's the end result. Basically involves taking a dremel and working into the deck that's between the air hole and side.

^ that's the fella on fasttech! He took hours to get there though....

Thanks, I found that in my searching. Also there was another guy that did similar without the finishing work and not quite as deep as that one. I think that should be a standard for the Magma.

OK back on topic, I have been using the CC for the last couple weeks and am a believer. Using it in my Taifun, 3D, and Patriot with great results. I have a Magma on the way that will get it also. Thanks to JeremyR and all the other people that have done the leg work on this stuff.

 

[jaxgator]

I'm sure the dremel mod would make all the difference in the world and improve it's capacity without air hole leaking, since it would be difficult for the juice to reach them.

I've got a dremel but am not sure I'd trust myself to perform that task without ruining my Magma. Sure wish I could though as that looks like it would solve a lot of the leakage problems.

 

[Tbev]

Gotta remember, doing this increases the volume under the cap, more volume = less flavor....

 

[Necrosis]

I've been considering order a second magma and using the dremel to make a shallow ditch along that area, maybe half the depth of a standard kayfun juice channel. But as it stands, I don't have the balls to do it when it's my only one (and I like it so much more than anything else I own it's all I use for dripping). If only there was a little metal tube or something I could insert into the hole just to give it a raised lip, a millimeter would make a big difference.

Back to rayon, I have two fogger v4's that'll be coming in and am wondering if anyone's got some experience wicking it with rayon compared to cotton. Watched a few wicking videos for it and it looked like the deep juice channels need a fair amount of material. How does it perform with normal thickness tails? Or, depending on experience, how about thinned tails?

 

[BNEAT]

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...ystems/545703-fogger-v4-259.html#post13904500

 

[folkphys]

I'm suddenly having a bit of a problem with this rayon wicking, and I'm not sure how to fix it; till now I've had very good results but this is puzzling me.

I put a new wick in one of my kayfuns yesterday, because the old one was tasting bad, and sure enough, it was pretty black. So the first wick I put in there, obviously it just wasn't enough rayon, it was giving me all that pop-pop-pop business. so I broke it down again, and did a whole new rayon wick, but this time using as fat a hunk of rayon as i could get thru the coil, and it wasn't easy, but finally by pulling on each end of it, I got it to slide thru. Once I got it all trimmed and primed, it looked perfect, so I put it all back together and gave it another try. I'm still getting this one huge POP! if it's been sitting for any length of time not being vaped -- like 10-15 mins; I have to press the fire button with the thing pointed away from me, let it pop, then I can take a hit; I can then take several hits, without any trouble, but once I put it back down and it sits again for 10-15 mins or more, when i first pick it back up and fire it, again I have to aim it away, let it pop, then take my hit. it's very frustrating because I thought the popping was from not having enough wick.

Andria

Sometimes this happens to me as well. Because I am lazy, I wont actually try and fix the problem immediately -- draining unscrewing and whatnot. So, by way of temporary mitigation here's what I do:

Either,
1. Take a quick dry pull just before firing the device.
Or,
2. Begin my draw just before firing, so as to pull away any pooled juice that might go popping off all angry-like.

And really, I'm not so sure that all this popping is actually an indication of incorrect wicking. Most of my builds in most of my atties can be a bit spit-prone at times -- including ones with cotton and XC-116, but especially the Kayfun types. Now I'm usually running them 0.5 - 0.08 ohms with 6-7 wraps of <29g, so that could be my problem. I don't know, but I've yet to find a build that is completely pop-free. As such, particularly with Kayfuns, I have found that switching out the standard well-less drip tip to one with a larger main hole diameter (bore) and with some kind of inner ledge (drip well) will calm down even the angriest of dragons.

It is the only thing that really makes any sense to me right now:

Juice pools on and around the coil.
The first coil ignition can only vaporize a portion of it,
And so the unvaporized juice is sent flying upwards towards your mouth in molten clumps of fiery dragon tears.

Increasing the overall air flow -- temporarily -- or at least decreasing the "draw pressure" (more air volume with less air pressure) could then begin to loosen up and maybe somewhat disperse those dangerous juice pools before they become angry pain missiles.

 

[AndriaD]

Hmm ok... I don't run anywhere near sub-ohm; it's 1.7Ω or 1.8Ω, I fergit exactly, but around that. Unfortunately I don't have any driptips like that; I do have one wide-bore, and I was using that yesterday -- it looks like this:



I normally do have the airflow fairly closed, or it just feels like I'm sucking air -- "smoking a straw" -- so, later today I'll open up the airflow a little and see if that helps. It's the KFL+ I use for evening (smoke color m-tank) so I have the whole day to fiddle with it. Last night I just put it aside, drained the higher-mg ejuice form my "day tank" and put the lower-mg in it; that coil/wick is working perfectly.

If I can't get it to stop popping like that then I'll just do it again, and keep doing it until I finally get one that doesn't want to pop me in the mouth, because this is the first time I've had a serious issue with this rayon that I couldn't figure out and fix right away.

Is there anything about the coil itself that might lead to this? As I said, it's about 1.7-1.8 ohms; it's fairly well compressed but not *perfectly* so. Was wondering if I spaced out the wraps a bit, if that might help get rid of the popping. Generally I don't prefer tightly compressed coils, I think this one got that way mainly from that huge chunk of rayon I pulled thru it.

Thx!
Andria

EDIT: Also -- would a very thin juice have anything to do with this? Because I did dilute this with a bit of water; at the time I was filling it, I was getting that thick throat congestion problem from vaping, and thinning the juice usually helps. Not sure it had anything to do with it, since I put it in the other tank and it behaved perfectly, but just thought I'd ask.

 

[SlickWilly]

Image isn't mine, but that's the end result. Basically involves taking a dremel and working into the deck that's between the air hole and side.

What does this gain? Stainless is hard, not easy to drill or machine. I'm not surprised it took the guy hours, I'm sure he went through lots of Dremel bits and i must have gotten hot as hell. You'd need a leather glove or a small vise to hold onto it.

Last night I drilled a hole through each of the posts on my new Fogger. It was a pain in the a$$ but I won't have the problem of the screws pulling the wire when tighten anymore. I used another new numbered drill set and managed to dulled two and snap one of my new bits even though I used cutting oil, but it will be worth it.

 

[HolmanGT]

Hmm ok... I don't run anywhere near sub-ohm; it's 1.7Ω or 1.8Ω, I fergit exactly, but around that. Unfortunately I don't have any driptips like that; I do have one wide-bore, and I was using that yesterday -- it looks like this:

View attachment 364914

I normally do have the airflow fairly closed, or it just feels like I'm sucking air -- "smoking a straw" -- so, later today I'll open up the airflow a little and see if that helps. It's the KFL+ I use for evening (smoke color m-tank) so I have the whole day to fiddle with it. Last night I just put it aside, drained the higher-mg ejuice form my "day tank" and put the lower-mg in it; that coil/wick is working perfectly.

If I can't get it to stop popping like that then I'll just do it again, and keep doing it until I finally get one that doesn't want to pop me in the mouth, because this is the first time I've had a serious issue with this rayon that I couldn't figure out and fix right away.

Is there anything about the coil itself that might lead to this? As I said, it's about 1.7-1.8 ohms; it's fairly well compressed but not *perfectly* so. Was wondering if I spaced out the wraps a bit, if that might help get rid of the popping. Generally I don't prefer tightly compressed coils, I think this one got that way mainly from that huge chunk of rayon I pulled thru it.

Thx!
Andria

EDIT: Also -- would a very thin juice have anything to do with this? Because I did dilute this with a bit of water; at the time I was filling it, I was getting that thick throat congestion problem from vaping, and thinning the juice usually helps. Not sure it had anything to do with it, since I put it in the other tank and it behaved perfectly, but just thought I'd ask.

AndriaD,

"Popping" I get that with my Fogger 4.1 running about 17-18 watts. However it doesn't bother me because it doesn't come up the mouth piece. By the way that is with a 50/50 mix however adding water IMHO might well enhance the Popping problem. Water boils at a much lower temperature than PG or VG so water vapor will pop and sputter pretty good. That said I don't have a real good feel for why my Fogger pops and sputters and my RSST running at 9 watts doesn't. I have a current mind set that says it is because the wick in the Fogger holds so much juice that when it first fires it is the coil sitting in a puddle of juice clinging to the CC wick. I have also noticed that with more air flow the popping is minimized.

With CC I have been using spaced coils. I don't know that I have a logical reason for believing this is better with CC but do believe it helps prevent the center of the wick from going dry. Look at some of the coil pictures the "Old Salts" have posted and most seem to be using spaced coils. So if it is good enough for the Old Dogs...

If the sputtering/popping is too bad try lower the power level just a little or even using wire one or two sizes larger this will force the coil to heat up a little slower which should eliminate the popping.

 

[snow blind]

Image isn't mine, but that's the end result. Basically involves taking a dremel and working into the deck that's between the air hole and side.

This is amazing! Pretty much the perfect RDA base. You eliminate all the leaking issues the Magma has and improve wicking via more naturally positioned wicks. Must attempt.... or not lol. I dont have 6 hours to spend with a dremel.

 

[Necrosis]

What does this gain? Stainless is hard, not easy to drill or machine. I'm not surprised it took the guy hours, I'm sure he went through lots of Dremel bits and i must have gotten hot as hell. You'd need a leather glove or a small vise to hold onto it.

Juice that would otherwise pool on the deck goes back into the well instead of the air hole. I'll just leave it at that, since I have no personal experience modding it.

On the plus side, rewicked my magma the normal way with two tails, thinned, and so far been having few issues with juice going down the airhole with 30 drops. Haven't tried going higher, I tend to have a handful of different flavors sitting on my desk and switch around constantly. Noticed that the rayon seems to transfer well between flavors, even going from a mint to a non-mint juice. Good stuff.

 

[Necrosis]

The popping issue sounds like it's wicking TOO well to me. You can give a thicker juice a try and see how that goes. Another thing to try is a longer drip tip that would distance your mouth from the coil an extra inch or two.

 

[BNEAT]

EDIT: Also -- would a very thin juice have anything to do with this? Because I did dilute this with a bit of water; at the time I was filling it, I was getting that thick throat congestion problem from vaping, and thinning the juice usually helps. Not sure it had anything to do with it, since I put it in the other tank and it behaved perfectly, but just thought I'd ask.

ding ding ding, we have a winner

 

[AndriaD]

AndriaD,

"Popping" I get that with my Fogger 4.1 running about 17-18 watts. However it doesn't bother me because it doesn't come up the mouth piece. By the way that is with a 50/50 mix however adding water IMHO might well enhance the Popping problem. Water boils at a much lower temperature than PG or VG so water vapor will pop and sputter pretty good. That said I don't have a real good feel for why my Fogger pops and sputters and my RSST running at 9 watts doesn't. I have a current mind set that says it is because the wick in the Fogger holds so much juice that when it first fires it is the coil sitting in a puddle of juice clinging to the CC wick. I have also noticed that with more air flow the popping is minimized.

With CC I have been using spaced coils. I don't know that I have a logical reason for believing this is better with CC but do believe it helps prevent the center of the wick from going dry. Look at some of the coil pictures the "Old Salts" have posted and most seem to be using spaced coils. So if it is good enough for the Old Dogs...

If the sputtering/popping is too bad try lower the power level just a little or even using wire one or two sizes larger this will force the coil to heat up a little slower which should eliminate the popping.

Well I'm still puzzled. I'm using 29ga wire, because it's a good compromise between 30ga's faster heating and 28ga's sturdiness. 28ga just heats too slowly, at the resistance I prefer (1.7-1.8); I've found that I'm often still trying to get a hit when the stupid 10-sec cut-off starts flashing at me.

I've got some water in the one I'm vaping right now, my "day" tank, and this coil/wick is behaving itself; just the standard little "pop-fizz-bubble" noises, none of that "hot pop in the mouth" business.

I *have* tried lowering the power just a bit, and it does help *just a little* -- at least, the pop isn't quite so loud or violent, though it's still there. I think I may end up just doing a whole new wick in the thing, because this really is an odd one. Up till now, my rayon wicks have worked extremely well in my kayfuns; when they'd start that popping business I knew it meant there wasn't enough wick, so I'd replace it with a fatter wick, and then it would work fine. I'll try spacing the wraps a bit, and see if that fixes it, and if not, I'll probably just replace that wick and see if that one does any better. If not, then I may just replace that coil too.

Thx!
Andria

 

[jaxgator]

JNoticed that the rayon seems to transfer well between flavors, even going from a mint to a non-mint juice. Good stuff.

Yup, I noticed that on my Plume Veil as well. Sitting at my desk dripping Cappuccino. Decide I want a little menthol. Drip, drip, drip. Puff, puff ... Bam! Menthol! Amazing stuff that rayon is. I guess it's because it doesn't actually soak into the fiber of rayon like it does with cotton.

 

[HolmanGT]

Well I'm still puzzled. I'm using 29ga wire, because it's a good compromise between 30ga's faster heating and 28ga's sturdiness. 28ga just heats too slowly, at the resistance I prefer (1.7-1.8); I've found that I'm often still trying to get a hit when the stupid 10-sec cut-off starts flashing at me.

I've got some water in the one I'm vaping right now, my "day" tank, and this coil/wick is behaving itself; just the standard little "pop-fizz-bubble" noises, none of that "hot pop in the mouth" business.

I *have* tried lowering the power just a bit, and it does help *just a little* -- at least, the pop isn't quite so loud or violent, though it's still there. I think I may end up just doing a whole new wick in the thing, because this really is an odd one. Up till now, my rayon wicks have worked extremely well in my kayfuns; when they'd start that popping business I knew it meant there wasn't enough wick, so I'd replace it with a fatter wick, and then it would work fine. I'll try spacing the wraps a bit, and see if that fixes it, and if not, I'll probably just replace that wick and see if that one does any better. If not, then I may just replace that coil too.

Thx!
Andria

I use 30 Ga wire kind of a happy medium 32 is too flimsy and 28 heats too slowly. I am going to re-wick my Fogger a little later today. If I find a solution or the source of the problem I will let you know. I am also going to modify the air control ring to allow for a larger amount of air. The factory air hole is half blocked when it is set to full open. The rational is I do know that if I really puff hard on it (for more air thru put) the Popping is almost completely gone.

Some of these issues may not be related to CC at all but more a function of the atty characteristics.

 

[BNEAT]

I use 30 Ga wire kind of a happy medium 32 is too flimsy and 28 heats too slowly. I am going to re-wick my Fogger a little later today. If I find a solution or the source of the problem I will let you know. I am also going to modify the air control ring to allow for a larger amount of air. The factory air hole is half blocked when it is set to full open. The rational is I do know that if I really puff hard on it (for more air thru put) the Popping is almost completely gone.

Some of these issues may not be related to CC at all but more a function of the atty characteristics.

Removing the AFC ring didn't make any difference on any of mine. There's enough of a champher on the inside of the ring to allow as much air in as would with the ring removed. I, as well as other people , have tried it both ways and it's not made a difference. I drilled may air holes and THEN it made a diff!

 

[Necrosis]

Heh, I'm a 30g user too and felt alienated with everyone seemingly switched to 28g. No matter how much I tried, I just didn't like 28g and 30 was always perfect, and in the end I prefer vaping on 1-1.5ohms. I'm interested in the air flow thing, because I seem to be backwards of everyone in that regard and always end up liking a tight draw the best, be it a dripper or tank. Maybe because I'm an indirect inhaler, but what it feels like is when I have a tight draw, it forces the air across the coil harder than if I loosen it up, since an airy draw just means I draw slower to get the same draw time, which would make the air flow alot more stagnant inside the chamber. Just something to think about, since we all vape differently even if we had identical gear and builds.

Another thought that just hit me, with cotton I've always been used to getting nice crackling/sizzling on a fresh wicking, but once the coil has gunked up just a little bit, it loses that (my guess is, the outside no longer gets hot enough). The rayon is keeping my coils clean and I still get that delightful crackling where I would already be changing my cotton out. Big plus for me, but it could be a con if the sizzling is a problem.

Back when I started with protanks, they sizzled and spurted alot and the infamous "flavor wick" tended to alleviate that somehow. Was simply an extra wick, often thinner, running across the top of the coil. Dont know how viable that would be in a fogger v4, but just another thought.

 

[etherealink]

I'm suddenly having a bit of a problem with this rayon wicking, and I'm not sure how to fix it; till now I've had very good results but this is puzzling me.

I put a new wick in one of my kayfuns yesterday, because the old one was tasting bad, and sure enough, it was pretty black. So the first wick I put in there, obviously it just wasn't enough rayon, it was giving me all that pop-pop-pop business. so I broke it down again, and did a whole new rayon wick, but this time using as fat a hunk of rayon as i could get thru the coil, and it wasn't easy, but finally by pulling on each end of it, I got it to slide thru. Once I got it all trimmed and primed, it looked perfect, so I put it all back together and gave it another try. I'm still getting this one huge POP! if it's been sitting for any length of time not being vaped -- like 10-15 mins; I have to press the fire button with the thing pointed away from me, let it pop, then I can take a hit; I can then take several hits, without any trouble, but once I put it back down and it sits again for 10-15 mins or more, when i first pick it back up and fire it, again I have to aim it away, let it pop, then take my hit. it's very frustrating because I thought the popping was from not having enough wick.

Andria

Mine pops every few hits and my wife's pops every single hit... cotton but, oh well FWIW.

 

[HolmanGT]

Removing the AFC ring didn't make any difference on any of mine. There's enough of a champher on the inside of the ring to allow as much air in as would with the ring removed. I, as well as other people , have tried it both ways and it's not made a difference. I drilled may air holes and THEN it made a diff!

BNEAT,

I may try drilling mine out also. I was surprised at how large the internal air ports are in comparison to the intake holes. Just another one of those things that make you go "Hmmm...".